Is India is a dumping yard for inferior IT products ?
- Thread starter amd999
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blr_p
Skilled
Prices fall or rise depending on demand & supply. Good quality goods will always have a premium attached to them. But you forget that in the absence of alternatives there is no guarantee to lower the price
If i was a premium PSU manufacturer and India decided to ban low quality imports i would be guranteed of windfall profits as everyone would have no choice but to buy from me. Where then is the all important question of lowering my asking price
Its always a bad idea to tinker with the marketplace, a fact that has escaped you in this exercise. I'm still trying to figure out your motivation here, who are you working for ?
Errrm guys he may have a point there but may not be conveying it in the right regard, I feel. The irony here being he's a distri (or claims to be?) and has put up the observations which in fact may hamper the sales.
Maybe he's talking of brands like Intex, mRon, Colorsit etc which makes <sarcasm>top-of-the-line</sarcasm> power supplies.
Maybe he's talking of brands like Intex, mRon, Colorsit etc which makes <sarcasm>top-of-the-line</sarcasm> power supplies.
Well the subject is old i mean this was happening long back and i will say yes.
We in india will get inferior products when compared to US,EU as one is we don't have strict rules to reject the products from MNC and other obvious reasons.
Well i will give an eg a colleague of mine who was with moserbaer(cd/dvd production line) before and he told me that we in india will get third quality products and most of the best quality ones goes to us/europe. actually we don't know these things unless and without an insider. Well an indian company is doing like this how come we can expect a foreign mncs.
the product bought from us or singapore are more superior in quality and longevity is more that's why if we have a chance we are buying and ofcourse price is another factor. this is not assumption but its very difficult to prove but is true. And these i'm taking about top mncs iteself. Then how come u expect cheap chinese products. they will dump their inferior products to india for cheap otherwise how come u see lot of chinese products like toys,mobiles etc. if they do this in europe and in us then the respective govts. will put anti-dumping fines to china and will blacklist those companies. But in india do we expect them? never ..
As a consumer we are in helpless situation as we can't do anything but to buy from them.
me before joining te itself dont know about good psu. well like me thousands of people are there and will buy inferior product without knowledge and getting ripped off.
See here again govt should take care that no company monopolises the situation and should take care of prices should not go. banning the low quality products should be done for the saftey of the people and also saving to the govt indirectly. so the laidback nature is one of the reason for these things.
We in india will get inferior products when compared to US,EU as one is we don't have strict rules to reject the products from MNC and other obvious reasons.
Well i will give an eg a colleague of mine who was with moserbaer(cd/dvd production line) before and he told me that we in india will get third quality products and most of the best quality ones goes to us/europe. actually we don't know these things unless and without an insider. Well an indian company is doing like this how come we can expect a foreign mncs.
the product bought from us or singapore are more superior in quality and longevity is more that's why if we have a chance we are buying and ofcourse price is another factor. this is not assumption but its very difficult to prove but is true. And these i'm taking about top mncs iteself. Then how come u expect cheap chinese products. they will dump their inferior products to india for cheap otherwise how come u see lot of chinese products like toys,mobiles etc. if they do this in europe and in us then the respective govts. will put anti-dumping fines to china and will blacklist those companies. But in india do we expect them? never ..
As a consumer we are in helpless situation as we can't do anything but to buy from them.
me before joining te itself dont know about good psu. well like me thousands of people are there and will buy inferior product without knowledge and getting ripped off.
blr_p said:If i was a premium PSU manufacturer and India decided to ban low quality imports i would be guranteed of windfall profits as everyone would have no choice but to buy from me. Where then is the all important question of lowering my asking price
See here again govt should take care that no company monopolises the situation and should take care of prices should not go. banning the low quality products should be done for the saftey of the people and also saving to the govt indirectly. so the laidback nature is one of the reason for these things.
blr_p
Skilled
I think its because if the product is too expensive it won't sell here, which vendor is going to take up inventory in this case.cri_sss said:
Since you want to go with history, take any apparel products, many of the jeans for example are made here (for export). Compare export quality with what you find locally, is there a difference ?
