You are right in that a price sensitive customer would not look at the framework due to the much higher upfront outlay anyway..
which leads me to a Genuine question (and not being sarcastic)- If I am from a non price sensitive demographic, spending $1000-$2000 every year (or two) won’t be an issue for me anyway.. so might as well get a shiny new machine each time
and Even if i am somewhat price sensitive, why not spend less upfront for a better laptop and change it for a generational upgrade after say X years as against trying to do modular upgrades every X/2 or X/3 years
the only reason for framework in India is to diy your laptop and for easy repair, of that’s u go for it and I do remember him taking about warranty but will have to look on site
framework laptops are made for technical people who mainly want to do the repair/replacement themself. although the idea is great, it is really not that good for a large part of users.
a normal user want a simple repairable laptop with upgrades. Mainly
1 upgrade ram x 2 ram slot
2 upgrade ssd x 1nvme +1 sata or 2x nvme
replacement for
1 battery
2 screen
the initial idea need, to revise the laptop ecosystem to follow a guidelines for components. no one gonna daily replace these main components.
framework laptops will replace cpu and gpu too? just asking….
I don’t understand the point of framework laptop. like you change everything in the laptop but then again you are still using the old housing/frame and display which probably can go bad over time. And upgrade mainboard cost is almost as a new laptop.
You may better off buying normal laptop from lenovo thinkpad series… just make sure the wifi/bt card support linux and get amd gpu or igpu varient. What more linux need to run anyways? Even if you face secure boot error issue you can easily enroll it in bios..
How are some of you not seeing the point? My MacBook Pro 13" (2018, 4 Thunderbolt 3 ports) is still working perfectly today. The display, speakers, battery (when idle), trackpad, keyboard, microphones—everything is perfect for me.
The only issue is the CPU (and to a lesser extent, the RAM), which also affects battery life. The M2 MacBook Pro has the same chassis and design as mine. If, like Framework laptops, we had drop-in replacements, I could easily keep using this Mac for another four years—assuming nothing else fails.
I see a huge value in what Framework is doing.
Another point is that it could pressure other companies to create more repairable and upgradable laptops, like HP has started to do.
And just for retaining the shell/display, you end up paying a premium to thr extent that a normal High grade laptop and a full new upgrade at a later point in time will be cheaper than a framework + incremental update
Its a noble concept as mentioned earlier - but thats about it. Building low volume modular components that are easy enough for normal consumer to update is far more expensive than standardized parts in bulk.
The net result being this:
Lets say you were to buy a non upgradeable M4 air today.. and a new M8/M9 Air 4 or 5 years later (with likely screen upgrades as well by then)
While I end up buying a Framework 13
Now The landed cost of the 2 you will get will still be the same as what I pay for the framework 13 today for retaining the optionality of future upgrades
And eventually When I exercise that optionality say around the same time you got your M9 Air.. My TCO now has already gone above yours.. Not to forget that The battery would anyway need a replacement , the shell would be ageing and the display would also have deteriorated
while you will be using a faster , nicer machine for a lower overall cost
@superczar it’s not just about the cost. It’s about fun, and also in a way about right to repair. I’d like to back a company that lets me repair and replace parts. It’s good ethics. I’m a Louis Rossman type asshole. I will back such good ethics any day. It’s a philosophical thing.
Btw, I think no expandable storage on phones of the worst practices of today, but that’s a discussion for another day.
PS. Why would you want to upgrade your display if you already have a nice panel? I doubt there are going to be amazing advancements in display technology that the display you’d get with this would become obsolete wanting you to upgrade.
Cost of landfill, disposal and reuse etc? TCO is one part of the story. Then there is planned obsolescence. I don’t think their target market is really you and me. Its the very small niche who do not subscribe to obsolescence and believe they are doing the world a favor by using their products for the rest of their lives.
With you on that - which is why I keep using the word noble to describe it.
The problem arises when people lose sight of why they wanted repairability in the first place.
A very small majority of the R2R folks want repairability for the sake of the environment or are thinking about the impact of e-waste on the earth. I can bet that 9/10 (or maybe 99/100) of those who cry hoarse about the right to repair on the internet will happily pick a new phone if they can snag the latest and the greatest on some kind of crazy deal if said crazy deal costs the the same or marginally more than the cost ofa fair priced modular battery or display that extends the life of their hypothetical designed-to-be-repaired existing phone
Hell , not ashamed to admit that I would do that same .
On a side note and re display advancements, many mid to high tier laptops now carry much higher color volume/ accuracy displays than what the same tier carried 5-10 years ago. Not advancement per se but a trickle down.
since the thread started with macbooks as the baseline, MBPs today have significantly brighter and true HDR (1000 nits) capable mini LED displays vs the very good back then but relatively basic now IPS displays on a MBP from say 2019. The difference in this case is quite stark
Similarly for base MBAs , the differerce is not as remarkable but big nonetheless. Current gen units have a 100% srgb coverage display vs 65% or so for 2019