Market Feedback Market sale issue

[kartikoli]

Since he doesn't want to cooperate its clear he won't pay, now we should move to next step of banning and sharing his contact details publicly also if OP wants then move to police complain.

Just a question to OP though did he ever mentioned that the product had gone through repair? I would give him a benefit of doubt that he gave it to repair guys who did all sorts of things inside and returned in working condition which he sold to OP but hiding this crucial part is not acceptable.

 

[goDofWar_skr]

Since he doesn't want to cooperate its clear he won't pay, now we should move to next step of banning and sharing his contact details publicly also if OP wants then move to police complain.

Just a question to OP though did he ever mentioned that the product had gone through repair? I would give him a benefit of doubt that he gave it to repair guys who did all sorts of things inside and returned in working condition which he sold to OP but hiding this crucial part is not acceptable.

Quoting his reply from mitesh's comment - "There is no way that I can verify these against the supplier of goods."

Clearly means he is just reselling stuff here to make a buck..

 

[kartikoli]

Quoting his reply from mitesh's comment - "There is no way that I can verify these against the supplier of goods."

Clearly means he is just reselling stuff here to make a buck..

now it makes sense

 

[enthusiast29]

There's also no way for us to know if he was just reselling or those words are just made up to protect himself.
Anyways, as per rules whatever he's selling be it on behalf of someone or reselling, he has to be responsible for it. Especially in the case of reselling since he technically owned the item then.

 

[Crazy_Eddy]

Since he isn't responding to this thread, PM me his details and I will add it to the Market blacklist thread.

 

[Silent47Assassin]

I know it is a little late, but I did purchase a CPU from this guy. I have his address (clicked it) because he sent the CPU via speed post in an envelope without any kind of protective packaging and declared it as a letter. I was very lucky that there was no damage. Let me know if sharing his address will be acceptable here or via pm.

 

[Crazy_Eddy]

Yes PM me. Thanks!

 

[Rahyro]

I know it is a little late, but I did purchase a CPU from this guy. I have his address (clicked it) because he sent the CPU via speed post in an envelope without any kind of protective packaging and declared it as a letter. I was very lucky that there was no damage. Let me know if sharing his address will be acceptable here or via pm.

CPU as a letter !!! You got to be kidding.
Am surprised that Speed post accepted it.
You sure are lucky to receive it in good condition.

 

[rootyme]

@Crazy_Eddy I have four suggestions, please go through them.
1. All electronics MUST have a full week of testing warranty. If the product is indeed in working condition, it shouldn't just die in seven days, right?
2. For electronics of any kind, it should be mandatory for the buyer to get it checked professionally (if they are not familiar with the process themselves) as soon as possible for any kind of tampering like this. A video must be made of the unboxing as well as the disassembly, and the issue must be publicly communicated on the deal thread itself.
This will have three possible outcomes as the following:

1. The seller just can't claim that the tampering was from the buyer's end side because a buyer wouldn't intentionally damage a device and ask for full refund. (For the honest ones)
2. Though that can be the case with some very dishonest buyers. A battery replacement can be 1.5k and after getting back the full refund, the buyer essentially pays the price of the battery for the entire piece. (The not so honest ones)
3. To avoid the above, if the seller strongly claims that the tampering was from the buyer's end, the buyer can easily send back the item bearing only the shipping price. If the buyer was lying, he would not want to let a good deal go down, and if the seller was lying, well, he gets his mess back. The damage incurred by the dishonest buyer would not be huge by any means since he was always eyeing to get away with as little amount spent as possible! (Both parties unharmed)

3. There should be a TE bank account which would act as the mediator between the buyer and seller? The buyers can pay the amount to TE and TE can forward that amount to the seller once the testing period/thorough verification is over from the buyer's end. This will solve a lot of issues. The buyers will always have to pay the full amount in advance before the seller ships, so that nobody gets away without paying. On the flip side, this would act as a perfect buyer protection method ensuring that the seller doesn't get away with pulling off crap like this.
4. A well defined rule as to what happens when a shipment is lost mid transit or is DOA should also be there. The buyer gets screwed for doing no wrong otherwise.

