Rahul Gandhi on Rs 12K minimum income plan for poor

vivek.krishnan

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He made the people who were sincere and dutiful about paying their taxes and clearing their utility dues look like idiots for being sincere.
This is true for any and all politicians. Any sane person(s) who paid the loans before any write off will be swearing that they will not pay off any in the future, least they too get the write offs and/or loan waivers.

When this Mundra scheme collapses, its going to be another write off.
 

Arv90

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Any sane person(s) who paid the loans before any write off will be swearing that they will not pay off any in the future, least they too get the write offs and/or loan waivers.
I have a colleague from Andhra who has already taken loan last December for the very same reason.
He got a 2 lakh waiver in the last election and is expecting the same to happen this year as well.
What a pity!:(
 
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nimod

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He may have done some good for the poor but its too less imo. Plus the constant fighting between him and the center run by bjp who could have just stood quietly and let this guy do something. most Delhi people are probably against both aap and bjp by now due to the constant fighting for last 4 years. probably congress will get more votes than these two and will have to get backing of AAP to form the govt.
You appear to be mis-informed.
You must visit Delhi or try to get information from Delhi residents.
Do not believe what floats in media when it comes to opponents of BJP.
I am saying all this because you used word 'probably' two times.
 

Lord Nemesis

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Man you are a piece of work. I know a guy like you. Everyone is wrong, everybody is bad. Only you are always correct :D

Not paying bills etc is civil disobedience. Its something started by Gandhiji himself. The electricity companies were looting people. Just cause some people were willing to pay even unjust charges for whatever bad circumstances, doesnt make others who protest bad. You're totally devoid of logic or understanding of even simple matters.
Yeah, justify crime in the name of civil disobedience. If you don't want to pay for electricity, then don't, but you don't have the right to steal electricity and use it at the expense of others. Electricity doesn't come free.

Gandhi was no pinnacle of character either. He was happy to endorse the British massacring of tribes in Africa and didn't give a damn about independence in India till he himself got humiliated and his own pride was hurt. He may have grown wise over time, but not everything he did is a showcase for what is right as you seen to imply here. If not paying the bills was civil disobedience, then don't use electricity after that point or generate your own by buying fuel and using a generator instead of leeching off at the expense of others.
 
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toocool6600

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Gandhi for sexual self control experiments used to sleep with 3 women all in nude including manu Ben his own niece......... And it's true

Is there anything that gandhi didn't do which was not inappropriate?
 
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fractal

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It is true that corruption is rife in India and across party lines. However no Indian should be stupid enough to put their faith in foreign powers to improve things in India. There is a brazen defense today of neo-colonialism in the west but the actual results of bringing democracy and rule of law by foreign powers are to be seen in Iraq and Libya. Whatever problems there are in a country, being under foreign influence is far worse. We should be glad that India today is in no danger of being subjugated again by foreigners. India will have to solve its own problems however difficult or impossible it seems.
People got independence and this is what they do with it. There is no country that deserves its independence less today.
 

Party Monger

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Yeah, justify crime in the name of civil disobedience. If you don't want to pay for electricity, then don't, but you don't have the right to steal electricity and use it at the expense of others. Electricity doesn't come free.

Gandhi was no pinnacle of character either. He was happy to endorse the British massacring of tribes in Africa and didn't give a damn about independence in India till he himself got humiliated and his own pride was hurt. He may have grown wise over time, but not everything he did is a showcase for what is right as you seen to imply here. If not paying the bills was civil disobedience, then don't use electricity after that point or generate your own by buying fuel and using a generator instead of leeching off at the expense of others.
Electricity companies charging 2x price than what they should. You expect people to leave a necessity like electricity rather than use civil disobedience as a tool?

Tomorrow they start charging you for oxygen, you will ask people to stop breathing?

