Sony HT-M5 Home Theatre Component System unable to play HD Audio

[sanjiv]

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The search for a new home theatre system started after i bought a Sony Blue-ray player earlier this year because the one we had could not decode the Dobly TrueHD or DTS-HD MA.To make things worst the left speaker of the HT had died. After some research and looking around i settled on Sony BDV-E980 because it could handle both Dolby TrueHD & DTS-HD MA the only problem was it had an inbuilt blu-ray player but it was a non issue i could store/sell my existing player.

I went to a Sony official shop and searched for the BDV-E980 but one of the shop assistants directed me to some 'new maal' that had just arrived and was suppose to be the tip of technology. The new system was HT-M5 after a lot of questions it turned out the HT-M5 is a component system meaning i could keep my existing blu-ray player and hook it up to the system. The price difference between HT-M5 and BDV-E980 was around 7K so to justify the price i requested a demo of both and well the HT-M5 won hands down. Its a wonderful system with a great set of deep bass sub's the only thing i did not like was the relatively high notes when the system was a MAX "1580W". When i asked about it to the salesman he quickly turned the treble on a lower side and the sound was bliss.

I tried researching abot the Sony HT-M5 online but to no avail, its like the system is only sold in India. Other than the Indian Sony website i could not find i anywhere

After asking the sales man if the system could handle HD audio streams he said everything a BDV-E980 can handle the HT-M5 can also. Since there was only one HT-M5 with them i bought it then and there, took it home and assembly required some time but the end result was wonderful. The HT-M5 is really something you need to hear to compare, i mean now that the treble was low the mid range bass punchy i could enjoy audio with decent bass without the two woofers. Can you imagine the huge speakers dishing out low/mid bass with ease without the mid/high's getting distorted.

At the time i only had a single blu ray disk which i bought from ebay.in for 500 bucks and was suppose to have DTS-HD MA but it was not recognized and only DTS CORE played. Thinking it was a fake i put it behind me and bought a blu ray movie from music world just 2 days back. The same thing happened only simple DTS and no DTS-HD?

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I changed HDMI wires and connected it to the computer via an HDMI port but no i could not get DTS-HD. It seems that the salesman knew jack-sht and the system does not support DTS-HD or Dolby-TrueHD

The main reason why i bought a new system was to hear the 5.1ch high def audio that i could not with my old system. This lack of feature totally screwed my blu ray plans, the system recognizes DT-HD MA as DTS CORE but with Dolby TrueHD there is no sound at all not even a back compatible simple DD track.

The whole system looks nice and is super glossy, its audio is one of the best i have heard recently. If it had the DTS HD/Dolby TrueHD decode it would have been a great product but without that important feature you are stuck with an system that is as good in features as your 6-7year old system.

I have given mails to branch manager and also customer care lets see what happens. I think a replacement to BDV-E980 is in order otherwise i will spam the hell out of Sony's FB page.

UPDATE: Mr.Vipul from Sony Delhi called up today on behalf of the branch manager and after i explained the whole thing he said that they are sending an audio engg to have a look at the system and the problem. Now Mr. Vipul did not seem very versed in the audio jargon and well an audio engg will be a good start. I pushed hard for exchange with Sony BDV-E980 to which he said let the engg first see if there is an work around.

He will arrive by evening straight from Delhi, oh well i hope something comes out of this all.

UPDATE2: Its done the engg switched the Blu ray player to LPCM 5ch mode instead of pass through and well everything seems good the blu ray player decodes the HD formats from the blu ray and then sends it via HDMI to the system in 5ch surround and the result is marvelous. You can notice the instant depth compared to the likes of DTS core.

The engg called up his superior at 8PM and told them the work is done. Then i had a chat with his superior and he asked if i still wish to change my system i off-course said no. He also apologized for the sales person and said since this was a new system the sales team did not know the head and tail of it, also the system was not meant for sale so soon and it was their fault. The bass seems even more profound now will do a write up soon.

 

[linuxtechie]

^Dude, why didn't you research first hand here on TE and then do the purchase? Sony is BS in terms of Sound.

