Front loading or top loading washing machine?

However, will check with the IFB tech who will come for installation if there is indeed an option to swap it out for a clear glass door. (However, not really a priority atm).
Don't forget to take a clear photo of the underside showing the drum. I expect to see bolts holding that tub together.
Do you know of any reliable outlet to sell my old Samsung Machine? I am only getting offers for purchase in scrap for around 1-1.5k at best. Wondering, if I can get anymore.
A scrap dealer might offer more. These exchange deals work because the real scrap value is more than they offer. Then you have to factor in transport.
 
@blr_p
Sure, will take a picture of the internals from the underside as long as the installation guy cooperates. From every repair video I have seen of various IFB models, they are all have unsealed drums.

No luck yet finding a scrap dealer who can buy the old machine. Let me know if you have any leads. Thanks
 
Thank you for your inputs. Clincher is the drum size and longer warranty on the IFB.

Price difference is about 6k, with IFB being more expensive.

IFB order is still processing so can cancel and order the LG. Never thought that I would be over thinking a washing machine purchase in this manner :arghh:
 
IFB Delivery guy just delivered the machine. Was kind enough to drag it to the back of the house where it will get installed.

IFB installation guy is on the way. Asked about buying a stand/cover/detergent etc. Any thoughts on this?
Was unable to take a picture from the bottom. However here is the view from the top.

Drum is definitely not sealed and can be repaired instead of a complete replacment.

Paid 2100 for a stand for the machine and bought 1ltr of IFB'S own liquid detergent for the initial loads.

IFB tech also tried to sell me on a water softenizer costing 1800. Refused to install that as there are cheaper options available in market.

Any recommendations on which liquid detergent does the best job for a front load? @blr_p
 

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Was unable to take a picture from the bottom. However here is the view from the top.

Drum is definitely not sealed and can be repaired instead of a complete replacment.
Ha! Exactly as I suspected. Yay :happy:
IFB tech also tried to sell me on a water softenizer costing 1800. Refused to install that as there are cheaper options available in market.
Do you have hard water? Notice any scaling in your pots or other
Any recommendations on which liquid detergent does the best job for a front load? @blr_p
Not really other than surf excel, Ariel or Tide for front loader.

My preference is for powders. 6kg surf for front loader at temperature no less than 40 degrees otherwise it does not rinse off well.

But the IFB guy will tell you the opposite. Liquids are better than powders. Why? Because IFB sells liquid detergent and not powder detergents.

Leave the blue insert in for liquids and remove it for powders.

With a full load I use about 30-40gm with powder and a capful which works out to 40ml for liquids. That works out Rs.6 for surf powder vs. Rs.9 for liquid surf per wash. As for how to tell what is a full load. A hands width from the top of the gasket to the top of the clothes loaded in the drum.

With whites it helps to add oxygen bleach to maintain whites. So add about 20-30gms of Vanish powder in addition to the regular detergent. Important to use powder as it contains oxygen bleach whereas liquid Vanish does not. Vanish will also work to remove any persistent odours that results from bacteria that plain detergent cannot remove unless washed at 60 degrees or higher.

If you want to do delayed washes then powder is the only option as liquid will thicken if left exposed for a few hours.

My preference is for Unilever over P&G as Unilever have been in India for over a century. So surf.

Liquid detergents have fats in them that deposit on the drum which then becomes food for mould. The way to avoid this problem is to leave the door open for at least ten hours after every wash and wipe the gasket dry after every wash. Keep a hand towel or microfiber towel on the machine for this job only.

Important not to cheap out with detergent. Stick to the big brands and pick the one that says for front loader.

Stay away from fabric softener. Ensure minimum temperature of any wash is no less than 40 degrees. Enzymes in branded detergents fully activate at body temperature and provide the best stain removal.
 
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Ha! Exactly as I suspected. Yay :happy:

Do you have hard water? Notice any scaling in your pots or other

Not really other than surf excel, Ariel or Tide for front loader.

My preference is for powders. 6kg surf for front loader at temperature no less than 40 degrees otherwise it does not rinse off well.

But the IFB guy will tell you the opposite. Liquids are better than powders. Why? Because IFB sells liquid detergent and not powder detergents.

Leave the blue insert in for liquids and remove it for powders.

With a full load I use about 30-40gm with powder and a capful which works out to 40ml for liquids. That works out Rs.6 for surf powder vs. Rs.9 for liquid surf per wash. As for how to tell what is a full load. A hands width from the top of the gasket to the top of the clothes loaded in the drum.