It is true that corruption is rife in India and across party lines. However no Indian should be stupid enough to put their faith in foreign powers to improve things in India. There is a brazen defense today of neo-colonialism in the west but the actual results of bringing democracy and rule of law by foreign powers are to be seen in Iraq and Libya. Whatever problems there are in a country, being under foreign influence is far worse. We should be glad that India today is in no danger of being subjugated again by foreigners. India will have to solve its own problems however difficult or impossible it seems.
I think we should ignore his ramblings. He speaks from a position of privilege in terms of both money and social positioning. For someone who has shit tonne of money at hand, its hard to understand why a 200 Rs bill being turned into 400 rs is a disaster for the household that barely manages to fulfill its needs in an extremely tight budget. His privilege blinds him to the problems of the less fortunate and less capable.

For him the world is black and white. If you cant afford something due to corruption escalating its price 2-3x, he advocates not using it rather than fighting against the said corruption. I think the whole notion stems from being able to stand on the backs of others and being able to wriggle your nose at them. If everyone can afford good education, medical facilities, electricity, internet etc, then how will his shit tonne of money help him stand out from the rest? So for him to feel superior and tell us that we dont deserve independence, he needs people suffering in silence, under his judgement and subjugation. That's the real tea.
 
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blr_p

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It is true that corruption is rife in India and across party lines. However no Indian should be stupid enough to put their faith in foreign powers to improve things in India. There is a brazen defense today of neo-colonialism in the west but the actual results of bringing democracy and rule of law by foreign powers are to be seen in Iraq and Libya. Whatever problems there are in a country, being under foreign influence is far worse. We should be glad that India today is in no danger of being subjugated again by foreigners. India will have to solve its own problems however difficult or impossible it seems.
I don't interpret his comment to mean we should get colonised again. I interpret his comments to mean the freedom fighters would turn in their graves if they saw what people are doing with the freedom they fought for.

Reminds me of that epic line of our presidents said. Narayanan i think.

Has the constitution failed us or have we failed the constitution.


[DOUBLEPOST=1555193330][/DOUBLEPOST]
A day later congress tune has crossed 4M views

1.5M more views in less than a day after i posted it here ?

BJP's tune is still where it was yesterday
Another day goes by and the congress vid is at 7.2M views
 
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toocool6600

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Constitution has failed and we have failed constitution

Because democracy is a hogwash, it was never there, it never will be, almost no where in the world, not USA even, USA is just a printing machine and a criminal entity, powerful by manipulation

Thing is human beings are born to be manipulated, just like manage farm of chickens and sheeps, that's the exact way human beings are managed, period
 
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blr_p

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Because democracy is a hogwash, it was never there, it never will be, almost no where in the world, not USA even
But what is your idea of democracy ? direct demcracy with refrendums like the swiss have in their cantons ?

USA is just a printing machine and a criminal entity, powerful by manipulation
I'd take it over the Putin & Xi criminal entity any day :D

Thing is human beings are born to be manipulated, just like manage farm of chickens and sheeps, that's the exact way human beings are managed, period
There is an element of truth to this. But then what. Yes, we are being managed otherwise there will be chaos.
 

Lord Nemesis

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Electricity companies charging 2x price than what they should. You expect people to leave a necessity like electricity rather than use civil disobedience as a tool?

Tomorrow they start charging you for oxygen, you will ask people to stop breathing?
There was a guy couples of years back who store from the bank and after getting caught, rambled on about how politicians were the real thieves as if what he did was right. You sound exactly the same way.

Do you know what civil disobedience meant in India before independence. Maybe you should read up on it?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salt_March

They didn't go and steal salt or let others pay for their actions because they ware being taxed heavily on salt. They marched to the shores to produce their own salt. People like you who support this sort of farce of stealing electricity wouldn't know what it means to stand for a cause. You are just bullies who stand up on top of others and act smug about taking a stance while you are just making others take the burden for you. To term that as fighting against corruption is laughable at best.


I think we should ignore his ramblings. He speaks from a position of privilege in terms of both money and social positioning. For someone who has shit tonne of money at hand, its hard to understand why a 200 Rs bill being turned into 400 rs is a disaster for the household that barely manages to fulfill its needs in an extremely tight budget. His privilege blinds him to the problems of the less fortunate and less capable.

