Graphic Cards HD4000 RIG connected to LG 47" LED Strange Problem

terence_fdes

wizened Dinosaur
Herald
Hi

As this is a Display related issue, I thought of posting a strange problem here.

Re: Skipped/Rolling Field's visible when 1080p content was played.

FEEDBACK OF MY ATTEMPT TO CONNECT MY NEW RIG TO THE LG 47" LED TV VIA HDMI CABLE

TEST-BED: 3770K with HD4000; (no discrete GPU); 16GB RAM; Dell monitor connected to Display port; LG 47" LED connected to HDMI (MX Brand cable 1.5m length) (rest of my specs are listed in signature)

I had to shift my RIG closer to the TV and re-used one of my HDMI cables.

CASE 1: I threw every possible 1080p content that I had and even with high bit-rate's, there was absolutely no lag/stutter/freezing.

However, I encountered one strange problem - every now and then a "field" would skip or roll from bottom of screen to center & disappear....(this lasted anywhere from 1-4 frames or even 30-60 frames). This appeared even with content from my internal HDD's. I also noticed the same issue when I connected my external 2TB Seagate & 1TB WD Passport Drive (both these were connected to my CM Storm Stryker front usb 3.0 ports). This happenned every 3-5 minutes. This problem is not noticed at all on my Dell U2312HM monitor :23:

CASE 2: Played You-Tube videos (right upto 1080p) ..... no such "field" problem on the LG TV. Buffering issue with 1080p. Will try again after 11pm as my net speed is 4Mbps (otherwise 2Mbps)

Let me also clarify the term "field" .... this term is not very accurate in the digital world today, although it's still noticed in rare situations. I need to go back in time ......
Every second consists of 25 frames in the PAL system & each frame consists of two fields. Back in the old days when all TV programmes were broadcast using Tapes (Betacam/U-Matic/Digibeta), sometimes an error would creep onto the tape wherein a field would skip or a glitch would be caused due to the recorder/playback head not being clean. All video editors (including myself) had to have the skills to pick up such errors on the fly & noticed on high-end broadcast CRT monitors.....we would go back & delete 1 frame & continue with the recording.... and also monitoring video signals through a waveform monitor & vectroscope. Every TV channel would scrutinise each tape before it was telecast (this was done by the Quality control team & Sony Channel had the best equipment to detect audio/video errors on broadcast tapes.... and were dreaded by all). There was a list of 25 such technical errors (of which the "field" skip/jump was one). If there were more than 3 errors on the tape - it was rejected & sent back to the recording studio.

Today with digital files frame rates range from 23.976 to 60 fps. In India we stick to 24 fps & 23.976 for broadcast purposes. Most of our LED/LCD TV's have an Auto-option to handle various frame rates. To avoid such issues video (not film based digital files for theater screening) files are compressed so that the bit-rate is not over 12-15 MBps for a 23.976 or 24 fps content.


What could have caused this skipped/rolling field ? I can think of just 4 reasons
1] (maybe) the Intel HD4000 cannot handle high bit-rate >23 MBps encoded content which is outputted to a large-screen LED TV (say 47") ..... not sure if this field error would be noticed on a 32" LED/LCD
2] I do not have a dedicated GPU as yet
3] The LG 47" LED could not decode this high bit rate (dammit .....gotta run a test again to playback DVD-Ripped files).
4] HDMI cable poor quality - MX brand (this possibility is extremely rare & I have known & used MX for many years)

Any feedback will be appreciated..... ALPHA17 could I tag any, anyone out here

Thanks
Terry

Note: I had posted another thread HDMI WI-FI Dongle... Is it available ....... Now, I am in two minds if an HDMI cable could give me this minor problem.... a wireless could be a nightmare :no2:
 
Well if this happens at just in the beginning (when you start a movie), I guess that can be attributed to the V-Sync frequency changing from 60Hz to 24Hz.
 
Well if this happens at just in the beginning (when you start a movie), I guess that can be attributed to the V-Sync frequency changing from 60Hz to 24Hz.

Nada.... I kept playing each movie for 7-10 mins at least & then skipping or jumping ahead.

Btw... I was using VLC Media Player 2.0.3 Twoflower ......... could VLC be a problem ???

& I have disconnected everything back again .... so will check all your guys feedback before I resume testing tomorrow evening (hopefully).

tagging @amitkher
 
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Nada.... I kept playing each movie for 7-10 mins at least & then skipping or jumping ahead.

Btw... I was using VLC Media Player 2.0.3 Twoflower ......... could VLC be a problem ???

& I have disconnected everything back again .... so will check all your guys feedback before I resume testing tomorrow evening (hopefully).

tagging amitkher

Most likely an issue with the OpenCL driver, if installed...try uninstalling it :)
 
@Chaos, @cranky and @Lord Nemesis.

