The real reason why India banned Tiktok

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India first and to date the only country to have done so. I remember at the time it was about denying Tiktok ie. China access to the market. A commercial loss. Additionally, it was about spying and user data theft. While all of these are true to an extent they don't get at the core reason which only recently dawned on me.

Tiktok has the ability to create mass unrest with the tweak of an algorithm and that capability is in the hands of a foreign power and importantly in this case, an adversary.

Public unrest is something the government deals with on a regular basis and it's common to enforce mobile Internet shutdowns. We hold the world record currently I think for how often it's done. But life & liberty comes before freedom of speech.

Tiktok was banned in India for the same reason the CCP banned most American social media over a decade ago. It's strategic. If anybody said this back then I don't recall. But to appreciate this you have to understand the Americans have been at this game for a long time. The CCP understood the power and latent threat of social media.

I got this insight looking at how the anti Israel protests seemed to kick off simultaneously in many western countries. The age group that is the least sympathetic to Israel is the 18-24 lot.

Guess what their primary source of information is.

Here is an interview with an Israeli employee who quit because he could see how biased things were and powerless to do anything about it. Jewish content creators kept getting content strikes whereas their opponents got away with much more. And shaped opinion a certain way as a result which just so happens to match the CCP's stance on the conflict.

At times I have to follow what goes on in other countries to understand better why certain decisions are taken here.

 

[6pack]

Then by this logic - Whatsapp, Facebook, X, Reddit, Telegram, Signal should also be banned?
X and reddit and youtube comments has lot of anti-India bots active on it.
Whatsapp, FB, Telegram all have mass followers on various channels/subs/pages etc. Lot of misinformation on these apps being forwarded everyday.

TikTok was banned for another reason too. They didn't allow GoI access to their data which Twitter, Meta, Google allow. China thought India was like Pakistan and paid the price.

 

[blr_p]

Then by this logic - Whatsapp, Facebook, X, Reddit, Telegram, Signal should also be banned?

Not controlled by an adversary which can weaponise the platform during war time. We're not going to war with US or any western power, yes?

Watch the linked video. You have a great working example there.

X and reddit and youtube comments has lot of anti-India bots active on it.

X fortunately is free now with Elon in charge. I don't know much about reddit. Youtube uses their stupid AI to moderate comments and a lot of my comments gets deleted. So those bots don't get far.

Whatsapp, FB, Telegram all have mass followers on various channels/subs/pages etc. Lot of misinformation on these apps being forwarded everyday.

WhatsApp recently limited how many forwards could be made. WhatsApp could never compete with Tiktok for content

TikTok was banned for another reason too. They didn't allow GoI access to their data which Twitter, Meta, Google allow.

Access to data is for domestic purposes but what good is it otherwise. Anyone breaks the law then the various agencies can catch them if they live in India.

I'm talking about a foreign power controlling what you see and tweaking it to their advantage which likely isn't in your favour. And if you try to counter with your own content they find excuses to block. The algorithm the does the rest.

Jews are targets in the west thanks to Tiktok. The Israeli govt is painted as the aggressor when all they're doing is responding to an attack. This then builds domestic pressure on all western governments not to support Israel. Get it now?

Now imagine how India will be portrayed in a war with China or the Paks. First internally to create pressure against the government and externally which we will have to handle anyway. But that domestic half front is now greatly weakened.

 

[kartikoli]

The Israeli govt is painted as the aggressor when all they're doing is responding to an attack

I know you are not someone who writes bulshit and you actually research before making an argument so I would say you should research before defending the genocide.

 

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I know you are not someone who writes bulshit and you actually research before making an argument so I would say you should research before defending the genocide.

Who says it is genocide?

This is a great example of malinformation doing the rounds.

Lie upon lie upon lie

 

[kartikoli]

Who says it is genocide?

This is another great example doing the rounds.

30k civilians dead (mostly women and children) and if this is not genocide then I don't know what it is.

 

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30k civilians dead (mostly women and children) and if this is not genocide then I don't know what it is.

So there are at least five lies in that bolded part.

Gaza is a unique place in the world. Very few men. Mostly women & children, right? What happened to the men? The fighters. Those figures do not include men on purpose. Where are they sourced? Hamas. And the western media buys into this nonsense. Why? Otherwise they lose access.

