Storage Solutions OS Partition Size - Suggestions Required

[paarkhi]

Programdata, program files and windows directory should always stay in C: no matter even if you are able to move it to another partition.
Have already experimented with them and mind you it creates a lot of problems further for many programs/application/software to be installed out there.
Programs will simply refuse to install, while installing i'll give abnormal errors and warnings and installations doesnt go successfully. After installing, the program wont run the way it should be or worst it wont run at all. Deploying/applying patches/updates/plugins etc.. becomes painful as the installer simply reads the default path for these 3 folders.

So these 3 should always sit where they are meant for.

Rest you can safely play with user account data and its documents etc.

Yes, Thanks for confirming my doubts I also feel the same but @Criminal is using it as daily basis so also wanted to know his experience. I always relocate C:\users\xxxxx\videos, documents\pictures\music to D:\xxxxxx without any issues/problems

 

[nRiTeCh]

@paarkhi Diff. users use their systems for diff. purposes. I aint saying @Criminal isnt doing something wrong as MS allows you to move/redirect it to another drive.
But not all software companies follows same foot. They will simply go by the standard path.
On my pc I have installed many big softwares all from Adobe and Autodesk to vmware and many others. And they do give issues. In fact Sql and VB also gave in issues.
And also even smaller tools and applications.

So imho the change in path compatibility factor isnt taken into consideration by all global software manufacturers and hence the issues arise with many of them.

I'll always advice to stay strict and stick to the default paths.

If you are a normal pc user with just regular usages like MS tools and softwares then yes you can afford to try a thing or another.

 

[lastguyonthenet]

Is there any issues if I install the applications in say D:\Applications instead of the usual C:\Program Files

 

[nRiTeCh]

Nothing. Go on. But best is to install in Program files dir in C or D.

 

[Criminal]

@paarkhi @nRiTeCh modifying registry and creating junctions are meant for people who understand the intricacy involved with them. i use the same "big" software that you use and i haven't faced any issue whatsoever. no issues with the automated updates, application of patches etc. junctions are transparent to end users and most of the software. what i did with my system is aptly known in computing parlance as "isolating data from the OS."

@lastguyonthenet the windows' user folders relocation utility i was referring to, is available under "Location" tab of respective folder's properties.

 

[paarkhi]

@paarkhi @nRiTeCh modifying registry and creating junctions are meant for people who understand the intricacy involved with them. i use the same "big" software that you use and i haven't faced any issue whatsoever. no issues with the automated updates, application of patches etc. junctions are transparent to end users and most of the software. what i did with my system is aptly known in computing parlance as "isolating data from the OS."

Planning to do regedit and junction once just for testing but which "big" software are you talking about?
is that a hebrew under your Forum name?

 

[Criminal]

^^ i was referring to nRiTeCh's list of big software

On my pc I have installed many big softwares all from Adobe and Autodesk to vmware and many others.

and yes, that's hebrew. i was checking whether forum supports the text. i just didn't remove it afterwards.

 

[nRiTeCh]

Read this...

 

[nRiTeCh]

@Criminal
Today I tried moving "C:\Program Files" & "C:\Program Files (x86)" to "D:\" for experimentation purpose.

Did changes to [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion]
and
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion]

for these same values,

Then I logged into another windows and manually copied C:\Program Files & C:\Program Files (x86) to D:\
And deleted Program Files completely from C:\

Rebooted in that OS. Ok it seemed to work.
But still after another reboot windows created Program Files & Program Files (x86) in C:\ but containing some basic windows folders amounting to some 360mb and 160mb approx.

Anyways I didnt bothered.

Further tried installing Autodesk maya, 3ds max and Corel all in 30-day Trial mode.
Installation went smooth.
Again rebooted windows.

Hell!! None of those software are opening. They are throwing licensing errors.
Flooded with all sorts of licensing errors and misc. startup errors.

I'm certain that registry entries were altered properly and were verified many times.
If any issues then windows itself wouldn't have booted or booted properly.

Also on internet these are the only settings to be altered.

If you have anything extra to share apart from these or where possibly I could have gone wrong then do let me know.

