Budget 41-50k PC for learning/virtualization

sunily

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Questions
  1. What is your budget?
    • 40K
  2. What is your existing hardware configuration (component name - component brand and model)
    • My old P4 is dead now. Since I already own a laptop so never bother to upgrade it but I need a separate powerful system for study
  3. Which hardware will you be keeping (component name - component brand and model)
    • Monitor - Samsung 17"
    • HDD - 250GB, 2 x 500GB, 2TB, External HDD (500GB, 1TB)
    • LG DVD Writer
    • Already bought a corsair mid tower cabinet
    • Keyboard and Mouse
  4. Which hardware component are you looking to buy (component name). If you have already decided on a configuration then please mention the (component brand and model) as well, this will help us in fine tuning your requirement.
    • CPU - AMD Ryzen 2400G
    • Motherboard - B350 (There are many models of this chipset from different vendors, not sure what's the difference, but I need which is VFM. BIOS should be latest)
    • GPU - I don't think this is needed
    • PSU - Best Power Supply Units to power all HDD. I may get rid of some after consolidating data.
    • RAM - 2 x 8GB
    • APC UPS (old local UPS is dead)
  5. Is this going to be your final configuration or you would be adding/upgrading a component in near future. If yes then please mention when and which component
    • Yes, will upgrade the following within 6-12 months
    • Monitor - 21" (Will make it primary and old LCD as extended display)
    • SSD
  6. Where will you buy this hardware? (Online/City/TE Dealer)
    • Gurgaon, else go to Delhi (Nehru Place)
  7. Would you consider buying a second hand hardware from the TE market
    • No
  8. What is your intended use for this PC/hardware
    • Gaming (very rare, may be 5% that too small games to change mind)
    • Browsing
    • Desktop Processing
    • Running some virtual machines
    • Learning some analytics tools
    • Watching HD movies
  9. Do you have any brand preference or dislike? Please name them and the reason for your preference/dislike.
    • I am good with any if after sales service in India is not pathetic
  10. If you will be playing games then which type of games will you be playing?
    • None as of now
  11. What is your preferred monitor resolution for gaming and normal usage
    1. Desktop - 1440x900
  12. Are you looking to overclock?
    • No but good if CPU and Mobo support it
  13. Which operating system do you intend to use with this configuration?
    • Windows 10 64 bit
    • Linux
    • Hypervisors
 

sunily

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Are you willing to bear shipment costs from Mumbai ? in case.
Surely, Nehru place will have everything you require..
Why should I bear cost or take risk of transit damage when I can go to Nehru Place and pick myself?
 

atiamd

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Nehru Place market is best for you to buy stuff from. Computer empire, cost to cost etc. are some good shops.

Also, you need to size your CPU and RAM based on how many and what kind of VMs you are going to use. e.g. your current proposal is good to run maybe 2 windows servers on top of the host windows 10. Or, maybe 3 linux. I can only run 4 linux VMs on my current config (AMD ryzen 1600, 16GB RAM). That too, are very slow on single HDD if all start doing stuff at the same time.

SSD for the host OS and apps is highly recommended, at least of 250 GB, but the more the better.

For PSU, go for a quality Seasonic S12II or M12II series e.g. Or, Corsair CX series at a minimum. Corsair VS and CS are not favored generally. 450 to 550W is more than enough for your use case. Even if you plan to put in a mid range gfx card later on.
 

vivek.krishnan

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If you want VFM, rather than going for current generation, go for one generation older (AMD) or earlier (Intel). Ensure you get a CPU with iGPU as well.

Also, an SSD is needed for sure.
 

sunily

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@atiamd
I won't be running more than 2 machines at a time at beginning. That's why I put SSD in future buy plan. What if I install host OS on one disk and create VMs on another disk?

These are PSU which I found from your suggested brands/models:
Is 430/450 W enough to power full system along with 4-5 internal SATA devices and external HDD?
CX550 450W 80 Plus - 4500
Seasonic S12II 430W - 5500

If not, then these are 500W+ PSU:
Corsair CX550 550W 80 Plus - 4800
Seasonic S12II 520W - 6500
Seasonic M12II Bronze 520W - 6700
Seasonic M12II EVO Modular 520W - 6700
How many connectors these have for SATA/IDE? Its not mentioned in detailed description.
If CX550 is also good then why should I spend Rs 1700-1900 more?

