Troubling trend of e-waste due to non repairable devices

vivek.krishnan

If you cant see the green dot, I'm offline :P
Skilled
He touched on Apple mainly. He could have also delved into the practices of Qualcomm with support for their older SoCs.

EDIT

Another example - why is Windows 10 so bloated that it hangs with HDDs and needs more RAM. Another example of why we need more powerful machines which do the same thing, just look more beautiful? While Linux works pretty well mostly.
 
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iPwnz

Brutally Honest
Skilled
It's a legit issue.
I wish there was a better system in place. So many peripherals and components could be revived and waste considerably reduced.
 

msankadi

Well-Known Member
Adept
With great power comes great responsibility.

Apple wants only money and power and they aren't capable of being responsible for anything.
 

AINDRASIS_GUPTA

Well-Known Member
Disciple
I'm surprised how someone hasn't called out yet regarding your biased behaviour towards a certain technology brand and misleading the members on the forum.

Let's look at some of the iFixit repairability scores:
  • Huawei Mate 40 Pro - 4/10
  • Microsoft Surface Duo - 2/10
  • Samsung Note 20 Ultra - 3/10
  • Pixel 4 XL - 4/10
  • iPhone 12 Pro Max - 6/10
  • iPhone 12 Mini - 6/10
  • iPhone SE 2020 - 6/10
  • iPhone 11 (2019) - 6/10
A person who might not be much acquainted with technology might take your words at face value. But, there's serious misrepresentation of facts here. Not to mention, every iPhone is supported up to at least 5 years of software updates, which neither of the above-mentioned phones will do. And when a phone is updated for a long period, customers will feel the less need to change.

So, it's time you stop misleading forum members with your baseless/useless claims. What a joke.
 

msankadi

Well-Known Member
Adept
So, it's time you stop misleading forum members with your baseless/useless claims. What a joke.


Haha I think you should comment on this on the video as I have not made the video. I do wholeheartedly agree with it though. A person who thinks Apple has good repairability is the one who is misleading forum members.

Any unbiased apple user will tell you the nightmare it is to try and get a device fixed from them. However, you can continue to live with your view of the world and ignore reality.

You have so conveniently shortlisted a few phones and posted to try and force your narrative. How many people use the phones you have conveniently selected in India? 0.2%?0.000002%?

Remember ewaste is by volume and nature doesnt care how many rupees you wasted on your phone. It is quantity and not the expensiveness that matters here.

Any android user especially the mass market phone users will tell you that you can get devices fixed much more easily and at cheaper rates, at authorized or unauthorized service centers alike.
 
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AINDRASIS_GUPTA

Well-Known Member
Disciple
Haha I think you should comment on this on the video as I have not made the video. I do wholeheartedly agree with it though. A person who thinks Apple has good repairability is the one who is misleading forum members.

Any unbiased apple user will tell you the nightmare it is to try and get a device fixed from them. However, you can continue to live with your view of the world and ignore reality.

You have so conveniently shortlisted a few phones and posted to try and force your narrative. How many people use the phones you have conveniently selected in India? 0.2%?0.000002%?

Any android user especially the mass market phone users will tell you that you can get devices fixed much more easily and at cheaper rates, at authorized or unauthorized service centers alike.
I mean, your post history don't lie about how you regularly mislead forum members by bashing a singular brand.

The fundamental facts that have been mentioned above and it goes against what you've preaching thus far. Unless you have some counterclaims to mention, there's no reason for me to argue with you.
 

msankadi

Well-Known Member
Adept
I mean, your post history don't lie about how you regularly mislead forum members by bashing a singular brand.

The fundamental facts that have been mentioned above and it goes against what you've preaching thus far. Unless you have some counterclaims to mention, there's no reason for me to argue with you.
Wow levels of insecurity
This thread wasn't about apple you are the one who is getting attached to your phone company
 

TEUser2K1

Well-Known Member
Adept
Repair-ability and Reusability of electroic components devices should be give extreme high priority. Display unit of mobiles, laptops, etc. should definitely use some global standards.

There is a huge issue with availability of rare earth materials, China did well calculated advanced moves which worked in their country's favor and have a scathing monopoly of those materials. Don't think people are using such materials with adequate sensibility though.

 
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rdst_1

Well-Known Member
Skilled
First off, let's not turn this into an Apple vs Others debate. Let's just not even go there and discuss the main topic.
Most of similar issues that we are facing today, can only go away if a) Our population decreases drastically or b) If we change our consumerist ways.
Anything else will just be a stop-gap measure and will eventually fail in the end.
 

vivek.krishnan

If you cant see the green dot, I'm offline :P
Skilled
I'm surprised how someone hasn't called out yet regarding your biased behaviour towards a certain technology brand and misleading the members on the forum.

