No LPG Subsidy from Jan 2016 for consumers with 10 Lac Income
- Thread starter Lord Nemesis
- Start date
Sir, please tell me how can I evade taxes too... not mocking you but seriously want to take few tips from you. The only thing I do to save some taxes is to invest 1L in various fcuking schemes. Never fudged any medical bills... "so far". Never claimed HRA.
Please share your gyan with me. I'll be highly obliged. And kindly don't use terms which only an economist of your stature can understand.
derp
Disciple
http://m.firstpost.com/business/rem...ubsidy-reforms-for-kerosene-urea-2563840.html
Go through this post and make notes if necessary!
Go through this post and make notes if necessary!
derp
Disciple
Also, if you have even an iota of sense of understanding numbers, you'll know why subsidy removal is a good thing
[DOUBLEPOST=1452009947][/DOUBLEPOST]Also, lpg subsidies were provided to bring those who use polluting sources of fuel like wood, waste etc towards more environment friendly sources(lpg). Now you won't understand that as you don't want to!
The value of 2200 Rupees is something you would understand when you start working yourself instead of living of your parents.
It doesn't matter how much you earn, you are not getting it for free. you have to put your time and effort to earn that money. Whether you are a daily wage worker or a business man on the scale of Ambani.
That is why whether you spend it for yourself or give it for others, you make sure that value is derived out of it. That is why I said that you don't understand the value of money and the toil of the people to earn their living
I also have asked you several times, who is the gas subsidy benefiting. I already told you that most people who can afford gas @ 450 per cylinder typically have enough incomes that they should be paying taxes (at least in the 10% category). Taxes are meant to be spent for the tax payers (spending for any other cause is secondary), so it makes complete sense if tax payers get that benefit. It also makes sense if people who are too poor to even have a taxable income get it at even less cost of Rs 50 or 100 with max limit. Tell me one damn reason why tax evaders should get it? Why should a taxi driver with 15~20 Lac income and doesn't pay taxes gets it and a IT employee with 10 Lac income doesn't just because his income is under the IT radar?
And what is you view on taxes? That only 3% of the population keep paying taxes at 20% and 30% while not getting anything in return while the rest evade them and still enjoy all the benefits? Do you think there should be some measures to prevent this?
The only people that can be deemed eligible to get benefits on taxes are the tax payers and people who are too poor to be paying taxes at all and neither of them are getting the benefits. Tax dodgers and black marketeers are the only ones getting subsidies after this move. The point you are are repeatedly and conveniently ignoring is that nobody is against the removal of subsidies for people with 10 Lac income, but that the tax payer is being forced to buy at vastly inflated rates (not at standard market rates) while tax dodgers are being rewarded with subsidies.
Which is where accountability comes into the picture. Make everyone who is liable to pay taxes pay them? Don't take taxes from only a few people and then rewards tax dodgers with benefits from it. As I already said, unlike me, a lot of people don't pay taxes honestly. While I pay more than I need to (due to not claiming some exemptions), there are people in my income level that pay only a third of what I pay eve if TDS. But they are at least paying something unlike a cab driver for instance who earns substantially, doesn't pay a dime in tax and still gets various benefits on tax money paid by others.
So why not remove subsidies all together since they are anyway only being abused?
You are crazy if you think those people can afford gas stoves and cylinders @ 450. Do you know what those people do? They take money from black marketeers and let them use their identity. The black marketeers get gas connections on their name and setup accounts. They have arrangements to have the cylinders delivered to them. They get the cylinders at subsidized rates and sell at Rs 2000 or so and even more during festival seasons.
So how about removing gas subsidies all together since its not usable by the people for whom its meant for?
derp
Disciple
How would you do that if AADHAR is linked to DBT?
rdst_1
Skilled
I don't have an AADHAR card and I can still get DBT. If you don't know then SC has said that you can't make AADHAR compulsory.
Secondly, how does AADHAR tell the govt that the guy who is getting the subsidy earns less than 10L. This is the main drawback of this scheme.
Even without AADHAR, DBT will ensure that the money goes into the account of the person in whose name the connection is. That doesn't ensure that the money/gas cylinder will eventually be used by that person.
I am going to give you an example of how this works.
Every college affiliated to AICTE has to pay their teachers a specified salary. However the colleges make the teacher's sign a different pay stub and pay them a much lower amount. Now the govt has done it's job by making labor laws and all, but the enforcement is seriously lacking.
Now this is similar to how black marketing works in LPG.
The person who can't afford these cylinders, let someone else ( the black marketer) take the cylinder. This black marketer pays for the cylinder, the poor person gets the subsidy and the black marketer sells the cylinder for 2k.
So the question still remains how does people giving up subsidy stop this black marketing as well as how does the system ensure that tax dodgers don't get the subsidy.
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derp
Disciple
For DBT, yes it is compulsory. Read the finer prints of court orders
Is this rule already in place or are they going to implement it after they tighten their noose around 10LPA people?
rdst_1
Skilled
So how is my dad getting DBT for our LPG connection despite not having an AADHAR card.
Also I edited my earlier post. If you could just answer the questions I raised in the last paragraph, I would be highly grateful.
^^ No. It is not compulsory. You can register your bank account directly for availing DBT. There are countless number of people who use their account number for DBT.
When the first time the judgement regarding aadhar was given, the govt stopped providing the DBT to those who already linked their Aadhar number under the pretext of complying with the order. When the same was contested again, the court gave further orders that allowed those who registered via Aadhar to continue getting their DBT via that route.
