Audio Do iPods have poor sound quality?

PristineNote said:
Very correctly pointed out. IPods are not bad as they are made out to be. They are style statement and have great ergonomics and sound good too (with a price tag). However the biggest problem with Apple is that they want you to be slave of their technology, buy their proprietary software. They always sell product from their stores and force you to buy them and monopolize the market. They are like Microsoft of the Media Players! The other problem with Apple is... (its gonna hurt lot of people) before you buy them apple is out with another latest model! Look how often have they changed the Media Players. After the warranty is over, its a stone if your player ever goes bad! Cowon are somewhat hyped.
Click to expand...
Sorry to disagree with some points....

1. The timeline of apple products updates are pretty much fixed/known nowadays...
Ref: Mac Buyer's Guide: Know When to Buy Your Mac, iPod or iPhone

2. They are not stone once the warranty is over.. I get support for my 30GB 5.5G classic even now (Official), and they last much longer in normal use compared to other products...
Regarding sound quality... it varies according to model...

I have a 5.5G which sounds better than even a clip+ (Without equalising, same earphones)
 
^ The service Apple provides after warranty period is as good as buying a new Apple product .As far as I remember when my iPod nano started giving issues after warranty period ,Apple service centre guys said they don't repair any products at all .Rather they would replace the product with the exact same one for close 60-70% of its actual cost :O . Ofcourse it didn't make any sense cause for slightly more amount a newer and better model of iPod Nano was available in market. In the end it did actually turn into a paper weight .

Also regarding the SQ , its only some of the older classics like 5.5G which sounded so great. Newer models aren't but I still feel they are not as bad as they are made out to be .Just not the best. I listen to a lot of music on my new iPhone 4 and can say that it sounds pretty damn good .At times it sounds good enough for me to give the PMP a skip for the sake of portability but then when I actually compare , the Fuze to me sounds little better with wider soundstage, more detailing & control at both the ends of the spectrum .
 
^^ I too liked the 5.5G Ipod. Heard one a few days back and I really liked it. :)

However thats all in the past, Apple has moved from the Wolfson DACs in the older Ipods to a Cirrus Logic DAC. The new Cirrus Logic DAC (IMO) sounds pretty crappy and cold. I had an Ipod 6G Classic and no matter how much I tried to like it since I loved the Apple UI I just couldn't accept how cold it sounded.

All the latest Apple devices have the Cirrus Logic DAC which IMO is just not that good. Of course YMMV. :)
 
FaH33m said:
^ The service Apple provides after warranty period is as good as buying a new Apple product .As far as I remember when my iPod nano started giving issues after warranty period ,Apple service centre guys said they don't repair any products at all .Rather they would replace the product with the exact same one for close 60-70% of its actual cost :O . Ofcourse it didn't make any sense cause for slightly more amount a newer and better model of iPod Nano was available in market. In the end it did actually turn into a paper weight .

Also regarding the SQ , its only some of the older classics like 5.5G which sounded so great. Newer models aren't but I still feel they are not as bad as they are made out to be .Just not the best. I listen to a lot of music on my new iPhone 4 and can say that it sounds pretty damn good .At times it sounds good enough for me to give the PMP a skip for the sake of portability but then when I actually compare , the Fuze to me sounds little better with wider soundstage, more detailing & control at both the ends of the spectrum .
Click to expand...
I received a mail informing that i could extend warranty at 2.5K for an year. ( that was 5 months ago ) so i guess if you are registered, every one will get that message. I had 32GB ipod touch.
 
Rockfella said:
The best thing about ipods/shuffles is that they usually have a veyr long life. many friends of mine have been using same player since 5+ years. Sansa Clip etc are newer players (afaik) we don't know the average life cycle of these products. i feel day/night difference in sound quality of shuffle and clip+. Clip is way superior.
Click to expand...
The shelf life of IPods are poor. I just thought that IPads were new and now they have already been phased out. The V2 have hit the market within a year. Foxconn (the makers of Apple products.... yes Apples are not made by Apple) had a revenue of 60 Billion$ (sales Foxconn: 2010) mostly manufacturing Apple products. They need to sell more for revenue. They dont care about their employees, do you think they give a damn to the consumer? (I hope that you must have heard about the Foxconn's employees being tormented and pushed to suicide?)

