Setting up networking in office!

imkaush

Adept
Hi guys!

I need some expert help here...:cool:

I have to setup wired/wireless networking in my friend's office.

I have attached the scaled layout of the same indicating the placement of the PCs, the SWITCH(for wired LAN to all the PCs), the Wifi-Router/Modem and the dimensions...

The partitions indicated in the layout will be mostly half-glass half-wood, and full glass doors.

There will be 13 PCs + HDR(for CCTV recording) max... initially they will start with 4 to 6 PCs + HDR

Because of the more number of PCs, we need to use a SWITCH for wired LAN connections, and some (or maybe all) PCs will be Wifi-enabled and will use the the network wirelessly (Wired connections will be failsafe option in that case).

The idea is to use the wifi router-modem for internet/network-sharing both wired(via the SWITCH) and wirelessly. :D

The internet connection may be CABLE-net(LAN) or ADSL, not yet decided.

I need suggestions for a wifi router-modem(ADSL or non-ADSL) with enough range to reach the PCs and provide reasonable speeds...
And also any suggestions for a reliable 16-port SWITCH...

Ready to buy online as well as from local Mumbai shops.

Highly appreciate any help.... :)

layout_netwrking.JPG
 
For a more powerful setup go for a x86 machine running a router os. Connect the 16 port switch to it and configure a n16 router as a access point. The x86 rig can also do time as a nas for the recordings.
 
Thanks @vivek.krishnan !!!

Using the "router os" seems an awesome idea...but i dont have any experience in it and can't experiment/start here...:oops:

Also it would be good to let the cctv guy handle the recording storage...;)


The n16 seems nice but if we opt for an adsl connection, then what are the options?
 
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Because of the more number of PCs, we need to use a SWITCH for wired LAN connections, and some (or maybe all) PCs will be Wifi-enabled and will use the the network wirelessly (Wired connections will be failsafe option in that case).
Decide how many you can wire, all is preferable. Wired is pretty reliable if done correctly and using a branded switch or router if you need more control over the network. Use a UPS for backup.

Wifi is only for those devices that cannot be wired.

The idea is to use the wifi router-modem for internet/network-sharing both wired(via the SWITCH) and wirelessly. :D
Will these be n, g or other protocol wifi adapters and do you have any way to enforce which protocol adapters will be used.

Is there already an existing wifi router in place.

I need suggestions for a wifi router-modem(ADSL or non-ADSL) with enough range to reach the PCs and provide reasonable speeds...
Define reasonable ?

What applications will these PCs be running.
 
Thanks @smnrock and @blr_p for your replies...

Decide how many you can wire, all is preferable. Wired is pretty reliable if done correctly and using a branded switch or router if you need more control over the network. Use a UPS for backup.
The office is a bare shell right now, everything including the furniture/floor/ceiling/wiring is yet to be started.
I have asked the electrician to provide LAN connections from the SWITCH to rest of the places(PCs, Wifi router and HDR)

Wifi is only for those devices that cannot be wired.
Agreed, but in their current smaller office, they are very frustrated with LAN ports not working/cables coming off the ports(loose plugs), etc.
So they think it is better to go for a wireless network, if possible and reliable.

Will these be n, g or other protocol wifi adapters and do you have any way to enforce which protocol adapters will be used.
Is there already an existing wifi router in place.
Everything is yet to be purchased.(they may use one or two currently used PCs)

Define reasonable ?
What applications will these PCs be running.
I don't have a specific/minimum speed requirement....just emailing and browsing.
Basically the PCs will be running MS Office/Outlook/Browser... and their emails will contain documentation attachments like doc/pdf/xls/jpg.
 
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The office is a bare shell right now, everything including the furniture/floor/ceiling/wiring is yet to be started.
I have asked the electrician to provide LAN connections from the SWITCH to rest of the places(PCs, Wifi router and HDR)
ok

Agreed, but in their current smaller office, they are very frustrated with LAN ports not working/cables coming off the ports(loose plugs), etc.
So they think it is better to go for a wireless network, if possible and reliable.
Ensure they get proper installers instead of cowboys.