With whites it helps to add oxygen bleach to maintain whites. So add about 20-30gms of Vanish powder in addition to the regular detergent. Important to use powder as it contains oxygen bleach whereas liquid Vanish does not. Vanish will also work to remove any persistent odours that results from bacteria that plain detergent cannot remove unless washed at 60 degrees or higher.

If you want to do delayed washes then powder is the only option as liquid will thicken if left exposed for a few hours.

My preference is for Unilever over P&G as Unilever have been in India for over a century. So surf.

Liquid detergents have fats in them that deposit on the drum which then becomes food for mould. The way to avoid this problem is to leave the door open for at least ten hours after every wash and wipe the gasket dry after every wash. Keep a hand towel or microfiber towel on the machine for this job only.

Important not to cheap out with detergent. Stick to the big brands and pick the one that says for front loader.

Stay away from fabric softener. Ensure minimum temperature of any wash is no less than 40 degrees. Enzymes in branded detergents fully activate at body temperature and provide the best stain removal.

We have a water softenizer setup so the water is not hard as it is otherwise. Still thinking, in the long run, might make sense to get the filter installed.

Have like 6kgs of Ariel Matic Top Load which will now go waste due to the change in machine type. Lol.

Will switch the powder once the current liquid detergent runs out.

Noted on rest of your recommendations.

Any reason why you don't recommend fabric softeners. I have stock of comfort as well it seems.
 
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We have a water softenizer setup so the water is not hard as it is otherwise. Still thinking, in the long run, might make sense to get the filter installed.
Can you link to the water softener you're using? How do you know it's working as intended.
Have like 6kgs of Ariel Matic Top Load which will now go waste due to the change in machine type. Lol.
Donate it
Any reason why you don't recommend fabric softeners. I have stock of comfort as well it seems.
You are essentially coating your clothes with grease. It's the slippery feeling that makes you think the clothes are softer.


After several years of using FS this what your drum will look like. You want to wash your clothes in that? How do you get that residue off without manual cleaning.

Why do you use it in the first place?

My theory is people with top loaders wash in colder temperatures which does not leave the clothes smelling fresh. Meaning their clothes ain't getting as clean as they should. So to mask this they add fabric softener just to have better smelling clothes.

If you wash at warm temperatures with the right amount of proper detergent your clothes should smell fresh when dry. It takes at least 5-8 washes to get fabric softener out of clothes.

 
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@blr_p

Yeah, will get rid of the old detergent and fabric softener etc along with the old machine. Waiting on someone to bite so I can clear up some space as well.

Noted on the softener, will skip on using them going forward. Thanks for your inputs and the links. A real eye opener for sure.

The wash quality after just a few washes between installation earlier today and now already feels like night and day when compared to the old Samsung. Or maybe it is just placebo. Time will tell.

The tinted glass is a pain for sure, basically you are operating blind and feel handicapped as you can't intervene or have no idea even if an intervention is required. Will check with IFB if I can pay to get the tinted glass replaced with a clear glass down the road.

The IFB tech who came to install didn't do a great job and his demo was lousy. I knew more about the machine and it various functions that he did. Didn't even take us through the process of cleaning the lint filter.

What's worse is that the machine turned to its side during operation this evening. The balance was off and the spin cycle was causing major wobbles and moved the machine. Thankfully caught it in time and no damage done. Sir installed the machine without the use of a spirit leveller and just used his gut feel to set it and then left. Didn't even bother to wait for 1 test wash cycle.

Have asked for a followup visit tomorrow to rectify this. Hopefully they send someone better.

A few gripes I have with the machine (or IFB App):

  1. No rinse hold option on the machine that you can access through the panel. You have to use the IFB app and you have to enable it before you start the wash cycle. Not sure how that will help.
  2. The IFB App integration is average at best. Provides no information on usage of power and water in each wash cycle. Only let's you set the additional wash programs that are not on the front panel.
  3. The IFB App just refused to pair with the machine on my android phone. Had to use my wife's iPhone to get it setup. Once setup, can see it on my android but still can't access it. Just terrible coding and UI all around (real amateur hour stuff when compared to LG/Samsung).
  4. The AI (fuzzy logic?) doesn't impact the wash cycle time regardless of the load. No idea if it is actually using less water or power as there is no easy way to check this thanks to the tinted glass.
Still loads to explore. Yet to try the power steam option or wash cottons/white at higher temps.
 
Heads up about washing thin fabrics in the washing machine. Put them in a washing bag along with smaller items.


This has never happened with my LG. Maybe my clothes are thicker. I'm also suspecting overloading which would push clothes out more towards the door.
 
Heads up about washing thin fabrics in the washing machine. Put them in a washing bag along with smaller items.