For him the world is black and white. If you cant afford something due to corruption escalating its price 2-3x, he advocates not using it rather than fighting against the said corruption. I think the whole notion stems from being able to stand on the backs of others and being able to wriggle your nose at them. If everyone can afford good education, medical facilities, electricity, internet etc, then how will his shit tonne of money help him stand out from the rest? So for him to feel superior and tell us that we dont deserve independence, he needs people suffering in silence, under his judgement and subjugation. That's the real tea.
My dad was a govt employee who at his highest before retirement made about Rs 6000 per month. He was 13 years old when India got independence and watched it through the years till the 90's. He passed away when I was 14 years. He was sincere and honest towards his duties. He didn't let corruption breed around him either. There are many who disliked him and many more who idolized him for that same reason. My present so called wealth (which is not much) comes from my own hard work and my mothers and I was not born into it. Me and my sisters education was funded of what little my father saved during his lifetime and the little bit of ancestral property he had and was burned out at the end of it. I started out with a salary of Rs 11k per month.

So, unlike the pretentious AAP followers who claim to be taking a stance against corruption while discussing about using fraudulent documents to evade taxes not 5 min later or just leeching of others and acting smug, I know better than to stand for such stuff.

I can also totally understand people who are are less than fortunate and resort to wrong doing because they don't have a choice, but I am not going to let them preach to me that they are righting a wrong by doing that.

Most of the people who who followed AAP are frauds who are in it just to trivialize their own corrupt ways by attacking politicians whose magnitude of corruption is bigger than theirs. AK himself is the same sort. Its bad if some congress or BJP politician misuses public funds. But its not misuse when he does the same thing. Different standards for themselves and others.

I pay my taxes, perform my duties and then criticize the politicians for not doing theirs. The kind of people who go behind AAP are those that evade taxes and then rant about the corruption of the politicians and justify their own behavior by blaming it on corruption of politicians. Its a convenient excuse. Just like the electricity thing. Don't pay, leech from grid and let other more responsible people take the burden of it while acting smug.
 
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Lord Nemesis

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To be honest, Political support can be summed up with the example of pyramid schemes.

1. The kind who don't buy that bull shit at all because they know better than that.
2. The kind who get into one or two of them and realize that its a scam and get out and warn others that its a scam.
3. The kind who gets into it, keep on going while ranting that the rest are all scams, but bluntly refuse to accept that theirs is just as much a scam
4. The kind who get into it with the realization that its a scam, drag others into it all the while ranting that rest are all scams.
 

toocool6600

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But what is your idea of democracy ? direct demcracy with refrendums like the swiss have in their cantons ?


I'd take it over the Putin & Xi criminal entity any day :D


There is an element of truth to this. But then what. Yes, we are being managed otherwise there will be chaos.
Well you like USA system better than Xi or putin, because you are not able to see the horrible misdeeds or not able to understand what happened, mostly because its complex and hidden or simply people have become blind or don't care, all USA presidents since world War 1 are highest degree criminals who were so powerful that there was no entity to try them and hang them to death or give them 500 years of prison time........... Individually, so since no court can touch them....... To you they seem like they are good great or better than Xi or putin

That's your argument and it's a horrible argument.

World has been made slave since 1913 when they created federal reserve system and to you its not even a problem or anything to even think about or even consider it.

All wars or issues in the world are because someone who wanted world at their feet created them and USA has invaded all the countries because it was their agenda to remain on top, so they did what they found good to be number 1

Horrible deeds
 

Lord Nemesis

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Thing is human beings are born to be manipulated, just like manage farm of chickens and sheeps, that's the exact way human beings are managed, period
The difference between humans and our evolutionary ancestors like a variety of apes is that humans possess enough intelligence to have independent thinking and action despite living in a society with other humans. Apes on the other hand typically formed groups and usually, the most aggressive and loudest became the leader of the group and the rest of the apes followed it without question and mimicked the leader. This tradition of leaders and followers moved on to humans as well, but only because evolution is a gradual process and there is no abrupt transition to humans from their ancestral apes. There will be specimens born of humans, but with intelligence and mentality closer to their ancestors than humans. It goes without saying that some apes could be more intelligent than some humans.