 

[vishal_k]

@Crazy_Eddy I have four suggestions, please go through them.

Your suggestions are from buyer's perspective, but what about sellers, they are not always the scammers, sometimes buyers intentionally/accidently do such things. Let me clear your points one by one. if I'm wrong please let me know, As a normal human being (which I think I am) I too can make mistakes-

1. All electronics MUST have a full week of testing warranty. If the product is indeed in working condition, it shouldn't just die in seven days, right?

Valid point but then the buyer will have too much time to test their DIY skills and can possibly damage the components like OC'ing a CPU/GPU or RAM without proper knowledge of voltage/current, doing invalid settings in BIOS, Stress testing a PSU beyond its rated limit and the list goes on.

2. For electronics of any kind, it should be mandatory for the buyer to get it checked professionally (if they are not familiar with the process themselves) as soon as possible for any kind of tampering like this. A video must be made of the unboxing as well as the disassembly, and the issue must be publicly communicated on the deal thread itself.
This will have three possible outcomes as the following:

1. The seller just can't claim that the tampering was from the buyer's end side because a buyer wouldn't intentionally damage a device and ask for full refund. (For the honest ones)
2. Though that can be the case with some very dishonest buyers. A battery replacement can be 1.5k and after getting back the full refund, the buyer essentially pays the price of the battery for the entire piece. (The not so honest ones)
3. To avoid the above, if the seller strongly claims that the tampering was from the buyer's end, the buyer can easily send back the item bearing only the shipping price. If the buyer was lying, he would not want to let a good deal go down, and if the seller was lying, well, he gets his mess back. The damage incurred by the dishonest buyer would not be huge by any means since he was always eyeing to get away with as little amount spent as possible! (Both parties unharmed)

This step is possible but then the so called professionals can do the scam by replacing original components with the non working ones because these repair guys doesn't do any repair work infront the customer and what happens behind the curtain, everyone knows.

3. There should be a TE bank account which would act as the mediator between the buyer and seller? The buyers can pay the amount to TE and TE can forward that amount to the seller once the testing period/thorough verification is over from the buyer's end. This will solve a lot of issues. The buyers will always have to pay the full amount in advance before the seller ships, so that nobody gets away without paying. On the flip side, this would act as a perfect buyer protection method ensuring that the seller doesn't get away with pulling off crap like this.

If you look closely to the amount of goods being sold here daily and their value, the annual value of transaction will be very high and will need proper audit which involves additional cost and man power for which not many are interested to pay. Running a website in today's time is already very difficult which @Crazy_Eddy understands very well.

4. A well defined rule as to what happens when a shipment is lost mid transit or is DOA should also be there. The buyer gets screwed for doing no wrong otherwise.

For lost shipment or damage during shipment, in-transit insurance in the only option but this results in increased shipping cost which both buyer and seller wants to avoid. For DOA, you already explained it very well in point 2 "Unboxing video".

 

[rdst_1]

@Crazy_Eddy I have four suggestions, please go through them.
1. All electronics MUST have a full week of testing warranty. If the product is indeed in working condition, it shouldn't just die in seven days, right?
2. For electronics of any kind, it should be mandatory for the buyer to get it checked professionally (if they are not familiar with the process themselves) as soon as possible for any kind of tampering like this. A video must be made of the unboxing as well as the disassembly, and the issue must be publicly communicated on the deal thread itself.
This will have three possible outcomes as the following:

1. The seller just can't claim that the tampering was from the buyer's end side because a buyer wouldn't intentionally damage a device and ask for full refund. (For the honest ones)
2. Though that can be the case with some very dishonest buyers. A battery replacement can be 1.5k and after getting back the full refund, the buyer essentially pays the price of the battery for the entire piece. (The not so honest ones)
3. To avoid the above, if the seller strongly claims that the tampering was from the buyer's end, the buyer can easily send back the item bearing only the shipping price. If the buyer was lying, he would not want to let a good deal go down, and if the seller was lying, well, he gets his mess back. The damage incurred by the dishonest buyer would not be huge by any means since he was always eyeing to get away with as little amount spent as possible! (Both parties unharmed)