 

[sanjiv]

UPDATE: Mr.Vipul from Sony Delhi called up today on behalf of the branch manager and after i explained the whole thing he said that they are sending an audio engg to have a look at the system and the problem. Now Mr. Vipul did not seem very versed in the audio jargon and well an audio engg will be a good start. I pushed hard for exchange with Sony BDV-E980 to which he said let the engg first see if there is an work around.

He will arrive by evening straight from Delhi, oh well i hope something comes out of this all.

^Dude, why didn't you research first hand here on TE and then do the purchase? Sony is BS in terms of Sound.

There was noting to research about the HT M5 is a totally new system and given the dealer had only the one i got greedy. This Sony system is really good in terms of sound quality.

 

[Chaos]

Neither does the BDV-E980 support DTS-HD/Dolby TrueHD via HDMI input. It'll only decode DTS-HD when you play a bluray disc through it. However looked like what you bought doesn't even support that.

Check the specs here:

http://www.sony.co.in/product/bdv-e980

http://www.sony.co.in/product/ht-m5

If you were so particular about high resolution decoding, you should have picked up a receiver and a set of HT speakers.

 

[linuxtechie]

#[member='sanjiv'],

This is what I am talking about:

Neither does the BDV-E980 support DTS-HD/Dolby TrueHD via HDMI input. It'll only decode DTS-HD when you play a bluray disc through it. However looked like what you bought doesn't even support that.

Check the specs here:

http://www.sony.co.in/product/bdv-e980

http://www.sony.co.in/product/ht-m5

If you were so particular about high resolution decoding, you should have picked up a receiver and a set of HT speakers.

You would have saved the frustration.

 

[sanjiv]

But then in BDV-E980's case i dont need DTS-HD/Dolby TrueHD via HDMI input support since it has an inbuilt blu ray player which my HT-M5 does not and thus had to use the HDMI bitstream method to get real HD audio out of the disk.

#[member='sanjiv'],

This is what I am talking about:

You would have saved the frustration.

The Sony HT-M5 is also just that a receiver and a set of HT speakers, i had a look at other receivers in the market and had almost settled on a Yamaha receiver and Yamaha center, surround speakers and active woofer but the whole thing was very expensive i still have the estimate slip with me.

The Yamaha complete speaker packs are a joke its best to get the items separately from Yamaha.

As far as the Yamaha's theater in box goes the India offerings are on the basics.

 

[cranky]

First, this is neither and article nor a review, just a crib thread with updates. Maybe a mod should move it?

HD audio decoding is useless when partnered with lousy speakers like the ones that come with all-in-one HTs from Sony and the like.

Frankly, at the kind of money this system comes for, you can choose between crappy sound and good sound. HD Audio formats start making sense when you have a system that is able to shine and actually sound different/better with the latest and greatest formats. And that is not at this price point, you need to spend about 3x to be able to realise the potential of HD Audio (DTS-Master and Dolby TrueHD).

The M5 seems like a good system for gaming. I can't see any merit in it beyond that.

 

[sanjiv]

First, this is neither and article nor a review, just a crib thread with updates. Maybe a mod should move it?

.............................

The M5 seems like a good system for gaming. I can't see any merit in it beyond that.

I will add more stuff to the review later, the HT M5 is a very good combo it surpasses what the Yamaha system can give at a similar price. At a higher price i am sure the Yamaha with those gorgeous towers and bookshelf speakers would be better but with them in the loop so does the price.

The M5 is a great VFM system and if you compare it with the likes of DENON AVR 1312 you will be surprised. The sound has improved quite a bit compared to the BDV-E980. As i said you need to hear it to believe it but by no means can it rival an expensive setup "Receiver+Speakers"

 

[cranky]

I think you should then put this into drafts and work on the revew. As you will probably notice, mods have moved it out of the review section.

On the system - you do know that the 1312 is a weak system to start with. Basis for comparison is your need (HD Audio) versus actual system capability and delivery. I don't need to hear a Sony. I'm aware of how they are made nowadays, at least what is available for sale in India. I do also know what the Japanese parent think about India and Indian consumers. Sony is well behind what can be considered reasonable audio.

Back to my point, HD audio decoding is meaningless if it is being delivered by a crappy system. It is fashionable to say (and a good enough reaosn for lots of people to buy) that their system supports a certain format but if it sounds like garbage it sounds like HD garbage. If you're happy with the sound, maybe you should start listening to the system a bit more and post a nice review of it, rather than berate the fact that it doesn't do this or that.