@vivek.krishnan sorry if I was not clear. When I said VFM, I was referring Mobo only as there are 10+ models of B350 chipset and I don't want to buy 10k mobo with many PCI/e slots when I have no plans to add any addon card like GFX/sound.

Once bought I have no plans to upgrade (cpu/mobo/ram) unless there is some problem and as long as it solve my purpose, may be 5-10 yrs, so I am going with Ryzen 2400G CPU.

Why RAM costs so high these days? 2x8GB DDR4 3000 is showing 20k+ online, local rate may be cheaper may be by 1k, but still that is too much. I also want to ensure that I buy 3000 MHz RAM only if mobo supports it. If mobo doesn't support more than 2400/2600 then buying 3000 RAM doesn't make sense.
 

atiamd

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Ram prices are high globally right now. I won't go into reasons in this thread. It can be easily googled.

S12ii520 looks at the sweet spot in your list Enough juice and decent price. I think it will Accommodate at least 6 sata devices. That's what you get from atx mobo usually anyway.

For 2 vm I think you will be fine and your pc now looks good for your purposes. Godspeed..
 

sunily

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Ok thanks, but I am still waiting for mobo and RAM, no one suggested any particular model for my requirement.
 

Party Monger

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i3 8100 will be enough CPU power for you. If you need more you can move to a 6 core i5. They have an igpu too.
Alternatively Ryzen 2200G will also work well. You can change CPU till 2020 cause AMD will support AM4 till then.
Ofcourse you can go higher on either. For AMD Mobo There is an asus one that has great specs at 5k. Including m2 slot.
--> https://mdcomputers.in/asus-prime-a320m-k.html?search=asus prime 320m-k&description=true
---> https://www.amazon.in/Asus-PRIME-A320M-K-AM4-Motherboard/dp/B06ZY2F35X
 

sunily

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i3 8100 will be enough CPU power for you. If you need more you can move to a 6 core i5. They have an igpu too.
Alternatively Ryzen 2200G will also work well. You can change CPU till 2020 cause AMD will support AM4 till then.
Ofcourse you can go higher on either. For AMD Mobo There is an asus one that has great specs at 5k. Including m2 slot.
--> https://mdcomputers.in/asus-prime-a320m-k.html?search=asus prime 320m-k&description=true
---> https://www.amazon.in/Asus-PRIME-A320M-K-AM4-Motherboard/dp/B06ZY2F35X
i3, seriously? Do you think it is powerful enough to run host+2VMs and to do multitasking among them?
I don't want to add/change it again to i5 next year.

And why if it is AMD, then why 2200G and not 2400G? 2400G have more core/threads, little more speed, vga11 and price diff is only 2k
Can u suggest 350 chipset mobo with M2 slot?
 

Party Monger

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i3, seriously? Do you think it is powerful enough to run host+2VMs and to do multitasking among them?
I don't want to add/change it again to i5 next year.

And why if it is AMD, then why 2200G and not 2400G? 2400G have more core/threads, little more speed, vga11 and price diff is only 2k
Can u suggest 350 chipset mobo with M2 slot?
I mentioned the minimum config. Going higher will only make it better :)
i3 8100 is a quadcore processor. Its basically 7th gen i5 rebranded as 8th gen i3. Just dont get older gen i3 as they were dual core.
 

atiamd

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Op, he is right. i3 8100....ryzen 2200g.... Ryzen 2400g... All are fit for your purposes. I3 8100 would most likely be faster due to higher IPC. All the three chips are 4c 4t.

For the mother boards there can be no suggestion from us because once you decide which cpu to go for you can then choose the mobo yourself based on your needs and budget. E. G. mATX boards will most likely have only 4 sata ports and 2 ram slots. So steer clear of them. Only get Atx as they have 6 sata ports and 4 ram slots. Ask the prices locally for every combo and then let us know. Then we can help you making an informed decision. Make sense?
 

sunily

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Op, he is right. i3 8100....ryzen 2200g.... Ryzen 2400g... All are fit for your purposes. I3 8100 would most likely be faster due to higher IPC. All the three chips are 4c 4t.