It sounds like Israel is deliberately targeting only women and children. That's the next lie. How would they do that even, like know where just women & children were.

Is Israel on a picnic. No they are in a war. Hamas has 24 batallions. About 19 have been dismantled. Only 5 left intact in Rafah. The IDF estimates they've killed around 13k combatants. These numbers come from a democratic and accountable government whose statements are constantly challenged. But those of a terrorist entity are taken as gospel truth. Why?

If Hamas attacks Israel its war. If Israel responds it's a war crime

Israel considers children as under 16. Hamas considers them under 19. Meaning Hamas is using a lot of kids to fight and then saying children are being killed. In the second intifada they were used to carry bombs into buses and other public places. When schools are named after dead terrorists it seems this is the highest aspiration a kid can have.

About 20% of rockets fired fall in Gaza and kill their own people. Hamas has been known to shoot their own to keep them from fleeing to designated safe areas. Every death whether Israeli or Palestinian is on Hamas.

So clearly the figures quoted are bogus. People are dying but nowhere as much as claimed. The counter to this is but earlier numbers were correct. Really?

In 2002, there was talk of this big massacre in Jenin. Oh at least a thousand must have been killed. Turns out in the end just 51 and all were terrorists.

In 2009, there was another conflict where Hamas played down the numbers and it turned out several hundred of their fighters were taken out.

The most recent was last October, this charge that Israel targeted a hospital. All the major news agencies said Israel kills 500 at hospital. A little later it was shown the attack was a PIJ rocket aimed at Israel but failed and fell in the parking lot of the hospital. Hospital building unharmed. Total casualties around 50. Some agencies retracted the article but no apologies tendered.

Hamas lies.

How much of this did you know? Nothing I bet.

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/how-gaza-health-ministry-fakes-casualty-numbers

Now, consider the Israeli figures. For all of October it was 1,400. Then in November it was reduced to 1,200. Why? It took them over a month just to figure out how many had died. You think the other side is doing this?

Finally, Israel isn't committing genocide but trying to prevent a future genocide of its people.

If Israel wanted to commit genocide half an hour is enough. Not six months.

The ICJ's case is bogus and all they said was there was a 'plausible' case of genocide. Nothing has been ruled which in any case will take years that is if the case isn't thrown out in the meantime.

But people are already saying it is genocide like it's a fact.

A lie can go around the world multiple times before the truth has time to get it's shoes on.

 

[psyph3r]

So there are at least five lies in that bolded part.

Gaza is a unique place in the world. Very few men. Mostly women & children, right? What happened to the men? The fighters. Those figures do not include men on purpose. Where are they sourced? Hamas. And the western media buys into this nonsense. Why? Otherwise they lose access.

It sounds like Israel is deliberately targeting only women and children. That's the next lie. How would they do that even, like know where just women & children were.

Is Israel on a picnic. No they are in a war. Hamas has 24 batallions. About 19 have been dismantled. Only 5 left intact in Rafah. The IDF estimates they've killed around 13k combatants. These numbers come from a democratic and accountable government whose statements are constantly challenged. But those of a terrorist entity are taken as gospel truth. Why?

If Hamas attacks Israel its war. If Israel responds it's a war crime

Israel considers children as under 16. Hamas considers them under 19. Meaning Hamas is using a lot of kids to fight and then saying children are being killed. In the second intifada they were used to carry bombs into buses and other public places. When schools are named after dead terrorists it seems this is the highest aspiration a kid can have.

About 20% of rockets fired fall in Gaza and kill their own people. Hamas has been known to shoot their own to keep them from fleeing to designated safe areas. Every death whether Israeli or Palestinian is on Hamas.

So clearly the figures quoted are bogus. People are dying but nowhere as much as claimed. The counter to this is but earlier numbers were correct. Really?

In 2002, there was talk of this big massacre in Jenin. Oh at least a thousand must have been killed. Turns out in the end just 51 and all were terrorists.

In 2009, there was another conflict where Hamas played down the numbers and it turned out several hundred of their fighters were taken out.

The most recent was last October, this charge that Israel targeted a hospital. All the major news agencies said Israel kills 500 at hospital. A little later it was shown the attack was a PIJ rocket aimed at Israel but failed and fell in the parking lot of the hospital. Hospital building unharmed. Total casualties around 50. Some agencies retracted the article but no apologies tendered.

