C language [A monster to face] help!!!

RS4

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May 16, 2010
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Konquerror said:
^^^Well whats VTU?
according to students, VTU stands for V TORTURE U:chair:
officially, its visvesvaraya technological university, Almost all the engineering colleges of karnataka come under VTU :judge:
 

asingh

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@OP:

"C" is a good language to learn. Take it as understanding the fundamentals of programing theory, and learning good coding practices. It puts in good discipline (typing) compared to many other languages out there. It can be painful at times (you realize when you move to other languages), but brings a smile to your face, for putting your basics in place, and creating logic order within your mind with reference to code/programs.

I learnt it on a blackboard (eeerrrmm.. well white board with a pen marker) and practiced (code dry runs on paper+bit of lab) after the 'lecture'. Till date the logic and sense inculcated by "C", I am thankful for. Who ever told you it is a monster, is correct, but the monster can be tamed and put on a leash to do your bidding. Best of luck. Enjoy the programing. Take it as a decent challenge...!
 

ragzdiablo

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Guys, i need some help too...

im doing my Eng. in IT..

i somehow cleared the first two sems...

but now, i have to learn C language properly..

my friend gave me a book called..

The Complete Reference C++ (tata McGraw-Hill Edition)...

ive heard, if you learn C++, you will get a very good idea of C too..

Should i refer to this book or join a course in NIIT?

I have a month till my second year starts...

can this be done at home?
 

harpreet89

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Jan 21, 2010
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Dont be scared of the C language. Its not that hard to learn.
Also,you are taking admission in engineering college, dont be scared of it as in the college its just the trailer of C language which you will be studying, not the advance one.
As i've myself gone through such situation, so i advice you to just go through the academic syllabus of your preferred university and then start learning it.
The best books for C language to start with is Let Us C by Yashwant Kanetkar and Mastering C by Venugopal.
These 2 books are the best books for Indian students and are most preferred by Indian Universities.
 

deathvirus_me

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shantanugoel said:
^^ very true.. and yeah once you learn C, most other languages are a cake walk.. :p
aah really ??

C is a good starting point, but most current gen. programming languages have a different logic base .. SOA solutions have nothing what C can teach .. learn C only if you wanna do low level access coding (or automation) . For current standards u shud start with Java of C# or any other industry accepted high level language. Java has a much easier learning curve than C in my opinion.
 

kikworks

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Hi, C was my first programming language, then C++, Java, and now I am working in C#. All these days, the basics of C helped me a lot. Even if you don't dive in to deep C, its very helpful to get the basics right. It'll be of long term benefit. Java is also great language, but the number of different versions like SE, EE, ME and different types of application you can develop using them, may confuse a lot and as they are very interesting, you may be tempted to skip basics and start with advanced concepts. Which will be turn into a very bad thing in future. So its always better to start with C, get the basics right and then make a decision whether to go with advanced C, or move to other languages like C#, Java even C++.

I quite like "How To Program" series from Deitel and Deitel. I have their book on C, C++ and Java. They are quite good and easy for beginners. Do check their sample chapters. One word of caution: usually their book will be quite thick at around 1000 pages. Don't be scared. They are quite simple and easy to learn.

All the best...

Thanks,
KIKWorks
 

deathvirus_me

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How dont understand how C forms the basic of learning current gen. language .. I dont even see it as a requirement until i wish to be stuck on C.

Also the reason Java is confusing if the very fact that u're basics are from C .. There are so many types of Java ?? There is only one Java, JEE and JME are specifications. The only time i required my C knowledge (almost after 9 years) was when i was trying out JNI .. I too started from C coz at that time no one had enough knowledge about other languages. Now that i know a few more, i'd say C used to be the basics, now it only makes u "not" understand modern day languages; unless u think the knowledge about variables makes it easier ...

No one will let u develop applications in C, coz the the amount of freedom in C is just too much. Heck even java uses low level C :) .. but you will not find any industry level solution in basic C, unless its some text simulation ...
 

agantuk

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If the argument is about which is more 'practical' in today's world, then Java definitely takes the honours. However, if the discussion is about which one is a better platform to become a programmer, it has to be C. Java doesn't give rise to programmers, you just get a bunch of coders. For all the talk about how Java makes trivial things easier, heck, it is just trivial things that are required in the industry today. For more complicated stuff, there are other alternatives.
 
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adi_vastava

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deathvirus_me said:
No one will let u develop applications in C, coz the the amount of freedom in C is just too much. Heck even java uses low level C :) .. but you will not find any industry level solution in basic C, unless its some text simulation ...
You looks like having some experience, than how can you comment like this, think virtualization and its all C, C++(hypervisors, app virtualization and even VM workstations). Think security products and at kernel its again all C(Encryption product with H/w or s/w level security, AVs, Anti rootkit and firewalls).

