India-Pakistan current war like situation discussion (Pahalgham)

India might have to consider dropping Rafale ( if story of downing is true)
If dog fight with multiple fighter jets are involved, have to consider inevitable tolerance to failure percentage. For eg., 1 Indian fighter down vs 5 Pak fighter down like scenario can be expected to happen. Unlike western countries, our real-world experience fighting war is not that high.
But JF-10 and PL-15 is sending shockwaves around the world.
This means, PL 15 will be fully studied by India, giving lot of information about it's working.
Chinese fighter jets indeed send enough message around the world, have to admit it.
But harop drone became a Hero for us.
In recent decades, no country staunchly stood by India. Russia is slowly drifting away, can't blame them considering our defense purchase from them used to be >70% now <25%. Now Israel supports us with critical tech and morale which is only saving grace.
 
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Bombing civilian space isn't the answer. They want to portray India as "heartless civilian murderers". Pakistan apparently is using civilian spaces as shields, such as keeping all commercial airports open (need to fact check, more). Pakistan has ego issues. The calmer India stays in being measured in its approach, the more it ticks them off, and they start escalating the issue to try and (laughibly) prove that "Nobody messes with us!". This makes them an even bigger laughing stock, which is the whole approach.

The dog is Pakistan; all bark, no logical substance.

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Just saw headlines of fuddu dawn newspaper

*Pakistan rattles India with firm response as patience runs out*

*Pakistan dictates the pause*

Seriously although it's wrong, but their civilians should have been shown the reality, their roads, stadiums, parks should have been bombed to let th be aware of the reality..

The advert at the bottom of the newspaper shows a kia car being sold at 70L pkr.. Lol
After this episode, the same car would be selling at 80L pkr le rattling ka maza
 
Russia is slowly drifting away
Main reason for that is their closeness to China which would have happened no matter what. I think 10-15 years ago we missed the opportunity to resolve our (then) trivial disputes with China and create a Rus-China-Ind alliance instead of the Rus-China-Pakistan alliance that will most likely form now. Russia also has been selling more and more arms to Pakistan.
 
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Bombing civilian space isn't the answer. They want to portray India as "heartless civilian murderers". Pakistan apparently is using civilian spaces as shields, such as keeping all commercial airports open (need to fact check, more). Pakistan has ego issues. The calmer India stays in being measured in its approach, the more it ticks them off, and they start escalating the issue to try and (laughibly) prove that "Nobody messes with us!". This makes them an even bigger laughing stock, which is the whole approach.

The dog is Pakistan; all bark, no logical substance.

View attachment 235009
I fully agree.. Hope there ll be no rhetoric from the govt (which I am actually sure and really love that.. They have been more for action and less for words in all this episode)
and I seriously wish the media to be responsible and not stoop as low as the media across border in chest thumping
 
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Is it true the Pakistan has again violated the ceasefire, and that China released a statement where they firmly stand with Islamabad in protecting their sovereignty?
 
resolve our (then) trivial disputes with China and create a Rus-China-Ind alliance instead of the Rus-China-Pakistan alliance that will most likely form now.
China proved they cannot be friends with anyone, so only transactional or time-bound relationship can work with them. Their policy is imperialism, not multi-polar power dynamics in the long run. And they are stern with that policy.
Moreover, our relationship and trade with USA couldn't workout if we were with China.
Russia also has been selling more and more arms to Pakistan.
Reality is that Russia understood they could real hardball bargain with India, them being sole supplier of our critical defense equipment. This because unsustainable at an onset after costs spiraled multiple times and delivery period extended on purpose to extract more monies.
And power-dynamics changed a lot, for eg., if we were too friendly with Russia right now, thing may not go well for us.
So, we are in better position except our indigenous arms manufacturing is not enough to perform, although we have tons of engineers roaming around without a job.
Is it true the Pakistan has again violated the ceasefire, and that China released a statement where they firmly stand with Islamabad in protecting their sovereignty?
 
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I fully agree.. Hope there ll be no rhetoric from the govt (which I am actually sure and really love that.. They have been more for action and less for words in all this episode)
and I seriously wish the media to be responsible and not stoop as low as the media across border in chest thumping

The difference in quality between representatives of both nations is a no-brainer. Do watch till the end!

 
What a massive W for India!

I thought I would post this after IAF, CDS and MOD etc confirm in their final press briefings but not a big issue wrong facts can be corrected later.

In an unprecedented (in indo pak tensions) blitzkrieg India just increased the cost of conducting terrorism on its soil multi fold.