SanDisk on the other hand doesnt upgrade the products every now and then. The Clip/Clip+ has been in the Market for almost 4 to 5 years, without changing shape or size. They let the consumer upgrade the memory, so that you do not have to discard the player for the want to more space. They supported oggs and flacs.

Would Apple ever let people upgrade the Memory? NEVER. They will force to you BUY another player of 16/32GB if you are not happy with 8GB for example. They are good multimedia player with bells and whistles (some of them may not be warranted) and functions that perhaps one will never use or intend to use. This philosophy continues in all their products phones, pads, pods....

SanDisk players on the other hand does what they are meant to do, and do a fantastic job out of it. Compare features and performance of Clip plus vs shuffle..... ? All the clip plus have over the years done is added more colours and upgraded the Firmware.

I can safely say this. Most of the audiophiles here would either own or intended to own Clip+ or Fuze at one point in time or other. I have had 4 Ipod Classic, two have gone kaput. I cant even find those models with people anymore; are we talking spares parts?

I can understand, its easy to love the Apples... but wait, the next one is already in line :D. No sir Apples do not have long life, if they did, they cant keep selling forever! Steve will loose the job and that Fox is a con!

Disclaimer: These are entirely my views. You may not like to agree with them. Also statistically there are more Apple fans than SanDisk (or other brands) etc. But I also know most guys like the B**bs than the Brains!

Quote: (We are) only a pawn in the game! : Bob Dylan

Afterthought: deleted ......
 
PristineNote said:
I can understand, its easy to love the Apples... but wait, the next one is already in line :D. No sir Apples do not have long life, if they did, they cant keep selling forever! Steve will loose the job and that Fox is a con!

\
Click to expand...
apple products do have a long life IMO, many of my friends own apple ipod touch /classic/ nano .

I have only heard about 1 failure . (yeah, i will know if their ipod goes bad )

THey keep selling forever because every new apple product is a lot more appealing over the other.

take Ipod 4g over 3gs ...or ipod touch 4g over 3g.

even nano.

i remember when first nano was introduced ....( mini were phased out ) it was a sensation.

apple does new things in a "cool" and appealing way. :) ( yeah its bad that they you want to sell your piece after the new one gets launched, but thats is not because you are afraid that soon a problem might pop up, its because the newer model is more appealing, is faster and better looking )
 
See, I may give a nub opinion so don't flame me.

I've owned an iPod 5G 30GB, iPod Touch, Philips GoGear Spark, and now a Motorola Milestone. Other sources have been X-Fi Xtrememusic, X-Fi Fatal1ty Pro, Realtek onboard from nForce4, 785G, the Dell Studio onboard, and now a Fiio E7. The most common headphone thats been hooked up to all these sources is my HD555. Only in certain cases do I use IEMs only.

Of all the portables I've had, I'd rank them like this. iPod 5G > Milestone > GoGear > iPod Touch. The touch just didn't do well with my headphones and the earphones that Apple provides is something that comes out the rear end of a horse. But one thing for sure is all my portables do/did way better than my onboard audio. Even my Milestone does better than my 785G's Realtek ALC889a.

Also, Apple's service is only as good as the time of their warranty.

I remember when I first thought I bricked my 5G, I called up Apple like an idiot instead of googling the answer. They wasted half an hour of my time on the phone and then in the first 10 minutes they told me my first call would be free and the next calls would be charged at $30 an hour. I was like Zzz, my phone's bill was around $20 a month =/.
 