3. There should be a TE bank account which would act as the mediator between the buyer and seller? The buyers can pay the amount to TE and TE can forward that amount to the seller once the testing period/thorough verification is over from the buyer's end. This will solve a lot of issues. The buyers will always have to pay the full amount in advance before the seller ships, so that nobody gets away without paying. On the flip side, this would act as a perfect buyer protection method ensuring that the seller doesn't get away with pulling off crap like this.
4. A well defined rule as to what happens when a shipment is lost mid transit or is DOA should also be there. The buyer gets screwed for doing no wrong otherwise.

1) Any electronic product can actually die at any time given how complex these are. Neither the buyer or seller is responsible for such bad luck when it happens. How will you ascertain that the failure happened just because of plain bad luck or because the seller maliciously sold a faulty product. Usually many sellers mention the testing warranty they are willing to provide. There is no need to force anyone as the terms are mentioned before the transaction takes place. After that it is left to the buyers and sellers to decide among themselves what the terms of sale are. You need to remember that making such rules can make TE an interested party and hence liable in court, which the admin doesn't want to.

2) As a seller, if you were to get my product opened and examined by a so-called professional (who are usually hacks) without my approval, then I won't take any responsibility. You, as a buyer, would be on your own. No person, who has a perfectly fine working product, will allow it to be opened and disassembled unless it is easy to do so. Most of the products being sold on TE, don't fall into that category. It has happened in the past, that when someone receives a faulty product, the seller and buyer negotiate among themselves how to deal with the situation amicably, unless we come across a bad apple like the present case.

3)TE admin doesn't want to turn this into eBay and provide escrow services. I wish, you would have searched and found older threads where this has been discussed umpteen number of times. There are Facebook Groups which work this way so people who want that, do have such options available elsewhere. Also, just like the first point, this would make the management of TE liable in court. They have made it perfectly clear many times before that they don't want to take that risk, not even for renumeration.

4) When a shipment gets lost mid-way, does the buyer only get screwed. If the seller were to refund the whole amount, won't he get screwed as well, as you put it, for no fault of his own. Many sellers mention it in their threads that Shipping is at buyer's risk and they would prefer to do a local deal only. Yet, you will see many people implore the seller to ship the product as they find it to be a good deal. Again, shipment risks should be discussed and an agreement reached between buyer and seller.

All your points are about making the transaction risk-averse for buyers. It is a good thing, but you need to understand that this is a forum and not a marketplace. The mods are voluntarily giving their time, for the discussions, and not to set up deals and then spend their entire days solving such issues. The stance of admins and mods has always been to let the Marketplace function with as less moderation as possible. It is the duty of the buyers and sellers to cover all their bases. Buying any second hand product, whether online or physically, is always going to be risky. And yet, such incidents happen very rarely on TE. So there is no need to increase the work-load for others when it is the duty of buyer and seller to set the terms and carry out the deal amongst themselves.

 

[ibose]

It is the duty of the buyers and sellers to cover all their bases.

+1. This is only what matters in the transaction. No use making life of the Mods and others complicated.

 

[rootyme]

Your suggestions are from buyer's perspective, but what about sellers, they are not always the scammers, sometimes buyers intentionally/accidently do such things. Let me clear your points one by one. if I'm wrong please let me know, As a normal human being (which I think I am) I too can make mistakes-

Valid point but then the buyer will have too much time to test their DIY skills and can possibly damage the components like OC'ing a CPU/GPU or RAM without proper knowledge of voltage/current, doing invalid settings in BIOS, Stress testing a PSU beyond its rated limit and the list goes on.

This step is possible but then the so called professionals can do the scam by replacing original components with the non working ones because these repair guys doesn't do any repair work infront the customer and what happens behind the curtain, everyone knows.