Will you now say that Indian manufacturers are also dumping ?
If one is willing to pay more then one can be assured of getting anything western over here. I think its question of volume, if the demand is low then the asking price is high & vice versa.cri_sss said:
What about the price though ? Will those products sell here.cri_sss said:
You must have read how upset the west is over the trade imbalance with China & her refusal to revalue the yuan. They are not exactly keeping quiet but what can be done is limited as they are so dependent on those cheap imports in the first place.cri_sss said:
Not sure what the answer is here. Is something stopping better products coming into the market and if so what ?cri_sss said:
Duties, earning potential, monopolies, to what extent these parameters play a role I will leave to the more knowledgeable on this board.
I don't know if more govt is the answer, but less duties, redtape will make things easier. Problem is there are many ppl that are being serviced by all these extra levies and dumping them might create a political problem.cri_sss said:
Whats problematic here is going down the examples route and applying that to the whole process. Sure you can quote me examples where low quality might have caused health problems but to regulate everything because of a few is ill advised.cri_sss said:
Maybe more consumer awareness & product testing will bring these problems to light. I've looked for magazines that did this but did not find too many. There were a few that did comparison tests but its patchy coverage at best.
cri_sss said:
No govt can dictate pricing policies to companies. For example can a govt dictate to MS or Apple what prices they can sell at in their country? Definitely not. Govt policies can only indirectly affect the prices. Prices are regulated by supply and demand. But in the end the final call is still in the jurisdiction of the company. If the govt reduces competition, then obviously the prices are going to increase because of lower supplies, higher demand and the monopolistic situation for the remaining companies.
Lord Nemesis said:
well monolopolizing is result of globalozation
if there are more local industries allowed here like in south korea or japan products will be cheap and our economy might get better
our foreign investment policy is also screwdup which dont allow direct investments like in china so we cant expect much growth here
and like you said these big companies are government of their own which decides which country gets rich and poor due to globalization
think whome can you blame for this situatuion here in india.
^^ Agreed that what the govt needs to do is to come up with policies that are friendly towards establishment of local industry, but that does not happen in a day.
In any case, my post was in reply to cri_sss who said that govt should ensure that companies do not increase prices due to monopoly after the low grade products are banned. This does not happen regardless of whether its a small or large company. govt policies like taxes etc may affect pricing, but they cannot directly control the prices.
In any case, my post was in reply to cri_sss who said that govt should ensure that companies do not increase prices due to monopoly after the low grade products are banned. This does not happen regardless of whether its a small or large company. govt policies like taxes etc may affect pricing, but they cannot directly control the prices.
6pack
ex-Mod
help said:
:rofl: sorry, but i just couldn't resist.
just the few companies here are already importing cheap chinese products and branding it as their own. no indian manufacturer will ever invest in r&d here when they will get their desired quality products from another country and make a packet from it. all this wont make our economy any better.
on the contrary our country loses more in foreign exchange.
help said:
care to give an example of how and where it is screwed up?
help said:
i can blame the greedy corporates who want to make a buck out of any opportunity they get and who throw quality away for quantity.
blr_p
Skilled
@LN : I see maybe you can explain the inherent contradictions in these statements then
AFAIK chinese currency isn't fully convertible, just like ours isn't. They might allow more foriegn ownership than our 49-51. But i dont see that making too much of a difference.
What you are asking in effect is why cant we become more like China ?
There will be many answers to that question i expect.
would prefer if more dealers replied to this thread as they would have more experience in import stuff etc
How can more products due to gloabalisation lead to a monopoly, surely prior to liberalisation we had more monopolies than now.
Whats stopping more local industries from forming. Isn't credit easier to get than in the past ?
What do you think has driven the stock market over the last few years if not for FDI ?
AFAIK chinese currency isn't fully convertible, just like ours isn't. They might allow more foriegn ownership than our 49-51. But i dont see that making too much of a difference.
