easiest country to move to?
- Thread starter salluks
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Salluks,
I've been following this thread for a while. Here are my thoughts. Have a little patience and read it through. I hope it will help you in some way or the other. I feel about India exactly like you.
However, for me, leaving India has never been an option for 2 big reasons.
I did however think about going abroad for 2 years or so for education. All this was before I went to the US.
I went to the US in April-May of this year for a 5 week vacation. Stayed with quite a lot of relatives there. I realised life isnt as easy as they make them out to be.
It's not outright racism, but you will rarely have friends outside your ethnicity. My cousins, uncles, aunts, etc.... all have Indian friends. They dont have phirangs they can actually call as friends. Even my cousin who is born and brought up in the US. I stayed in GWU for a day with him and hung out with his friends. They are ALL Indians. He has only one white friend.
Another thing I heard was that Muslims have it even tougher. Ever since 9/11, the whites are freaked out. Basically, some of the guys behind 9/11 who were killed or arrested were normal people. None of their neighbours, friends even gave them a second though. But once it was revealed that they were terrorists, there is a fear psychosis in the US. Now, most people are not outrightly racist, but they just keep their distance from Muslims. It's very unfortunate.
My cousin was telling me this and he told me that there is quite a lot of b**ching and backbiting that goes on in his University w.r.t Muslim students. He says many of them are really lonely as they rarely get to hang out with guys other than fellow Muslims.
Ok, that was the bad part. The good part is that everything is totally systematic and orderly there. It's clean, you have all the facilities there. People listen to you. As a customer if you have a complaint, they will actually give oyu a fair hearing and if they dont, there are good mechanisms in place to help you. Our consumer court has a looooong way to go before it can become like that. Also, the cops are actually there to help you and protect you unlike in India.
Yes, there are murders, rapes, etc...but it's lesser and there is sterner action taken if something unfortunate happens.
At the end, you need to take a call based on all your factors of your life.
1). What about your parents? When you get a Green card(or whatever it is for other countries), will you make them shift to the country you are now a resident of? This is assuming you are the only son.
Or would you prefer for them to stay in Bangalore all alone in their old age with no one to support them? I am actually seeing my grandparents getting old with numerous medical problems. Luckily for them, their son is about 30 secs away on the next road. Their son-in-law and daughter(my parents) are 2 minutes away by car. Between us, we have three drivers so everytime they want to go to the hospital or wherever, they can count on us. They have 2 full time nurses staying with them to help them.
Are you sure you want your parents to grow old without you being here?
If you make plans to come back after a few years, forget it! Once you get used to a life of comfort and convenience in a Western country(or Eastern!), you will not be able to adjust here.
My mom's cousin was working in the US for the past 6-7 years. Now, his two kids are around 4-6 tyears old and he doesnt want to bring them up in the US. So, he's shifted here and is miserable! He's now seriously thinking of shifting back to the US or some other place because he cant live in this pollution, traffic, lawlessness and filth.
2). Are you a loner? Think about how you will lead the rest of oyur life if oyu dont have any close friends. If you move to another country, you will be lonely. Friends will not be like the friends you made in your hometown.
3). These foreign countries have their problems too. Though I agree for you, it will seem heaven. But once you get settled in, you will start to realise the problems.
One thing you SHOULD remember is this: In India, you are a first class citizen. In any other country, you are ALWAYS an outsider. For the rest of your life, you would have to live as a second class citizen. If you think it's a small price to pay for the comfort, peace of mind, etc, then go ahead. Do some proper research before jumping in.
I've been following this thread for a while. Here are my thoughts. Have a little patience and read it through. I hope it will help you in some way or the other. I feel about India exactly like you.
However, for me, leaving India has never been an option for 2 big reasons.
I did however think about going abroad for 2 years or so for education. All this was before I went to the US.
I went to the US in April-May of this year for a 5 week vacation. Stayed with quite a lot of relatives there. I realised life isnt as easy as they make them out to be.
