Adobe strikes back: no Flash for iPhone, end of story?
- Thread starter Lord Nemesis
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Spacescreamer
Innovator
blr_p
Oracle
Umm, maybe Apple was asking for source code to ensure it worked properly on the iphone or vice versa ? -- or set conditions that were not acceptable by Adobe.
Adobe refused, turtleneck blogs about it and here is the result. This way he gets the irate apple users off his back by blaming adobe and they blame back.
You're not getting flash so better deal with it. Its not like Apple cant make a substitute but it locks you out from existing content. Course its extra work for nothing and given the in-the-past good relations between the two companies its a pity.
He's managed to get uber tight fisted music execs to allow music to be sold in his store when they refused nearly everyone else and then got them to drop encryption a bit later, its odd he could not work something out with Adobe :huh:
You failed this one JOBS!
Adobe refused, turtleneck blogs about it and here is the result. This way he gets the irate apple users off his back by blaming adobe and they blame back.
You're not getting flash so better deal with it. Its not like Apple cant make a substitute but it locks you out from existing content. Course its extra work for nothing and given the in-the-past good relations between the two companies its a pity.
He's managed to get uber tight fisted music execs to allow music to be sold in his store when they refused nearly everyone else and then got them to drop encryption a bit later, its odd he could not work something out with Adobe :huh:
You failed this one JOBS!
malhotraraul
Galvanizer
at the end of the day the only thing that matters is "who gets what ??"
maybe this did not go too well !!!!
maybe this did not go too well !!!!
iGo said:
From what I understand, Adobe already has a working prototype of flash for iPhone OS and its Apple that's in the way. Apple doesn't want flash to become a application development layer and that's how Adobe wants it to be. i.e as a cross platform development layer rather than as an app that's limited to playing flash files in a limited context and environment.
As for being Adobe being lazy, I would hardly call a company that delivered major revisions of 18 products with huge code bases in barely 6 months lazy. At least definitely not if Apple is used as an yard stick considering Apple is uber lazy when it comes to fixing problems and their tendency to rather point fingers at others.
If Apple gets its lazy ass up and fixes the tonnes of bugs in their OS that people like us report, I would guess flash wouldn't be a fraction as buggy on Mac OS and so wouldn't a dozen other major app's that were originally responsible for getting Apple's brand value to such a point that they were able to sell iMac's and iPods after their dire condition in the late 90's.
Pointing fingers is nothing new for Jobs or Apple (especially considering their fan following and their inclination to blindly believe what Jobs has to say rather than what the actual developer says) and it has been a strategy they frequently employ to get their troubled customers of their backs.
YoGi-Sama
Galvanizer
ummm... actually no, this was nothing like Apple getting to strong-arm Music execs. Adobe very well knows that Desktop flash player isn't ready out-of-the-box for touchscreen devices, and Flash lite is too lame in terms of feature sets. I can't believe they aren't considering a well featured mobile (and touch) optimized Flash player. One thing iPhone OS and Android made clear that desktop or desktop-like OS doesn't work well for small screen or mobile devices, you have to think differently for these. Adobe is simply playing stubborn here, but since Apple is well known for stubbornness people aren't noticing Adobe in this department.
In the end, nobody is winning this argument, neither Apple nor Adobe and definitely not the users... and the crux of the story is that Adobe is in the position to change that, but not willing to. They could have very well fixed what's wrong with their software and everyone would have been happy. But they are showing the same retard attitude they been doing on the desktop/PC front. They are churning out next version of their Creative Suit one after another, but not fixing some of the annoying bugs that's been there since ages... specifically in Flash (development software). Every iteration is getting more and more sluggish to work on despite all the speed advantage in processing power you get in hardware. The only solace I found was Photoshop CS4 64-bit which definitely felt faster to work on (Interface and UI) compared to earlier CS3 counterpart.