If you look closely to the amount of goods being sold here daily and their value, the annual value of transaction will be very high and will need proper audit which involves additional cost and man power for which not many are interested to pay. Running a website in today's time is already very difficult which @Crazy_Eddy understands very well.

For lost shipment or damage during shipment, in-transit insurance in the only option but this results in increased shipping cost which both buyer and seller wants to avoid. For DOA, you already explained it very well in point 2 "Unboxing video".

I just realized the loopholes in my POV. Thanks a lot for pointing these out!

1) Any electronic product can actually die at any time given how complex these are. Neither the buyer or seller is responsible for such bad luck when it happens. How will you ascertain that the failure happened just because of plain bad luck or because the seller maliciously sold a faulty product. Usually many sellers mention the testing warranty they are willing to provide. There is no need to force anyone as the terms are mentioned before the transaction takes place. After that it is left to the buyers and sellers to decide among themselves what the terms of sale are. You need to remember that making such rules can make TE an interested party and hence liable in court, which the admin doesn't want to.

2) As a seller, if you were to get my product opened and examined by a so-called professional (who are usually hacks) without my approval, then I won't take any responsibility. You, as a buyer, would be on your own. No person, who has a perfectly fine working product, will allow it to be opened and disassembled unless it is easy to do so. Most of the products being sold on TE, don't fall into that category. It has happened in the past, that when someone receives a faulty product, the seller and buyer negotiate among themselves how to deal with the situation amicably, unless we come across a bad apple like the present case.

3)TE admin doesn't want to turn this into eBay and provide escrow services. I wish, you would have searched and found older threads where this has been discussed umpteen number of times. There are Facebook Groups which work this way so people who want that, do have such options available elsewhere. Also, just like the first point, this would make the management of TE liable in court. They have made it perfectly clear many times before that they don't want to take that risk, not even for renumeration.

4) When a shipment gets lost mid-way, does the buyer only get screwed. If the seller were to refund the whole amount, won't he get screwed as well, as you put it, for no fault of his own. Many sellers mention it in their threads that Shipping is at buyer's risk and they would prefer to do a local deal only. Yet, you will see many people implore the seller to ship the product as they find it to be a good deal. Again, shipment risks should be discussed and an agreement reached between buyer and seller.

All your points are about making the transaction risk-averse for buyers. It is a good thing, but you need to understand that this is a forum and not a marketplace. The mods are voluntarily giving their time, for the discussions, and not to set up deals and then spend their entire days solving such issues. The stance of admins and mods has always been to let the Marketplace function with as less moderation as possible. It is the duty of the buyers and sellers to cover all their bases. Buying any second hand product, whether online or physically, is always going to be risky. And yet, such incidents happen very rarely on TE. So there is no need to increase the work-load for others when it is the duty of buyer and seller to set the terms and carry out the deal amongst themselves.

Understood. I hadn't considered these before. Thanks for pointing them out!

 

[Slayer88]

@Crazy_Eddy I have four suggestions, please go through them.
1. All electronics MUST have a full week of testing warranty. If the product is indeed in working condition, it shouldn't just die in seven days, right?

I was to share my experience with a sale I had but forgot to do it.

I sold a PSU that did not have warranty to a forym member. It was a pretty old one but was in working condition. I had my doubts on the buyer as his WhatsApp number was a Business "School" account. The member was old but inactive. I wrote to the mods asking for their thoughts. (did not get a response)

I took videos of the packaging and the buyer was satisfied. Upon receiving it, the buyer tells me his entire home's power tripped when he plugged in the PSU. He even sent me a video. of this. TLDR: The user told me he flipped the 110/240V switch on the back of the PSU and it blew, obviously. The user was clueless about this leading me to believe that we really have very junior/inexperienced members. Thankfully, I had all the screenshots of these messages on WhatsApp. Those that saw my sale post probably remember I had a ton of fine print, this is why.

To your point #1 even in the best of scenarios, a perfectly good product can go bad in less than a week. Things like moisture, no earthing, static, droppage (for HDDS) are all very grave issues for PC components and are hard/impossible to prove.