This has never happened with my LG. Maybe my clothes are thicker. I'm also suspecting overloading which would push clothes out more towards the door.
I always use a washing net/bag/pillow for delicates, small clothing articles like socks and handkerchiefs as well as items that need a gentle wash. Works really well and highly recommended.
 
The wash quality after just a few washes between installation earlier today and now already feels like night and day when compared to the old Samsung. Or maybe it is just placebo. Time will tell.
How do you tell its better?
The tinted glass is a pain for sure, basically you are operating blind and feel handicapped as you can't intervene or have no idea even if an intervention is required. Will check with IFB if I can pay to get the tinted glass replaced with a clear glass down the road.
Don't wait. Try and get it done ASAP.
The IFB tech who came to install didn't do a great job and his demo was lousy. I knew more about the machine and it various functions that he did. Didn't even take us through the process of cleaning the lint filter.
Always good to know a product better than the person selling it to you.
What's worse is that the machine turned to its side during operation this evening. The balance was off and the spin cycle was causing major wobbles and moved the machine. Thankfully caught it in time and no damage done. Sir installed the machine without the use of a spirit leveller and just used his gut feel to set it and then left. Didn't even bother to wait for 1 test wash cycle.
This is just typical. That is why I expressly bought a spirit level for this purpose only. And make sure once levelled they tighten all four upper second nuts.
  1. No rinse hold option on the machine that you can access through the panel. You have to use the IFB app and you have to enable it before you start the wash cycle. Not sure how that will help.
Losing rinse hold in newer machines is a gripe for me. At least you have the option via the app. The USP of WiFi on the machine then is access to extra options.

Interested to know about this 'Hot Rinse' option that I do not see on the machine but mentioned in the manual. See attached.
  1. The IFB App integration is average at best. Provides no information on usage of power and water in each wash cycle. Only let's you set the additional wash programs that are not on the front panel.
I've yet to see power consumption in an app for the washing machine even by LG. So far it isn't as granular as on their split AC's. I use a Meco power meter for power monitoring.
  1. The AI (fuzzy logic?) doesn't impact the wash cycle time regardless of the load. No idea if it is actually using less water or power as there is no easy way to check this thanks to the tinted glass.
This is the part I was interested in. So you're saying even on a full load that the time is still 1h50m on the Cottons cycle? As that is what it defaults to on empty.
Still loads to explore. Yet to try the power steam option or wash cottons/white at higher temps.
Your machine has add item. If you have a IR thermometer. Wait a half hour after the wash has begun then press add item. Open the door and measure the temperature of the clothes. This way you will know how close it delivers on the various temperature settings. When I tested this I noticed some discrepancies.

Can you measure your drum dimensions and post depth and diameter in cm?
 

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How do you tell its better?
Very tricky to answer this conclusively. The clothes are coming out drier which is a huge win as it is currently 6-10 degrees here in Gurgaon. Plus, the clothes feel much better to touch. This could also be the change in detergent. Or like I said, could simply be placebo. The Cotton Wash + Steam cycle for my white cotton shirt worked wonders as well.

Don't wait. Try and get it done ASAP.
IFB Tech came back with the pricing. It was 4k to change to door to a clear glass one. Makes no sense to spend that right out of the gate on a brand-new machine. And no buyback on the old door as well. Have already racked up some additional spends on top of the machine in the form of the stand and eco crystal filter (to soften the water). Got the filter installed for peace of mind and after looking at videos of nasty and damaged drums, this was a no brainer.

Always good to know a product better than the person selling it to you.

This is just typical. That is why I expressly bought a spirit level for this purpose only. And make sure once levelled they tighten all four upper second nuts.
Your average user won't know so much, and the techs and the brands are doing a disservice. Not even advising on basic maintenance steps is a major miss in my books.
The guy came again and has set the machine up properly. Will order a spirit level to ensure that it is actually set properly. Any recommendation? The phone app is not at all accurate.

Interested to know about this 'Hot Rinse' option that I do not see on the machine but mentioned in the manual. See attached.

I've yet to see power consumption in an app for the washing machine even by LG. So far it isn't as granular as on their split AC's. I use a Meco power meter for power monitoring.
I haven't come across this Hot Rinse option yet.

Not showing power and water consumption on a smart enabled washing machine is a big oversight IMO. Hopefully they add it down the line but looking at the state of IFB's Android App and how it still refuses to pair with the machine, I won't be holding my breath.

This is the part I was interested in. So you're saying even on a full load that the time is still 1h50m on the Cottons cycle? As that is what it defaults to on empty.