Just beause you works in domain where C may not be required does not make it that useless isn't it? Additionally I prefer not to generalize things especially in public forum where anyone can interpret XYZ meaning from your text.
 

deathvirus_me

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ajab.ghajab said:
If the argument is about which is more 'practical' in today's world, then Java definitely takes the honours. However, if the discussion is about which one is a better platform to become a programmer, it has to be C. Java doesn't give rise to programmers, you just get a bunch of coders. For all the talk about how Java makes trivial things easier, heck, it is just trivial things that are required in the industry today. For more complicated stuff, there are other alternatives.
Programmers, coders .. i'd like to know some real difference .. So one might know the logic of the work, the other might know some method calls .. at the end both are delivering what is required, so who is better ?? Have you ever tried presenting your logic without some working samples ?? Wudn't it be so easier if i cud simply make people realize my understanding without giving evidence of it working ??

adi_vastava said:
You looks like having some experience, than how can you comment like this, think virtualization and its all C, C++(hypervisors, app virtualization and even VM workstations). Think security products and at kernel its again all C(Encryption product with H/w or s/w level security, AVs, Anti rootkit and firewalls).

Just beause you works in domain where C may not be required does not make it that useless isn't it? Additionally I prefer not to generalize things especially in public forum where anyone can interpret XYZ meaning from your text.
In that case everyone shud learn Assembly ..

Tell me, which platform would u prefer to write me a x64 notepad application ?? Wud u do it in pure C ?? Well sure u can, but even i can do it in much less time. The only thing that really matters is the delivery. And the time i will spend to deliver a more feature rich application, u wud spend to make it look a proper application.

If C was indeed the best language to learn and work on, why would anyone even think about making better coding platforms ?? Why is their a VS 2010 and not a C 2010 ?? Why is their such a craze about Java and not a craze about C ??

Also u got my point wrong, C is not useless, it forms the base of every high level coding language, but the less we know the more secure the coding platform is. Everyone shudn't be given the freedom offered by C; its just that simple. The best of C codes will not be understandable to 90% of the regular coders, so why would any company bother to invest on such things .. coz at the end of the day, u will deliver the same thing.
 

adi_vastava

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deathvirus_me said:
In that case everyone shud learn Assembly ..
use assemblly for what? Kindly mention. To develop a product, really? we do use it occasionally and our code is full of inline assembly but the idea always is to hit the problem with a language which at first is able to solve it and than will be able to deliver it as fast as possible. do you think assemblly will be able to do it.

>>Tell me, which platform would u prefer to write me a x64 notepad application ?? Wud u do it in pure C ??

"your question itself is wrong (which platfor for X64)", X64 is a platform so when you are bulding your code for X64, you already told your compiler/linker what binary format you are expecting.isn't it? Now will I code it in C, NO but NEITHER in Java or C#; as notepad is an application which shipped with OS itself and should have no dependency which all C# and Java applications have (JVM and .net ). My vote is for C++/win32 SDK

>>Well sure u can, but even i can do it in much less time. The only thing that really matters is the delivery. And the time i will spend to deliver a more feature rich application, u wud spend to make it look a proper application.

I agree to this, I said something similar in first point.

>>If C was indeed the best language to learn and work on, why would anyone even think about making better coding platforms ??

I agree to this as well BUT this is not what you originally said. In your original comment "you said that there is no industry problem which C can solve", you were indeed wrong with that generalization. As there are certain things which still can only be done in C/C++. Better coding platform are their to ease the implementation but when it comes to hardcore performance you can not use those.

>>Why is their a VS 2010 and not a C 2010 ?? Why is their such a craze about Java and not a craze about C ??

What sort of question is this? Visual studio is just an IDE which indeed ships a C compiler with it, no matter what version you are using. Why they are developing new versions of it, answer is simple, it has to do with the changes in features of MS languages which I don't know exactly, additionally its about money.

>> the less we know the more secure the coding platform is.

In that way Java/C# are more secure coding platform, right :bleh:? If so we better stop discussing it now.

Your intermediate code can be easily turned to the source code and this is why you need to obfuscate them. This argument is pretty much useless as there is no such thing as secure platform once your code is in memory; one can anyday debug it.

This is the real advantage of working in C/C++ and OS you know how things work, you know Java is nothing but a platform built over win32 API providing indirect access of OS to the program which makes that java program platform independent. Once you know it; you can debug your java environment as well.

>>Everyone shudn't be given the freedom offered by C; its just that simple.

Childish argument, C can do nothing more than any other language it it is running at ring 3 (user mode), all it can do is to crash the process, which even a C# application can do.
>>The best of C codes will not be understandable to 90% of the regular coders.

Really, you think so? what do you mean by regular coders, Java coders are regular, I do not think so? I am amazed the way you think and it only tells me to sitback till you have more experience and are willing to understand

>>So why would any company bother to invest on such things .. coz at the end of the day, u will deliver the same thing.

You may not have worked in such product which is fine but there exist a requirement known as performance and that is why most of your games are also in C/C++. And I hope you know that companies are investing in it.

Come out of your small world buddy, there is lot to learn for everyone of us. In case you still think your vision is all correct about C, I suggest you to post in MS technet forum to be convinced.