It's not outright racism, but you will rarely have friends outside your ethnicity. My cousins, uncles, aunts, etc.... all have Indian friends. They dont have phirangs they can actually call as friends. Even my cousin who is born and brought up in the US. I stayed in GWU for a day with him and hung out with his friends. They are ALL Indians. He has only one white friend.
Another thing I heard was that Muslims have it even tougher. Ever since 9/11, the whites are freaked out. Basically, some of the guys behind 9/11 who were killed or arrested were normal people. None of their neighbours, friends even gave them a second though. But once it was revealed that they were terrorists, there is a fear psychosis in the US. Now, most people are not outrightly racist, but they just keep their distance from Muslims. It's very unfortunate.
My cousin was telling me this and he told me that there is quite a lot of b**ching and backbiting that goes on in his University w.r.t Muslim students. He says many of them are really lonely as they rarely get to hang out with guys other than fellow Muslims.
Ok, that was the bad part. The good part is that everything is totally systematic and orderly there. It's clean, you have all the facilities there. People listen to you. As a customer if you have a complaint, they will actually give oyu a fair hearing and if they dont, there are good mechanisms in place to help you. Our consumer court has a looooong way to go before it can become like that. Also, the cops are actually there to help you and protect you unlike in India.
Yes, there are murders, rapes, etc...but it's lesser and there is sterner action taken if something unfortunate happens.
At the end, you need to take a call based on all your factors of your life.
1). What about your parents? When you get a Green card(or whatever it is for other countries), will you make them shift to the country you are now a resident of? This is assuming you are the only son.
Or would you prefer for them to stay in Bangalore all alone in their old age with no one to support them? I am actually seeing my grandparents getting old with numerous medical problems. Luckily for them, their son is about 30 secs away on the next road. Their son-in-law and daughter(my parents) are 2 minutes away by car. Between us, we have three drivers so everytime they want to go to the hospital or wherever, they can count on us. They have 2 full time nurses staying with them to help them.
Are you sure you want your parents to grow old without you being here?
If you make plans to come back after a few years, forget it! Once you get used to a life of comfort and convenience in a Western country(or Eastern!), you will not be able to adjust here.
My mom's cousin was working in the US for the past 6-7 years. Now, his two kids are around 4-6 tyears old and he doesnt want to bring them up in the US. So, he's shifted here and is miserable! He's now seriously thinking of shifting back to the US or some other place because he cant live in this pollution, traffic, lawlessness and filth.
2). Are you a loner? Think about how you will lead the rest of oyur life if oyu dont have any close friends. If you move to another country, you will be lonely. Friends will not be like the friends you made in your hometown.
3). These foreign countries have their problems too. Though I agree for you, it will seem heaven. But once you get settled in, you will start to realise the problems.
One thing you SHOULD remember is this: In India, you are a first class citizen. In any other country, you are ALWAYS an outsider. For the rest of your life, you would have to live as a second class citizen. If you think it's a small price to pay for the comfort, peace of mind, etc, then go ahead. Do some proper research before jumping in.
wow, thanks for the detailed write up..Nikhil said:
just my mom and a bro, we plan to live togeather, neither plans nor option to venture out on own, whereever i go or my bro go's, the other will follow mostly. thats the reason he went to dubai,but the weather there is too much for us as we've been in bangalore all our lives, but that should be a problem all our lives.
[These foreign countries have their problems too. Though I agree for you, it will seem heaven. But once you get settled in, you will start to realise the problems.2). Are you a loner? Think about how you will lead the rest of oyur life if oyu dont have any close friends. If you move to another country, you will be lonely. Friends will not be like the friends you made in your hometown.
its quite fine, i like my own/family company.so this shouldn't be a big problem either
i know, no countries perfect, but i would atleast like to see basic facilities and basic courtesy towards fellow human's(isin't thats what makes us human?)
if anybody thinks this happens in india, there's nothing more i can say!
my water board guy puts me 60,000 water bill, cos some other idiot took the connection on our house, and there's nothing we can do about it! been running around to every possible govt office from past 2 months, nikhil,ur from bangalore, ull know better when i say how govt offices act here!!!
about the us things, thats exactly i posted before, am not atall interested in US/UK kind of countries, infact i would like to go to a cuontry which prolly doesn't exist on the map!