On that front, I don't even see your point. You say you were misled into believing something. Sony has never claimed the system is capable of HD Audio decoding. You don't even have a case. If you have made a purchase based on your perception rather than written literature and published specifications (word of salesman is not admissible as proof, even if he did tell you that), you have no right to start spamming the company. It's cases like this that worsen the collective perception of us as a buying public.

Either handle this quietly and tactfully, else be prepared to lose face when the company finds out you didn't do your research. You don't have a leg to stand on so you might want to back off gracefully.

Good Luck.

 

[sanjiv]

UPDATE2: Its done the engg switched the Blu ray player to LPCM 5ch mode instead of pass through and well everything seems good the blu ray player decodes the HD formats from the blu ray and then sends it via HDMI to the system in 5ch surround and the result is marvelous. You can notice the instant depth compared to the likes of DTS core.

The engg called up his superior at 8PM and told them the work is done. Then i had a chat with his superior and he asked if i still wish to change my system i off-course said no. He also apologized for the sales person and said since this was a new system the sales team did not know the head and tail of it, also the system was not meant for sale so soon and it was their fault. The bass seems even more profound now will do a write up soon.

..........................

Good Luck.

Firstly the 1312 is around Rs27,000 so its not exactly cheap in my books yes its entry level but so is HT M5 if you look in the great scheme of things. Not everyone has a money stash to get the DENON high end and the works. The HT-M5 is a VFM alternative compared to the DENON alternative or dare i say even on the likes of Yamaha.

The fact that it does not do what the sales man said it did was the very axis of the problem so why should i not start off the review with that lead. At the time there was no info online not from Sony India or any forums zilch, nada. In such a case how is one suppose to do research when there is no reading material available Off-course you will ask the shop keeper what it has and not have. I hope if anyone is about to buy the same system after talking to the sales staff and search's online finds exactly what the system lacks. In this price range there are very few things that receivers lack and it should be a point to point out what is lacking exactly.

I consider people working in official Sony stores to know a thing or two and yes i would trust them more than a multi brand store on product knowledge. I can spam their FB page on this issue and i mean why not the BOX has a sticker on it that says "BluRay ready" when someone says a product is bluray ready it should mean that it can handle all aspects of a blu ray does it not who is to blame?

This is all past now that the engg. has fixed the main problem i am again very happy with the product. I will write/redo this review with a more detailed analysis of sound and comparisons with my old now sold Onkyo HT R330.

 

[linuxtechie]

 

[puneetritehere]

#[member='sanjiv'].. take this one piece of advice and remember it always... whenever you go to any such sony, samsung, philips showroom.. do not expect any of the salesmen to have any kind of technical knowledge about the product.. consider them monkeys who have been trained to read out whats written in the brochure. and they are not even able to do that properly.. its your foolishness if you expect any kind of comprehensive explanations from such salespeople in these shops.. these are not proper salesmen.. they are just idiots who have been hired to walk behind you while you are in the shop and tell you the prices of products which are already displayed in little tags in front of the products..

how do you expect these people to be able to give you the slightest explanation about 5.1 surround, DTH, etc etc.. when they dont even know what dolby, or 5.1 channel means???

the sony regional manager apologizing to you because of the salesmen not knowing about the product was just a polite and diplomatic way to deal with your situation.. you can go to the showroom and enquire about a 6 month old product and they still wont know the basics of the product .. forget its head and tail..

the best thing to do is research online.. if the product was up for sale in the showroom, there surely must've been a lot of info. online.. i'd only say its your fault you couldnt search for the appropriate info and research properly, good online research and being able to extract information and search for it is also a skill..do a lot of it and you will know what i am talking about.. you will start recognizing difference between useful and bogus links, before even opening them, be able to search faster, and be able to decide upon the keywords which would be required to get to even one page about the product if it exists on the net.. ...

and no, i disagree with you on the BluRay Ready argument.. just because a product is said to be bluray ready, doesnt mean it can handle all the different aspects of bluray.. i am not arguing about what should ethically and morally be mentioned, but this is how marketing is done and the companies cash in on the consumers negligence about technical terms... this is what we also sometimes call marketing gimmicks.. just because a device is said to be ready USB ready, doesnt mean it can handle all the formats you throw at it that you can possibly dump on a usb flash drive...

this happens with all the electronic products.. nowadays so many mobile phones are sold in the market and are claimed to have 720p HD recording. You really think these phones capture 720p resolution videos?? when even while buying full sized desktops we need to take care about ram and processor speed and dedicated graphics to make sure that HD videos run smoothly??? that 720p resolution is just software interpolated resolution.. its funny that people would believe that their mobile phones costing 20 grand have the same video capabilities as an HD camcorder costing 30 to 40 grand..

