Audio Completing my Audio Setup

B

balashome

Disciple
Hello everybody,

Thank you very much for helping me with my beginners' audio setup a few months back. I am a very satisfied man now. But as with all these gadgets, the urge to keep bettering the setup is always there. My present system consists very simply of a Marantz SR4001 receiver and a pair of PSB Alpha B1s.

To this I have decided to add the EPOS ELS Subwoofer. This should make the setup an intensely musical one - of course limited by the HT receiver and the entry level front speakers.

I will post pictures of the setup as soon as I have sub which will be later on this month.

Now, my objective is to give the system a finishing touch - round it off to a 5.1 while still strongly retaining its 'Music first' touch. My usage as mentioned earlier is skewed 60-40 in favour of music over movies. Over the past couple of months or so, I auditioned several speakers - bookshelves and floorstanders and have only managed to confuse myself more over the choice. Now, I need to add a couple of fronts which are significantly and far reachingly better than the PSBs for music as also a solid centre speaker. If the fronts are of outstanding quality, so much so that a centre needs to be postponed for sometime I am OK with that as well. The amount that I have earmarked for this exercise is Rs. 40,000. This is pretty much a rigid budget that I am working on.

The speakers that I considered and have auditioned at various points of time include:

- KEF iQ5
- Monitor Audio BR2
- Monitor Audio BR5
- Wharfedale Diamond 9.5
- EPOS M12.2
- Acoustic Energy Evo 3
- Jamo C405
- Jamo C605

Speakers that I am yet to audition but which still are in the hunt are:

- Wharfedale Diamond 9.6
- Mordaunt Short 906i/908i
- Mordaunt Short Mezzo 2
- Usher V602

All the other contenders except for the Usher are available in Chennai for auditions. Considering that I will have a subwoofer which goes as deep as 20 Hz, what fronts would you recommend? If you can think of options outside of this list, that too is fine - as long as it is still within the budget. My only consideration is that the new speakers have to be musically far superior than the PSB's thereby justifying moving them to the rear:). My preference is for Indian Classical music, Fusion albums, instrumentals and of course normal filmy music. Occasional pop/rock albums are also included for taste. I do not listen to techno rock, rave, trance or metallica or death metal and the likes.

My room is 12X14 and the receiver to be paired with is a Marantz SR4001 with 80W of power per channel at 8 ohms. I look forward to your thoughts and comments on this. As the thread goes on I also hope to be sharing my notes on the speakers I have had the pleasure of auditioning.

Thanks.
 
You're going to have problems.

The sound signature of the PSBs aren't easy to match, so when you move them to the rear, you'll have issues with off-screen dialogue and effects being tonally mismatched with the front. If that doesn't sound like a big problem to you, then read on. If it does, stick with PSB - you should be able to get some Image 4Ts for the fronts, though I'm not sure how much of an 'improvement' this would be over your current system. And the more expensive PSB lines are significantly more expensive, and have different sound signatures.

Anyway, to your contenders - I didn't particularly care for the Diamond series when I auditioned them, nor the Jamo C series. I did hear the iQ5 and iQ9. They're usable but i found them too laid back for my taste, and slightly flattering in the lower mids, which I didn't care for. I loved the Polk Lsi, they were a very close contender in my choice, even if they aren't on your list. Polk and KEF are both from ProFX, so you should be able to access both brands readily.

I would advise you to skip it actually, there isn't going to be a quantum leap forward with that kind of money, of course IMO. May I suggest you wait till you have a significant amount to invest, and then upgrade the whole system. If you indeed need a 5.1 just add the rest of the package from the same manufacturer/line. You'll get even tonal response and a good surround experience at least.

I would personally wait until I had a lot more money (~2 to 3 times your current budget) and then pick new mains. Some of the mains in the 50K-1 lakh range offer good value, far better than the ones in the <50K segment. The cabinetry is of higher quality, as are the drivers. Compromises are mostly limited to the crossovers, wiring and terminals. I'll be personally doing the rounds in November to look for my replacement mains and electronics, until then you're on your own.
 
Sangram - thanks for the honest thoughts. But like I said - the system (even though it is based on a home theatre receiver ) is skewed towards music.

For movies I have mixed and matched with different speakers as the rear and did not find it too much of a problem. However, going with conventional wisdom I will have the fronts and the centre speaker of the same make and model. This will ensure that I will have no problem as far as dialogue and imaging is concerned. And anyway I will not be listening to music in multi channel. For movies, the rear speakers are used sparingly and I will take any slight variance of tone in my stride, if (and thats a significant if) the fronts improve my overall musical experience.

Think of this as a stereo system - given 40K, which one of these speakers would you choose? Actually I was quite impressed with the Jamo C605. Its voice reproduction as well as imaging were oustanding. And it was quite easy to drive inspite being a mid level floorstander.

I am also leaning towards the EPOS M12.2 after having spent multiple sessions with them. But I want to make sure that they are the item to go with before I take the plunge.

I forgot to add that my source will be an Oppo 980H.
 
And Sangram - I really do love the sound signature of the PSBs. But the thing is that they generally dont seem to have a good conversion rate when it comes to pricing in India. Take the Alpha B1s for example. They cost just $169 in the US. Here it costs you 15,000. A similar skew is found throughout the line.

I am still willing to pick up a PSB speaker (within 40K) if it will be a significant improvement over the Alpha B1s. The obvious contender is the Image B25 but I have the feeling that some of the other speakers in contention have the Image standmounter well beat. I must add that I have not listened to the Image series of PSB.

Thanks for your help and look forward to your findings in November - although I suspect I am raring to finish up my system before then:)
 
I agree about the overpricing of the PSBs, as Lakozy is the only distributor of the brand. Even though I ended up buying my mains from him, this time they're not getting my business as I don't like their business ethics.