Your machine has add item. If you have a IR thermometer. Wait a half hour after the wash has begun then press add item. Open the door and measure the temperature of the clothes. This way you will know how close it delivers on the various temperature settings. When I tested this I noticed some discrepancies.
It was a single shirt to just test the mode. I am yet to run it at full load. The AI works only in three modes - Mix 60, Cotton and Synthetics. I am yet to try the AI mode with mix/full load. Will report back if the duration changes. With just one piece of clothing added for wash, the wash cycle started very quickly and very minimal water was used. Easy to identify as there was no washer gushing through the detergent tray after a few minutes.

I can't temps etc as the pause/add clothes only works within the first few minutes of starting the cycle. Door refuses to open once the water level goes beyond a certain level (Kinda pointless feature in hindisght as it is very rigid in its use case).

Can you measure your drum dimensions and post depth and diameter in cm?
How would you like me to do this? I am assuming you are asking me to measure the inside drum and not just the mouth of the drum. It is 36cms deep and 48cms across. (Could be a few inches more or less)
 
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Very tricky to answer this conclusively. The clothes are coming out drier which is a huge win as it is currently 6-10 degrees here in Gurgaon. Plus, the clothes feel much better to touch. This could also be the change in detergent. Or like I said, could simply be placebo. The Cotton Wash + Steam cycle for my white cotton shirt worked wonders as well.
Could be the higher wash temperature.

IFB Tech came back with the pricing. It was 4k to change to door to a clear glass one. Makes no sense to spend that right out of the gate on a brand-new machine. And no buyback on the old door as well.
I do not see any reason not to do so if you are happy with the machine. You could just have him remove the dark pane. Aesthetics will be a bit off but otherwise the machine will work just fine.

already racked up some additional spends on top of the machine in the form of the stand and eco crystal filter (to soften the water). Got the filter installed for peace of mind and after looking at videos of nasty and damaged drums, this was a no brainer.
Had you mentioned this earlier I'd have told you to skip this eco crystal nonsense. They offered me the same thing too and I'd told them I wasn't interested in snake oil. Take a look at the photo you posted. Do you notice a little white plastic box attached to the black water intake pipe? Guess what that is.
IFB Aqua energie.png
The science behind this magnetic softening is total BS! It does not work.

See below


Do you have hard water? There is a kit you can use to measure it in case you want to know.


And the stand is unnecessary. The machine is spec'd to work without the stand. Typical con is install without levelling. Then return the next day with stand and level

The guy came again and has set the machine up properly. Will order a spirit level to ensure that it is actually set properly. Any recommendation? The phone app is not at all accurate.
A two foot spirit level. Unfortunately you will have to go to a hardware store to get it and check yourself whether it's true.

How would you like me to do this? I am assuming you are asking me to measure the inside drum and not just the mouth of the drum. It is 36cms deep and 48cms across. (Could be a few inches more or less)
What you posted is fine. The volume of your drum is 65 litres. No wonder you found the LG smaller. It measures at ten litres less.
 
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@blr_p

Yeah the inbuilt aqua energie element for whatever reason only feeds into prewash. The normal wash pipe has no treatment. Anyway, the damage to the wallet is now done. Maybe I can call IFB and ask them to take it back. Let's see.

The better wash quality is definitely due to warm water wash instead of cold.

Bought the stand so I can wash the floor underneath when needed. The older machine had started to rust as it was placed directly on the ground. And I did ask in my previous posts about the various accesories, maybe you missed them.

Anyway, not the end of the world. :)

With the door, I did check with the guy if the dark pane can be removed. He refused to do so saying the internal local mechanism etc will be exposed. I will try my luck with another IFB tech over the weekend.
 
@blr_p

Yeah the inbuilt aqua energie element for whatever reason only feeds into prewash. The normal wash pipe has no treatment. Anyway, the damage to the wallet is now done. Maybe I can call IFB and ask them to take it back. Let's see.
You should test whether you have hard water or not.

And I did ask in my previous posts about the various accesories, maybe you missed them.
Maybe I did and so did everybody else.


With the door, I did check with the guy if the dark pane can be removed. He refused to do so saying the internal local mechanism etc will be exposed. I will try my luck with another IFB tech over the weekend.
Then you will have to install a clear pane. The mechanism should not be exposed.
The IFB App just refused to pair with the machine on my android phone. Had to use my wife's iPhone to get it setup. Once setup, can see it on my android but still can't access it. Just terrible coding and UI all around (real amateur hour stuff when compared to LG/Samsung).
The app was last updated in Oct 2023 so it's getting regular attention.