#[member='cranky'] i'd just like to point out that if the salesmen presses the consumers to believe, even if out of his own ignorance, that a product has a feature that it really does not, then the consumer does have a case..if not, then why even have salesmen.. . a complete and comprehensive specsheet of these products is not openly kept in the shops but only found inside the packed box inside the booklet.. the brochures just highlight the main features of the product..

#[member='sanjiv'] upload pics of your system..

#[member='sanjiv']... why are you copying and pasting the same replies over and over again???

 

[6pack]

UPDATE2: Its done the engg switched the Blu ray player to LPCM 5ch mode instead of pass through and well everything seems good the blu ray player decodes the HD formats from the blu ray and then sends it via HDMI to the system in 5ch surround and the result is marvelous. You can notice the instant depth compared to the likes of DTS core.

are you sure its decoding the dts master audio track? in the specs, its written clearly that it does not support dts master audio, so how can it decode it in the first place?

maybe its just decoding the core dolby hd track in 5.1 now compared to stereo before. i'm assuming it was stereo before, because, you wrote the engineer changed it to lpcm 5 ch mode.

 

[sanjiv]

are you sure its decoding the dts master audio track? in the specs, its written clearly that it does not support dts master audio, so how can it decode it in the first place?

maybe its just decoding the core dolby hd track in 5.1 now compared to stereo before. i'm assuming it was stereo before, because, you wrote the engineer changed it to lpcm 5 ch mode.

The Blu Ray player decodes the DTS HD/TrueHD itself and sends the decoded audio stream via the HDMI in LPCM mode to the receiver "HT M5". Now since the HT-M5 can handle 5 channel LPCM via HDMI it give the same level of detail as the original DTS hd/TrueHD stream. I was under the impression that HDMI can only handle 2.1ch PCM but i was wrong the engg told me it can handle upto 8ch.

Some info i found online about the same: http://forums.highdefdigest.com/hom...-v-receiver-sounds-better-than-bd-player.html

Yes before the HT-M5 decoded DTS Core when presented with a DTS MA HD stream but now the blu ray handles the decode and sends the audio as LPCM 5.1 via the HDMI to the HT M5 which has added more bass and detail over Core DTS.

-----------------------------------------------

I agree it was short sighted of me to accept what the salesman told me about the product but when i bought it almost no info was available online like i said the Sony India had no entry for the HT-M5. Even today other than SOny India almost no info is available on the product. I bought it after i heard its clarity and good depth when he gave me a demo with "House of Flying Daggers".

That Bluray sticker was one of the reasons why i came under the influence of the salesman.
Mobiles do record in 720P but in what fps who knows and those CMOS sensors are the worst. All electronics are getting very shabby dont know the reason why.

I have uploaded pics of the HT M5 receiver in my first post, since the whole thing is super glossy and the mobile camera is well worthless pics also turn out that way.

I gave the updates in the original post and as a replay to represent the time difference between updates.

 

[ak56u]

UPDATE2: Its done the engg switched the Blu ray player to LPCM 5ch mode instead of pass through and well everything seems good the blu ray player decodes the HD formats from the blu ray and then sends it via HDMI to the system in 5ch surround and the result is marvelous. You can notice the instant depth compared to the likes of DTS core.

The engg called up his superior at 8PM and told them the work is done. Then i had a chat with his superior and he asked if i still wish to change my system i off-course said no. He also apologized for the sales person and said since this was a new system the sales team did not know the head and tail of it, also the system was not meant for sale so soon and it was their fault. The bass seems even more profound now will do a write up soon.