@terence_fdes you can tag anyone and everyone you wish not just me. (I am not an expert)

Have you tried running the same video / film from your SSD?

Update your motherboard BIOS to the latest version and update your drivers.

Can be the cable is saturated with the content OR cannot pump so much data continuously. This is just an inference I am drawing, let other senior members pitch in.

About the Wi-Fi USB dongle with an HDMI support, I did not pitch in because I am not aware of such a device and have recently researched about them and am still on the fence whether these could be the answer as the effective bandwidth provided by these will be minuscule compared to a physical cable.

Hope this issue gets ironed out as soon as possible. Cheerio!
 
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My take, it's a refresh rate issue and you're out of luck because the HD4000 is unable to accurately set custom refresh rates. I've faced a similar problem with ATI HD onboard graphics and my Philips display. In my case the problem got fixed with a driver revision and setting the refresh rate to 50Hz instead of 60Hz.

You can have a look at the driver property page and see if there's any joy in setting a custom refresh/resolution, however you will be stuck at that for both desktop and video. For a start, try setting it to 50Hz.
 
Chaos, cranky and Lord Nemesis.

terence_fdes you can tag anyone and everyone you wish not just me. (I am not an expert)

Have you tried running the same video / film from your SSD?

Update your motherboard BIOS to the latest version and update your drivers.

Can be the cable is saturated with the content OR cannot pump so much data continuously. This is just an inference I am drawing, let other senior members pitch in.

About the Wi-Fi USB dongle with an HDMI support, I did not pitch in because I am not aware of such a device and have recently researched about them and am still on the fence whether these could be the answer as the effective bandwidth provided by these will be minuscule compared to a physical cable.

Hope this issue gets ironed out as soon as possible. Cheerio!

Thanks Abhay .... looking at all possible options as my mind is gong BLANK.
1. I can try out playback from the SSD - but cannot think of this as a pernament solution
2. All my drivers + bios are the latest including Intel HD4000 Graphics (I've allocated 1GB RAM for the HD4000 & cannot go higher....for the theoretical 1700 or 1800+ MB on a Z77 board)
Not Installed (not sure) Intel VGA driver - I thought this is an outdated driver for my system with 64-bit OS

3. The better solutions to the HDMI dongle issue are priced between 3.5K to 10K .... which I consider ridiculous & might as well use a 5 meter HDMI cable - a good brand suggest. And the money saved goes towards a better GPU 660 .... which I wish to add by Diwali. So if after my further testing this "field" issue is not resolved.... then perhaps it's to do with HD4000

4. Most of my HD movies are from the YIFY team & I have noticed that in the last 2 months those guys have changed their encoding methods (from Blu-Ray) and are now using a higher bit-rate >23Mbps. Now even my WDTV Live Hub cannot handle this bit-rate effectively (lag/stutter/freeze)...... Will try posing this issue on the WDTV forums as I was going bonkers over this issue for the past 2 months. My WDTV firmware is also the latest. I repeat again that the above problem - lag etc DOES NOT OCCUR at all from my 3770K system...... just the odd "field-glitch".

In many ways - I feel I am discovering more and more on my new system (without a discrete GPU as yet) the HD4000 is great with After Effects & handles 3 complex filters in realtime.

Lastly (for now) - Is VLC the best available media player ? (I need a player that also displays .srt sub-titles ..... Does the old war-horse Windows Media Player do it?)
Should I install K-Lite codecs pack ....... [I always had this on my earlier system], but did not install on my new one as there are also so many un-necessary ones & not all of them get uninstalled successfully.

and yeah .... sid_donnydarko ..... will try the old tested formula of un-installing & re-installing some drivers
 
use media player classic home cinema with ffdshow tryout installed. in mpchc, use output settings as Evr Sync, and in Evr Sync settings, choose "Present at nearest Vsync". For 60Hz refresh rates use 13, + - 2. For 59Hz or less use 14 + - 2.

Use this guide for setting sync - vertical sync » MPC-HC GothSync

Please do not install any codec pack like Klite or cccp.

mpc-hc download: http://sourceforge.net/projects/mpc-hc/

ffdshow-tryout download: http://sourceforge.net/projects/ffdshow-tryout/
 
use media player classic home cinema with ffdshow installed. in mpchc, use output settings as Evr Sync, and in Evr Sync settings, choose "Present at nearest Vsync". For 60Hz refresh rates use 13, + - 2. For 59Hz or less use 14 + - 2.

