German professor apologises after denying internship citing 'India's rape problem'

[Spacescreamer]

A professor at one of Germany's oldest universities apologised on Monday for denying an internship to an Indian student because of the “rape problem in India” after the German ambassador strongly condemned the incident.

The matter came to light after a colleague of the Indian student posted emails exchanged between Annette G Beck-Sickinger, the professor at Leipzig University, and the student on the question-and-answer site Quora. Neither the student nor the colleague identified themselves.

The issue emerged amidst a renewed debate on the country's poor record in women's safety, especially after the controversy generated by the banned documentary, India's Daughter, which purportedly highlights the misogynist mindset of Indian men.

By Monday evening, another student came forward to tell the media that Beck-Sickinger had refused his PhD application in March 2014 on similar grounds. In an email purportedly sent by the professor to this student, she wrote she no longer accepted “any male Indian guests, trainees, doctoral students, or post docs due to the severe rape problem in India”.

In a statement posted on the German Embassy website, Beck-Sickinger apologized, saying: "I have made a mistake. I sincerely apologise to everyone whose feelings I have hurt."

Beck-Sickinger, a professor of biochemistry and bio-organic chemistry, did not deny the email exchange with the Indian student who initially accused her.

Reached for her comments through email, she told Hindustan Times that the matter was a "misunderstanding" and the outcome of an "unpleasant discussion" with the Indian student.

She claimed the university did not discriminate with Indian students and that she had accepted several Indians in her department in the past.

"Unfortunately, this mail was a misunderstanding. Of course, I have nothing against male Indians and I have accepted several Indian students in the past. Currently, two male Indian students work in a lab course with me in my labs," she said.

"However, my lab is full and I cannot take any additional student in summer. This led to an unpleasant discussion with one of the Indian student," she added.

One email from Beck-Sickinger posted on Quora stated: "Unfortunately I don't accept any Indian male students for internships. We hear a lot about the rape problem in India which I cannot support. I have many female students in my group, so I think this attitude is something I cannot support."

On the Quora post, the Indian student's colleague said Beck-Sickinger had also sent him an email in which she said it was "unbelievable" that Indian society had not been able to solve the problem of rape.

"I fully agree that this is a generalisation and may not apply to individuals. However, it is also unbelievable that the Indian society is not able to solve this problem for many years now. Reports reach Germany on a weekly base (basis), and especially these 'multi-rape crimes' are threatening, but for me also demonstrate the attitude of a society towards women. Also female tourist are kidnapped by groups of males and then abused," Beck-Sickinger wrote.

She claimed that "many female professors in Germany (have) decided to no longer accept Indian male students for these reasons, and currently other European female associations are joining."

German ambassador Michael Steiner reacted strongly to the professor's denial of internship and endorsed India's efforts to deal with violence against women.

In a letter to Beck-Sickinger, which was made public, Steiner said, "Your oversimplifying and discriminating generalisation is an offense to these women and men ardently committed to furthering women empowerment in India; and it is an offense to millions of law-abiding, tolerant, open-minded and hard-working Indians.

"Let's be clear: India is not a country of rapists. I would encourage you to learn more about the diverse, dynamic and fascinating country and the many welcoming and open-minded people of India so that you could connect a simplistic image, which -- in my opinion -- is particularly unsuitable for a professor and teacher," Steiner added.

Leipzig University was founded in 1409, making it one of Germany's oldest universities. Its website describes it as an "interdisciplinary, international comprehensive university" that was placed among the top 25 in Germany for four consecutive years by a global ranking agency.

Source

 

[letmein]

Cool story brah

 

[Lord Nemesis]

I don't see the problem. It is not the university that is discriminating and rejecting the students. If she in her personal capacity is uncomfortable taking on Indian students as interns possibly even fearing for her own safety, it is her personal choice. She has a very good reason to be uncomfortable considering how many foreign nationals especially in the academic sector have been targeted for rape in India.

It is amazing to the extent to which crimes against foreigners are usually suppressed in India. I think it was a German scholar some years back that was gang raped by a bunch of students along with her land lord and then raped twice by police when she went to file complaint after which she was threatened with death if she doesn't keep her mouth shut and leave the country immediately. Even 10 years back, when I was working at my previous work place, female employees from abroad traveling to India alone were regularly given advisory by their respective countries about the rape problem in India. The problem was so high at the time that the company used to send a vehicle from Chandigarh to Delhi Airport to pick up the visitors so that they don't have to travel in taxis anywhere in Delhi.