 

[Criminal]

Then I logged into another windows and manually copied

you need to use junctions too. it's a complicated one time procedure. earlier i had to re-install windows every 2.5 years. this time around, i am way past that mark. instead of installation errors, i was expecting more of BSODs. but surprisingly, i haven't encountered a single occurrence.

if possible, send me the installation files of your software and i'll record a video for you.

If you have anything extra to share apart from these or where possibly I could have gone wrong then do let me know.

i did 2 things - moved couple of windows folders and created a recovery 'installation' which would take me directly to user creation part during windows installation. i must've taken some notes. i'll look for them. also, there were too many registry changes. it took me hours.

 

[Criminal]

Okay, I checked my notes... here's the crucial information: You can't isolate windows folders from the installation drive on a running windows instance (i.e., while you have a user logged in). You can't move the system files that are already in use. You need to it while you are doing a fresh install and in the audit mode. This is right before you create a new user during windows installation. While in the audit mode, I moved folders, created junctions. Changed registry paths. And before completing the windows installation, I took a diversion and created recovery point. This recovery point doesn't give me my files back but takes me to the middle of windows installation where I am asked to create a new user. If my windows goes corrupt, I’ll just have to kick the recovery procedure and I am presented with a new user creation dialog. I’ll just need to create username different than the previous one. And once I log in, I can copy the old stuff from old user folders. Usually, what people do is frantically start gathering useful files from C drive, desktop etc, when their windows goes kaput. They have to do it using Linux, live OS, or by removing the hard disk. This is where my "windows folders isolation" and "recovery to the middle of windows installation" help me.

Moving files/folders on an already working windows installation is possible but it's too time consuming. You’ll have to change registry paths of all of your programs. That’s why it's better to do it before you create a new user. I remember wasting a couple of days changing all the paths and then I quit and started from formatting the disk.

My windows' base is flawless... maybe this's the reason that I don't face any kind of installation/licensing issues.

 

[nRiTeCh]

Just after posting my query something strike my mind and and removed all the above installed stuff which were installed on a trial license.
Again did the installations but this time I put in license info (serial keys) and went ahead. And guess what it worked for all those biggy s'wares.
Still cant trace what problems they had with a trial license.

Well as for audit mode, do I now need to again reinstall a fresh os and then perform audit stuff and modifications/movement of folder paths & registries?? Coz ssince past 13 yrs I have been relying on good old Ghost! Can that be done on my existing installed windows? I think so Yes, using Sysprep.


For your setup, did you follow Sysprep and waik?

Or any concrete links you followed on the web or may be some blog or forums.

This is all sounding quite interesting and would like to dig deep.


Forgot to mention that user-profile-default-location has also been set to D:.
So now if I create a new user it takes a lot of time to login in for the first time to creates its desktop and user profile. But the next time onwards its as usual fast.

 

[ssslayer]

How does having multiple partition help in the case of Windows corruption or hard disc failure?

 

[Criminal]

@nRiTeCh i've got couple of windows machines at home, so i wanted to use WAIK. but for some reason i couldn't download it. i used Sysprep. yes, you can modify your existing windows installation. i wanted to create a recovery point prior to completing windows installation. so, i had no option but to reinstall windows.

i referred to lots of websites for this purpose but i can't recall them now as it happened 3 years ago. lot of discussion happened on microsoft's own forum.

This is all sounding quite interesting and would like to dig deep.

why this sudden change of heart? you were so averse to this idea sometime back.

How does having multiple partition help in the case of Windows corruption or hard disc failure?

1) your data on a different partition will not be overwritten in case you reinstall windows.
2) nothing much can be done in case the hard disc fails beyond repair. but in most of the cases, data from lesser used sectors can be recovered easily. these lesser used sectors happen to be on the partitions where people just dump their data. boot sector area, windows installation partitions, torrent download folders etc are some of the areas which develop bad sectors sooner than the rest of the hard disk. it's beneficial if you keep your precious data away from such places, preferably on a different partition.