- Major terror bases both inside Pak and PoK were destroyed. esp. LeT/JeM HQs. This itself is a satisfactory end objective.
- A significant amount of their air defence systems were destroyed. We made mockery of the Chinese tech.
- 11 PAF airbases and a couple of army bases were pummelled with missiles. They look like ruins. An AWACS too was destroyed. Read that again... an AWACS was destroyed. First time since 1971 there were several casualities of PAF personnel and with subsequent attacks many PAF personnel were also killed. even their $1B from IMF is not enough to fix these.
- The significant Sargodha Air Base, is also included in this. The F16s from the US is here.
- The most significant air base Noor Khan air base in Rawalpindi. This is one that oversees the Pak Nuclear arsenal. if only anyone understood how fking significant this act is. Pak would have crapped their pants after this and rant to their two daddies Trump and Xi. Both had to put out statements in support of Pak.
- The most daring of all - We hit one of the most sensitive locations - Pak nuclear weapons storage facility in Kirana hills. The tunnel entrance was hit precisely to send a message to Pak that we are unfazed by their nuclear threats (they tested to spook us, that is the probable reason for earthquake of that magnitude). Now think about that. Has any country attacked a nuclear weapons silo of a nuclear armed country? That too a neighbour.
- This nuclear dare, the possibility of India neutralizing the nuclear arsenal of their chief minion and their precious F16 airbase attack are probably what spook the US Intel then Rubio and Vance.
- Not to forget we fired a fking Brahmos into Pak. modified to launch from air without the help of Russians!!

This is a humiliation any respectable airforce/country would never recover from. but alas it is Pak.
Gqo0A3bbEAAil6I.jpeg


Never before had this damage to Pak been done before without boots on ground and engaging in a protracted full scale war. With minimal loss to us. The heroes of this episode were the homegrown Akash Missiles, L70 (an ancient weapon that was modernised, a miracle in itself) and other AA guns. It guaranteed our Air Defense Superiority.

I finally feel the meek India of the recent past (read about how helpless and lame we looked after 26/11 and each terror attack) which sent dossier after dossier and sang "aman ki asha" slogans has squarely ended with this bold episode. esp. in a country where some top bollywood actors have their relatives as politicians in pak!! This is not just a shock to Pak but also a messaging to China too. Both the Military and Political Leadership conducted themselves professionally. Even at the face of disproportionately bad PR towards India by the usual suspects esp. tiktok but obviously there it is CCP driven we can do nothing about that. Sadly MEA's final messaging was meh.

Only tempering thoughts after this can be: pak is a small fry but we are no match for China. It is highly improbable that our pro social justice anti-merit country will have any chance facing the dragon as an equal. Another way this massive W would lose its sheen is if the Indus Water Treaty gets reinstated. But I fear that might happen as Modi might be further pressured by Trump for a trade deal. As it is plenty clear that pak is a strategic asset for US and it does not want to lose it fully to China.

Thank you for reading this wall of text, now stop crying, whining, ranting, taunting etc and go buy good defence companies ETFs or stocks if that is your jam. A lot of cool shit is going to be made in large numbers. NFA.

At the end of this definitely have to express sincere gratitude to Manohar Parrikar one of the best DMs of India... whose bold decisions in the face of so much fake news and propaganda are still saving our ass to this day. And om shanti to all the soldiers who lost their lives in shelling and firing.

Apologise in advance for any typos and wrong info that might be corrected in the future.
 
What a massive W for India!

I thought I would post this after IAF, CDS and MOD etc confirm in their final press briefings but not a big issue wrong facts can be corrected later.

In an unprecedented (in indo pak tensions) blitzkrieg India just increased the cost of conducting terrorism on its soil multi fold.