In addition when you see educated Indians like lawyers, judges and the like making comments about how women should be confined to their houses and how its their own fault and punishment when they get raped or even trivializing such crimes, what guarantee of safety do these female professors have that some Indian students with like minded thought processes that they took on as interns won't gang up on them to "teach" them a lesson for being progressive enough to get an education and taking on a job at the university.

Maybe, it is discrimination, but thinking from their side, there is might be good reason for them to feel that way.

 

[drkrack]

I don't see the problem. It is not the university that is discriminating and rejecting the students. If she in her personal capacity is uncomfortable taking on Indian students as interns possibly even fearing for her own safety, it is her personal choice. She has a very good reason to be uncomfortable considering how many foreign nationals especially in the academic sector have been targeted for rape in India.

It is amazing to the extent to which crimes against foreigners are usually suppressed in India. I think it was a German scholar some years back that was gang raped by a bunch of students along with her land lord and then raped twice by police when she went to file complaint after which she was threatened with death if she doesn't keep her mouth shut and leave the country immediately. Even 10 years back, when I was working at my previous work place, female employees from abroad traveling to India alone were regularly given advisory by their respective countries about the rape problem in India. The problem was so high at the time that the company used to send a vehicle from Chandigarh to Delhi Airport to pick up the visitors so that they don't have to travel in taxis anywhere in Delhi.

In addition when you see educated Indians like lawyers, judges and the like making comments about how women should be confined to their houses and how its their own fault and punishment when they get raped or even trivializing such crimes, what guarantee of safety do these female professors have that some Indian students with like minded thought processes that they took on as interns won't gang up on them to "teach" them a lesson for being progressive enough to get an education and taking on a job at the university.

Maybe, it is discrimination, but thinking from their side, there is might be good reason for them to feel that way.

Common , it's clearly her over reaction
She's feeling unsafe about Indian trainee committing Rape in Germany??
Then it's Germany's law and order needs to be set right..
This is the kind of colonial attitude we're still continuing, foreigners are always right.

How about European pedophiles roaming in India? Do we issue a travel advisory to kids traveling to Europe??
FYKI per capita crime against women is more in Germany than India....

She's over reacted, and apologized also, she's been mercilessly snubbed by German ambassador & rightly so. We don't even have that much confidence in our system & blaming ourselves!!

 

[asingh]

In addition when you see educated Indians like lawyers, judges and the like making comments about how women should be confined to their houses and how its their own fault and punishment when they get raped or even trivializing such crimes, what guarantee of safety do these female professors have that some Indian students with like minded thought processes that they took on as interns won't gang up on them to "teach" them a lesson for being progressive enough to get an education and taking on a job at the university.

She might have over reacted, but seeing the way men act around here in India, there is some justification to her "fear".

 

[techfan]

I don't see the problem. It is not the university that is discriminating and rejecting the students. If she in her personal capacity is uncomfortable taking on Indian students as interns possibly even fearing for her own safety, it is her personal choice. She has a very good reason to be uncomfortable considering how many foreign nationals especially in the academic sector have been targeted for rape in India.

It is amazing to the extent to which crimes against foreigners are usually suppressed in India. I think it was a German scholar some years back that was gang raped by a bunch of students along with her land lord and then raped twice by police when she went to file complaint after which she was threatened with death if she doesn't keep her mouth shut and leave the country immediately. Even 10 years back, when I was working at my previous work place, female employees from abroad traveling to India alone were regularly given advisory by their respective countries about the rape problem in India. The problem was so high at the time that the company used to send a vehicle from Chandigarh to Delhi Airport to pick up the visitors so that they don't have to travel in taxis anywhere in Delhi.

In addition when you see educated Indians like lawyers, judges and the like making comments about how women should be confined to their houses and how its their own fault and punishment when they get raped or even trivializing such crimes, what guarantee of safety do these female professors have that some Indian students with like minded thought processes that they took on as interns won't gang up on them to "teach" them a lesson for being progressive enough to get an education and taking on a job at the university.

Maybe, it is discrimination, but thinking from their side, there is might be good reason for them to feel that way.

She might have over reacted, but seeing the way men act around here in India, there is some justification to her "fear".

these reactions are akin to saying that since some terrorists wear turbans & have long beards it's ok to suspect everyone wearing turbans & having long beards of being a terrorist

 

[blr_p]

I don't see the problem. It is not the university that is discriminating and rejecting the students. If she in her personal capacity is uncomfortable taking on Indian students as interns possibly even fearing for her own safety, it is her personal choice.