When properly done, wired is ANY day more reliable than wireless.

A basic rule of thumb, if a station is static ie not moving then you use wire, if it moves around then there is the option for wireless that too only if necessary.

Everything is yet to be purchased.(they may use one or two currently used PCs)
No laptops, smartphones or tablets ?

I don't have a specific/minimum speed requirement....just emailing and browsing.
Basically the PCs will be running MS Office/Outlook/Browser... and their emails will contain documentation attachments like doc/pdf/xls/jpg.
You will have to enquire as to what their daily data load was from the previous office. That is the starting point.
 
ok

Ensure they get proper installers instead of cowboys.

When properly done, wired is ANY day more reliable than wireless.
True, in that case, I will need some tips for the same...as I am doing such a setup for the first time. My only experience is setting up/troubleshooting of my home network, which includes configuring mtnl modem(bridge-mode) & TP-LINK WR841N(WPA2-PsK & MAC Filtering). I have basic knwoledge about Networking stuff from my engg studies... :p

A basic rule of thumb, if a station is static ie not moving then you use wire, if it moves around then there is the option for wireless that too only if necessary.

No laptops, smartphones or tablets ?
Completely agree with the rule. Probably, there will be 2 - 3 laptops(not yet decided exactly but currently they have 1 Viao), max. 2 smartphones(occassionally), max. 1 tablet(occassionally)

You will have to enquire as to what their daily data load was from the previous office. That is the starting point.
Currently their usage is approx 75MB per day per PC using Airtel 2Mbps plan.
 
True, in that case, I will need some tips for the same...as I am doing such a setup for the first time. My only experience is setting up/troubleshooting of my home network, which includes configuring mtnl modem(bridge-mode) & TP-LINK WR841N(WPA2-PsK & MAC Filtering). I have basic knwoledge about Networking stuff from my engg studies... :p
Can't give you tips, it depends on the run. Hire a pro to do it. If the company plans to stay in the same premises for a few years then its worth it. Since its an empty shell then its feasible.

From what i can gather in your previous post there was interference on the line that affected the throughput. In addition the ports were not installed/maintained properly indicating mechanical problems. There could even have been connectivity issues with the ISP. Grounding problems etc.

Completely agree with the rule. Probably, there will be 2 - 3 laptops(not yet decided exactly but currently they have 1 Viao), max. 2 smartphones(occassionally), max. 1 tablet(occassionally)
This number is likely to grow and with it the variety of clients as well. There will be n, g and possibly even b clients coming and going and you will not have any control over it. Slower clients in a mixed network slow things down for everybody because they hog the line longer. They can even cause frequent disconnects if the router firmware isn't mature. If your neighbours opt to use wifi then there will be added interference.

Bear in mind there are only 3 channels available. If they are taken then provided everybody isn't using it at the same time its workable but the word reliable does not come into it at all because of the variables that can jump in without any warning or control from your part.

Currently their usage is approx 75MB per day per PC using Airtel 2Mbps plan.
This will grow over time too. You want to route as much of this through wire as possible.
 
Can't give you tips, it depends on the run. Hire a pro to do it. If the company plans to stay in the same premises for a few years then its worth it. Since its an empty shell then its feasible.

From what i can gather in your previous post there was interference on the line that affected the throughput. In addition the ports were not installed/maintained properly indicating mechanical problems. There could even have been connectivity issues with the ISP.


This number is likely to grow and with it the variety of clients as well. There will be n, g and possibly even b clients coming and going and you will not have any control over it. Slower clients in a mixed network slow things down for everybody because they hog the line longer. They can even cause frequent disconnects if the router firmware isn't mature. If your neighbours opt to use wifi then there will be added interference.

Bear in mind there are only 3 channels available. If they are taken then provided everybody isn't using it at the same time its workable but the word reliable does not come into it at all because of the variables that can jump in without any warning or control from your part.