- Major terror bases both inside Pak and PoK were destroyed. esp. LeT/JeM HQs. This itself is a satisfactory end objective.
- A significant amount of their air defence systems were destroyed. We made mockery of the Chinese tech.
- 11 PAF airbases and a couple of army bases were pummelled with missiles. They look like ruins. An AWACS too was destroyed. Read that again... an AWACS was destroyed. First time since 1971 there were several casualities of PAF personnel and with subsequent attacks many PAF personnel were also killed. even their $1B from IMF is not enough to fix these.
- The significant Sargodha Air Base, is also included in this. The F16s from the US is here.
- The most significant air base Noor Khan air base in Rawalpindi. This is one that oversees the Pak Nuclear arsenal. if only anyone understood how fking significant this act is. Pak would have crapped their pants after this and rant to their two daddies Trump and Xi. Both had to put out statements in support of Pak.
- The most daring of all - We hit one of the most sensitive locations - Pak nuclear weapons storage facility in Kirana hills. The tunnel entrance was hit precisely to send a message to Pak that we are unfazed by their nuclear threats (they tested to spook us, that is the probable reason for earthquake of that magnitude). Now think about that. Has any country attacked a nuclear weapons silo of a nuclear armed country? That too a neighbour.
- This nuclear dare, the possibility of India neutralizing the nuclear arsenal of their chief minion and their precious F16 airbase attack are probably what spook the US Intel then Rubio and Vance.
- Not to forget we fired a fking Brahmos into Pak. modified to launch from air without the help of Russians!!

This is a humiliation any respectable airforce/country would never recover from. but alas it is Pak.
View attachment 235008

Never before had this damage to Pak been done before without boots on ground and engaging in a protracted full scale war. With minimal loss to us. The heroes of this episode were the homegrown Akash Missiles, L70 (an ancient weapon that was modernised, a miracle in itself) and other AA guns. It guaranteed our Air Defense Superiority.

Even after all this, some of you are behaving like edgy teenagers. 56" ? mudi? Really? That's all that you got out of this? It is ok if you don't support the ruling party and may be the supporter of the opposition party. But at the time of a war like situation and a terrorist attack, making juvenile remarks about the govt which has acted in the best interest of India is immature and reflects poorly on you and your intellectual abilities. Please avoid this pretense of being a "Patriot"... you just don't like the guy who is the PM. Be brave and accept that don't behave like pakistan. The same opposition was crying DE-ESCALATE when India was pummeling pak... Now after cease fire they are posting Indira Gandhi pics and mocking Modi. How stupid is this?

I finally feel the meek India of the recent past (read about how helpless and lame we looked after 26/11 and each terror attack) which sent dossier after dossier and sang "aman ki asha" slogans has squarely ended with this bold episode. esp. in a country where some top bollywood actors have their relatives as politicians in pak!! This is not just a shock to Pak but also a messaging to China too. Both the Military and Political Leadership conducted themselves professionally. Even at the face of disproportionately bad PR towards India by the usual suspects esp. tiktok but obviously there it is CCP driven we can do nothing about that. Sadly MEA's final messaging was meh.

Only tempering thoughts after this can be: pak is a small fry but we are no match for China. It is highly improbable that our pro social justice anti-merit country will have any chance facing the dragon as an equal. Another way this massive W would lose its sheen is if the Indus Water Treaty gets reinstated. But I fear that might happen as Modi might be further pressured by Trump for a trade deal. As it is plenty clear that pak is a strategic asset for US and it does not want to lose it fully to China.

Thank you for reading this wall of text, now stop crying, whining, ranting, taunting etc and go buy good defence companies ETFs or stocks if that is your jam. A lot of cool shit is going to be made in large numbers. NFA.

At the end of this definitely have to express sincere gratitude to Manohar Parrikar one of the best DMs of India... whose bold decisions in the face of so much fake news and propaganda are still saving our ass to this day. And om shanti to all the soldiers who lost their lives in shelling and firing.

Apologise in advance for any typos and wrong info that might be corrected in the future.
This is among THE most sensible takes I've read, in this thread :cigar:
 
What a massive W for India!

I thought I would post this after IAF, CDS and MOD etc confirm in their final press briefings but not a big issue wrong facts can be corrected later.

In an unprecedented (in indo pak tensions) blitzkrieg India just increased the cost of conducting terrorism on its soil multi fold.

- Major terror bases both inside Pak and PoK were destroyed. esp. LeT/JeM HQs. This itself is a satisfactory end objective.
- A significant amount of their air defence systems were destroyed. We made mockery of the Chinese tech.
- 11 PAF airbases and a couple of army bases were pummelled with missiles. They look like ruins. An AWACS too was destroyed. Read that again... an AWACS was destroyed. First time since 1971 there were several casualities of PAF personnel and with subsequent attacks many PAF personnel were also killed. even their $1B from IMF is not enough to fix these.
- The significant Sargodha Air Base, is also included in this. The F16s from the US is here.
- The most significant air base Noor Khan air base in Rawalpindi. This is one that oversees the Pak Nuclear arsenal. if only anyone understood how fking significant this act is. Pak would have crapped their pants after this and rant to their two daddies Trump and Xi. Both had to put out statements in support of Pak.
- The most daring of all - We hit one of the most sensitive locations - Pak nuclear weapons storage facility in Kirana hills. The tunnel entrance was hit precisely to send a message to Pak that we are unfazed by their nuclear threats (they tested to spook us, that is the probable reason for earthquake of that magnitude). Now think about that. Has any country attacked a nuclear weapons silo of a nuclear armed country? That too a neighbour.
- This nuclear dare, the possibility of India neutralizing the nuclear arsenal of their chief minion and their precious F16 airbase attack are probably what spook the US Intel then Rubio and Vance.
- Not to forget we fired a fking Brahmos into Pak. modified to launch from air without the help of Russians!!