Use this guide for setting sync - vertical sync » MPC-HC GothSync

Please do not install any codec pack like Klite or cccp.

thanks & this sure is interesting stuff..... will try it out over the weekend as the guide is really exhaustive ...... phew :O. Just one more bit ... which build version of mpchc do you recommend or which is the latest, is it this one
Media Player Classic Homecinema 1.3.1588.0

also would prefer a 64 bit ver ...... and not a beta
Thanks
 
i think those are patched mpc-hc downloads. please do not download from there. download from the sourceforge links i gave above.
latest mpc-hc is 1.6.4.4052. ffdshow tryout latest rev 4486_20120825 (it will install both audio and video codecs) and if you have not installed microsoft directx redist in your system yet, please install that first before installing mpchc. It is around 100Mb in size.
 
i think those are patched mpc-hc downloads. please do not download from there. download from the sourceforge links i gave above.
latest mpc-hc is 1.6.4.4052. ffdshow tryout latest rev 4486_20120825 (it will install both audio and video codecs) and if you have not installed microsoft directx redist in your system yet, please install that first before installing mpchc. It is around 100Mb in size.

oops.... thot that this was built-in the Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit. Will run dxdiag to check if it's there

This is gettin more n more interesting .... thanks @6pack :bigok:
 
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nopes. its not built in. you will need to install directx june2010 release from link i gave. i have same win7 x64 version too. directx diag wont show you if older versions are installed. some video codecs require the directx 9.0c versions of files which is not there in win7.
 
nopes. its not built in. you will need to install directx june2010 release from link i gave. i have same win7 x64 version too. directx diag wont show you if older versions are installed. some video codecs require the directx 9.0c versions of files which is not there in win7.

Just curious .... why do you recommend the june2010 v9.29.1974 version of directx .... and not the more recent ones?

the HD4000 needs which version of microsoft directx for windows 7 64bit ...... I believe it's compatible with DX 11.

Eventually by Diwali I will be going in for a Nvidia 660 GPU which again is compatible with DX 11.

Or should I play safe & install 9c first?

If I install DX11 can I go backwards ?
 
directx11 is not backwards compatible with directx 9 or 10. you need directx9 since its not installed by default in win7. many programs use directx 9 version and so does mpc-hc filters and ffdshow.
keeping directx 9, 10 or 11 all at same time wont hurt your system.

Just curious .... why do you recommend the june2010 v9.29.1974 version of directx .... and not the more recent ones?
answering your q with a quote.

What are the minimum requirements for MPC-HC?
In order to run MPC-HC with no problems you must have at least Windows XP SP3 operating system, SSE capable CPU and the latest DirectX 9.0c runtime (June 2010). Install it regardless of the operating system, they all need it.
 
Download the 32 bit version of MPC-HC. The 64bit is a bit buggy and results could be unexpected. Make sure the output device is EVR Custom Presenter.

I'm mostly sure its a VLC bug.
 
Download the 32 bit version of MPC-HC. The 64bit is a bit buggy and results could be unexpected. Make sure the output device is EVR Custom Presenter.

I'm mostly sure its a VLC bug.

Still waiting to sort this out as I am looking out for a 10 meter HDMI male-to-male cable to permanently connect my PC to my LED TV (hopefully by this weekend).
I am targetting MX cables from MDRelectronics
MDR Electronics - MX Electronics - Home Theater Cables & Connectors - Computers & Laptop Accessories - Pro Audio / Studio Audio Cables & Connectors - Audio Video Components & Accessories - Fiber Optic Component & Accessories - Cable TV Component & Ac
MDR Electronics - MX Electronics - Home Theater Cables & Connectors - Computers & Laptop Accessories - Pro Audio / Studio Audio Cables & Connectors - Audio Video Components & Accessories - Fiber Optic Component & Accessories - Cable TV Component & Ac
MDR Electronics - MX Electronics - Home Theater Cables & Connectors - Computers & Laptop Accessories - Pro Audio / Studio Audio Cables & Connectors - Audio Video Components & Accessories - Fiber Optic Component & Accessories - Cable TV Component & Ac

Will be meeting the manufacturers at the BroadcastIndia Exhibition this morning to figure out which of the above is best.
Note: a 20% discount is offered on the above for online purchases & will try to wiggle a bit more from them if possible.
 
use media player classic home cinema with ffdshow tryout installed. in mpchc, use output settings as Evr Sync, and in Evr Sync settings, choose "Present at nearest Vsync". For 60Hz refresh rates use 13, + - 2. For 59Hz or less use 14 + - 2.

Use this guide for setting sync - vertical sync » MPC-HC GothSync
.

UPDATE:
Thanks so much 6pack for helping me resolve my HDMI audio issue..... Just when I thot of resolving the "flicker" issue ..... the guide pages do not exist anymore :( .... Tried googling but no luck .....

Will try out the options as suggested by you

No luck .... check attached image (methinks I would need that "guide"). Refresh rate of my monitor is 60Hz so 13 +/- 2 was added




- - - Updated - - -

Download the 32 bit version of MPC-HC. The 64bit is a bit buggy and results could be unexpected. Make sure the output device is EVR Custom Presenter.

I'm mostly sure its a VLC bug.

No luck .... tried this option (see attached image)
 

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