Headphones for replacing Sennheiser PX80/100


rdst_1

Well-Known Member
Veteran
I bought them as well to try them just because @red dragon spoke so highly of them. They sound great and all, but boy do they feel flimsy. Also didn't like their sound signature or the lack of sound stage. BTW, choosing DTS Surround feature on my LG G8X really helped with the sound stage. I might still hold on to them, but I am gonna put them on sale here as well. If someone pays me what I paid for them, then I'll let them go, otherwise don't mind holding on to them.
 

red dragon

Justiceforall
Veteran
They may feel flimsy, but drop them from 100 feet, nothing will break..they are indestructible...give em some time mate..the intimate presentation will win you over. Aren't you enjoying the splashy cymbals already?
They are possibly the best sidekick to the 650 you love...but I'm not in right frame of mind to discuss headphones today.
Did you get the yellow earpads, if so, DO NOT sell them now, even if you do not enjoy the sound signature ( understandable, it is not typical signature of high end Sennheiser, but if you listen to HD700, it will show you how bad this kind of edgy sound signature sounds with a large soundstage) You will be able to sell them at a very high price after couple of years.
After all these are dynamic drivers, give them couple of hours to play at least to open up the drivers a bit ( it is NOT burning in)
I never apply any DSP for any headphones. Give it some more power to work on, they will upscale drastically.
If you do not like this sound signature, stay away from bl03/T2/IE40 Pro, they are all pretty intimate sounding. You however will like IE80 in IEM and Meze Classic 99 in closed over ear cans. Beyer DT990 will also possibly disappoint you.
What exactly is bothering you the most? It is usually the treble and narrow sound stage (but it is extremely accurate) Could you find a single technical fault except the hot treble.
 
Last edited:

rdst_1

Well-Known Member
Veteran
They may feel flimsy, but drop them from 100 feet, nothing will break..they are indestructible...give em some time mate..the intimate presentation will win you over. Aren't you enjoying the splashy cymbals already?
They are possibly the best sidekick to the 650 you love
What exactly is bothering you the most? It is usually the treble and narrow sound stage (but it is extremely accurate) Could you find a single technical fault except the hot treble.
I agree that they sound so different to the 650 that they make the perfect sidekick.
Yes, the treble is higher than I like but it was the narrow soundstage that I found really difficult to deal with at first. So much detail in the narrow soundstage made everything sound very congested. I could hear everything but not able to place them right and that kinda diminished the pleasure the extra details had brought out.The DTS Surround feature helps a lot in that regard though. I did like that they are very detailed and great for vocals. Another issue I had with them was that they are very uncomfortable to wear. Maybe they'll loosen up with time but I have monkey ears so on ear headphones have always caused me pain if worn for long durations. I still haven't put them for sale so maybe somewhere at the back of my mind I want to keep them.
Basically, I can enjoy them for shorter listening sessions but not for the usual longer ones that I have with my HD650. My first IEMs that I really liked were HeadDirect RE1 known for their laid back sound, so I guess I have always preferred veiled, laid back sound over the detailed, in-your-face sound that these have.
 

red dragon

Justiceforall
Veteran
Finally got some time to spend with the new hd25 ( my old one is in terrible shape) and holy smoke!! The details!!
It's insanely detailed and clear, each and every instrument is precisely located despite having a complete in your head sound stage.
If you listen to some nicely recorded drum solos, you can hear ALL the ghost snare hits ( I know the solo as I recorded it myself), I tried with all my cans, only NDH20 is somewhat close ( which costs 5-6 times more) HD600 presented it nicely, but missed a lot of details ( no wonder no one mixes with them)
This a pure studio tracking headphones with some nice add-ons.
 