In the end, nobody is winning this argument, neither Apple nor Adobe and definitely not the users... and the crux of the story is that Adobe is in the position to change that, but not willing to. They could have very well fixed what's wrong with their software and everyone would have been happy. But they are showing the same retard attitude they been doing on the desktop/PC front. They are churning out next version of their Creative Suit one after another, but not fixing some of the annoying bugs that's been there since ages... specifically in Flash (development software). Every iteration is getting more and more sluggish to work on despite all the speed advantage in processing power you get in hardware. The only solace I found was Photoshop CS4 64-bit which definitely felt faster to work on (Interface and UI) compared to earlier CS3 counterpart.
shantanugoel
Discoverer
i concur with nemesis.. its not as much about flash as it is about air..html 5 is hardly a replacement for flash video as of now and will not be for quite a few years to come..and expect a lot of infighting for settling on the actual video codec for it..
iGo said:
If you are referring specifically to bugs with the Mac versions of their products, then chances are high that they were marked as Apple dependencies and left alone till apple fixes the problem or their part of the problem. We have a tonne of bugs in our own product lines marked like that and some of them as old as 7~8 years. Many times when there's an issue that's very serious for the customer we are asked to worked around apple's bugs and we have a tonne of those kind of patches as well in our codebase's. It would probably be the same with Adobe as well.
YoGi-Sama
Galvanizer
^ Nope... not on mac. I work mostly (Office / Productive) on Windows. I use my Mac (Macbook) majorly for testing and while traveling. The performance issues, or let's call it quirks are what I face in my day to day work on Windows. They are not large enough to stop my work but annoying enough. What's more annoying is that even after two-three generations of product, they aren't fixed.
I'm not saying Apple doesn't have bugs in their software and neither they have fastest turnaround record for fixing those. But Adobe is more or less in the same league when it comes to fixing bugs. Apple OS share is quite little, but when you compare Adobe software's market share on both PC and Mac, Adobe in definitely a giant in that comparison. So when Adobe rips my wallet every generation after another for insanely priced Software Suites, I expect it fix bugs occurring in daily work-flow and not just add a new feature to justify increasing cost of the suite. Because, not many user's would use the new radical feature in their day-to-day work. Exactly the way you are irritated with Apple due to their broken font system as it's part of your daily work.
Apple is no saint but then no big corporation will ever be (yep, not even Google), but Adobe definitely doesn't deserve any praises for throwing it in a towel instead of growing a pair and fixing their software.
I'm not saying Apple doesn't have bugs in their software and neither they have fastest turnaround record for fixing those. But Adobe is more or less in the same league when it comes to fixing bugs. Apple OS share is quite little, but when you compare Adobe software's market share on both PC and Mac, Adobe in definitely a giant in that comparison. So when Adobe rips my wallet every generation after another for insanely priced Software Suites, I expect it fix bugs occurring in daily work-flow and not just add a new feature to justify increasing cost of the suite. Because, not many user's would use the new radical feature in their day-to-day work. Exactly the way you are irritated with Apple due to their broken font system as it's part of your daily work.
Apple is no saint but then no big corporation will ever be (yep, not even Google), but Adobe definitely doesn't deserve any praises for throwing it in a towel instead of growing a pair and fixing their software.
I have an Iphone 3gs and i certainly miss Flash and java on my phone . If Iphone gets Flash and Java support , image the free games that i can access from the internet and not having to go to itunes and pay for full version of some games . Maybe this is what apple is afraid of . They want to protect their itunes entity .
I think Microsoft has a competing product line for Adobe Flash, called WPF (Windows Presentation Foundation). Maybe Apple will talk with Microsoft for this one.
Anyway, Android is picking up, so Adobe will surely talk to Google and get a better base than Apple.
Apple's rigid thinking will take it down very soon. Great, they are coming out with fantastic products, but remember that there are competitors with cheaper alternative. Also few people will go with the original product, whereas majority will go with the cheaper alternative.
Anyway, Android is picking up, so Adobe will surely talk to Google and get a better base than Apple.