PristineNote said:
The shelf life of IPods are poor. I just thought that IPads were new and now they have already been phased out. The V2 have hit the market within a year. Foxconn (the makers of Apple products.... yes Apples are not made by Apple) had a revenue of 60 Billion$ (sales Foxconn: 2010) mostly manufacturing Apple products. They need to sell more for revenue. They dont care about their employees, do you think they give a damn to the consumer? (I hope that you must have heard about the Foxconn's employees being tormented and pushed to suicide?)

SanDisk on the other hand doesnt upgrade the products every now and then. The Clip/Clip+ has been in the Market for almost 4 to 5 years, without changing shape or size. They let the consumer upgrade the memory, so that you do not have to discard the player for the want to more space. They supported oggs and flacs.

Would Apple ever let people upgrade the Memory? NEVER. They will force to you BUY another player of 16/32GB if you are not happy with 8GB for example. They are good multimedia player with bells and whistles (some of them may not be warranted) and functions that perhaps one will never use or intend to use. This philosophy continues in all their products phones, pads, pods....

SanDisk players on the other hand does what they are meant to do, and do a fantastic job out of it. Compare features and performance of Clip plus vs shuffle..... ? All the clip plus have over the years done is added more colours and upgraded the Firmware.

I can safely say this. Most of the audiophiles here would either own or intended to own Clip+ or Fuze at one point in time or other. I have had 4 Ipod Classic, two have gone kaput. I cant even find those models with people anymore; are we talking spares parts?

I can understand, its easy to love the Apples... but wait, the next one is already in line :D. No sir Apples do not have long life, if they did, they cant keep selling forever! Steve will loose the job and that Fox is a con!

Disclaimer: These are entirely my views. You may not like to agree with them. Also statistically there are more Apple fans than SanDisk (or other brands) etc. But I also know most guys like the B**bs than the Brains!

Quote: (We are) only a pawn in the game! : Bob Dylan

Afterthought: deleted ......
Click to expand...
Wooo... It would take a long post to reply....

putting everything in short... I'm Extremely Disappointed and shocked by the view especially who deals with technological products....

Do you bash apple for upgrading thier lineups every year...

Then, Stop reading everything. News technical writeups and all, Your brain also gets upgraded, which makes us buyer losing a poor intellectual seller at the time of buying...

Stop your children from school their mind is also upgraded...

start working on PII or III. cpus are upgraded every year...

finally hang yourself.. You also get older everyday...

Sorry for being harsh, But can't control my feeling seeing someone blocking the technological reach to people.

YOU HAVE DISAPPOINTED ME A LOT GAUTHAM....
 
i do have a preference for cowons they somehow suit my needs :) (especially the extraordinary 40 hrs playback time on my iaudio7 :) )

but frankly according to me what really matters is good iems which compliments your player and the quality of the audio you put in it.
 
PristineNote said:
The shelf life of IPods are poor. I just thought that IPads were new and now they have already been phased out. The V2 have hit the market within a year. Foxconn (the makers of Apple products.... yes Apples are not made by Apple) had a revenue of 60 Billion$ (sales Foxconn: 2010) mostly manufacturing Apple products. They need to sell more for revenue. They dont care about their employees, do you think they give a damn to the consumer? (I hope that you must have heard about the Foxconn's employees being tormented and pushed to suicide?)

SanDisk on the other hand doesnt upgrade the products every now and then. The Clip/Clip+ has been in the Market for almost 4 to 5 years, without changing shape or size. They let the consumer upgrade the memory, so that you do not have to discard the player for the want to more space. They supported oggs and flacs.

Would Apple ever let people upgrade the Memory? NEVER. They will force to you BUY another player of 16/32GB if you are not happy with 8GB for example. They are good multimedia player with bells and whistles (some of them may not be warranted) and functions that perhaps one will never use or intend to use. This philosophy continues in all their products phones, pads, pods....

SanDisk players on the other hand does what they are meant to do, and do a fantastic job out of it. Compare features and performance of Clip plus vs shuffle..... ? All the clip plus have over the years done is added more colours and upgraded the Firmware.

