PC Peripherals Of PSU, UPS, PFC and Sine wave

anooj30299301

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Jan 14, 2008
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Guys, I would like to put some points though not technical.

First, go for APC if money permits and if you love your rig.
I recently bought APC smart UPS SUA750i, the cheapest of pure sinewave. Previous model was APC back ups 800VA for two and a half years. It gave me approx. 45 mins backup and full 24 hrs downloading on the rig.(By the way i have rs 500 PSU:ashamed: ). Exactly after 7 months I thought why not plug logitech z 5500. I did and within next 4 months i enjoyed safe shutdowns etc. after 4 months till this date hardly had a backup for more than a minute. I removed the speaker plug after that 4 months.
Point is I never had problem with extra watts faithfully given by the UPS though not sinewave.

Now SUA 750i is pure sinewave -bought for 9.2K at AAD UPS, Bowenpally, hyderbad. its giving 39 minutes backup and loas os option to regulate, change settings etc which I think no other company can provide.

Safe computing = APC:hap2:
 

Techie#1

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Sep 20, 2005
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^^ Some points to clarify Anooj
1) what sort of Ah rating does the battery of this APC smart UPS SUA750i have (Not very clear from the APC website) & is the replacement battery readily available in the market/with the dealer?(I say this with much seriousness,'coz i could NOT get a replacement for my 9.5Ah batteryof my 800VA Numeric UPS,No company produces these nowdays & hence i am in lookout for a new UPS alltogether)

2) What's the REAL World "Input voltage range" for the said APC UPS to draw power from the Mains.Though APC says it be 160 - 285V range,i say this 'coz sometimes the voltage in the mains@my place fall below even to 120-130 range(during the summer sometimes),which the said APC UPS might Not pickup to charge itself from...& this is exactly the reason,why i had to opt for a Numeric UPS with their wider input voltage range,even though i knew which the better product was.

3)Will it be a ideal condition to connect my Quasi-wave inverter to a PureSinewave APC UPS to power my PC(though i'm NOT even certain what sort of power my PC's SMPS would be actually getting & also supplying a Non-sine wave Inverter power to a pure sinewave APC UPS would be detrimental to its health).

The Power position @my place is rather poor with frequent powercuts-short& long duration throughout the day & Night.However i'm much into torrents & leave my pC almost 24x7,which needs a disciplined & continuous healthy power requirement.My Only soution would be a power supply which address all these problems & giving me real peace of mind!!!

**Q'n .3 is open to all & i would also be Most Thankful to those who cares to anser my previous query here:http://www.techenclave.com/pc-peripherals/of-psu-ups-pfc-sine-wave-114774-2.html#post944800

All Thanks to those who replies!!!
 

anooj30299301

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Alright Techie#1,

First I donno much technical but hope the below clarifies some points:

1 I have not opened SUA750i(will try that) but as my 800VA had 2 7ah, I presume the same. This is because for APC 1.5 to 2.2 to higher(3,5,7,10, kV) that demand enormouse battery resources uses Exide batteries. Any APC dealer will show you that happily. I saw th ones needed for a 2.2 KV model. Just for the info part, he quoted 42K for the model with 4 Exide 28 ah batteries(very costly)(APC Smart-UPS XL 2200VA 230V No Battery)
For this 1.5kv model he quoted ~19K. Load of 1980 watts(APC Smart-UPS 1500VA USB & Serial 230V) and 1kv for ~12K (APC Smart-UPS 1500VA USB & Serial 230V) - both sporting internal APC batteries.

2 Numeric is the next best or comparable to APC, as I heard, but you can configure APC with their net agent software all the oltage, surge etc... a lot, even with a SUA750i one too. But I suggest you go for 1kv or more but all are pure sinewave.

3 I do not know but guest AOC needs direct mains to be effective:huh: and am not sure I answered your questions well - any o it.

But yes Numeric is as good as APC but I went for APC since I need to power my A/V receiver too, just for switchng off when mains off. See for the connections before going for APC. in another forum APC pure sinewave was supported a lot, so I opted for that or else would have changed the batteries for APC 880VA for just 1600rs(apc make).

PS: Exide batteries is as good or better to APC or panasonic, which by the way is deployed in big server oriended companies, heck most companies.
 

clown_abhi

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Sep 27, 2007
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Hey guys,

Why is the load mentioned in a UPS? I run a system which consumes ~375W of power at full load and with aging and all reaches 470W on a APC UPS 500VA(300W). Still it runs fine.

I have got a 1000KVA UPS(which should handle 600W) now but i just wanted to know is the load any important and if yes, what bad happens if running my sys on a 300W UPS?
 

sushrukh

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Jun 12, 2006
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tangentray said:
The Problem:
Most new and sophesticated PSU-s have active PFC-s. Active PFC is incompatible with simulated sine wave output, it would only work with pure sine wave. The problem is more financial in nature. It is not that APC does not produce UPS wich output pure sine wave but they are the best server class pieces which come at a premium ~>10k. Now many of us have never thought about that while buying, once bought then only we find this out. So we are left with either changing our UPS or PSU!!!

