What do you think about our Foreign Minister

[yugaaa]

The U.S. Didn’t Single-Handedly Broker an India-Pakistan Armistice | Washington Monthly

The Trump administration dangerously complicated matters, offering more proof of why we need experts, what it disparages as the “Deep State.”

washingtonmonthly.com

"In fact, the Trump administration dangerously complicated matters, offering more proof of why we need experts, what it disparages as the “Deep State.”

Finally, India makes it official: Trump didn't broker India-Pakistan ceasefire | India News - The Times of India

India News: NEW DELHI: India on Tuesday reiterated its rejection of US President Donald Trump's offer to mediate in the dispute with Pakistan over J&K, and said I.

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

From what I understood, he meant that we attacked the foreign sovereign territory of Pakistan, and then chickened out because Trump "forced" a ceasefire

Probably the guy is sour because he worked for Joe biden and now he has been reduced to writing essays for the washingtonmonthly ?

Trump issues multiple statements for weeks and India denies it after a couple of weeks ? How sensible is that ? Especially coming from Times ?

 

[PunkX 75]

The US deep state Vs India Deep state. What is the difference?
What constitutes the respective deep states?
Please elobarate.

From my understanding, Deep State within the US is more defence-oriented and institutionalized. In India, it tends to be more politicized

 

[yugaaa]

But how ?

 

[PunkX 75]

Trump issues multiple statements for weeks and India denies it after a couple of weeks ? How sensible is that ? Especially coming from Times ?

I hate Toilet of India as much as the next person.

But your stance has been very confusing, so I prefer them more, right now.

 

[yugaaa]

I hate Toilet of India as much as the next person.

But your stance has been very confusing, so I prefer them more, right now.

Sure . The point is what was the EAM/ Govt doing for a few weeks while Trump was boasting himself and literally teasing our govt , elected /appointed officials ?

 

[TEUser2K1]

The point is what was the EAM/ Govt doing for a few weeks while Trump was boasting himself

https://www.livemint.com/politics/new-delhi-islamabad-directly-negotiated-jaishankar-rebuts-donald-trumps-claim-of-india-pakistan-ceasefire-mediation-11747903073321.html

US warned about big Pak attack, we said we’ll hit harder: Jaishankar to MPs panel

Chairing a meeting of MP, External Affairs Minister (EAM) S Jaishankar clarified that the ceasefire was initiated by Pakistan through military channels, dismissing US claims of brokering the de-escalation.

www.indiatoday.in

'Pakistani army sent message': Jaishankar counters Trump's claims, reveals what led to India-Pakistan ceasefire | India News - Times of India

India News: External affairs minister S Jaishankar refuted Donald Trump's claim of brokering peace between India and Pakistan. Jaishankar clarified that the cessa

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

Jaishankar breaks silence on Trump’s India-Pak truce claim—‘made one thing clear to US…’

Jaishankar says Europe had luxury of not choosing between security & prosperity, India didn’t. ‘Our neighbors, especially Pakistan and China, have kept us on high alert.’

theprint.in

US was in United States: EAM Jaishankar on Trump's claim on mediation

External Affairs Minister S. Jaishankar clarified that the recent India-Pakistan ceasefire was a direct bilateral agreement initiated by Pakistan's army, dismissing claims of international mediation. While countries like the US expressed concern, the negotiation occurred solely between New Delhi...

economictimes.indiatimes.com

I mean, how many times he have to say sharp dialogs ?

 

[yugaaa]

https://www.livemint.com/politics/new-delhi-islamabad-directly-negotiated-jaishankar-rebuts-donald-trumps-claim-of-india-pakistan-ceasefire-mediation-11747903073321.html

US warned about big Pak attack, we said we’ll hit harder: Jaishankar to MPs panel

Chairing a meeting of MP, External Affairs Minister (EAM) S Jaishankar clarified that the ceasefire was initiated by Pakistan through military channels, dismissing US claims of brokering the de-escalation.

www.indiatoday.in

'Pakistani army sent message': Jaishankar counters Trump's claims, reveals what led to India-Pakistan ceasefire | India News - Times of India

India News: External affairs minister S Jaishankar refuted Donald Trump's claim of brokering peace between India and Pakistan. Jaishankar clarified that the cessa

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

Jaishankar breaks silence on Trump’s India-Pak truce claim—‘made one thing clear to US…’

Jaishankar says Europe had luxury of not choosing between security & prosperity, India didn’t. ‘Our neighbors, especially Pakistan and China, have kept us on high alert.’

theprint.in

US was in United States: EAM Jaishankar on Trump's claim on mediation

External Affairs Minister S. Jaishankar clarified that the recent India-Pakistan ceasefire was a direct bilateral agreement initiated by Pakistan's army, dismissing claims of international mediation. While countries like the US expressed concern, the negotiation occurred solely between New Delhi...

economictimes.indiatimes.com

I mean, how many times he have to say sharp dialogs ?

