Manual control on SX100 and A590?

[Renegade]

I am looking to buy a digicam. Was confused between A590, TZ4 and SX100.

What I require is a good P&S with manual control so that I can get some fundamentals in spare time. The TZ4 doesnt have manual but has 28mm lens.

How good are the manual features. Aperture, shutter, focal length, manual exposure etc on the A590 and SX100. Are they really worth their presence.

What about the SX100's features. Are they superior as far as manual control goes.

I am not really concerned about the optical zoom. Even 4X would do.

If the manual isnt upto the mark then I guess the wide angle lens wins the battle.

EDIT - Just read that SX100 doesnt have exposure bracketing Its a really useful feature!
Does A590 and TZ4 have it?

 

[Crazy_Eddy]

Silly question, but .. Have you considered a DSLR ?

 

[-D.Payne-]

Well, the A,S,M modes on both those cameras will let you learn a lot in the long run. They do "work", and are quite different in terms of use and experiment-ability.

But in terms of full manual control with EV bracketing etc., you'll only have to move up to a superzoom - which is quite bulky. It's quite sad that we don't have cameras with full manual control but without the bulkiness of the superzooms anymore.

There are really no great standard zooms cameras with full manual controls out there right now except for the G9/G7 and the Ricoh GR series which are also too expensive to consider.

My best bet for you among those choices would be the SX100IS for versatility or the TZ4 for wide-angle shooting + portability but with no manual controls (who knows, it might lead to better experimentation. ).

FYI, I use my camera (Sony H2) in P-mode (Program) 90% of the time. Then it all comes down to taking the picture at hand. Aperture and Shutter priority are useful but only in some circumstances.

Payne

 

[Brendon]

^^ Good advice ! But I would suggest you go for the Canon since with manual controls as you can really learn a lot about photography.

I have a bulky Fuji S5600 and a more compact Nikon Coolpix. I however rarely use the Coolpix since I can't adjust squat !

 

[Switch]

Look who is askin for advise

Anyways a 590 with IS is an excellent point and shoot... Sx100 should also be good but would be considered bulky in comparison to 590... I happened to gift one to my sister(590) just about a month back and they being first time shooters took some excellent pics with the cam... Has good manual controls too...

So if you ask me 590 it is... Cause of the sheer size...

P.S. I got one with a hard case and a 2 GB Sandisk Mem card for 9K from Palika about a month back...

 

[Renegade]

Thanks all 3 of you for your opinions, really useful in putting things in perspective.

My best bet for you among those choices would be the SX100IS for versatility or the TZ4 for wide-angle shooting + portability but with no manual controls (who knows, it might lead to better experimentation. ).

FYI, I use my camera (Sony H2) in P-mode (Program) 90% of the time. Then it all comes down to taking the picture at hand. Aperture and Shutter priority are useful but only in some circumstances.

Payne

The TZ does have a lot more programmed modes and I think it also has exposure bracketing. Read on DP review on the spec sheet.

Why cant they put a damn small feature on the canons

^^ Good advice ! But I would suggest you go for the Canon since with manual controls as you can really learn a lot about photography.

SX100 is 150% of what A590 is selling for. I wonder if the price difference is justified for the 10X zoom (for me) :ashamed:

Look who is askin for advise

P.S. I got one with a hard case and a 2 GB Sandisk Mem card for 9K from Palika about a month back...

I dont know what youre talking about :bleh:

Palika is out of question since I need one sitting on my ass There arent any available locally in that *price range*. So will be buying it online by tonight.

@everyone - How much zoom do you use when you are not peeping :rofl:

 

[Chaos]

[Spam]How about a DSLR :rofl:[/Spam]

 

[-D.Payne-]

@Chaos: Hehehe. I *think* he wants something less bulky than your average dSLR (Olympus E-420 included. )

@Renegade: Don't think about in terms of zoom. I'll tell you what the most usual feature of all these superzoom cameras is: A fast lens!

