bssunilreddy
Juggernaut
That's why I am saying that a Device between the cylinder & regulator will accurately show the weight of the remaining gas to empty.
I have an idea for LPG based gas stoves.
- Thread starter 6pack
- Start date
rdst_1
Innovator
What problem will this device solve? Everyone can afford to buy 2 cylinders. Hell, I have 3 cylinders at my home and it helps as we can't book a refill whenever we want to and we get LPG Cylinder supply on a fixed day every month. For most people who can order a refill as soon as their cylinder becomes empty, just having 2 cylinders is enough.
Also, there are devices available which are safety devices but also show different levels of cylinder state. Sure, they won't tell the exact weight but they clearly give indication a few days ago when the cylinder is close to getting empty.
Also, there are devices available which are safety devices but also show different levels of cylinder state. Sure, they won't tell the exact weight but they clearly give indication a few days ago when the cylinder is close to getting empty.
Buy BluePhlare Home Lpg Gas Safety Device Online at Low Prices in India - Amazon.in
Amazon.in: Buy BluePhlare Home Lpg Gas Safety Device online at low price in India on Amazon.in. Free Shipping. Cash On Delivery
www.amazon.in
@ssslayer , that was what i was thinking as well. If the regulator maintains a steady pressure then there is no way to measure the amount in the cylinder.
One way is probably try to get the flow rate in KG/hr. Most non commercial cylinders are around 14KG net weight. If we get liter/hr we need to convert it to grams/hr flow so we could deduce how much would be left.
For piped connections and cases like adder where multiple gas cylinders are connected to a single pioe, this is meaningless.
Edit: i know now the idea is useless.
One way is probably try to get the flow rate in KG/hr. Most non commercial cylinders are around 14KG net weight. If we get liter/hr we need to convert it to grams/hr flow so we could deduce how much would be left.
For piped connections and cases like adder where multiple gas cylinders are connected to a single pioe, this is meaningless.
Edit: i know now the idea is useless.
Nope, it's not useless. Can be very helpful for rural people and small food joints ( AFAIK some of them still worry about timely delivery of cylinders)
But that segment of population is extremely cost sensitive.
But that segment of population is extremely cost sensitive.
rdst_1
Innovator
I live in a village where supply is fixed to 1 day a month and even that is erratic at times. The simple solution that everyone employs over here is have 2 cylinders (not connections). Food joints need to have a commercial cylinder for which supply is not an issue.
What is exact need for this, if you have 2 cylinders I know the ball park week when its going to get over, if lot of frying is done or if guests are there, may be it gets over by 5 days less. I also have 3 cylinders, if no one qualified is not there in the house to change the cylinder, they revert to using induction stove but luckily everyone in my house knows how to change the cylinder.
I did have instances where 2 cylinders got empty and who ever changed the cylinder failed to inform me, since I am the one who books the cylinder in my house. This is where induction stove really helps.
My faber triple ring, three burner hob gives about 19days/cylinder, where as the same cylinder in the old 2 burner butterfly lasts a month
I did have instances where 2 cylinders got empty and who ever changed the cylinder failed to inform me, since I am the one who books the cylinder in my house. This is where induction stove really helps.
My faber triple ring, three burner hob gives about 19days/cylinder, where as the same cylinder in the old 2 burner butterfly lasts a month
Last edited:
Wont work.
The pressure inside the cylinder varies with the quantity of LPG
The pressure outlet at regulator is fixed
The burner flame valve (stove knob) creates pressure drop across it (to suit your desired flame length)
Atmospheric pressure is fixed.
This means the gas flow rate is dependent on the stove knob (of course yes, that's why at sim setting the flame is low and at max setting the flame is high).
Your measuring of gas flow rates will give no information about what is happening inside the cylinder.
Another easier way to picturize the situation: flame height is dependent on gas flow rate.
IF the gas flow rate indeed varies with changing contents inside the cylinder then on Day1 of new cylinder you should get a tall flame, and this flame should decrease everyday gradually.
But it doesn't happen that way. The flame is always steady throughout the life of the cylinder.
Then one sudden day, you find that the flame doesn't form or cannot maintain, and this is the day when your cylinder is "empty".
What you require is a device that measures pressure inside the cylinder. And that can happen only before the regulator.
Technically I would advise you to make a regulator with inbuilt inlet pressure gauge. That will suit your purpose of indicating when the cylinder is half way through or going to die out. Commercially, I cant advise, you have to judge whether people are indeed willing to pay for it.
rdst_1
Innovator
There are already many devices like this available in the market. I even gave a link to one in my first post. They even come with a cutoff safety mechanism in case of leaks. Also don't oxygen cylinders have some similar mechanism with a pressure gauge.