i know running away is not the answer, thats what i used to think all this while that i would be the change, blah blah blah
but, the fact is we are helpless and there's nothing we can do about it and sit on some forum and talk it out to remove the frustration.
my life is pretty good here, but as i said before, its not about that anymore.
u tell me, would u rather have a bicycle and good road to ride on than a porche with no road?
even if u sit in a merc, u'll still have to wait for 45 mins in a signal cos some VIP is crossing the road
y is a product more expensive here even when we earn less salaries?
y do we have to pay bribe just to live our lives?
u go to buy milk, it say 15 bucks or MRP and the store guy charges 16 cos its refrigerated , wtf?
all govt can do is jaago grahak jago campaign?
karnataka gets flood hit and people die, and all every paper cares about is a fight between to guys!
more damage is done in karnataka than AP and AP gets 1000cr when compared to karnataka's 150 crores(cos AP is congress dominated)
there are trillion other instances as these which we prolly don't even notice cos we are used to being pushed around.
raksrules
Oracle
Even my neighbors stayed in US for long and decided to get their son's schooling done in India but their son was no able to cope up because the things that they teach in India in say 2nd 3rd standard is something taught in say 5th or 6th there (hypothetically), inshort they have very less IQ (call center guys know very well).
OT: Also i have seen people complaining lot after coming back from say US etc, will drink mineral water, won't eat paani puri and bhel puri outside for hygiene reason. I mean WTF, itne saal yahan rahe tabhi kuch hua nahi, 1-2 saal US mein kya rahe akad aa gayi.
One of my friends stayed in US for a couple of years and when he came back we were supposed to go out somewhere. You guys won't believe, he was scared to cross the road. He said that in US we can just press that button on either side of road and cars etc stop and we cross. Saala 25 saal ka seekha hua road crossing skill 2 saal mein bhool gaya.
Rant over
OT: Also i have seen people complaining lot after coming back from say US etc, will drink mineral water, won't eat paani puri and bhel puri outside for hygiene reason. I mean WTF, itne saal yahan rahe tabhi kuch hua nahi, 1-2 saal US mein kya rahe akad aa gayi.
One of my friends stayed in US for a couple of years and when he came back we were supposed to go out somewhere. You guys won't believe, he was scared to cross the road. He said that in US we can just press that button on either side of road and cars etc stop and we cross. Saala 25 saal ka seekha hua road crossing skill 2 saal mein bhool gaya.
Rant over
blr_p
Oracle
I'd say this is 100% true in the gulf, i grew up there. Cross a local and even if he's in the wrong its your fault. Its much less in Europe and even more less in the US. Tho you have to make an active effort to integrate. In the gulf you are forever a migrant.nikhil said:
Heh, not in my experince, BWSSB & BESCOM have deal with me quite well in comparison to SBI and i can't even speak kannada. I was quite amazed actually given how so many ppl say exactly the same thing you did.salluks said:
I agree that this is disgraceful, not the media bit because they are only reporting what happens but the damn party itself. What was the result ? CM had to back downSalluks said:
Sallu,
I can understand your reasons. Just that you shouldnt do it in a hurry. Think through EACH AND EVERY aspect before doing it. I really mean EACH and EVERY aspect. Even those that seem trivial and unimportant.
Edit: dont expect the media to be better anywhere else. Just watch a few US talk shows and oyu'll know what I'm on about.
I can understand your reasons. Just that you shouldnt do it in a hurry. Think through EACH AND EVERY aspect before doing it. I really mean EACH and EVERY aspect. Even those that seem trivial and unimportant.
Edit: dont expect the media to be better anywhere else. Just watch a few US talk shows and oyu'll know what I'm on about.
l33t_5n1p3r_max
Contributor
Bhai, if you're getting a job with a bcom degree take me along too! ROFL.
Notice how I'm just fixated with his bcom degree? Thats how bored I am...hate my life, maybe I should move to America too! God damn this country, terrible I tell you...theres like no electricity and sh1t for my washing machine and my maid servant charges me 50 bucks extra for washing clothes and my pepsi costs 22 bucks instead of 20 cause its refrigerated...