You also forgot to share 1 more video where he said he called up the Pakistanis to tell them about an imminent strike from Indian forces .

 

[bssunilreddy]

From my understanding, Deep State within the US is more defence-oriented and institutionalized. In India, it tends to be more politicized

India Deep State is into doing conspiracies and assassinations to tend to their needs while US Deepcool state is purely Dod and its initiatives.
Our dod isn't part of our deep state as at least we don't have the head ache what US and Europeans have.

 

[TEUser2K1]

You also forgot to share 1 more video where he said he called up the Pakistanis to tell them about an imminent strike from Indian forces .

That is not the topic in discussion, why you are trying to change the topic ?

 

[solo_wing]

Jaishankar is a good FM no doubt.

India's challenges have also multiplied a lot in past decade or so.

Wars, Sanctions , Trade with so many different partners who have so many issues with each other already.
It is tough to balance out in between all of them.

India is still looked as reliable partner by both West and East. Otherwise Japan/Uk/Italy offering India 6th gen. fighter jet would have ringed bells in USA by now.
France offering advance weapons to India without any issues.

Russia offering partnership to India without holding themselves back.

Iran offering us major port.

Israel still offering their advance weapons.

Our relation with Gulf country is pretty good too.

yes with our neighbours we are having issue sadly.

Overall some credit has to be given to the FM and current govt. too.

 

[yugaaa]

That is not the topic in discussion, why you are trying to change the topic ?

It is still relevant to the original topic discussed ? An EAM warns the enemy about an impending attack is not relevant to his sense of grip and grasp ? How do we even trust what he says with regard to Trump or with regard to JD Vance ?

Jaishankar is a good FM no doubt.

India's challenges have also multiplied a lot in past decade or so.

Wars, Sanctions , Trade with so many different partners who have so many issues with each other already.
It is tough to balance out in between all of them.

India is still looked as reliable partner by both West and East. Otherwise Japan/Uk/Italy offering India 6th gen. fighter jet would have ringed bells in USA by now.
France offering advance weapons to India without any issues.

Russia offering partnership to India without holding themselves back.

Iran offering us major port.

Israel still offering their advance weapons.

Our relation with Gulf country is pretty good too.

yes with our neighbours we are having issue sadly.

Overall some credit has to be given to the FM and current govt. too.

The world has a lot of challenges . Today India has fewer challenges than it had say 30 years back when we were weaker economically and each and every country played with us . We were resilient back then , unfortunately we feel that we are doing a good job of sorting out unknown problems . We had more no. of countries welcoming Indian passports than today .
Just last month many African countries started new visa policies ,especially those decisions were taken with respect to Indians . What is our EAM doing about them ? As far as I am concerned his family is settled in the USA and he is the lone ranger trying to make last minute money and fame . He has nothing to lose or bleed for India .
Why do we not look at Japan /UK / Italy as partners who need our money , low cost manufacturing while they have the technology ? Many forget the human resources that we have compared to the rest of the world .

Rest all the points that you have made have been there for decades before the clowns came into govt . Iran port , Russian , Israeli relations , Gulf relations were all there before the vishwa guru came and will still be there after he leaves as well .
I sincerely and seriously do not understand what Jaishankar has done or achieved to credit anything worth while .
latest news is Modi not invited for G7 summit . You can credit that to Jaishankar as well .

 

[solo_wing]

An EAM warns the enemy about an impending attack is not relevant to his sense of grip and grasp ? How do we even trust what he says with regard to Trump or with regard to JD Vance ?

I dont know exactly how this works but I know this for sure that responsible countries follow some protocols before attacking .
Infact even when testing missiles there are protocols of informing other nations that we are going to test certain type of missile so that enemy does not get spooked and think they are being nuked.

