kartikoli
Innovator
Solar panel and stuff
- Thread starter iPwnz
- Start date
variablevector
Forerunner
Savings from solar power to decrease; net metering system to replace gross meter system
The move to introduce gross meters is coming as a blow in the dark to those who have installed solar on rooftops lured by the promise of subsidy and dreaming of getting rid of excess electricity bills.
In Kerala, they're already talking about getting rid of net metering and switching to gross. The proposed rate you'd get paid for every unit you generate is Rs 2.69 / kWH, which is incredibly low compared to the 7-8 you'd get charged for the units you consume.
Based on my understanding of the economics of power generation, long term net metering does not seem sustainable for most grids. Especially if more and more solar power producing homes keep getting added that generate all of their peak electricty during midday when the power demand is low. These homes then generate next to no power in the evening and at night, when power demand on the grid is the highest. This mismatch is called the duck curve. That means grid operators have to find an alternate source of energy for those peak hours. In India, that is probably going to be coal.
So effectively the grid is burning more coal (because solar-powered homes are offsetting their energy costs and can therefore afford to consume more) while at the same time paying out of their pockets for power than they don't need during the middle of the day. How long can they sustain that? If the breakeven for your solar system is, like 10 years, then what are the chances your grid operator changes their policy before that?
This is one of the major reasons I'm reluctant about these grid-tied systems.
Party Monger
Juggernaut
Shouldnt a hybrid inverter take care of this? Use what you produce first then import from grid? Or export to grid.Savings from solar power to decrease; net metering system to replace gross meter system
The move to introduce gross meters is coming as a blow in the dark to those who have installed solar on rooftops lured by the promise of subsidy and dreaming of getting rid of excess electricity bills.keralakaumudi.com
In Kerala, they're already talking about getting rid of net metering and switching to gross. The proposed rate you'd get paid for every unit you generate is Rs 2.69 / kWH, which is incredibly low compared to the 7-8 you'd get charged for the units you consume.
Based on my understanding of the economics of power generation, long term net metering does not seem sustainable for most grids. Especially if more and more solar power producing homes keep getting added that generate all of their peak electricty during midday when the power demand is low. These homes then generate next to no power in the evening and at night, when power demand on the grid is the highest. This mismatch is called the duck curve. That means grid operators have to find an alternate source of energy for those peak hours. In India, that is probably going to be coal.
So effectively the grid is burning more coal (because solar-powered homes are offsetting their energy costs and can therefore afford to consume more) while at the same time paying out of their pockets for power than they don't need during the middle of the day. How long can they sustain that? If the breakeven for your solar system is, like 10 years, then what are the chances your grid operator changes their policy before that?
This is one of the major reasons I'm reluctant about these grid-tied systems.
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variablevector
Forerunner
Yes. The catch is those cost even more money upfront and therefore it takes even longer to breakeven. I've seen 15-20 years quoted as the time for that to happen. Hence why people avoid them.
I personally think they can still make more sense though. Because you get actual power backup and the option to be fully independent of the grid.
Edit: Although it seems my numbers are off. It looks like Indian solar companies are quoting 3-5 years as the breakeven period for a grid-tied system with subsidies. I was looking at the US numbers, which are closer to 6-10.
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nitin_g3
Herald
I'm waiting for lithium batteries to become way cheaper so that I can build self sustainable solar system where I don't need any grid power.
AFAIK, panels not on ALMM are ineligible for net metering since 1st April 2024. Make sure your panel is in ALMM.
Grids can also store energy in the form of pumped hydro, community / city scale sodium-ion batteries.
The Govt has imposed high tariffs on batteries from China (in the name of MII) hence DISCOMs find it cheaper to source from coal, for now.
The PPA (Power Purchase Agreement) with DISCOM is for 25 years and they cannot withdraw from it unilaterally, there are muliple court precedents on it.
They will stop accepting new net metering applications in near future, but it won't impact exisiting users.