Firstly the 1312 is around Rs27,000 so its not exactly cheap in my books yes its entry level but so is HT M5 if you look in the great scheme of things. Not everyone has a money stash to get the DENON high end and the works. The HT-M5 is a VFM alternative compared to the DENON alternative or dare i say even on the likes of Yamaha.

The fact that it does not do what the sales man said it did was the very axis of the problem so why should i not start off the review with that lead. At the time there was no info online not from Sony India or any forums zilch, nada. In such a case how is one suppose to do research when there is no reading material available Off-course you will ask the shop keeper what it has and not have. I hope if anyone is about to buy the same system after talking to the sales staff and search's online finds exactly what the system lacks. In this price range there are very few things that receivers lack and it should be a point to point out what is lacking exactly.

I consider people working in official Sony stores to know a thing or two and yes i would trust them more than a multi brand store on product knowledge. I can spam their FB page on this issue and i mean why not the BOX has a sticker on it that says "BluRay ready" when someone says a product is bluray ready it should mean that it can handle all aspects of a blu ray does it not who is to blame?

This is all past now that the engg. has fixed the main problem i am again very happy with the product. I will write/redo this review with a more detailed analysis of sound and comparisons with my old now sold Onkyo HT R330.

You're mistaken sir. The AVR 1312 is available ~20k in Delhi with bill...

I will add more stuff to the review later, the HT M5 is a very good combo it surpasses what the Yamaha system can give at a similar price. At a higher price i am sure the Yamaha with those gorgeous towers and bookshelf speakers would be better but with them in the loop so does the price.

The M5 is a great VFM system and if you compare it with the likes of DENON AVR 1312 you will be surprised. The sound has improved quite a bit compared to the BDV-E980. As i said you need to hear it to believe it but by no means can it rival an expensive setup "Receiver+Speakers"

I have no intentions to argue here. Just trying to help you out in buying a good HT. Brands like Sony, Philips, Panasonic and Samsung cannot be compared to the proper audio brands like Denon, Yamaha or Onkyo. m5 will be blown away by 1312 any day. Have you ever compared the size of a Sony player+avr with a Denon avr? Sony's avr with integrated blu-ray or DVD player is half of Denon's avr only. I am not implying that bigger is always better but brands like Sony do cut corners to make their products visually appealing and compact. If you're looking for an HT under 30k, go for Onkyo 3400 or 3500. If you can slightly increase your budget to 35k, go for Denon 1312 + JBL SCS140BK speakers.

And post audio related queries at hifivision.com for more informed replies.

 

[sanjiv]

You're mistaken sir. The AVR 1312 is available ~20k in Delhi with bill...



I ha..........................................eakers.

AVR 1312 was around 26-27K in Chd but this is a old quote not a latest one. This Sony M5 does not have a blu ray player in it, the amplifier is D class and the separation is so-so its better or as good as my old Onkyo with JVC speakers in both low's and mid's but highs are a bit too harsh, i have written a review but its in the draft section rite now.

Its a VFM proposition yes you loose the definition in bass but if you lower the bass the overall sound is pretty good and clear.

 

[ak56u]

AVR 1312 was around 26-27K in Chd but this is a old quote not a latest one. This Sony M5 does not have a blu ray player in it, the amplifier is D class and the separation is so-so its better or as good as my old Onkyo with JVC speakers in both low's and mid's but highs are a bit too harsh, i have written a review but its in the draft section rite now.

Its a VFM proposition yes you loose the definition in bass but if you lower the bass the overall sound is pretty good and clear.

Sound is a subjective thing. I personally didn't like M5 at all. The bass wasn't there, as rightly pointed out by you, but even the highs and mids were flat. And they are priced at ~45k, in which one has a lot of options including wharfedale MS-100 5.1 package + Denon 1312, which will beat Sony hands down. My point is, for a visually appealing but sounding okay system, Sony M5 can be considered. But if you really want a bang for your buck, look at audiophile brands.....

Cheers

 

[Being.smart]

Hey bro sup, Can you tell me @ what price you bagged the system, as i am also planning to get the same system..

Currently i am enjoying Logitech Z5500 mapped to Creative X-fi champhion, and older version of Sony DZ870W DVD home theater..

Just hoping to get much better sound from HT-M5.... always if you have any plan to resell plz tell