Firstly and generally any country usually declare war on the other country. (first point that USA made after Pearl Harbour was Japanese not declaring a war and taking them by complete surprise. Ofcourse militarily it does not make sense but again these protocols are there to atleast have some honor and respect for each other)

Even during Trumps time...Gen. Milley had warned chinese had they will be warned if USA attacks them. Trump had even called for his "Tried for Treason"

We dont know how and what system and hotlines are laid down for govt. of the world to avoid escalations. But they are and even Soviet and USA have managed to deescalate on brink of nuclear war because of such protocols.


Dont make a fuss about it so much. Many things we common people will not understand no matter how well we understand geopolitics.

 

[TEUser2K1]

It is still relevant to the original topic discussed ?

No, it was not at all relevant to context in the post.
My response was to your post "The point is what was the EAM/ Govt doing for a few weeks while Trump was boasting himself" which was well clarified in my response.
But then you attempted to change the topic for another.

How do we even trust what he says with regard to Trump or with regard to JD Vance ?

I prefer to trust knowledgeable leaders in our country.
And he clarified the subject very well.

 

[solo_wing]

The world has a lot of challenges . Today India has fewer challenges than it had say 30 years back when we were weaker economically and each and every country played with us . We were resilient back then , unfortunately we feel that we are doing a good job of sorting out unknown problems . We had more no. of countries welcoming Indian passports than today .
Just last month many African countries started new visa policies ,especially those decisions were taken with respect to Indians . What is our EAM doing about them

Visa policies being changed for Indians and Indians not being so welcomed has a lot to do with Indians behaviour also as tourist.

Everywhere Indians go they create some menace. Recently A German girl was raped by 2-3 Indians in Thailand. That is not just one off case ...many times this is a regular behaviour...(have you seen the recent video of that Malik Swash guy in Turkey . Even on Video he is saying horrible things to a nice girl who is helping him)

Indians stealing goods from Hotels and being caught .

Now I am not saying all Indians travelling are like that but even if 5% of Indians travelling behave like this it is enough to leave a bad taste .

I was recently travelling to Russia through Kazakhistan. 3 times I was checked by border control at Kazakhistan Border and Russian Border. (

All 3 times I was told same thing by immigration there ...Indians run away to other countries from Russia illegally ...Are you aware of this? I said yes .
Luckily I had a invitation from Moscow and my bag had Mountaineering gears so they could be explained that i was in for only some adventure work.


I have seen few times how Indians can behave and trust me if I was in Immigration department in other country...I might have taken same steps for Indians.

Dont blame all on Jaishankar for this.

Check this guys full video here and imagine how much damage he has done for Indians travelling to Turkey.

 

[PunkX 75]

Visa policies being changed for Indians and Indians not being so welcomed has a lot to do with Indians behaviour also as tourist.

Everywhere Indians go they create some menace. Recently A German girl was raped by 2-3 Indians in Thailand. That is not just one off case ...many times this is a regular behaviour...(have you seen the recent video of that Malik Swash guy in Turkey . Even on Video he is saying horrible things to a nice girl who is helping him)

Indians stealing goods from Hotels and being caught .

Now I am not saying all Indians travelling are like that but even if 5% of Indians travelling behave like this it is enough to leave a bad taste .

I was recently travelling to Russia through Kazakhistan. 3 times I was checked by border control at Kazakhistan Border and Russian Border. (

All 3 times I was told same thing...Indians run away to other countries from Russia illegally ...Are you aware of this? I said yes .
Luckily I had a invitation from Moscow and my bag had Mountaineering gears so they could be explained that i was in for only some adventure work.


I have seen few times how Indians can behave and trust me if I was in Immigration department in other country...I might have taken same steps for Indians.

Dont blame all on Jaishankar for this.

Agreed. No sense of international civic sense or cultural etiquette. Education alone cannot instill class in most of us Indians. A few notable examples, off the top of my head:

1. A woman eating dal-rice with her hands in the London Tube (metro)
2. Indians dancing to bhangra in the middle of a Canadian city, like it's an open-space Indian nightclub
3. An Indian family on a Finnish train speaking so loudly that it came across as if they were having a household lunch
4. An indian on a German train playing loud Punjabi music on his phone
5. Spitting Paan and Ghutka in public spaces of Jersey
6. Insulting Japanese hosts for not serving pure-veg food

How is Jaishankar, or the government, even remotely responsible for our lack of general etiquette? This is not even adding to all the bullshit we do in our own country - Peeing in public spaces, harrasing foreign tourists (women, particularly), and invading their space, thinking we're F-grade Romeos; Destroying public property over language rows, among others.