So, it is not right to say that human beings are born to be manipulated and managed, but its more like intelligent humans have manipulated and managed the specimens of humans have failed at being intelligent enough to have what is necessary to characterize them as human beings. Basically they are managed like apes are managed.
 

toocool6600

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The difference between humans and our evolutionary ancestors like a variety of apes is that humans possess enough intelligence to have independent thinking and action despite living in a society with other humans. Apes on the other hand typically formed groups and usually, the most aggressive and loudest became the leader of the group and the rest of the apes followed it without question and mimicked the leader. This tradition of leaders and followers moved on to humans as well, but only because evolution is a gradual process and there is no abrupt transition to humans from their ancestral apes. There will be specimens born of humans, but with intelligence and mentality closer to their ancestors than humans. It goes without saying that some apes could be more intelligent than some humans.

So, it is not right to say that human beings are born to be manipulated and managed, but its more like intelligent humans have manipulated and managed the specimens of humans have failed at being intelligent enough to have what is necessary to characterize them as human beings. Basically they are managed like apes are managed.
Tomato...... Tahmato problem

Human being are not born equal and they don't have free will and can't control more than 5 - 10 % of their lives, intelligence has nothing to do with with who will control the world as such, American Chris langan with IQ of 200 is seen playing in game shows and lives in country side with his wife in a farm, although he is doing some high IQ work in science field but he is nowhere among the people controlling the world............

Human live in a hierarchical system and its a natural system which comes into existence according to the laws of the nature based on which humans got their deep rooted characteristics and brain, the brain works as it works because it's designed to make sure human survival at all costs............ Humans can't die just by holding their breath, they just won't, unless they do something in which death becomes inevitable....(anyone tried to die just by stopping their breath and successful let me know)

Religion came into existence for better survival before religion tribal system, with the process of cultivation the game of hierarchy system came into existence and so did the existence of the large society and small state, large state and then countries, but the problem was that not all people of a state can be the king, because not all people are born leaders and have heart to do things required to do, so hierarchy was imminent and it still is and it still will be

There is no difference in hierarchical system and capitalistic system it's all same and its dominant system because it is only natural state where humans intelligence system can be used and rewarded most efficiently and effectively for some kind of growth in the system, but it also differentiates between a rich and poor person, rich once became rich can be there for longest of time but poor will suffer long time although there is some chance that poor can go up top but its not in his hands entirely because he has no free will and no control over life more than 10%, nobody can know and do every thing, but rich has major advantages

Now in the modern system few top countries fighting top spots need to do horrible things to be able to be on top and for that they need to fool the public by any or all means which they are doing, and dumb public looks at American system and praise it like anything just blinded by money and big so called success of USA for last few decades not knowing they are supporting killers and mass murders and mass humanity ensalvers.

But what the heck if I get best salary, best car best house best brands to splurge upon, everything best of the best why do I care what the hell it's done, world can go to the dogs all i care

So lots of blabbing........ But humans are by very nature of their existence, born to be ruled
 

Lord Nemesis

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Words of Warning from Dr. B.R. Ambedkar in 1949

If we wish to maintain democracy not merely in form, but also in fact, what must we do?

The first thing in my judgement we must do is to hold fast to constitutional methods of achieving our social and economic objectives. It means we must abandon the bloody methods of revolution. It means that we must abandon the method of civil disobedience, non-cooperation and satyagraha. When there was no way left for constitutional methods for achieving economic and social objectives, there was a great deal of justification for unconstitutional methods. But where constitutional methods are open, there can be no justification for these unconstitutional methods. These methods are nothing but the Grammar of Anarchy and the sooner they are abandoned, the better for us.