The Image series is hard to beat, even at their (somewhat inflated) price point. I think the pricing gets better up the line, actually, I remember they showed off the Platinum bookshelves to me @1.5L (the dollar price in the day was ~2500, prices have fallen and I'm not sure about the new prices), without any form of negotiation.

If you are in a hurry and like the Jamos, do pick them up. I really don't like any of their speakers any more, as they design primarily with focus towards HT and not music (with a few exceptions), and they sound like it as well. I haven't heard the EPOS, so do spend your time and take the plunge - it is important for you to know why you took the decision you took, specially when comes the time to upgrade again.
 
Sangram - I dont want to hurry and finish this system up by any means! This is going to be a long term investment. I dont see myself upgrading the speakers anytime soon at all.

Yes, I can see how the receiver might need a revamp pretty soon. But the speakers - I want them to pull their weight for the next few years.

So, I want to take a well considered decision within the budget as also satisfying the various parameters (musicality mainly) that have been set.

I really wish there are people here who have heard the EPOS and can tell me if there are other options that are better than that at a similar price point. I have also received advice at various points of time that at the price point I am looking at, it is always best to look at bookshelves rather than floorstanders. What is everybody's opinion on that?
 
ah, matching a center tonally to a different set of speakers.. Amazing twisted task that..

It took me 3 months and 4 returns to finally get what is a reasonable (albeit not perfect fit)

I was in a very similar situation a few months ago

Deciding on the sub was the easy part (Tonal matching for the sub was 100X easier compared to the center)

It took me over 10 odd trials and 3 returns before being able to hit the (almost) right center for my fronts

I wouldn't care too much about the surrounds

Even a half decent used surround pair off Ritchie street from a semi decent make will fit the bill...

As for a sub, I auditioned Torvin (rather earth shaking, but excessive distortion), Wharfedale (SW 110, was it?..very decent but ripoff price, perrhaps @ 150 INR to a USD), Klipsch (RF something IIRC...extremely boomy though) , Polk PSW (regular analog series-very boomy) and a Polk DSW (D class amplifier- very tight bass) 500

In the end, it was a close call between the Wharfie and the Polk and I ended up picking the latter

FOr the center, make sure your dealer is OK with you auditioning the centers at your home with Your setup and agrees to accept multiple returns till you are satisifed

Sangram, Personally, I have fallen in love with the KEF iQ5s

All I'll say is that this is the first pair of speakers where I can actually hear the enunciation of each word when someone like Snoop Dogg performs :lol: (not that I care much abt him, or his style of music)

Even though they are substantially cheaper than my main media room fronts, they beat them hands down on the transparency scale

All of that transparency and imaging comes at a cost though and I wouldn't use the iQ5s for say a Ministry of sound remix (not that I care for that genre either) unless they are coupled with a good sub

(My Phase Techs, or that Polk Lsi (C, was it?) would not need a sub for the aforementioned task though)
 
Superczar - thanks for chipping in. I might have to plan an outing to your place to listen to those KEF's. Tell me, if those are the old iQ5s wouldn't the new iQ5SE be even better? WhatHiFi says that they beat the Monitor Audio BR5 handily - not that I trust WhatHiFi in everything.

Also I think I might have to clarify on one thing. I dont plan to have a centre speaker of a different make or model. It is all about the fronts here and I will take the matching centre for any of the fronts I select. So, from the front I will have perfect tonal matching. It is only in the rears that there would be some disagreement. But that is OK.
 
Bala first fix a budget. One can only suggest something once you have a budget fixed. So fix a budget for the mains+center and the sub.

Out of that list, it'd be a toss up between the Usher, KEF and Epos. The rest I don't particularly care about.
 
Chaos said:
Bala first fix a budget. One can only suggest something once you have a budget fixed. So fix a budget for the mains+center and the sub.

Out of that list, it'd be a toss up between the Usher, KEF and Epos. The rest I don't particularly care about.
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Chaos - I had mentioned the budget in the first post. It is a rigid Rs. 40,000. And if it is possible only to get outstanding fronts for this price, then that too is OK. I can put off the centre for some more time.

Let me know your thoughts based on this.

Also I have already procured the subwoofer. Its an EPOS ELS Subwoofer. I got it for 30,000. It is expected towards the end of this month - being shipped from the UK.
 
In that case if I were you, I'd hang on and accumulate a bit more dough before pulling the trigger. Considering what you have now, 60k is the minimum budget you should be looking at for fronts.
 
Chaos said:
In that case if I were you, I'd hang on and accumulate a bit more dough before pulling the trigger. Considering what you have now, 60k is the minimum budget you should be looking at for fronts.
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But here is the thing, Chaos. If I do plan for a Rs. 60,000 speaker, will my receiver (Marantz SR4001) be able to drive them well? I suspect not.

That is why I am mostly looking at 8 ohm or 6 ohm speakers and not the really low impedence speakers like Dynaudio et al.
 
A receiver is a suboptimal amplifier for any speaker. You can always change later to a power amp/processor setup. For now just get the best speaker u can.
 
Chaos said:
A receiver is a suboptimal amplifier for any speaker. You can always change later to a power amp/processor setup. For now just get the best speaker u can.
Click to expand...

Chaos, yes, I understand that I will need to optimize my receiver for a significant improvement in music. But that is not planned for now. Right now I want the best fronts that 40,000 can buy.

When you talk about an outlay of 60,000, what are the speakers you have in mind?

I would definitely like to get speakers that work with my current Marantz. If this receiver is not able to drive them to very high levels, that is fine. But I should be able to drive them to reasonable levels. I want to have a pair of fronts that will be there for quite some time.
 
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