Last edited:

Julian

om nom nom
Veteran
Finally got some time to spend with the new hd25 ( my old one is in terrible shape) and holy smoke!! The details!!
It's insanely detailed and clear, each and every instrument is precisely located despite having a complete in your head sound stage.
If you listen to some nicely recorded drum solos, you can hear ALL the ghost snare hits ( I know the solo as I recorded it myself), I tried with all my cans, only NDH20 is somewhat close ( which costs 5-6 times more) HD600 presented it nicely, but missed a lot of details ( no wonder no one mix with them)
This a pure studio tracking headphones with some nice add-ons.
I still don't believe/understand how you guys are hyping these little guys so much when you already own monster cans cost 10x as much! I mean i seriously can't imagine supraaurals sounding better than circumaurals. And not even considering the passive isolation.

If my ears were in shape i would have bought a pair just to see what all the fuss is about lol

p.s. Are you all set to leave?
 

red dragon

Justiceforall
Veteran
Trust me man, this is a really good one. And it was really expensive even a year back for an on-ear.
These are possibly 25 years old cans still in production with minimal change in design and sound signature.
Something must be really right with them to be used for 2 decades and still going very strong among DJs and professional videographers.
Yes, pretty much set...long drive today to Kosice ( a beautiful city in Slovakia, Kosice)
 

Julian

om nom nom
Veteran
I haven't seen one in person, but from the photos they look more like the Beyerdynamic industrial design rather than a typical Sennheiser. They look like a smaller version of my dt770. I guess the exceptional sound quality but in a more compact package must be what people like. I also saw a plus version on Amazon. What's the difference?

Safe trip!
 

red dragon

Justiceforall
Veteran
Buddy, I will try to send you a pair of hd25 to you once I reach and settle down a bit in Africa as a small Christmas gift. Please PM your address at your convenience.
I'm sure your ears will be fine by then.
You're right, they look and sound like some of the Beyer on ears, but with the fantastic Sennheiser mid and absolutely no trace of their veil.
I'm sure you will be able to appreciate them.
Trust me on this, I'm not easy to please when it comes to headphones. I hate expensive cans like hd700 ( absolutely rubbish IMHO)
Even the hd600 doesn't really impress me anymore, honestly hd598 sounds better to my ears.
Even the hd820 is an overpriced POS ( except soundstage, nothing is exceptionally good in it)
I got rid of most of my expensive cans except 2.
LCD X ( absolutely phenomenal sounding)
Neumann NDH20 ( the most accurate headphones I've heard)
Sundara is not that expensive, but sounds perfect (hifiman could easily priced them higher, yet people would buy)
And there are cheap stuff with fantastic sound, specially the IEMs..T2/ ie40 pro/ bl03 are all better than IEMs costing 10-20 times more.
The ie40 truly deserves the pro name, it's possibly the cheapest on stage monitor which can easily compete with entry/ mid level customs.
It's definitely better than Andromeda and JH audio IEMs even for casual listeners ( getting a good seal is the main issue, with a proper seal, I'm pretty sure most people can't distinguish them from 1000 USD IEMs)
I will rank HD25 in that top tier, those rare breed of cans which have enough bass, excellent treble extension without a recessed mid. Technically superior to HD6XX any day.
 

Julian

om nom nom
Veteran
Don't think there's much chance of that, my dt770 are nicely packed away in their box for a couple months now and i only listen (very softly) on my crappy old speakers (atp3). But the last couple days i think i listened either to too much music or too loud for my ears (not that loud at all for a normal person) and now the tinnitus is more aggresive. I think i need to rest them for a few days again. The ENT actually gave me a pretty good heads-up so i'm not that surprised, but he said that this is probably not going to go away very easily. So while sounding like a total pessimist, i think i'm done with headphones (and sanity) for the foreseeable future.