What will happen if I run my active PFC PSU along with simulated Sine wave UPS?
In an ideal case, with power cut in this scenario the UPS starts providing simulated sine wave, the PSU expecting a pure sine wave would power down killing your system, the UPS sensing no load will shutdown as well. In short your system will behave like it has no UPS backup at all. A lot of deviations have been seen though. For example the Corsair VX450 is reported to have run without any hitch, other good psu-s would run with a heavy humming noise due to overload. We would all agree it would be a bad idea to take a chance with our precious monnies err.. hardware.
I'm using a 650VA APC UPS which according to u should be emitting a simulated sine wave output as it's not a costly solution & my Cooler Master 700W PSU has Active PFC on it but i have never had any problem like you are saying.I've used nearly 50+ active PSUs with more than 40 APC UPSes which have sine wave output & i've never faced any problem like you.

I think, it's a problem which has happened to you only because of another reason.It has got nothing to do with the simulated sine wave & pure sine wave incompatibility. ;)
 

Naga

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sushrukh said:
I think, it's a problem which has happened to you only because of another reason.It has got nothing to do with the simulated sine wave & pure sine wave incompatibility. ;)
Obviously u have not researched the matter enough. Lots of ppl have been having the same problem, including me.
 

clown_abhi

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clown_abhi said:
Hey guys,

Why is the load mentioned in a UPS? I run a system which consumes ~375W of power at full load and with aging and all reaches 470W on a APC UPS 500VA(300W). Still it runs fine.

I have got a 1000KVA UPS(which should handle 600W) now but i just wanted to know is the load any important and if yes, what bad happens if running my sys on a 300W UPS?
Still waiting for answers from tech guru.
Funny enough the microtek service guy also had no answers to this question. :rofl:
 

Infected

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Jun 26, 2008
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Why is the load mentioned in a UPS? I run a system which consumes ~375W of power at full load and with aging and all reaches 470W on a APC UPS 500VA(300W). Still it runs fine.
How do you know your system is actually taking more than 300Watts, if you have an APC it will have the red light blinking to point out that the UPS is overloaded...and will shutdown.

APC in india generally uses Exide batteries. and for most of us it is the 7ah one. costs about 1K.

It has got nothing to do with the simulated sine wave & pure sine wave incompatibility
No it doesnt it has something to do with Simulated/Stepped Sine wave & Active Power Factor Correction (Active PFC). And only occurs when the electronics are pushed near or beyond their ratings.
 

Dinesh_Malhotra

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Jun 22, 2006
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i have a APC Bi1000i 1kva model...
it powers my rig, LCD, 2 tubes, 2 fans atleast for 5 hrs :)
 

star_86

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Nov 20, 2008
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Hi i m planning to buy a good UPS for my comuter, please suggest a dealer.
Should have a good battery life,
Should have warrenty of atleast a year,

Thanks.
 

abhi

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Jan 8, 2006
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Heres my Rig...
tagan 600 W psu,
core to quad 6600,
4 gb ram,
Radeon 4870 ,2 hdds,1 dvd drive,
LCD and xbox 360.

Suggest a good ups .....i dont want an expensive one.
 

spidy333

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Jan 5, 2009
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Suggest me a UPs for my config..

P45 chipset + Q6600 + HD4850 with Corsair VX450W.. I dont need a expensive one.. just protecting my capital from power surges and some 10 min backup...
 

akiso

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Oct 14, 2008
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Only problem in TE is that when u ask about UPS.
:ashamed: "Saap suk Jaata hai" :S
Koi reply nahi, badi badi gayan marte rahte ho. Atleast bata toh doh what u r using.
 

Phenom

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Thanks a lot for this valuable piece of information. I really didn't know this !!!
 

beanstalk_230

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Dec 28, 2008
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Lucknow
thanx a lot ppl for this important info...

BUt again it leaves me with a Q.. What UPS should be used with a VX450/Tagan 500/ other PSu's having active PFC if the budget is around 3-4k

OR

We should head over and buy a passive PFC PSU (Coolermaster Extreme Series) and simply buy a APC 650 or 750 UPS for it ????????

PUtting it down simply... Im buying a APC 650 UPS... NOw which PSU should i go in for.... to run the following config -

e7300 + 500GB + 19" for ATI 4850 OR 4870
 

arnuld

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Jan 7, 2009
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lispmachine.wordpress.com
VanishingNerd said:
I would like to add my personal case regarding this section. In my case the Corsair TX750W caused the APC 800VA Back UPS's max load to come down from 540W to ~250W. The APC guy was flummoxed by what was going on. The same UPS had been performing perfectly with the Cooler Master Extreme Power 600W I had prior to my getting the TX750W. In the end I sold it off to a guy who had the Cooler Master Extreme Power 600W.
Oh.. man so sad :(