Let's look at some of the iFixit repairability scores:
  • Huawei Mate 40 Pro - 4/10
  • Microsoft Surface Duo - 2/10
  • Samsung Note 20 Ultra - 3/10
  • Pixel 4 XL - 4/10
  • iPhone 12 Pro Max - 6/10
  • iPhone 12 Mini - 6/10
  • iPhone SE 2020 - 6/10
  • iPhone 11 (2019) - 6/10
A person who might not be much acquainted with technology might take your words at face value. But, there's serious misrepresentation of facts here. Not to mention, every iPhone is supported up to at least 5 years of software updates, which neither of the above-mentioned phones will do. And when a phone is updated for a long period, customers will feel the less need to change.

So, it's time you stop misleading forum members with your baseless/useless claims. What a joke.

Misleading? Puh-leez.

Apple is one of the primary opponents to right to repair, all in the same of safety and what not. Their latest tactics are nothing short of holding you to ransom.

Many people assume that because they update the OS they are better off. The actual fact is that they are now giving users what they want finally which should have been there in the first place. And the premium you pay initially?

Reparability scores - what's the point of these if you cannot repair it without Apple's proprietary tech. All in the name of safety? BS. All in the name of keeping profits.

Accept Apple for what it is and what is not. Writing like this means you are just another fanboi, who cannot see beyond the faults of your favourite brand.

Haha I think you should comment on this on the video as I have not made the video. I do wholeheartedly agree with it though. A person who thinks Apple has good repairability is the one who is misleading forum members.

Any unbiased apple user will tell you the nightmare it is to try and get a device fixed from them. However, you can continue to live with your view of the world and ignore reality.

You have so conveniently shortlisted a few phones and posted to try and force your narrative. How many people use the phones you have conveniently selected in India? 0.2%?0.000002%?

Remember ewaste is by volume and nature doesnt care how many rupees you wasted on your phone. It is quantity and not the expensiveness that matters here.

Any android user especially the mass market phone users will tell you that you can get devices fixed much more easily and at cheaper rates, at authorized or unauthorized service centers alike.

Apple RMA is a nightmare sometimes, but not always. You just need the right connections. But yeah, its a nightmare nonetheless.

I mean, your post history don't lie about how you regularly mislead forum members by bashing a singular brand.

The fundamental facts that have been mentioned above and it goes against what you've preaching thus far. Unless you have some counterclaims to mention, there's no reason for me to argue with you.

Being critical is not an issue. It needs to be valid. Which in this case is.

First off, let's not turn this into an Apple vs Others debate. Let's just not even go there and discuss the main topic.
Most of similar issues that we are facing today, can only go away if a) Our population decreases drastically or b) If we change our consumerist ways.
Anything else will just be a stop-gap measure and will eventually fail in the end.

a. Not going to happen.
b. Not going to happen either.

Rather than either, I would like that

For Android

More companies allow BL unlocking. I am looking at the BKK family mainly - apart from OP others don't. And OP is no longer in affordable class.
Spares are available easily.
Custom ROMs are not banned or blocked
Paid services for further updates if possible
Recalls should be done if there are issues like the Nokia USB port fiasco and Samsung S7 Edge display pink line

Apple

Don't be a douchebag.

Phones now last longer than before and I am still holding on to my POCO F1 which was bought from a user here on TE. Been almost 2.5 years and all I need to do now is change the battery (70% health) and it should work for another year comfortably - till 5G kicks in.
 

AINDRASIS_GUPTA

Well-Known Member
Disciple
Misleading? Puh-leez.
Apple is one of the primary opponents to right to repair, all in the same of safety and what not. Their latest tactics are nothing short of holding you to ransom.
Apple have their own reasons for opposing Right To Repair. And they’re partly correct in their regard. You haven’t experienced third-party Apple service centres in India who scam customers selling cheap components that works 50 per cent of the time and on top of that swap useful components out of the buyer’s iPhone without him/her knowing. Later, when customers complain that their devices not working as intended, the third-party service centres shrug off their responsibilities and Apple gets the blame. I have worked with multiple third-party Apple service centres in the past and the quality of components they provide is a hit or miss.
Granted, Apple authorised service centres in India are no saint, but third-party service centres are worse. You haven’t been in the field hands-on and that’s why you don’t know much what goes behind the scenes.
Many people assume that because they update the OS they are better off. The actual fact is that they are now giving users what they want finally which should have been there in the first place. And the premium you pay initially?
You're the first person I've met who's undermining the importance of 5 year OS updates - which has been the industry benchmark for such a long time. Seriously?
Moreover, you must be out of your depth if you still think Apple products are premium even now. When lacklustre, downgraded products such as S21 is selling at 70K INR or overheating OP9 Pro is selling at 65K INR, you should point your fingers to someone else. Maybe go out, research the market. Instead of staying in your safe bubble and thinking Apple charging premium for their products. Even in 2021.
Reparability scores - what's the point of these if you cannot repair it without Apple's proprietary tech. All in the name of safety? BS. All in the name of keeping profits.
Reparability Scores doesn’t just denote how easily the smartphone can be repaired. It also denotes how easily the phones can be taken apart and recycled at the end of their life and not end up at landfills. For example the Motorola Razr scores 1/10 which means that it’s near to impossible to take it apart for recycle & reuse.
Again, before pointing your fingers and singling out a brand, look at what the industry is doing.
Accept Apple for what it is and what is not. Writing like this means you are just another fanboi, who cannot see beyond the faults of your favourite brand.
Let’s not get into that stupid, 2012-esque ‘fanboy’ thing in 2021. We are way past those idiotic Android vs iOS wars. Expected better from a veteran member here.
 