What is a fast lens? The average 3x-4x zoom camera have ranges of 35-140mm at f2.8-f5.3 to f5.6. (If you do not know, people who do know - ignore!)
That means: at 3x zoom all these "standard" cameras are taking in 4 times lesser light than with no zoom or their widest angle. (Since area of the aperture opening is inversely proportional to the square of the diameter; and f5.6 is twice as small as f2.8)
SO, at shots taken at 3-4x zoom in all standard cameras indoors or at night time are a tough fight because either shutter speeds have to 4 times slower or flash has to be on. Even if flash is on, due to the reduced aperture the flash intensity is also decreased. Most of these cameras have weak flashes on board, so these shots come out real dark.

NOW, for a superzoom the range is usually between f2.8 to f3.5-f4 types. So though MOST of your use of the zoom lens is at around the 3x-5x range (for a 12x zoom lens camera), you'll get much better aperture values at around f3-f3.4. This means better light-gathering (upto 3 times more), better use of flash (plus these cams have stronger flashes) and faster shutter speeds.

And that's my case for a superzoom camera.

*back to work.*
Payne

PS: I keep repeating 3x, 4x zoom factors but it should ideally be in focal-lengths (mm). But this just makes it user-friendly.

 

[BIKeINSTEIN]

n00b- you need a DSLR. :rofl:

here's my logic for 10x min.

Just like in Engg, for a 100mks paper, one aint scoring 100 in real.
same way you won't be using 10x 99% of the time.
Plus if you have sniped in some game like Far cry- seen the instability at high zoom levels- pointless for handheld cam.

So just like 40% of 100 means 'pass' and a happy me, if i need stable, solid, good 40%, i.e good 4x in P&S(or PoS some may say:lol cams, i need to be aiming for 100% na- i.e. 10x in cam lingo.

Wah- whatta a theory. :O

:stup1:

 

[Renegade]

@Chaos: Hehehe. I *think* he wants something less bulky than your average dSLR (Olympus E-420 included. )

Ignore him and bikey, they are just trying to have fun at my expense. I was all set to buy the A590 until chaos confused me with TZ4 and then SX100 and now he wants me to buy a DSLR. Masky even went ahead and suggested a FM10 :O

:rofl: @ bikey's theory. Then I guess i need to chose between TZ4 and SX100. Have a theory for that too? :bleh:

EDIT - I thought a larger aperture range was better for more control. And isnt the shutter speed dependant on what aperture I choose to shoot with? :S Damn I am confused now. Half knowledge is dangerous, time to hit the books.

 

[Renegade]

PS: I keep repeating 3x, 4x zoom factors but it should ideally be in focal-lengths (mm). But this just makes it user-friendly.

I know, I know.

On one hand I have a cam with 28mm for wide angle shooting. Which in itself has so many possibilities to experiment with. A 280mm max so I guess it should be a unnoticeably better in handling against camera shakes. Also the exposure bracketing feature that can be replicated in photoshop as well, dont know how convincingly though.

On the other I have a cam with full manual control which I believe would be a good tool to delve more into the intricacies of photography. And also no noise compensation which is good coz I can use photoshop when needed.

I know its all down to prioritising and given the choices I would go for something that would help me learn more. It if were just for shooting and ease of use (portability) I would have taken the TZ4 eyes closed.

I wish I had some contol over the TZ4 programmed modes so that I could experiment more. Dialing a mode and clicking a picture wont be as involving.

 

[BIKeINSTEIN]

Love letter from newegg- the A590IS just got a bit cheaper.

Newegg.com Newsletter - Get Summer-Sized Savings Now! Panasonic Shaver $19.99 with Free Shipping

 

[Brendon]

I know, I know.

On one hand I have a cam with 28mm for wide angle shooting. Which in itself has so many possibilities to experiment with. A 280mm max so I guess it should be a unnoticeably better in handling against camera shakes. Also the exposure bracketing feature that can be replicated in photoshop as well, dont know how convincingly though.

On the other I have a cam with full manual control which I believe would be a good tool to delve more into the intricacies of photography. And also no noise compensation which is good coz I can use photoshop when needed.

I know its all down to prioritising and given the choices I would go for something that would help me learn more. It if were just for shooting and ease of use (portability) I would have taken the TZ4 eyes closed.