 

[ssslayer]

1) your data on a different partition will not be overwritten in case you reinstall windows.
2) nothing much can be done in case the hard disc fails beyond repair. but in most of the cases, data from lesser used sectors can be recovered easily. these lesser used sectors happen to be on the partitions where people just dump their data. boot sector area, windows installation partitions, torrent download folders etc are some of the areas which develop bad sectors sooner than the rest of the hard disk. it's beneficial if you keep your precious data away from such places, preferably on a different partition.

1. I get your point but if you are going to overwrite the Windows partition by using Windows OS disc, you may as well use a Live USB/CD to access disc data and copy to backup [unless the user is afraid of using Live Discs (of Linux, or any other OS) to recover data]. But of course this step requires a separate media to copy the "recovered data" to compared to the case of having separate partition.
2. This point looks to be quite valid.

 

[Criminal]

...if you are going to overwrite the Windows partition by using Windows OS disc, you may as well use a Live USB/CD to access disc data..

But then you'll need to spend extra time in salvaging data, each time you reinstall windows. You can eliminate the need for live discs by using windows' built-in OS repair program and by keeping your data on a separate partition. And as you mentioned, you'd also need extra media if all of your stuff is on the same partition.

I've gone one step further and moved 'Users' and 'Program Data' folders away from windows partition. People may save their data on other partitions/external drives but they'd always need to salvage some data from these two folders. They contain files saved on desktop, documents folder and some program settings or temporary data (such as MS Office temp files). So, if I need to reinstall windows for some reason, I'll just have to run the recovery and I won't have to spend any time in looking for data on C:\ drive that might get overwritten. The idea is to get back to a working system in as little time as possible.

 

[nRiTeCh]

@nRiTeCh
why this sudden change of heart? you were so averse to this idea sometime back.

Haha! Yes you are right mate.
Some years down one of my friend tried this stuff and it was hell of a horrible experience. And also on many forums and MS itself restricts from modifying the root stuff.
But now that I'm a bit free and that my windows is 4+yrs old I recalled this thread and wanna give this a shot.
Right now 70% success but sysrep is still pending.

You mentioned "I took a diversion and created recovery point" I think thats the usual part in sysrep. Would also like to have a recovery point so let me know more about it.

 

[Criminal]

You mentioned "I took a diversion and created recovery point" I think thats the usual part in sysrep. Would also like to have a recovery point so let me know more about it.

i don't know if creating a recovery point is part of Sysprep... people create recovery points wherever they wish to. some do it before installing an unreliable software and some just to recover from potential virus attack.

i created recovery point before exiting the audit mode. you should've asked about the procedure 3 years ago... i've forgotten a lot of things now my notes are incomplete. it seems i was too happy that the system worked and i didn't care to complete the documentation. i'll try to finish it in my spare time.

only advice at this moment i can give you w.r.t. recovery is that you should try to make full use of your recovery space... i've put only those software on my recovery disk that are absolutely essential for me to carry on with my work. though it takes me a day to install latest updates for those software but i save time in searching and installing them during the downtime.

if you have lots of time, do all this stuff with a fresh OS install... you'll need to deal with lesser issues.

 

[nRiTeCh]

Have you disabled pm option here?
As you are again trying to complete your long pending notes can you share the same with me once done?

 

[Criminal]

my windows crashed yesterday night! I was anticipating it. this time it happened after 3 years, as opposed to the usual 2.5 years for me.

i got back into windows after running recovery... and found few files dumped in C: drive. i had put those files 3 years ago in the backup so that i could get back the original registry had my attempt at modifying windows failed. i deleted those files after i found my windows installation to be stable, and therefore i wasn't able to recall/find the exact steps.

1) install windows
2) optional: create backup
2) reboot in audit mode. click on cancel when prompted by sysprep.
3) create 'User' and 'ProgramData' folders on a separate partition and copy the original content from C:\
4) delete original folders from C:\
5) create junctions of these folders in C:\ to the folders in new location
6) update registry to reflect this path change
7) reboot to check for any issues.
8) once you are satisfied, quit the audit mode by selecting 'quit' from sysprep dialog.
9) optional: create backup

i am now thinking of using WAIK and a 3rd party backup tool to customize future windows installations. i am looking for ways to incorporate various updates in the backup, so that i don't have to download them after a recovery. i spent the whole day updating windows and MS Office.