vivek.krishnan

If you cant see the green dot, I'm offline :P
Skilled
Apple have their own reasons for opposing Right To Repair. And they’re partly correct in their regard. You haven’t experienced third-party Apple service centres in India who scam customers selling cheap components that works 50 per cent of the time and on top of that swap useful components out of the buyer’s iPhone without him/her knowing. Later, when customers complain that their devices not working as intended, the third-party service centres shrug off their responsibilities and Apple gets the blame. I have worked with multiple third-party Apple service centres in the past and the quality of components they provide is a hit or miss.
Granted, Apple authorised service centres in India are no saint, but third-party service centres are worse. You haven’t been in the field hands-on and that’s why you don’t know much what goes behind the scenes.

You're the first person I've met who's undermining the importance of 5 year OS updates - which has been the industry benchmark for such a long time. Seriously?
Moreover, you must be out of your depth if you still think Apple products are premium even now. When lacklustre, downgraded products such as S21 is selling at 70K INR or overheating OP9 Pro is selling at 65K INR, you should point your fingers to someone else. Maybe go out, research the market. Instead of staying in your safe bubble and thinking Apple charging premium for their products. Even in 2021.

Reparability Scores doesn’t just denote how easily the smartphone can be repaired. It also denotes how easily the phones can be taken apart and recycled at the end of their life and not end up at landfills. For example the Motorola Razr scores 1/10 which means that it’s near to impossible to take it apart for recycle & reuse.
Again, before pointing your fingers and singling out a brand, look at what the industry is doing.

Let’s not get into that stupid, 2012-esque ‘fanboy’ thing in 2021. We are way past those idiotic Android vs iOS wars. Expected better from a veteran member here.

Again with the broken record!

Apple third party ASSC contracted by Apple or by themselves. So because they cant do proper audits, they need to lockdown the entire thing right? And this is world wide, not India only! So they cannot control it worldwide right?

Updates - I am not denying them, you are paying for that premium. It was that people assume updates means better. Not really. And 5 years only? Apple shows that off as if its a big deal. Maybe have a look at custom roms. Even an iPhone 5/5S/6 is pretty good for most uses today, but Apple wont allow you to unlock it right?

Reparability - again with the reusabilty? Read and see. If you cannot reuse it - its trash, simple. Don't be deluded that its better.

Umm, we are brand agnostic, you are finger pointing fanboi here. Ooh, did we single out you and your brand? Yeah, we did. Its the start of electronic lock-ins and no one wants to find that they cant replace a part because the manufacturer wants a cut because people are not buying iDevices that frequently but repairing them.

And please bother to read up before commenting. I am not even going to bother looking into your so called experience, just shows how much you are defending your brand, which you are a part of.
 

AINDRASIS_GUPTA

Well-Known Member
Disciple
Again with the broken record!
Apple third party ASSC contracted by Apple or by themselves. So because they cant do proper audits, they need to lockdown the entire thing right? And this is world wide, not India only! So they cannot control it worldwide right?
Right to Repair will always stand, how much Apple tries to void the same. There are specific EU & Australian laws out there protecting consumers. There's a reason Apple has to provide 2 years of warranty in the EU.
Updates - I am not denying them, you are paying for that premium. It was that people assume updates means better. Not really. And 5 years only? Apple shows that off as if its a big deal. Maybe have a look at custom roms. Even an iPhone 5/5S/6 is pretty good for most uses today, but Apple wont allow you to unlock it right?
Flashing custom roms are a thing of the past. Even on Android. The average customer don't care.
There's also a reason why the iOS jailbreaking scene died.
Reparability - again with the reusabilty? Read and see. If you cannot reuse it - its trash, simple. Don't be deluded that its better.
Greater repairability score = Better reusability
Better reusability means higher environmental sustainability and easier recycling process.
I can't make this more simpler.
Umm, we are brand agnostic, you are finger pointing fanboi here. Ooh, did we single out you and your brand? Yeah, we did. Its the start of electronic lock-ins and no one wants to find that they cant replace a part because the manufacturer wants a cut because people are not buying iDevices that frequently but repairing them.
Your statement makes zero sense and comes off idiotic. If Apple was looking for planned obsolescence, they would have stopped updating old phones a long time ago.
A iPhone 6S which was released in 2015 still got an iOS 14 update last year. But, a Samsung S7 which was released in the same year, was max upgraded to a petty 2017 Oreo.
And please bother to read up before commenting. I am not even going to bother looking into your so called experience, just shows how much you are defending your brand, which you are a part of.
You don't have to look into my experience. You can continue using your POCO F1 for another year.
 