For the mother boards there can be no suggestion from us because once you decide which cpu to go for you can then choose the mobo yourself based on your needs and budget. E. G. mATX boards will most likely have only 4 sata ports and 2 ram slots. So steer clear of them. Only get Atx as they have 6 sata ports and 4 ram slots. Ask the prices locally for every combo and then let us know. Then we can help you making an informed decision. Make sense?
Isn't 2400G 4C 8T?
And i3 8100 isn't supporting HT.

Let me finalize the cpu then I find the appropriate mobo by comparing them.
 
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atiamd

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Oh yes, 2400g is 4c/8t. But its 1.5 times the cost of i3 8100 which is 4c/4t. If you want, sure go ahead with it if the costs are okay with you.
 

sunily

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Oh yes, 2400g is 4c/8t. But its 1.5 times the cost of i3 8100 which is 4c/4t. If you want, sure go ahead with it if the costs are okay with you.
i3 8100 - 9700
2400G - 13500

Do I need GFX card with i3 8100? If yes, then system will cost the same. If not then I can think of i5 8400 as well if it costs same as 2400G, but 8400 has very low base frequency 2.8 GHz compare to 2400G 3.9GHz
 

atiamd

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Then i5 8400 will be better. We can't compare frequencies of CPUs from different vendors and even different gen CPUs from the same vendor. In gaming benchmarks e.g. i5 8400 usually wins against ryzen 2400G when a discrete GPU is used. For your use case:

I cannot find any benchmarks that would suggest one CPU is better than the other. I can only assume i5>i3>=ryzen 2400g

And, yes, all i3, i5 etc. come with iGPU.
 
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Party Monger

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i3 8100 - 9700
2400G - 13500

Do I need GFX card with i3 8100? If yes, then system will cost the same. If not then I can think of i5 8400 as well if it costs same as 2400G, but 8400 has very low base frequency 2.8 GHz compare to 2400G 3.9GHz
Go with i3 8100, add gfx card later if needed.
 

Him

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i3 8100 - 9700
2400G - 13500

Do I need GFX card with i3 8100? If yes, then system will cost the same. If not then I can think of i5 8400 as well if it costs same as 2400G, but 8400 has very low base frequency 2.8 GHz compare to 2400G 3.9GHz
If you can afford i5 8400 then go with it. It is almost comparable to R5 1600 and better than both 2400G and 8100. Those quoted prices are high they are selling for much lower prices at other stores. i5 8400 will set you back by around 13.5K.
 

atiamd

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I doubt i5 8400 is "comparable" to R5 1600 for VM workloads. R5 1600 should be faster as it can provide double the threads. So, e.g. 3 VMs with dedicated 4 cores per VM will fare much better than i5 8400 given that it has only 6 threads. Clock speeds will most likely have less effect on this kind of scenario. The only reason why an R5 1600 is not suggested so far is that it requires a dedicated graphics card to provide display and thus will increase the costs. While an i5 or Ryzen 2400g or i3 8100 or Ryzen 2200g do not require a separate graphics card.

OP, rather than getting confused, I would suggest, you find the cost of the builds around these 3 CPUs and finalize your purchase:

1) Ryzen 2400G - Preferred due to 4c/8t
2) i5 8400 - second choice
3) i3 8100 or Ryzen 2200G - last choice. In your situation, I would go with i3 8100 out of these two due to the fact that you don't need graphics horsepower that 2200g provides and also i3 8100 will perform better than 2200g in the workload that you have.

Also, I have a fair experience with VMs. If you could tell me exactly what OS, apps, DBs etc. you are going to use, we can narrow down the choices together. Do you plan to purchase VMWare or will you be using virtualbox or would you buy Hyper-V?
 

Him

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R5 1600 definitely has advantage over 8400 for VM or other multithreaded tasks that is why I said 'almost comparable'. I am well aware R5 1600 does not come with iGPU. I made the comparison to give OP an idea how 8400 stacks up compared to other processors mentioned in this thread. The price difference between 2400G and 8400 is not that much. I doubt 4c/8t will make any difference for VM compared to a 6c/6t processor. Also I'm not sure what he meant by Desktop processing but for processing tasks i5 8400 will outperform 2400G in most cases if not in all cases. So below are my recommendation-

i) Budget choice - Ryzen 2200G or i3 8100

ii) Performance choice - i5 8400

I don't think buying 2400G makes any sense for non gaming build.