 

[yugaaa]

Visa policies being changed for Indians and Indians not being so welcomed has a lot to do with Indians behaviour also as tourist.

Everywhere Indians go they create some menace. Recently A German girl was raped by 2-3 Indians in Thailand. That is not just one off case ...many times this is a regular behaviour...(have you seen the recent video of that Malik Swash guy in Turkey . Even on Video he is saying horrible things to a nice girl who is helping him)

Indians stealing goods from Hotels and being caught .

Now I am not saying all Indians travelling are like that but even if 5% of Indians travelling behave like this it is enough to leave a bad taste .

I was recently travelling to Russia through Kazakhistan. 3 times I was checked by border control at Kazakhistan Border and Russian Border. (

All 3 times I was told same thing by immigration there ...Indians run away to other countries from Russia illegally ...Are you aware of this? I said yes .
Luckily I had a invitation from Moscow and my bag had Mountaineering gears so they could be explained that i was in for only some adventure work.


I have seen few times how Indians can behave and trust me if I was in Immigration department in other country...I might have taken same steps for Indians.

Dont blame all on Jaishankar for this.

Check this guys full video here and imagine how much damage he has done for Indians travelling to Turkey.

Yes , let us pass the buck and blame a few idiots ? Visa policies affect business visits ,prospective trade and bilateral talks . Let us not question the ones who are supposed to run the govt and give them a free pass ? let the diplomats , politicians enjoy their diplomatic status and visa free travel to countries ?
Let us not discuss the multiple mishaps of policy and diplomatic failures in the Indian subcontinent and the rest of the world , but let us blame a few idiot tourists and turn it into a discussion on why the EAM is not able to get some concessions on trade , travel ? Let us discuss and celebrate useless achievements like trade negotiations with countries which do not matter at all and credit laser eyes , charlie chaplin pants ?

 

[solo_wing]

into a discussion on why the EAM is not able to get some concessions on trade , travel ?

I talked only on part about visa getting harder for India as tourist.
You very conveniently decided to ignore that point again.

 

[yugaaa]

I talked only on part about visa getting harder for India as tourist.
You very conveniently decided to ignore that point again.

What you do not realise is that Indians spend money . There are more no . of millionaires in India who go to foreign countries to spend money . A few idiots do not matter if they create a ruckus . If you are going to base your views on a few Indians you should have a look at how Africans behave on flights or at airports . The majority of Indians stick to rules . Point is our Foreign minister or EAM has not been able to showcase our power and get concessions . So that is why I do not blame a few but I clearly blame the incompetent FM . Countries in Africa have also started a stricter visa policy for Indians .

 

[TEUser2K1]

A woman eating dal-rice with her hands in the London Tube (metro)

Lot of shittier things happen in those tubes which didn't get this much attention.
Indians and lot of people from other cultures do eat with hands, it's no big deal to whine about. The situation maximum warrants a fine.
The only issue here is when such things are done by Indians. Have seen people from other far poorer and uncouth countries doing this against Indians. Indians love to self denigrate themselves together with closet racism by others is the primary issue.
Most of Indians criticizing others on social media may not have even traveled outside their own districts, partly are jealous of others living their life.
Indians do need lot of self improvement, but we have to understand that we are from a poverty ridden country which is upcoming. Population-wise too, we may be more represented.
Even otherwise, in every facet of the world, India is like a disliked child and are treated in step-motherly manner.

 

[PunkX 75]

Lot of shittier things happen in those tubes which didn't get this much attention.
Indians and lot of people from other cultures do eat with hands, it's no big deal to whine about. The situation maximum warrants a fine.
The only issue here is when such things are done by Indians. Have seen people from other far poorer and uncouth countries doing this against Indians. Indians love to self denigrate themselves together with closet racism by others is the primary issue.
Most of Indians criticizing others on social media may not have even traveled outside their own districts, partly are jealous of others living their life.
Indians do need lot of self improvement, but we have to understand that we are from a poverty ridden country which is upcoming. Population-wise too, we may be more represented.
Even otherwise, in every facet of the world, India is like a disliked child and are treated in step-motherly manner.

Yes, I agree that the backlash was a bit too harsh and unwarranted.

Another example would be the backlash against Sharmishta Panoli, but that's a conversation for elsewhere.