This will grow over time too. You want to route as much of this through wire as possible.

So we can conclude that we should use wired connections as default and wireless only if required...

EDIT: In the current office, they are facing disconnection issues(not throughput issues) and the reasons are mixed, sometimes isp and other times physical connection issues....:oops:

Kindly suggest options for a Switch and wifi router/modem for this scenario....

Thanks a lot!

P.S.:the LAN cables will be CAD6 :)
 
Kindly suggest options for a Switch and wifi router/modem for this scenario....
You will need switches, not just a switch. Look at D-link or netgear for their 4,8,16 port offerings. Maybe you can re-use some of the existing switches form their present office.

Think of a set of lights in series and another set in parallel. If one light goes or has trouble in the series configuration then all the lights will have trouble. The same applies when you hook up switches.

So you want to connect the switches in parallel or star-like instead of in series or daisy chaining them. So there will be one wire coming in from a central point into each room, that wire then gets hooked up to a switch with the desired number of ports. You can use 10/100 switches in the different rooms as your data requirement seems low.

Basic email & browsing works fine with fast ethernet, big transfers or video will require gigabit. What about the security cameras, are they data heavy ?

I think your main switch should be gigabit but gigabit switches tend to heat up more and fail more often. The vendors don't provide heat sinks on the cheaper models. 100 mbit or gigabit is your choice to make so ensure your vendor has a good warranty in case you have to replace them.

How many people are expected to access the net (at the same time) into the future ?

Where will your DHCP be located ? or will you give static IP's.

EDIT: In the current office, they are facing disconnection issues(not throughput issues) and the reasons are mixed, sometimes isp and other times physical connection issues....:oops:
If you daisy chain switches then one problem can affect many others and is difficult to track down, basically every connection has to be tested. In a star configuration the problem is easier to find and is also limited to the particular branch or its respective port on the main switch. I wonder if their present networking woes are down to daisy chaining, its easy for you to check, if they have one wire going from one switch to the next and then a wire from that switch to the next and so on..

ISP issues with Airtel are low, setup the modem to G.dmt only, put it on a UPS . Ensure the line's SNR is adequate. Data connection goes straight to the modem and not through any splitters. Seperate data from the voice line. Otherwise more phones answering will disconnect you from the net. Am still trying to find an acceptable solution to this problem. Just how many phones can you have off one line and not interfere with the net ?

P.S.:the LAN cables will be CAD6 :)
That's CAT 6
 
They currently have a small office with 3 wired PCs, 1 w/l PC and 1 laptop(max. 2 smartphones)
So they have only 1 DLink DL-2730U wifi router/adsl-modem for the network/internet.

A 16-port Switch would suffice for 13 PCs(there wont be more than that)... All the PCs will be connected to this one central point...
No daisy-chaining/star combination required...

The cameras are minimal in terms of resolution(and also without sound)... so live streaming wont be an issue...

Got the point about vendor warranty... please provide suggestions (for both the switch and the wifi router/modem) :)

The internet will be accessed by MAX 13 PCs + 2 laptops (at the same time)...

The wifi router/modem will work as a DHCP for both wired and w/l networks...
I am thinking about having static IP (using IP address reservation per MAC address)

I am searching for a good ISP in their area in parallel....
 
They currently have a small office with 3 wired PCs, 1 w/l PC and 1 laptop(max. 2 smartphones)
So they have only 1 DLink DL-2730U wifi router/adsl-modem for the network/internet.
I don't understand how they had so much networking problems with just one device (!)

A 16-port Switch would suffice for 13 PCs(there wont be more than that)... All the PCs will be connected to this one central point...
No daisy-chaining/star combination required...
gbit
D-link DGS-1016D
Netgear JGS516

100mbit
D-link DES1016A
Netgear Prosafe 16-Port 10/100 Mbps Switch (JFS516)

These are all unmanaged switches, so no web interface. D-link g-bit model is fanless whereas netgears has a noisy fan so best to put it in a closet. You can check out cisco's offerings as well in the same range. Performance wise they will be similar, the only distinguishing feature is warranty as the g-bit ones will die in 3 years.