Aadhar has no constitutional validity and hence cannot be used as compulsory document for any such purpose. It was rolled out as a scope limited field test and then illegally included as a requirement for a lot of things by congress govt. There is big and scary bill prepared for it, but is was never passed into law.
When BJP govt came into power, one of the first things they proposed was to do away with the whole Aadhar program and they wanted to start a fresh program (so that they can eat their share of tax payers money again). After widespread backlash, they backed out from the move and let it continue.
When the first time the judgement regarding aadhar was given, the govt stopped providing the DBT to those who already linked their Aadhar number under the pretext of complying with the order. When the same was contested again, the court gave further orders that allowed those who registered via Aadhar to continue getting their DBT via that route.
Aadhar has no constitutional validity and hence cannot be used as compulsory document for any such purpose. It was rolled out as a scope limited field test and then illegally included as a requirement for a lot of things by congress govt. There is big and scary bill prepared for it, but is was never passed into law.
When BJP govt came into power, one of the first things they proposed was to do away with the whole Aadhar program and they wanted to start a fresh program (so that they can eat their share of tax payers money again). After widespread backlash, they backed out from the move and let it continue.
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^^ derp has more knowledge on these matters; let him answer (on behalf of govt of india)
I updated my bank account with my LPG distributer in Nov 2015. The form had a separate section for people NOT having Aadhar card.
derp doesn't have any experience of real life issues. He is just spewing out text book knowledge, which we've all been exposed to, throughout our school lives - that an honest indian should pay taxes so that the honest govt can look after them, blah blah blah.
he can't answer to anything which is not in his text book
I updated my bank account with my LPG distributer in Nov 2015. The form had a separate section for people NOT having Aadhar card.
derp doesn't have any experience of real life issues. He is just spewing out text book knowledge, which we've all been exposed to, throughout our school lives - that an honest indian should pay taxes so that the honest govt can look after them, blah blah blah.
he can't answer to anything which is not in his text book
sharktale1212
Skilled
So here's something which I had said earlier:
http://www.newslaundry.com/2016/01/05/more-than-a-quarter-of-cess-collected-remains-unutilised/
Collects cess but can't use still wants to "help" people.
http://www.newslaundry.com/2016/01/05/more-than-a-quarter-of-cess-collected-remains-unutilised/
Collects cess but can't use still wants to "help" people.
derp
Disciple
Kindly go through the following link
http://indianexpress.com/article/india/india-news-india/lpg-cap-a-case-for-expanding-the-experiment/
http://indianexpress.com/article/india/india-news-india/lpg-cap-a-case-for-expanding-the-experiment/
One of the first hurdles to Aadhar's legitimacy is get a final decision on whether an Indian citizen has Right to privacy.
The BJP govt has decided and recommended that we don't have such a right. But it is yet to be decided by a bench.
After that, the govt has to pass a bill in parliament for Aadhar to make it legitimate. There's still a long way to go.
The Aadhar bill prepared by congress apparently had a few disguised scary clauses that allowed govt to take out money from a linked bank account just like they can deposit money. This is probably to have something like when you refuse to pay a faulty bill to say a govt utility or even a private one like say Airtel, they can get the money out from your account directly without your authorization.
The BJP govt has decided and recommended that we don't have such a right. But it is yet to be decided by a bench.
After that, the govt has to pass a bill in parliament for Aadhar to make it legitimate. There's still a long way to go.
The Aadhar bill prepared by congress apparently had a few disguised scary clauses that allowed govt to take out money from a linked bank account just like they can deposit money. This is probably to have something like when you refuse to pay a faulty bill to say a govt utility or even a private one like say Airtel, they can get the money out from your account directly without your authorization.
derp
Disciple
"
The government last month undertook a key reform announcing income-based subsidy for LPG cylinders. The oil ministry said that the taxpayers with an annual income of over Rs 10 lakh will not get subsidised LPG cylinders starting January 2016. The government estimates this would lead to an annual savings of Rs 300 crore.
The government has already started the direct benefit transfer (DBT) of LPG subsidy into the beneficiary bank accounts. DBT in case of LPG results in an estimated savings of Rs 14,672 crore in a year, as per the oil ministry data."
Looks like DBT is pretty successful!!
The government last month undertook a key reform announcing income-based subsidy for LPG cylinders. The oil ministry said that the taxpayers with an annual income of over Rs 10 lakh will not get subsidised LPG cylinders starting January 2016. The government estimates this would lead to an annual savings of Rs 300 crore.
The government has already started the direct benefit transfer (DBT) of LPG subsidy into the beneficiary bank accounts. DBT in case of LPG results in an estimated savings of Rs 14,672 crore in a year, as per the oil ministry data."
Looks like DBT is pretty successful!!
What's the big deal?
Get a PMJDY account and link it with your Aadhar card. All the low-grade govt employees living in my private colony have done the same. They've been selling their LPG cylinders in the black market.
Any more text (links)?
derp
Disciple
Their salaries are <10lpa anyways. See the government can't make policies based on illegal trading atleast on a short term basis. All options have to be first evaluated. Why don't you give your suggestions?
. Let the plans roll out. Eventually, some check(s) would be formulated. Anyways, a thief would always find some work around. Don't you download movies via torrents, knowing the risks involved? Same logic!!