The second thing we must do is to observe the caution which John Stuart Mill has given to all who are interested in the maintenance of democracy, namely, not “to lay their liberties at the feet of even a great man, or to trust him with power which enable him to subvert their institutions”. There is nothing wrong in being grateful to great men who have rendered life-long services to the country. But there are limits to gratefulness. As has been well said by the Irish Patriot Daniel O’Connel, no man can be grateful at the cost of his honour, no woman can be grateful at the cost of her chastity and no nation can be grateful at the cost of its liberty. This caution is far more necessary in the case of India than in the case of any other country. For in India, Bhakti or what may be called the path of devotion or hero-worship, plays a part in its politics unequaled in magnitude by the part it plays in the politics of any other country in the world. Bhakti in religion may be a road to the salvation of the soul. But in politics, Bhakti or hero-worship is a sure road to degradation and to eventual dictatorship.

The third thing we must do is not to be content with mere political democracy. We must make our political democracy a social democracy as well. Political democracy cannot last unless there lies at the base of it social democracy. What does social democracy mean? It means a way of life which recognizes liberty, equality and fraternity as the principles of life. These principles of liberty, equality and fraternity as the principles of life. These principles of liberty, equality and fraternity are not to be treated as separate items in a trinity. They form a union of trinity in the sense that to divorce one from the other is to defeat the very purpose of democracy. Liberty cannot be divorced from equality, equality cannot be divorced from liberty. Nor can liberty and equality be divorced from fraternity. Without equality, liberty would produce the supremacy of the few over the many. Equality without liberty would kill individual initiative. Without fraternity, liberty would produce the supremacy of the few over the many. Equality without liberty would kill individual initiative. Without fraternity, liberty and equality could not become a natural course of things. It would require a constable to enforce them.

http://mls.org.in/books/HB-2667 CPA Speaches (Eng).pdf
 
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toocool6600

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Keep reading ambedkar and all this and keep the illusions alive, real life is nowhere close to all these books

All of these books are for normal people, the powers that control the world don't read this ideal books and surely don't follow principles

Utopia is a grand illusion...... it never was and it never will be utopia

In my understanding I think there is huge injustice in this world as seen by the eyes of a ideal human, infact even ideal human not able to understand the level of injustice, only few of them can comprehend it.
 

blr_p

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Well you like USA system better than Xi or putin, because you are not able to see the horrible misdeeds or not able to understand what happened, mostly because its complex and hidden or simply people have become blind or don't care, all USA presidents since world War 1 are highest degree criminals who were so powerful that there was no entity to try them and hang them to death or give them 500 years of prison time........... Individually, so since no court can touch them....... To you they seem like they are good great or better than Xi or putin
Nixon had to resign that the system working for the people. Clinton was impeached in the house of representatives. Trump almost got taken out, fortunately Mueller was a professional. Indira lost the election after emergency. Can you point to anything remotely similar happening to Russian & Chinese leaders ? No, you cannot. So I rest my case.

Do you ignore the misdeeds that went on in the SU or what Mao did to his people ? nothing can compare to that. They also wanted to preserve this misery in other countries too. Why do you give them a pass. Because they never invaded anyone ? they have. Hungary, Czechs, Cambodia, Korea. And possible more if they weren't opposed.

Look the world council is the UNSC, where the cops are the judges as well and the only thing i'm sad about is we're not at that table.

That's your argument and it's a horrible argument.
Perfectly entitled to your opinion just wish it had legs :)

The fact remains we've not had a world war since 1945.

Like it or not the Americans have underwritten the peace in Europe, middle east and far east. They're tired of it now.

World has been made slave since 1913 when they created federal reserve system and to you its not even a problem or anything to even think about or even consider it.
You have a problem with fractional banking now ?

Don't put your money in banks then, put it in gold. Very common option in this country.

All wars or issues in the world are because someone who wanted world at their feet created them and USA has invaded all the countries because it was their agenda to remain on top, so they did what they found good to be number 1

Horrible deeds
Have to keep reminding Indians that we did this too during the nineteenth century. It's called keeping the peace and shaping things in your interest. Something i look forward to India doing AGAIN in the future.

The Americans are only the latest cheerleaders of the system the Brits put in place at the end of the nineteenth century. Given a choice after WW2, they would have been perfectly happy just to drink Coke and watch movies. Americans quite frankly think the rest of the world can go to hell. If Trump gets another term i see this happening gradually. Others are going to have to grow up and look out for their own. And not depend on the Americans.
 
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