The cameras are minimal in terms of resolution(and also without sound)... so live streaming wont be an issue...
Does the video stream go into the ethernet network or is it seperate.

Got the point about vendor warranty... please provide suggestions (for both the switch and the wifi router/modem) :)

The internet will be accessed by MAX 13 PCs + 2 laptops (at the same time)...

The wifi router/modem will work as a DHCP for both wired and w/l networks...
I am thinking about having static IP (using IP address reservation per MAC address)

I am searching for a good ISP in their area in parallel....
Rather than modem/router its better to seperate out modem and router. modem will always be on wifi only intermittently, so modem is most likely to give out sooner. It can be easily replaced for cheap.

DLink DSL-2502U is good enough as a modem. You hook that up in bridge mode to the wifi-router and let the latter handle the DHCP if required. You could even opt for a simpler beetel modem model which is just a modem with no router ie no LAN ports on the back but it needs to be able to setup as a bridge otherwise it won't work with the wi-fi router.

If the stations are fixed then static is easiest, if you have laptops that come & go then you need a DHCP facility.

For wifi routers there are 2 models that come to mind here Asus N13U B1, N16 & D-link DIR-655. All N300 2.4Ghz routers. The idea is to use models that are 2-3 years old in the hopes that outstanding firmware bugs will have been fixed. This is very important as you will be operating in an essentially mixed wifi client environment. Check out the corresponding support forums of the models concerned for any topics that talk about random client disconnects requiring regular manual router reboots and make your decision accordingly. The one that faces the least disconnects is best. Best is to ask in their forums about disconnects in a mixed environment and then make your decision.

The Asus models have the option of adding 3g internet whereas the d-link does not. So you have a backup of sorts in case your main line goes down but bear in mind internet performance on 3G is very dependent on the time of day. You want to pick a 3G provider that has the closest tower for best reception. Then if its peak hour performance is less, also there is issue of placing the router closer to a window for better reception which you do not have to care about with wired internet. Nightmare scenario is crap reception with constant disconnects, this is wireless x2 and is asking for trouble unless you can sort out the variables. An external mounted antenna with a wire leading to your router is required. WiMax could also be an option.

However your placement of the wifi-router on the layout is good ie centrally located for internal wifi coverage. Start from that location and draw a circle of radius 30 feet from it and you have an idea of coverage you can expect. I see no issues with covering the entire office.

Have you conducted an site survey with inSSIDer to see how busy their wifi environment is, how many networks show up ? Do this before you buy the router.

To give you an idea of range ability of the above routers. You can see how the N13 beats everbody for range and price. You will have to check the features on the other models and decide if they are necessary. Though for your requirements the N13 should suffice. Bear in mind that a slow b or g client at the periphery of the routers range will slow the network down for everybody.

cached_radarchart_bench_58_937_950_954_1058.jpg


Location A: AP and wireless client in same room, approximately 6 feet apart.

Location C: Client in upper level, approximately 25 feet away (direct path) from AP.
One wood floor, sheetrock ceiling, no walls between AP and Client.

Location D: Client in upper level, approximately 35 feet away (direct path) from AP.
One wood floor, one lower level sheetrock wall, sheetrock ceiling between AP and Client.

Location F: Client on upper level, approximately 65 feet away (direct path) from AP.
Four to five interior walls, one wood floor, one sheetrock ceiling between AP and Client.
 
I don't understand how they had so much networking problems with just one device (!)
Sometimes its the router rebooting by itself and some times ISP issues....:oops:

100mbit
D-link DES1016A
Netgear Prosafe 16-Port 10/100 Mbps Switch (JFS516)

These are all unmanaged switches, so no web interface. D-link g-bit model is fanless whereas netgears has a noisy fan so best to put it in a closet. You can check out cisco's offerings as well in the same range. Performance wise they will be similar, the only distinguishing feature is warranty as the g-bit ones will die in 3 years.
I think I should go with the 100mbit ones as there's no such heavy requirement to use g-bit...