Agree, there is no obligation on her part to accept anyone she does not want for any reason whatsoever.

i dont know how smart it is to serve under such a person who has been forced to accept you, its best to go where you are accepted.

She has a very good reason to be uncomfortable considering how many foreign nationals especially in the academic sector have been targeted for rape in India.

this is the part i find a bit curious coming from a prof. that she would mention rape (did she ever explicitly state rape as a reason for not accepting an application).

 

[asingh]

these reactions are akin to saying that since some terrorists wear turbans & have long beards it's ok to suspect everyone wearing turbans & having long beards of being a terrorist

Correct.

Prevention beats the cure. Depends on the brevity.

 

[Lord Nemesis]

these reactions are akin to saying that since some terrorists wear turbans & have long beards it's ok to suspect everyone wearing turbans & having long beards of being a terrorist

But then, that is how the world currently works.

Why do security details at airports or other places in foreign countries target people with turbans for rigorous checks? Can you claim that its racist if they do so? Similar stuff happens in India as well. Muslims and people who look like muslims are often targets of more rigorous checks and processes than others.

Why is it that when Kashmiri people (especially muslims) want to get credit cards, it is much harder for them than other people and that too they don't get the same level of credit limit as other people who have a similar job profile? Despite having similar job profile and salary bracket and all other things being equal, I have found that most of them get max credit limit anywhere between one third to half of other people.

One may think that its wrong, but that is the price one has to pay for the repeated thoughtless words and actions of even a few. This is no different. When some so called educated Indians with pea brains spew nonsense and want to behave in an uncivilized manner, the impact of that is going to reflect on the entire Indian community. After all, when people from Indian community here are discriminating against the entire female race, Is it so hard to accept that the female race across the world is going to hate and fear the entire Indian community?

 

[preetikarmakar]

I don't see the problem. It is not the university that is discriminating and rejecting the students. If she in her personal capacity is uncomfortable taking on Indian students as interns possibly even fearing for her own safety, it is her personal choice. She has a very good reason to be uncomfortable considering how many foreign nationals especially in the academic sector have been targeted for rape in India.

It is amazing to the extent to which crimes against foreigners are usually suppressed in India. I think it was a German scholar some years back that was gang raped by a bunch of students along with her land lord and then raped twice by police when she went to file complaint after which she was threatened with death if she doesn't keep her mouth shut and leave the country immediately. Even 10 years back, when I was working at my previous work place, female employees from abroad traveling to India alone were regularly given advisory by their respective countries about the rape problem in India. The problem was so high at the time that the company used to send a vehicle from Chandigarh to Delhi Airport to pick up the visitors so that they don't have to travel in taxis anywhere in Delhi.

In addition when you see educated Indians like lawyers, judges and the like making comments about how women should be confined to their houses and how its their own fault and punishment when they get raped or even trivializing such crimes, what guarantee of safety do these female professors have that some Indian students with like minded thought processes that they took on as interns won't gang up on them to "teach" them a lesson for being progressive enough to get an education and taking on a job at the university.

Maybe, it is discrimination, but thinking from their side, there is might be good reason for them to feel that way.

I agree to your point, if this the reality that foreign women wants to be safe than accept it. Yes, not every one will have the same mentality but, my point is when India wins a world cup we Indian are been congratulated and appreciated by the world, so now when we Indians have demonstrated such brutal rape cases than off course we all will be blamed for it.

 

[booo]

Its just like calling all germans nazis. generalization never solved any issues. time to learn mathematics, set theory and venn diagrams. rapist is an indian is not same as indian is rapist.

 

[asingh]

Its just like calling all germans nazis. generalization never solved any issues. time to learn mathematics, set theory and venn diagrams. rapist is an indian is not same as indian is rapist.

Not really. See what all, Germany and most of Europe affected by the war; have done to eradicate Nazis, Nazism, the symbols and basically the ideology. They literally wake up everyday, and say to themselves "we are not Nazis and will not let the regime come back"*. Now if only us Indian men can do the same, pertinent to woman. "We are men, and will be nice/normal to women and not treat them like animals".


*Yes, there were some witch-hunts, but we exonerated ourselves beautifully in this regard, at Nagaland time back.

 

[asingh]

I agree to your point, if this the reality that foreign women wants to be safe than accept it. Yes, not every one will have the same mentality but, my point is when India wins a world cup we Indian are been congratulated and appreciated by the world, so now when we Indians have demonstrated such brutal rape cases than off course we all will be blamed for it.

We Indians hate internal introspection and external critique. Basically feedback of any sort is seen as loss of face, dignity, and honor. The blame is spot-on.