N
NotMyRealName
I don't know if anyone even looked at it but i mentioned volumetric flow measurement. Not pressure. It will have to be 'reset' every new cylinder. Calibration would be a major headache, even if we want only approximate indications.
rdst_1
Innovator
LPG gas measurement is in a kg gas unit because the volume and pressure can be affected by temperature. LPG expands at 1.5% per 5.55°C temperature increase. In other words, the density changes.
So, if the gas bottle was filled by volume on a hot day, it would have less gas, in kg, than a gas bottle filled on a cold day. That's why it is measured and sold in a kg gas unit.
I think maybe piped gasline uses Volumetric measurement but the meters need to have automatic temperature correction mechanism built-in.
I already explained why volumetric or mass or molecular or whatever property flow meters will not work.
N
NotMyRealName
How do the piped gas meters work?
There, edited my post for your clarity.
Flow meters will work. Whether piped gas or cylinder gas.
But you cannot deduce anything about the condition of cylinder from it.
N
NotMyRealName
So if the flow meter shows x units and we know how many units are in an average cylinder?
But the flow rate changes whenever I change the stove knob setting. Your estimated time left for empty cylinder will keep changing based on whether I am boiling eggs or sauteeing veg or deep frying samosas.
Do you do the cooking at your home / place of work?
Otherwise you wont miss such an obvious detail.
N
NotMyRealName
Man, you're really confusing me. When you say rate i assume you mean units/time. I'm talking about total number of units. Like how a meter works. A few of my friends have piped gas, but i never actually checked how the reading works. I'll ask them.
All i'm saying is i want to know the consumption in units for a cylinder just like a piped connection. And i don't get what is different between the two.
I will have to do a 'calibration' once. Or twice. Assume the meter reads 0 units on a full cylinder. End of cylinder say it reads 348 units. So i know a full cylinder contains about that much. So next cylinder would reach empty at around 696 units. Or instead of adding, maybe reset the meter to 0 each new cylinder.
All i'm saying is i want to know the consumption in units for a cylinder just like a piped connection. And i don't get what is different between the two.
I will have to do a 'calibration' once. Or twice. Assume the meter reads 0 units on a full cylinder. End of cylinder say it reads 348 units. So i know a full cylinder contains about that much. So next cylinder would reach empty at around 696 units. Or instead of adding, maybe reset the meter to 0 each new cylinder.
It can't be done. The liquid gas while being filled is at a different pressure and the regulator has a rubber valve which allows gas to flow at a different lower pressure to reduce chance of explosion.
Even if we try to measure the gas flow at entry point of the gas range, it won't work properly due to temperature changes which effect gas expansion and other reasons. So rate of flow per time won't work in this case.
Even if someone managed to make such a flow meter, it would have to be made of brass and need lot of space and not get hot due to burners in close proximity. Plus need to keep safety in mind above everything. Such a thing would be costlier than anything in the market and no one will buy it.
Companies research or just steal ideas before bringing out such things in the market. If foreign companies who do R&D a lot don't have such a thing in their gas range, it's probably because it's too costly or not possible.
Even if we try to measure the gas flow at entry point of the gas range, it won't work properly due to temperature changes which effect gas expansion and other reasons. So rate of flow per time won't work in this case.
Even if someone managed to make such a flow meter, it would have to be made of brass and need lot of space and not get hot due to burners in close proximity. Plus need to keep safety in mind above everything. Such a thing would be costlier than anything in the market and no one will buy it.
Companies research or just steal ideas before bringing out such things in the market. If foreign companies who do R&D a lot don't have such a thing in their gas range, it's probably because it's too costly or not possible.
N
NotMyRealName
I DON'T want rate per time. I just want total quantity flowed through.
Is there some specific reason a meter works for piped gas but won't work for a cylinder? Coz i'm missing the point if there is one...
Yes, the flow totalizer will work. But what are you going to do with it?
Bill to someone else on daily gas consumption?
Or try to to use some AI/M/crap to predict how long the cylinder will last based on the gas consumption real time and historical trend?
LPG and PNG are different gases.
The link is of Australia but it's the same for India too.
www.elgas.com.au
The link is of Australia but it's the same for India too.
LPG Gas vs Natural Gas and Natural Gas vs LPG or Propane Gas vs LPG
Natural gas is methane gas distributed by pipelines. LPG (liquefied petroleum gas) is propane, usually sold as bottled gas. Learn more...
www.elgas.com.au