I can safely say this. Most of the audiophiles here would either own or intended to own Clip+ or Fuze at one point in time or other. I have had 4 Ipod Classic, two have gone kaput. I cant even find those models with people anymore; are we talking spares parts?

I can understand, its easy to love the Apples... but wait, the next one is already in line :D. No sir Apples do not have long life, if they did, they cant keep selling forever! Steve will loose the job and that Fox is a con!

Disclaimer: These are entirely my views. You may not like to agree with them. Also statistically there are more Apple fans than SanDisk (or other brands) etc. But I also know most guys like the B**bs than the Brains!
Quote: (We are) only a pawn in the game! : Bob Dylan
Afterthought: deleted ......
Click to expand...
the point you make is a very farcical one my friend.you actually claim you have problems with products getting updated every year? i have owned the sansa clip and its a good mp3 player but ipods do set the trend in the market.you talk about the ipad and tbh there isnt a single tablet out there which competes with the ipad 1 let alone the ipad 2.this is called vision and not making sales outta crappy outdated products.they dont rest on their laurels and thats what sets them apart.my friend has a macbook of 4 years old and it still runs as fast as it used to.so does this mean apple should keep selling the same macbook till 2011 coz it does the job and to show it has a terrific shelf life.i have a ipod shuffle which i have owned for 3 years now.its awesome and works like a charm everytime i use it.iseeing as you are a dealer of sandisk products its fairplay that you shower them with your appraisals but if you are actually thinking of proving apple products as too new for people well thats what we want really.we want the latest products with the best features available.and if you are comparing and elevating sandisk as a better company than apple i am sure there are a fair few chuckles which you have given to the members today.
 
@PristineNote There are certain parts of your view I agree with and certain that I don't. I am all for the technological advance Apple is making. I am all for more storage that Apple provide. If tomorrow apple would improve the SQ of the iPods I would be the first to buy it. The UI is great, the third party accessories are the most compared to any other brand, awesome casing, highest capacity, great and simple looks and form factor and I do not mind the price point of the iPods. Maybe not of the iPad but that's a different story and OT.

For me, no support for Flac and iTunes is more of a deal-breaker than anything else. Prolly if I could out the digital signal from the iPod to an external portable dac+amp it would be amazing. Or if Apple creates an iPod classic body with 500GB of storage with the SQ of an Sflo2 and Flac support I wouldn't mind paying 400$ for it. Maybe even get rockbox for it ;) I should stop dreaming....hehe.

Let not go OT and keep our views to SQ of the iPods as the TS had intended. Or lets have another thread.
 
bennysachdev said:
@PristineNote There are certain parts of your view I agree with and certain that I don't. I am all for the technological advance Apple is making. I am all for more storage that Apple provide. If tomorrow apple would improve the SQ of the iPods I would be the first to buy it. The UI is great, the third party accessories are the most compared to any other brand, awesome casing, highest capacity, great and simple looks and form factor and I do not mind the price point of the iPods. Maybe not of the iPad but that's a different story and OT.

For me, no support for Flac and iTunes is more of a deal-breaker than anything else. Prolly if I could out the digital signal from the iPod to an external portable dac+amp it would be amazing. Or if Apple creates an iPod classic body with 500GB of storage with the SQ of an Sflo2 and Flac support I wouldn't mind paying 400$ for it. Maybe even get rockbox for it ;) I should stop dreaming....hehe.

Let not go OT and keep our views to SQ of the iPods as the TS had intended. Or lets have another thread.
Click to expand...
I too dont complete agree with Gautam, but a lot of what he says makes sense. Apple for all their 'technological advances' cant provide a simple Microsd card slot for me to upgrade the onboard memory.

Also look at their Classic range. Their 5.5G and below had a better SQ which went worse in the 6G and above that I had. So whats the point in upgrading features when the crux of a PMP that is SQ is not an important feature according to Apple.