Does the video stream go into the ethernet network or is it seperate.
The video signals from the cameras are sent to the HDR through separate coax cables... these live/stored videos can be viewed via HDR's web interface...
So the HDR will definitely require a static IP for ease of access...

Rather than modem/router its better to seperate out modem and router. modem will always be on wifi only intermittently, so modem is most likely to give out sooner. It can be easily replaced for cheap.

DLink DSL-2502U is good enough as a modem. You hook that up in bridge mode to the wifi-router and let the latter handle the DHCP if required. You could even opt for a simpler beetel modem model which is just a modem with no router ie no LAN ports on the back but it needs to be able to setup as a bridge otherwise it won't work with the wi-fi router.
I agree with this point... also if they opt for Cable broadband, then the modem would not be required at all.
The ISP will probably be decided by this weekend...

If the stations are fixed then static is easiest, if you have laptops that come & go then you need a DHCP facility.
The stations are fixed and as I mentioned max 2-3 laptops...
But a DHCP with an IP reserved per MAC address(map each station/laptop/phone MAC to a fixed IP) will be best IMO...

For wifi routers there are 2 models that come to mind here Asus N13U B1, N16 & D-link DIR-655. All N300 2.4Ghz routers. The idea is to use models that are 2-3 years old in the hopes that outstanding firmware bugs will have been fixed. This is very important as you will be operating in an essentially mixed wifi client environment. Check out the corresponding support forums of the models concerned for any topics that talk about random client disconnects requiring regular manual router reboots and make your decision accordingly. The one that faces the least disconnects is best. Best is to ask in their forums about disconnects in a mixed environment and then make your decision.

The Asus models have the option of adding 3g internet whereas the d-link does not. So you have a backup of sorts in case your main line goes down but bear in mind internet performance on 3G is very dependent on the time of day. You want to pick a 3G provider that has the closest tower for best reception. Then if its peak hour performance is less, also there is issue of placing the router closer to a window for better reception which you do not have to care about with wired internet. Nightmare scenario is crap reception with constant disconnects, this is wireless x2 and is asking for trouble unless you can sort out the variables. An external mounted antenna with a wire leading to your router is required. WiMax could also be an option.
Thanks for the options, will look into these...

However your placement of the wifi-router on the layout is good ie centrally located for internal wifi coverage. Start from that location and draw a circle of radius 30 feet from it and you have an idea of coverage you can expect. I see no issues with covering the entire office.
They had initially planned to keep it with the switch, but I changed it to the center... :D

Have you conducted an site survey with inSSIDer to see how busy their wifi environment is, how many networks show up ? Do this before you buy the router.
The whole building is new and neighbouring offices are either vacant or undergoing interior work like ours... so I don't expect to find any networks but will have a look...am visiting the site today...

To give you an idea of range ability of the above routers. You can see how the N13 beats everbody for range and price. You will have to check the features on the other models and decide if they are necessary. Though for your requirements the N13 should suffice. Bear in mind that a slow b or g client at the periphery of the routers range will slow the network down for everybody.
Thanks for this comparision... We will make sure all the devices we buy and use here are of the n-type.... besides they rarely have visitors with laptops/smartphones requiring to use their network, so am not worried about the mixed clients scenario...
 
Any updates ?

What have you decided to go with.
The LAN wire/port placements were already given to the electrician initially...
But their interior work was on hold due to some reasons... so I have some more time(approx. 2-3months) to decide on which router/modem/switch to go for.... maybe I will get a good deal on one during this time... :p

For the wifi router, almost zeroed in on the N13... will surely post any further updates/queries... :D

Thanks a lot @blr_p ... :)

Meanwhile do pour in with any more suggestions (based on experience) for wifi-router/modem/switch are most welcome!!! :p
 
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