What you are asking in effect is why cant we become more like China ?
There will be many answers to that question i expect.
would prefer if more dealers replied to this thread as they would have more experience in import stuff etc
muzux2
ex-Mod
help said:
i agree, i think india might be having a weak or no anti-dumping laws in her books, possibly because we don't have big manufacturers here who can make products like PSU, LCD's of their own, hence there is nothing to protect own market from dumping. Dumping is one way to render domestic industry non-competitive but we don't have domestic industry here, hence weak or even no anti-dumping restrictions on thse products.
Companies usually go dumping in india prolly to get a more chunk of market. Its their Business Strategy and we are handicapped to accept their products @ cheaper prices irrespective of their quality.
Yes, products sold in india are of low quality compared to the western countries. Problem lies in purchasing power. But there are some products sold in india which are AT PAR with the west. This includes dvd writers, hard disk drives, modems etc.
The other problem is the import duty or custom duty. Writers and HDD's are free from import duty or at least the dollar price is at par with rupees. Cannot say that about monitors. I don't know how many people would buy a SMPS for more than Rs. 500. Or the latest ati graphics card. Or a cabinet for more than Rs. 1500. Your either a gamer with a Rs. 50,000+ computer and a exclusive 30k lcd monitor or your a web surfer with a 15k PC.
Are the products sold here are of inferior quality?
Yes, majority of them are made by some cheap firm in china or taiwan but that doesn't mean they don't last. I think a 15k PC will work great for 3-4 years till something fails.
So if there were two guilty parties i could narrow down on then it would be 1) Import duties 2) Purchasing power.
The other problem is the import duty or custom duty. Writers and HDD's are free from import duty or at least the dollar price is at par with rupees. Cannot say that about monitors. I don't know how many people would buy a SMPS for more than Rs. 500. Or the latest ati graphics card. Or a cabinet for more than Rs. 1500. Your either a gamer with a Rs. 50,000+ computer and a exclusive 30k lcd monitor or your a web surfer with a 15k PC.
Are the products sold here are of inferior quality?
Yes, majority of them are made by some cheap firm in china or taiwan but that doesn't mean they don't last. I think a 15k PC will work great for 3-4 years till something fails.
So if there were two guilty parties i could narrow down on then it would be 1) Import duties 2) Purchasing power.
blr_p said:
Sorry for bad use of punctuation. My agreement was only to the part about govt needing to promote local industry. If we are talking about IT hardware industry, its not just about credit. You need conditions suitable for establishment of such industry. The way I see it, we do not have the requisite conditions and so we do not have any such substantial hardware industry either.
IT/Software Services industry boomed in India because the govt promoted it considerably with direct incentives to the companies (cheap land and what not) as well as ensuring that there was enough supply of qualified human resources for that industry. Today a guy can start a services company of his own with enough capital and do fairly well.
Hardware industry on the other hand is much more risky for anyone to invest in. It needs human resources, land as well as material. The chance of failure is much higher. More incentives are needed for anyone to risk their neck in this industry and get the industry kick started. More importantly we do not have enough qualified human resources for this industry and we loose a lot to brain drain as well.
there is a difference between industrialized nation and developing countriesblr_p said:
if you open up trade(globalization) without proper local industries here local products would suffer the result economy slows down and manufacturing here becomes almost impossible and less jobs for people hence there is no profit in that but the huge global industries can survive and supply product in these counties and the developing countries are only place for outsourcing their jobs and no real development in any sector
which is monopoly
why do you think we have more than 10% inflation and its getting worse?
i would say that nothing have changed in this country in the past 50 years despite all these economy growth(stocks) that you people say
our standard of living is the same and its getting worse
stock doesn't mean anything.
foreign investments makes up for most of the industrial growth
but getting help from world bank and allowing outsourcing companies would only deplete all out resources and kill local economy
we will eventually have no power to produce but to give services for these global industries and become dependent on them
a country full of slaves thinking that their country is getting better
i hope this answers most of other peoples quote above...