Also their blocking of Rockbox was the last straw for me. I had an old 3G Apple player and rockbox really breathed new life into it. I did not research properly and found out that the 6G didn't support Rockbox. I loved the UI and the clickwheel but utimately the SQ didn't cut it which made me sell it off.

Sansa also allows you to use Rockbox but frankly FLAC and OGG support is already there in the default firmware. Apple does not officially allow you to play FLAC files. You need Rockbox to use FLAC but Rockbox support is now disabled.
 
Apple charges EXTRA ( a whole lot ) for memory upgrade in all its devices , they serioulsy DONT WANT to give an option for memory upgrade ( cause their costlier models will be useless then )

take for example ..

the ipad 16 GB /3g+wifi costs, 34K

the ipad 64 GB / 3g +wifi costs, 54K

Difference in features - 48GB; Price diff. - 20K

Ipod touch 8 GB - 15K

Ipod touch 64 GB - 26K

Difference in features - Only 56 GB memory. Price Diff. : 11K

whats the difference ....nothing, except for memory. if they had an option for upgrade no one would buy the 64GB one. they certainly are keeping more profit in the higher memory models , that's their business plan.

I am not saying its justified, but still " that's how they roll " .
 
And sorry again for getting to the fundas again...

Does Ipod need the best sound quality?
if we all think about one thing, it would be easier to arrive at the move...

How do you define sound quality?
THe frequency response, clarity etc... But, How do you get them? Only by using a high end in ears or headphones.
How much percentage of ipod owners change to atleast M2 or better?

And how much percentage use for the features/user experience of it....

I bet the later is higher (Maybe far higher) than the former.

As a company, to satisfy the majority of the customer base, I would prefer sacrificing small amount of customers.

One thing is Ipod is never claimed to be an audiophile player, It does things better than others and some things are sacrificed to attain the balance or Optimum.

If sound quality is the major choice over user experience, there are lots of players (CD walkman, Hifiman etc...)

Kindly don't come to a conclusion that I'm against sound quality preference in ipod. Even i would like to have the best audio quality in it.

But, the hard fact is its tough to have best of both worlds.

P.s: As an Engineer, If i want my device to have the best user experience, i make sure there are no bottlenecks in the flow of data.
One factor that's important in a ext storage (SD/Micro sd card) is its uncertainity in read write speeds on various brands. Which boils down finally to the user experience. (More RAM is always faster than bigger pagefile).
and Kindly i request people to look device as it is intended / designed for use.

Note: May be OT, But i had a thread which explains something about ipods.http://www.techenclave.com/general-portables/how-ipod-different-mp3-player-exploration-171110.html

Oh, This has become a long post...

--- Updated Post - Automerged ---

Ok I'm again...

Emphasising on SD/MicroSD storage preference.

If I'm intending to use a MicroSD card in an ipod. How will it be..

1. Load all songs in SD card insert in ipod. Give update library, scan songs again (BTW how much people are familiar with that, Ipods are prefered since they don't need to do these things).
Then, During usage, the list would take few seconds to load (1st -ve in user exp).

2. Else, Load all the database (HTML files for the library) in the main memory and songs in sd card, speeds up the process. But if you load /overwrite songs and access again, either it would search the song for some time (2nd -ve in user Exp) or give a error message "file not found. like to locate it?". (3rd -ve in user exp)

3. Best let us sync ipod with sd card in it.. Then bash apple again for slow transfer speeds (4th -ve for user exp)

and if they are ready to do it, it would be prefered only by 10% of customers by losing 70-80% of them.

If i was steve or an apple employee of any hierchy, i wouldn't do that.
 
^^ So judging from your posts, you don't disagree that Apple dont have the best sound quality ?

Thats what the whole topic was about !

I wont disagree that Apple Ipods have fantastic UI so lets leave it at that. :)
 
^^ Simple...

Do ipods have poor sound quality? No....

Does ipods have "the best" sound quality? No...

It is not poor, But it is certainly not the best. (BTW To find the difference you need much better gear)

Hope I'm not confusing.
 
Back
Top