This is a humiliation any respectable airforce/country would never recover from. but alas it is Pak.
View attachment 235008

Never before had this damage to Pak been done before without boots on ground and engaging in a protracted full scale war. With minimal loss to us. The heroes of this episode were the homegrown Akash Missiles, L70 (an ancient weapon that was modernised, a miracle in itself) and other AA guns. It guaranteed our Air Defense Superiority.

Even after all this, some of you are behaving like edgy teenagers. 56" ? mudi? Really? That's all that you got out of this? It is ok if you don't support the ruling party and may be the supporter of the opposition party. But at the time of a war like situation and a terrorist attack, making juvenile remarks about the govt which has acted in the best interest of India is immature and reflects poorly on you and your intellectual abilities. Please avoid this pretense of being a "Patriot"... you just don't like the guy who is the PM. Be brave and accept that don't behave like pakistan. The same opposition was crying DE-ESCALATE when India was pummeling pak... Now after cease fire they are posting Indira Gandhi pics and mocking Modi. How stupid is this?

I finally feel the meek India of the recent past (read about how helpless and lame we looked after 26/11 and each terror attack) which sent dossier after dossier and sang "aman ki asha" slogans has squarely ended with this bold episode. esp. in a country where some top bollywood actors have their relatives as politicians in pak!! This is not just a shock to Pak but also a messaging to China too. Both the Military and Political Leadership conducted themselves professionally. Even at the face of disproportionately bad PR towards India by the usual suspects esp. tiktok but obviously there it is CCP driven we can do nothing about that. Sadly MEA's final messaging was meh.

Only tempering thoughts after this can be: pak is a small fry but we are no match for China. It is highly improbable that our pro social justice anti-merit country will have any chance facing the dragon as an equal. Another way this massive W would lose its sheen is if the Indus Water Treaty gets reinstated. But I fear that might happen as Modi might be further pressured by Trump for a trade deal. As it is plenty clear that pak is a strategic asset for US and it does not want to lose it fully to China.

Thank you for reading this wall of text, now stop crying, whining, ranting, taunting etc and go buy good defence companies ETFs or stocks if that is your jam. A lot of cool shit is going to be made in large numbers. NFA.

At the end of this definitely have to express sincere gratitude to Manohar Parrikar one of the best DMs of India... whose bold decisions in the face of so much fake news and propaganda are still saving our ass to this day. And om shanti to all the soldiers who lost their lives in shelling and firing.

Apologise in advance for any typos and wrong info that might be corrected in the future.
God I love it when every single word, every single fact and every single evidence is correct and to the point.. So much so that all I am left with as a response is pressing the like button with all my weight.
Kudos bud
 

I am pleased to announce the Governments of India and Pakistan have agreed to an immediate ceasefire and to start talks on a broad set of issues at a neutral site. We commend Prime Ministers Modi and Sharif on their wisdom, prudence, and statesmanship in choosing the path of peace."

Behind the scenes, Indian government has agreed to let Trump mediate it seems. Hope we also got something in return for this as it's against our policy of not allowing third parties.
 
After pahalgam attack when the main opposition party said they stand with the govt, I thought they still have some redeemable qualities especially in times of national crisis. Turns out they are just waiting for opportunity to corner the govt as war or no-war will give them enough even when its lose, win or stalemate situation.

It hasn't been 24hrs since the announcement of ceasefire, and they are already saying "miss indira" blah blah and are asking for immediate parliament session etc to cash-in on public disappointment. They couldn't even wait for the talks with pak tomorrow. If we continued with the operation and had to suffer losses(which is guaranteed in any war), they'll just claim the human cost as reason for their inaction during parliament and mumbai attacks.

For their next mis-adventure, Pak has to just wait until the opposition forms govt.