Their video makes it look so simple.


It's a bit quirky. Mobile data needs to be off and location on during the configuration.

If you scroll down through the options you will see hot rinse.
The Cotton Wash + Steam cycle for my white cotton shirt worked wonders as well.
Interested to know how well steam works. Is the steam introduced from the top of the drum or from the bottom? Check for any nozzle at the top of the gasket. If there isn't one then it's coming from the bottom. Also when does the steam appear? Is it at the beginning or towards the end of the wash cycle.

Guess you will need a torch to tell :)

Theory says steam due to the higher temperature 50-60C opens the fibres up more allowing detergent to penetrate more easily. This helps with stains removal, odour removal and offers a degree of sanitisation. Generating Steam is cheaper than heating water to 50-60 so there might be some cost savings here which can only be verified with a power meter and comparing it with a 60 degree wash without steam.

Steam appears to be doing the same job that pink Vanish powder does. Whether it can replace Vanish requires testing but it will certainly make it more effective. If you then want whitening use the liquid Vanish or white Vanish powder as that contains optical brightners. It adds blue but this tricks the eye into seeing more white.

The program to use to specifically get rid of odours is the 'Refresh' program. This is equivalent to using a laundry sanitiser. But it only works with 1-2 items at a time.
 
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Another euro brand to put on the do not buy list. Electrolux.


Attractive design but the tubs are welded

Just a glance at the spare parts is enough to confirm


Entire drum assemblies instead of individual drum components. See attached.

Labour costs are high in Europe so they make the fixing part quick but the result in India is this drum assembly part makes up 50% of the machine cost. If the machine is Rs. 35-40k then the part will be Rs.15k-20k

Same applies for Bosch, Siemens & Beko (Voltas)
 

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Hello forum members, I'm on the lookout for an 8-9kg front-loading washing machine, which of the following machines would be best for a family of 4-

a) Samsung 9 kg, Hygiene Steam with Inbuilt Heater, Digital Inverter, Fully-Automatic Front Load Washing Machine (WW90T4040CB1TL, Black)

b) LG 9 Kg 5 Star Wi-Fi Inverter AI Direct Drive Fully-Automatic Front Load Washing Machine with In-Built Heater (FHP1209Z5M, 6 Motion DD & Steam for Hygiene Wash, Middle Black)
Or
LG 9 Kg 5 Star Inverter Touch Panel Fully-Automatic Front Load Washing Machine with In-Built Heater (FHM1409BDM, Middle Black, Steam for Hygiene Wash)

c) IFB 9 Kg 5 Star AI Powered Front Load Washing Machine, 2X Power Steam (EXECUTIVE SXS ID 9014, 2023 Model, Silver, In-built Heater, 4 years Comprehensive Warranty)

d) Other you see fit as per the below requirement

Sort of confused with LG releasing a slower 1200rpm AI model whereas non-AI is 1400rpm.
Prior experience has been with trusty Whirlpool semi-automatic for more than a decade. (Had a top bad experience with top loading automatic and reverted to semi-auto).

Requirements-
-The reliability of the machine is pivotal in terms of build quality, cost of repair, and brand service.
- Less vibration and noise if possible
- Work with hard water in an emergency
- 8, 9kg capacity, so a drum with the most volume w.r.t stated capacity would be preferred. Budget around or below 40K

Looking at these, my preference is currently LG non-AI model > IFB > Samsung
 
Requirements-
-The reliability of the machine is pivotal in terms of build quality, cost of repair, and brand service.
- Less vibration and noise if possible
- Work with hard water in an emergency
- 8, 9kg capacity, so a drum with the most volume w.r.t stated capacity would be preferred. Budget around or below 40K
Points one and two would have the LG leading with the other two in second place

All can work in hard water but you will have to descale on a regular basis.

Last point would have ifb and Samsung catch up with LG as their drums are larger than LG

Looking at these, my preference is currently LG non-AI model > IFB > Samsung
All tied for now. Can you visit a showroom and see these models in person? Given this is your first ever front loader. Then decide whether you can live with the smaller LG or not.

Omit that 1200 rpm LG btw. It only has a depth of 46cm. For size look at the 1400 rpm model with a 60 cm depth to get an idea of LG's drum volume and then compare that with an 8kg LG of similar depth.

AFAIK there is no difference in drum volumes between 8&9kg for all three brands. Meaning I don't see why pay more for a 9kg model over an 8kg model

Though if you could confirm that with some drum measurements (depth & diameter of the metal drum in cm) by visiting a store then we'd have a confirmation. Unfortunately this info isn't in the specs and it's critical.
 
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