Talking about IEMs, i've always liked Sony's non-XB ones. In fact the ones which come with some phones were pretty good, like the mh750. I was also quite happy with the ones that came with my mw600 bluetooth. They're short length so just need an extension to use with a phone. But i've had REALLY shitty luck with MEElectronics. First I bought the m9 a few years back because they were ultra-cheap ($7 or 8). They sounded good enough but just wouldn't seal. No matter what tips i used. So the piss poor isolation meant i could also hear all the ambient noises. Ended up giving it away to a friend. Couple years later I again bought a Mee (some people never learn eh?). This time the M6 Pro. Thought they would help for my drumming (though i use an electronic set, for whenever i may need to play on an acoustic). Well, these $40 beauties sound awesome, but again, TERRIBLE ISOLATION! Just like the M9. Even the ceiling fan sound leaks into my ears. So they are also packed away nicely in their box. The only proper earphones i can use are the ones which came with the BT. Mine are not the MH755 with the flat backs but the older, rounded back version. These are all under $10 and are miles better than the boat/jbl cheap crap.
 

lepermessiah

Member
Disciple
I agree that they sound so different to the 650 that they make the perfect sidekick.
Yes, the treble is higher than I like but it was the narrow soundstage that I found really difficult to deal with at first. So much detail in the narrow soundstage made everything sound very congested. I could hear everything but not able to place them right and that kinda diminished the pleasure the extra details had brought out.The DTS Surround feature helps a lot in that regard though. I did like that they are very detailed and great for vocals. Another issue I had with them was that they are very uncomfortable to wear. Maybe they'll loosen up with time but I have monkey ears so on ear headphones have always caused me pain if worn for long durations. I still haven't put them for sale so maybe somewhere at the back of my mind I want to keep them............
I guess it boils down to preferences. Looks like you enjoy headphones with a wide, 3D like soundstage with a laid back presentation. I did not like the Audio Technica M50x-s which had a wider soundstage and more recessed mids but loved the HD25 and Grado SR60-s with their hot treble. Weirdly, I found these comfortable enough. Not on the level of a PX80/100, but not too bad, nonetheless. Why don't you try velour pads? They should be more comfortable than the supplied pleather pads at the cost of some isolation.

Finally got some time to spend with the new hd25 ( my old one is in terrible shape) and holy smoke!! The details!!
It's insanely detailed and clear, each and every instrument is precisely located despite having a complete in your head sound stage......

You can say that again. Listening to well mastered songs on these are awesome. I found that these are quite unforgiving of poorly mastered songs and does nothing to sugarcoat the flaws. As you said, these are actual studio headphones with a little sprinkling of treble and bass. Listening to Opeth on these is a treat.

I still don't believe/understand how you guys are hyping these little guys so much when you already own monster cans cost 10x as much! I mean i seriously can't imagine supraaurals sounding better than circumaurals. And not even considering the passive isolation.......

These isolate pretty well, actually. Coupled with a snug fit and high sensitivity which can make these go loud, I actually cannot hear phones ringing near me when I am listening to a song on these.

Trust me man, this is a really good one. And it was really expensive even a year back for an on-ear.
These are possibly 25 years old cans still in production with minimal change in design and sound signature.
Something must be really right with them to be used for 2 decades and still going very strong among DJs and professional videographers.....
I was ogling at these since 2012 when I was interning. Even back then, these weren't cheap- around 18K and 14K on Ebay for a lower impedance variant which had aluminum housings instead of plastic (Adidas special edition or Amperior- I forgot). Stayed away since I couldn't afford them. Even used ones go for 14-15K even at the beginning of this year.

... I also saw a plus version on Amazon. What's the difference?...
I think the plus version has some more accessories like a carry case, extra cables and earpads.

......the fantastic Sennheiser mid and absolutely no trace of their veil.
Agreed. Though the mids aren't as forward as my Grados, these are no slouches. Very clear and crisp.

I hate expensive cans like hd700 ( absolutely rubbish IMHO)
Am curious.. Why did you not like them?

Even the hd820 is an overpriced POS ( except soundstage, nothing is exceptionally good in it)
Again, curious. Could you tell me more?

I got rid of most of my expensive cans except 2.
Looks like I would be doing the same (albeit not so expensive as the ones in your collection). Might put up my Grados for sale and stick with just the HD25 and PX100.