I wish I had some contol over the TZ4 programmed modes so that I could experiment more. Dialing a mode and clicking a picture wont be as involving.

An excellent reason to go for manual control ! :hap2:

 

[-D.Payne-]

Suggestion: Go to a camera store in Delhi and try out the superzooms along with the SX100. You might find that the FZ-series from Panasonic are not that bulky after all. And the FZ-18 would give you 28mm as well. But it's more expensive. (Even the Oly 560 and 570).

Try before you buy. Only then will you know "bulk" and size.

 

[Renegade]

Suggestion: Go to a camera store in Delhi and try out the superzooms along with the SX100.

I can try out the same at a Jumbo electronics store here as well. However I think I have made up my mind. Thanks for all the explanation. :hap2:

Love letter from newegg- the A590IS just got a bit cheaper.

Newegg.com Newsletter - Get Summer-Sized Savings Now! Panasonic Shaver $19.99 with Free Shipping

But if I aim for 40% I may end up failing the exam. :hap5: will go for 100%

An excellent reason to go for manual control ! :hap2:

Manual it is!! :clap:

Will get an Ultra 2GB card to go along with it.

Thanks everyone who helped me out. Special credit for special appearances by chaos and crazy_eddy. :bleh:

 

[-D.Payne-]

Ah... mods. Always wanting to bring closure to threads.



Payne

 

[Renegade]

:lol: Nah not that, I was looking to make the purchase by tonight.

 

[Renegade]

Since d_payne wanted more juice from this thread I'll take it further.

A faster lens is one which has the lowest aperture values. So that it can use faster shutter speeds for same exposure.

Also a good aperture range is Ideally same aperture value at both ends. So smaller the gap means more stable exposure even while changing the zoom.

Going by that the SX100 is the best of the 3. It does not have the lowest aperture value at wide angle (F2.8) but it does have a smaller range. And it does have a much better aperture size when compared to TZ4.

[table="head"]Camera|Aperture range|Macro focus range
A590IS|F2.6 - F5.5|5cm
SX100IS|F2.8 - F4.3|1cm
TZ4|F3.3 - F4.9|5cm[/table]

Am I correct in all my interpretations so far?
Also does the 1cm macro focus range on the SX100 make it a better cam for macro photography?

What is a fast lens? The average 3x-4x zoom camera have ranges of 35-140mm at f2.8-f5.3 to f5.6. (If you do not know, people who do know - ignore!)
That means: at 3x zoom all these "standard" cameras are taking in 4 times lesser light than with no zoom or their widest angle. (Since area of the aperture opening is inversely proportional to the square of the diameter; and f5.6 is twice as small as f2.8)
SO, at shots taken at 3-4x zoom in all standard cameras indoors or at night time are a tough fight because either shutter speeds have to 4 times slower or flash has to be on. Even if flash is on, due to the reduced aperture the flash intensity is also decreased. Most of these cameras have weak flashes on board, so these shots come out real dark.

NOW, for a superzoom the range is usually between f2.8 to f3.5-f4 types. So though MOST of your use of the zoom lens is at around the 3x-5x range (for a 12x zoom lens camera), you'll get much better aperture values at around f3-f3.4. This means better light-gathering (upto 3 times more), better use of flash (plus these cams have stronger flashes) and faster shutter speeds.

 

[hatter]

Palika is out of question since I need one sitting on my ass There arent any available locally in that *price range*. So will be buying it online by tonight.

BTW, at Computer Empire I was quoted Rs 9.6K for 590IS+1GB bundled card. It was with bill and warranty

 

[-D.Payne-]

Am I correct in all my interpretations so far?
Also does the 1cm macro focus range on the SX100 make it a better cam for macro photography?

1. Yep, you're right about that. Btw, difference between f2.6 and f2.8 is negligible as opposed to f3.2-f.3.5 vs f5.5 (105mm on the 590IS vs the SX100IS).

2. A 1m macro focus range is cool, BUT doesn't make much more sense than a 2-5cm range since by 2cm your camera will be creating a huge shadow over whichever object you're taking a photo of. So unless you have fancy lighting (macro-rings etc.), this 1cm-5cm is quite the same.

Payne

PS: Yay for long threads!