 

[booo]

Now if only us Indian men can do the same, pertinent to woman. "We are men, and will be nice/normal to women and not treat them like animals".

well, generalization again...

 

[asingh]

well, generalization again...

Not really. That is why we have provisions for pre-natal gender determination, dowry, acceleration for abuse/rape judiciary. As I have mentioned here many times, there is a huge gender inequality in India. Be it literal numbers or the status we have given to women in India. The rural population do not even think in this accord, it is just normalcy. Urban folks are catching up, but behind their doors it is almost the same. The mindset will take decades and quite a few generations to deviate. That is why I correlated it with your example of Nazi Germany. They have taken stern steps to remove this stigma.

Can we...? Are we...? en masse..?

 

[booo]

^Yes... its very important for the govt to make amends to the rules to protect. but it is more important to educate people. making harsh rules dont change people perception. forget all the other things, simple things like women folk smoking or drinking or even buying booze is a huge thing in India. people need to get over it. govt should take steps to educate people on that. but instead the knee jerk reaction of making amends to the law to hang convicts.

killing bad people is not going to change the society.

 

[asingh]

^Yes... its very important for the govt to make amends to the rules to protect. but it is more important to educate people. making harsh rules dont change people perception. forget all the other things, simple things like women folk smoking or drinking or even buying booze is a huge thing in India. people need to get over it. govt should take steps to educate people on that. but instead the knee jerk reaction of making amends to the law to hang convicts.

killing bad people is not going to change the society.

See it this way. Educating people is going to take 3-4 generations. 90-100 years (maybe more), for the affect to transpire to a tangible and visible entity. Having strict laws will be an immediate deterrent and an attempt to harness this social monstrosity. A populations mindset (for any ideology) can change due to these aspects, rapidly:

1. A war.
2. Huge influx of invaders which forcefully change the people via rules and regulations (maybe not Afghanistan).
3. Cricket.
4. An injection of monetary vehicles which lure/tempt/entice people to act differently thereon think in variation.
5. Foreign rule (maybe same as [2] above).
6. A large scale societal program with controlled mechanism and constant vigilance -but- we might move to socialism then.

Now none of the above are possible, even remotely, and I would never in my senses suggest them, but they are observational in nature. What are we left with.? Education, of course. As you said. The problem is, the pace is snail-like, but the atrocities and boorish mindset remains. Women are still battered and abused mentally and physically. One issue: not all are successfully drafted to the net and confines of education. Now what..?

Nothing.

 

[Lord Nemesis]

Its just like calling all germans nazis. generalization never solved any issues. time to learn mathematics, set theory and venn diagrams. rapist is an indian is not same as indian is rapist.

Maybe it is wrong, but do you think that generalization is completely unscientific and discouraged?

How do you arrive at all those per capita figures. How do you derive the birth or death rates or even the poverty levels or growth rate of a country? Do you go out and collect exhaustive real time statistics for each and everything or do you just collect samples and extrapolate and generalize that data for the whole country? How do you get stats like xx% of the men do this or yy% of the women do that

It is far from ideal and may not be completely accurate in the big picture, but people still do generalize and believe it when they see evidence to reinforce those ideas.

If people think that majority of terror attacks in the world are being carried out by people who are muslims. People may still not generalize that all muslims are terrorists because of it, but its perfectly plausible for them to think that muslims are terrorists and be wary and cautious of all muslims because of that.

This is no no different. When women across the world hear that a rape is potentially happening every 2 minutes in our country and they hear the brazen nonsense of a few of so called educated people in the country, they may still not come to the conclusion that all Indians are rapists, but they will least think that Indians are rapists and would be wary of Indians.

 

[booo]

^ are you suggesting that the professor's perception was based on a scientific study? scientific study requires peer review. you don't take a scientific study granted.

all your argument proves that the particular professor was gullible. like most of the people. that does not make it right.

 

[asingh]

^ are you suggesting that the professor's perception was based on a scientific study? scientific study requires peer review. you don't take a scientific study granted.

all your argument proves that the particular professor was gullible. like most of the people. that does not make it right.

The numbers are all out there regarding the rape incidents. Now to cross reference them for sanctity would be impossible. Plus seeing how men act with women here, why would you doubt it. It is how people are signing off that documentary as a scam. Else we can wait for 5 years while the numbers are audited, and the dire situation for women continues. Can men in India remove the selfish "I" from their ideology...? Doubt it. I fail to understand the self defense and save-face attitude that Indians exhibit.