Apple's rigid thinking will take it down very soon. Great, they are coming out with fantastic products, but remember that there are competitors with cheaper alternative. Also few people will go with the original product, whereas majority will go with the cheaper alternative.
sandy453
Contributor
The main issue of contention is not flash but about controlling content on iPhone . Apple wants to have complete control over what applications users see and use on their phone. This is possible only if all the applications are sold through their app store.They feel by supporting flash would just complicate things for them. There might be a possibility they lose their control where a user might download a flash file from net and just play it rather than going through app store.
This reason for Apple not supporting flash is more economic than about
technology. Remember, for every application downloaded through appstore ,apple gets its share .
This reason for Apple not supporting flash is more economic than about
technology. Remember, for every application downloaded through appstore ,apple gets its share .
rajndra said:
Actually WPF is not a flash competitor. It does not work cross platform and is not compact either as it depends on the .Net runtimes. The flash contender is Silverlight and it works on both Windows and Mac. Linux has the moonlight project going on. Silverlight is shaping up nicely, and its being ported to many platforms including mobile ones like Symbian.
The problem is that this too runs bad on Mac OS due to OS Bugs (From the analysis I did when I was writing code for Silverlight 2), though not as bad as Flash. Also Silverlight on iPhone OS is mostly out of question. One of the main strong points with having silverlight on Mobile platforms is that you can develop cross platform standalone apps. So basically its a development layer rather than a simple app and Apple would never allow this to happen on iPhone OS.
Read the comments on about how even an icon like Steven Jobs can just lie and get through 
.....at his age why should business care about profits and getting others down ?
Anyways apple will be down soon again likein early 90s
Steve Jobs on the 6 grudges Apple holds against Flash – GSMArena Blog
http://www.niemanlab.org/2010/04/mark-fiore-can-win-a-pulitzer-prize-but-he-cant-get-his-iphone-cartoon-app-past-apples-satire-police/
If apple would have HQed in India.....the Shiv Sena would have been behind Gobs then he would have known that he is not the king anymore :rofl:
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.....at his age why should business care about profits and getting others down ?Anyways apple will be down soon again likein early 90s
Steve Jobs on the 6 grudges Apple holds against Flash – GSMArena Blog
http://www.niemanlab.org/2010/04/mark-fiore-can-win-a-pulitzer-prize-but-he-cant-get-his-iphone-cartoon-app-past-apples-satire-police/
If apple would have HQed in India.....the Shiv Sena would have been behind Gobs then he would have known that he is not the king anymore :rofl:
Best comment
IEBlog : HTML5 Video
MSFT seems to have come out in support of HTML5 and announced that H264 will be the format with thier backing.
Brilliant.. Simply brilliant.
Pick a post by some moron on GSMArena's blog and post it as it it was true :|
1. Internet video does not involve fees as of now.
2. Apple is not the only member of the consortium that owns the patent.
3. Apple is DEFINITELY NOT the firm that runs the licensing program.
4. There are other issues however,
MSFT seems to have come out in support of HTML5 and announced that H264 will be the format with thier backing.
Supra said:
Brilliant.. Simply brilliant.
Pick a post by some moron on GSMArena's blog and post it as it it was true :|
1. Internet video does not involve fees as of now.
2. Apple is not the only member of the consortium that owns the patent.
3. Apple is DEFINITELY NOT the firm that runs the licensing program.
4. There are other issues however,
^^ bah Jobs can post his opinion...then ppl can also post thier comments....brilliant or not. Anyways we all know how JOBS is
Anyways both Apple and Adobe is now on loggerheads and there is only Apple fanboi's .....no Adobe fanbois.....Apple simply doesn't want Flash and for that they are pointing fingers.
Anyways both Apple and Adobe is now on loggerheads and there is only Apple fanboi's .....no Adobe fanbois
.....Apple simply doesn't want Flash and for that they are pointing fingers.saumilsingh
Galvanizer
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