Sundara is not that expensive, but sounds perfect (hifiman could easily priced them higher, yet people would buy)
Was curious about these too. How good is their comfort and soundstage? How good are these at instrument separation?

And there are cheap stuff with fantastic sound, specially the IEMs..T2/ ie40 pro/ bl03 are all better than IEMs costing 10-20 times more.
The ie40 truly deserves the pro name, it's possibly the cheapest on stage monitor which can easily compete with entry/ mid level customs.
It's definitely better than Andromeda and JH audio IEMs even for casual listeners ( getting a good seal is the main issue, with a proper seal, I'm pretty sure most people can't distinguish them from 1000 USD IEMs)
Woah- better than the Andromeda?! High praise since the Andromedas are known to be quite sensitive and resolving.

I will rank HD25 in that top tier, those rare breed of cans which have enough bass, excellent treble extension without a recessed mid. Technically superior to HD6XX any day.
Again, high praise when you are ranking them above the HD6XX which were already well regarded. Can't thank you enough for telling me when the HD25 was going on sale in Amazon. Best money I have spent on a pair of headphones.

.....So while sounding like a total pessimist, i think i'm done with headphones (and sanity) for the foreseeable future.
I would have gone mad for sure. Don't know how you are holding up.
 

Julian

om nom nom
Veteran
One day at a time type. Life was already pretty shit before the lockdown etc. now this happened. Although I've passed the ending-it-all type of thoughts phase a few years ago. I think I'm just too fed up with everything to even bother lol. Nothing really matters anyway. We started as atoms and will end the same. What we do in between really is insignificant.

P.s. i read what you wrote about the sensitivity etc. Please, please do not listen to music too loud. Can't say when the shit hits the fan.
 

lepermessiah

Member
Disciple
P.s. i read what you wrote about the sensitivity etc. Please, please do not listen to music too loud. Can't say when the shit hits the fan.

Of course. In fact, I usually don't even come close to 50% of the volume (on the V20 it is about 22-26 on the HiFi DAC mode). I kind of have sensitive ears and do not want to ruin them in any way by listening to stuff at high volume.
 

rdst_1

Well-Known Member
Veteran
I guess it boils down to preferences. Looks like you enjoy headphones with a wide, 3D like soundstage with a laid back presentation. I did not like the Audio Technica M50x-s which had a wider soundstage and more recessed mids but loved the HD25 and Grado SR60-s with their hot treble. Weirdly, I found these comfortable enough. Not on the level of a PX80/100, but not too bad, nonetheless. Why don't you try velour pads? They should be more comfortable than the supplied pleather pads at the cost of some isolation.

Yeah. I am trying hard to like them, but the congested soundstage always gets to me. Have spent couple of hours A/Bing them and always liked the HD650 better even when running with the same amp.
I am still going to hold on to them because they are easy to drive with my phones and I don't need to amp up the volume as high as I do on the 650s. I have a feeling these will be much better suited to listening to Hindi music or Acoustic tracks like you seem to be enjoying them with. In songs where a lot is going on, I find everything getting mixed up, which becomes actually worse because of the detail retrieval these have.
 

red dragon

Justiceforall
Veteran
Please don't get me wrong, Andromeda is a wonderful IEM and made with a lot of care and passion. And it sounds beautiful.
But it's very sensitive, hisses a lot with older hifiman DAPs.
But the most irritating thing for me is that it is extremely forgiving. It has this strange capability of making even Muse albums very dynamic!! I could see the waveforms almost brickwalling in a DAW, with definite clipping at points, but couldn't hear it!!
It didn't try to sweeten the sound like cheaper IEMs do, it did something magical. It's perfect for listening to music, but not at all suitable for tracking/ mixing.
HD700 needs a thread for bashing...it should not exist IMHO
@lepermessiah, buddy, I'm pretty sure you're a Metallica f
 

Top