People who signed up for solar in 2015-2016 are paid INR 10-12 / unit even today for net excess they generatee, where as new agreements now offer for INR 2/3 unit.
have inquired about the ALMM thing the panel is there and the meter has been converted to net meter today,
total quote 2.35L for 6kw panels [6.2kw] + 8kw growatt 3 phase inverter + high rise structure [ 5k extra if it exceeds 2m]
in bihar I am paid 6.8 for each unit that goes to grid
too much hassle
10k for new electricity connection[bribe to get a connection passed] and some rewiring again from distribution box for new connection
If the price difference is <1K per panel, TopCON is preferred because it has higher efficiency, more linear degradation and follows newer standards.
Both will perform just fine and have a performance warranty of minimum 25 years so you are good with either.
17/- in MH.
You are right. I wrote an essay on this very matter around 2020. Grid tied solar are in fact anti-infra. You are warring with Tata, reliance, padani using your panels. We're being entertained by the government's subsidies and net metering because energy firms aren't meeting the demands. Someday, they will catch up and lobby the govt into discontinuing all subsidies.
Did yo got subsidy.
I think the subsidy was for the families under 150000 income. The vendors are filling forms of everyone and when the subsidy will be rejected they will put the blame on government
I think you have to pay complete amount to vendor and the subsidy will be credited later.
nitin_g3
Herald
That's how it works.
I suggest you read the terms on pm solar website before coming to any conclusion.
Looking for suggestions.
We live in a flat. Have 3 terraces/balconies.
1 on west-south corner of the building, which gets okay-ish sunlight since it is at the corner and no buildings in front on the south or the west side. Area is around 11 x 11 feet. Only two walls, two are railings on south - west side.
2 on the north side of the flat, both have 3 walls and one open side (Railing only on the north side). No direct sunlight as far as I can tell (One 11 x 11 and one 6 x 8 feet).
Main purpose would be to reduce the electricity bill, not power the whole house because obviously that is not going to happen. Our electricity bills ranged from 10-15K per month (Pune, MH) during summers because we have 3 bedrooms with 3 split ACs (One of them is older and very power hungry). Otherwise the bills are around 5K range during monsoon and winters.
Is there a site or brochures I can look at to calculate or estimate roughly the savings per month, cost and the break-even time if I plan to fit solar on one or more of the balconies?
Or should I completely scrap the idea because it is not going to work?
We live in a flat. Have 3 terraces/balconies.
1 on west-south corner of the building, which gets okay-ish sunlight since it is at the corner and no buildings in front on the south or the west side. Area is around 11 x 11 feet. Only two walls, two are railings on south - west side.
2 on the north side of the flat, both have 3 walls and one open side (Railing only on the north side). No direct sunlight as far as I can tell (One 11 x 11 and one 6 x 8 feet).
Main purpose would be to reduce the electricity bill, not power the whole house because obviously that is not going to happen. Our electricity bills ranged from 10-15K per month (Pune, MH) during summers because we have 3 bedrooms with 3 split ACs (One of them is older and very power hungry). Otherwise the bills are around 5K range during monsoon and winters.
Is there a site or brochures I can look at to calculate or estimate roughly the savings per month, cost and the break-even time if I plan to fit solar on one or more of the balconies?
Or should I completely scrap the idea because it is not going to work?
I have a friend from Pune who used to get a bill of ₹15,000, just like yours. Now, he has installed an 8 kW solar plant, and his bills have reduced to ₹2,000-₹3,000 per month.
I can share the vendor details if you like. He got it done for a very reasonable price.
Use this calculator link to calculate the breakeven and monthly savings.
With the area that I have, I don't think 8kw is going to happen. I think for 100 sq ft size (Only one terrace that gets the sunlight) it would be around 1kw.
One query about on-grid setups, how do the calculations happen?
Since in summer, the top slab for electricity bill is like INR 16/unit and at that time the generation is also higher.
In winters our consumption is around 300 kWh so top slab is around INR 11/unit, but also the solar generation would be lower.
So will the system subtract the units generated vs units consumed and generate final bill with slabs in place? Or just give flat slab for units generated?