vivek.krishnan

If you cant see the green dot, I'm offline :P
Skilled
Right to Repair will always stand, how much Apple tries to void the same. There are specific EU & Australian laws out there protecting consumers. There's a reason Apple has to provide 2 years of warranty in the EU.

Flashing custom roms are a thing of the past. Even on Android. The average customer don't care.
There's also a reason why the iOS jailbreaking scene died.

Greater repairability score = Better reusability
Better reusability means higher environmental sustainability and easier recycling process.
I can't make this more simpler.

Your statement makes zero sense and comes off idiotic. If Apple was looking for planned obsolescence, they would have stopped updating old phones a long time ago.
A iPhone 6S which was released in 2015 still got an iOS 14 update last year. But, a Samsung S7 which was released in the same year, was max upgraded to a petty 2017 Oreo.

You don't have to look into my experience. You can continue using your POCO F1 for another year.

And that's what we are fighting for. R2R should stand. But the way you are putting it, Apple is only working to break it behind the scenes using Apple DRM.

Flashing custom ROMs is a part of R2R. I can still use the device as I want. Apple does not allow it. Samsung has started something of an initiative.

Again the same thing. If you cannot put the part without Apple allowing you to do, where is the reusability? Just shows that you are still not bother to read. pff.

Umm, again commenting without reading. I want to change my battery. Is it genuine from an Apple shop? Yes. Will it work? Yes. Will it display an error message that you may have a non genuine battery? Yes? Whats the point? Today batteries and camera, tomorrow touch panels and other parts.

I do plan to use the POCO as long as it lasts. And the parts will be available for a 2-3 years, if not more. And I can get them changed without asking Xiaomi to validate my camera or battery or etc
 

TEUser2K1

Well-Known Member
Adept
Isn't primary concern of this thread about reducing /avoiding e-waste and way to achieve it ?

Funny to see how people are arguing favoring some BigBrand's petty interests, etc. The whole thing not about concerns of Apple or other brands, it is about reducing e-waste. Should we all be discussing on that topic only ? How about putting repair-ability /re-usability above brands ?
 

vivek.krishnan

If you cant see the green dot, I'm offline :P
Skilled
Isn't primary concern of this thread about reducing /avoiding e-waste and way to achieve it ?

Funny to see how people are arguing favoring some BigBrand's petty interests, etc. The whole thing not about concerns of Apple or other brands, it is about reducing e-waste. Should we all be discussing on that topic only ? How about putting repair-ability /re-usability above brands ?

Nopes. Its all about how companies are doing what they are - basically informing the public what BigTech is doing aka planned obsolesce.

Which will increase the e-waste only.

And maybe ways to reduce it?
 

TEUser2K1

Well-Known Member
Adept
Repair-ability, re-usability, standardizatin, etc. can hugely reduce e-waste.

Looking thing from that perspective will let bigcorps innovate on those lines and will make world a better place.
 
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Nalin

Well-Known Member
Skilled
I remember my LG refrigerator developed some issue 4 years after its purchase and they said we don't make the parts of that particular model anymore basically forcing us to buy a new model again. Same goes for their TV as I had to throw it away within 5 years because they don't make its parts anymore. At that moment I decided to boycott LG products for good. Doing my bit for the environment.
 

y2s

Well-Known Member
Disciple
All these consumer electronic companies rely on planned obsolesce so they can sell you a slightly better product every year. Be it Apple/Samsung or Google etc. All are to be blamed.

Cheapo android devices are the biggest offenders as they become practically unusable in a short amount of time. They maybe cheaper to fix (If there is spare part availability) but really what's the point? Also not much of a dev community for custom ROM's around them. Obviously there are outliers in this category (Such as F1 etc which are truly VFM)

Despite Apple's best efforts to shut down 3rd party repair / make it extremely difficult for consumers to fix their devices - There exists a huge refurb market for their products globally. Even broken phones usually have parts harvested and reused. I would argue - its much easier to fix a 5 year old iPhone in 2021 vs any 5 year old Android just based on parts availability. What Apple needs to do better is the Find My lock - there needs to be a better mechanism in place. It is preventing so many phones from being reused.
 
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