GOD, can't wait to get to the US where I can get a maid for 300 rupees a month, afford my own washing machine, 202930293mbit internet connection, get pepsi 2 rupees cheaper and most importantly, speak with a white person (my only aspiration in life before I die!)!
lol..bahar jaa munna..3 days of travel in overcrowded MRT's and you'll be wishing you could have your own bike/car/auto like you have in India, only this time, you won't be able to afford any of these.
Notice how I'm just fixated with his bcom degree? Thats how bored I am...hate my life, maybe I should move to America too! God damn this country, terrible I tell you...theres like no electricity and sh1t for my washing machine and my maid servant charges me 50 bucks extra for washing clothes and my pepsi costs 22 bucks instead of 20 cause its refrigerated...
GOD, can't wait to get to the US where I can get a maid for 300 rupees a month, afford my own washing machine, 202930293mbit internet connection, get pepsi 2 rupees cheaper and most importantly, speak with a white person (my only aspiration in life before I die!)!
lol..bahar jaa munna..3 days of travel in overcrowded MRT's and you'll be wishing you could have your own bike/car/auto like you have in India, only this time, you won't be able to afford any of these.
l33t_5n1p3r_max said:
salluks said:
He's talking about Singy seeing how he mentioned the MRT. Nobody I know in the US (outside NYC, those people suck anyway) travels in dingy trains with some fat bastard's sweaty armpit pushing into your face while he sings some obnoxiously loud crap rap that makes you want to kick him in the nuts and shoot his penis off.
Sudarshan_SMD
Galvanizer
You should try moving to Villages. you will only miss 24*7 electricity supply.
Even heard of competition in villages for most clean villages("swach sundar gaon")?. move to village which has been awarded those of the awards. People are good, environment is good for living, no pollution. You don't have to care of government there, people in 'Grampanchayat'(head of village) will sort all matters. For cleaning work, roads, etc you don't rely on govt. people use their own manpower for all that.
I think you will find peace in such village, but problem then will be job...you will have find job. FYI electricity rates, landline rates & broadband rates are far more lower than cities. Only problem is no 24*7 electricity.
Hacker
Contributor
Nikhil said:
Nikhil nice post although I disagree on the above point, this has nothing to do with racism, its upto you, how you talk with others.
My cousins have very few Indian friends most of their friends are whites.
If you can sweet talk, you can make friends easily in any country.
l33t_5n1p3r_max
Contributor
Imatrollfeedme.
Speaking of making it in the world..you really must be dense to think you'll be welcomed with open arms abroad with a b.com degree. Even in India you'll be lucky to land a job at dell tech support lol - "Hello saar, dell tech support how may I help you? Have you tried plugging in your pc?"
First question you'll face is - "What is this B.com degree you seem to have". Ahh, the joys of having too much free time and multiple boards to troll on..lol
Not just that, it depends entirely on your personality. In all the years that I've lived in the US, I've observed that most Indians (not all, but an overwhelming majority) stick with fellow Indians only. Even if a whitey or Afro-American comes along to talk or chat, they stutter, walk away or just plain ignore which doesn't really reflect an easy going personality. Perhaps it is our intrinsic nature to be shy/reserved/whatever but the ones that don't suffer from this problem (including yours truly) have made tons of great white & black friends over the years. Same goes with Indian females - they rarely talk with their Indian male counterparts, let alone whites or blacks. All this makes it easier to go out/date white/black women while Indian women stick with fellow Indian lady colleagues.Hacker said:
Hacker said:
I guess it's possible. But I've seen it happen to a LOT of my friends who have moved there in the past 2 years. They end up with Indians only.
Of course, I'm a little bit fixated on this point because for me, going abroad to study doesnt mean only the campus, facilities, etc.... It also means the people I study, work and play with. If I'm spending tens of lakhs of rupees, I would like to get to interact with people from a completely different background and know about their lives, their childhood, etc....etc....
Anyway, we are going OT.
l33t_5n1p3r_max
Contributor
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