Hamas lies.

How much of this did you know? Nothing I bet.

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/how-gaza-health-ministry-fakes-casualty-numbers

Now, consider the Israeli figures. For all of October it was 1,400. Then in November it was reduced to 1,200. Why? It took them over a month just to figure out how many had died. You think the other side is doing this?

Finally, Israel isn't committing genocide but trying to prevent a future genocide of its people.

If Israel wanted to commit genocide half an hour is enough. Not six months.

The ICJ's case is bogus and all they said was there was a 'plausible' case of genocide. Nothing has been ruled which in any case will take years that is if the case isn't thrown out in the meantime.

But people are already saying it is genocide like it's a fact.

A lie can go around the world multiple times before the truth has time to get it's shoes on.

 

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Israel is a fake country built on stolen land.

Another classic.

Jews have a connection to the land that goes back over three thousand years. The dome of the rock is built over the temple of David right? So the Jews were there many centuries before the Muslims turned up.

Palestine isn't even an Arab word. It's roman. The British took it up and Palestinian for them meant arabs AND Jews. At some point the Jews got dropped out of that. But Israel is still 20% Arab. Imagine that. The arabs of Israel are the most free of anywhere in the Arab world. Supreme Court judges, members of parliament, media figures and even serving in the IDF. Nobody talks about them.

Tell me where was the Palestinian government in exile. Who was the first president of Palestine? There ain't one. because there never was a Palestinian state. The ottomans who ruled over the area for many centuries never used the term to refer to that region.

So it is Palestine that is fake and it's people who were arabs became Palestinian somewhere in the 60s when Arafat made it so. The rest is soviet propaganda after Israel beat their Arab client states in '67 with western hardware.

Next is this stolen bit. In the early 20th C, the Jews bought land at higher than market price from the Turkish landlords. They then worked the land and made it productive. This caused friction with the local elites who wanted them gone. So when a two state was declared at the UN all the arab neighbours pounced and the Israelis had to hold. They did and beat back the arabs.

Losing a war has consequences for both sides. The arabs lost and land was taken otherwise the Israeli state would be undefendable.

Here is a playlist if you actually care to learn about the history

I could waste time with your jal jeera link but I won't bother with media of a country that sponsors Hamas.

 

[psyph3r]

The dome of the rock is built over the temple of David right? So the Jews were there many centuries before the Muslims turned up.

So that makes it right to take over another piece of land that has been settled by other people because your religion and book tells you that you're the chosen people of God ?

I could waste time with your jal jeera link but I won't bother.

Same goes for your Hasbara sponsored playlist

I'm not interested in wasting my time arguing with someone that defends a country based on backward beliefs, their eventual goal is to fulfill their retarded prophecy flatten the mosque and build their third temple,

In Search of the Apocalyptic Red Cow

Lawrence Wright’s 1998 report on a Pentecostal cattle breeder from Mississippi and an Orthodox rabbi from Jerusalem who believe that a red cow could bring on End Times.

www.newyorker.com

The Red Heifer and the Third Temple in End-Time Prophecy | Messianic Bible

Throughout almost 1,900 years of exile, the Jewish people yearned to return to Israel, build the Third Temple in Jerusalem and restore the Temple service.

free.messianicbible.com

 

[AINDRASIS_GUPTA]

Finally, Israel isn't committing genocide but trying to prevent a future genocide of its people.

Let's not make a mockery of term 'genocide' when the IDF is just as trigger happy as any other rogue militant organization.

The IDF has killed close to 200 humanitarian aid workers in Gaza, including 7 as recent from World Central Kitchen (WCK), even when the WCK staff co-ordinated their movement with the IDF, killing nationalities from Australia, UK, and US.

There is a famine currently ongoing at Gaza, and Israel is not even letting innocent aid workers to work in peace and providing safe human passage. How is that acceptable to any normal citizen?

 

[karanssh]

This thread has derailed into something else entirely. like every other thread about these topics. The way I see this is - with American companies, atleast India and indians can invest into them and vice versa.
Why should we deal with china and chinese companies when they deal with us unfairly - it is well documented that china does not allow indian or even american social media companies in their country. Why should we let them entry into our market, our revenue, our time?

 

[blr_p]

Let's not make a mockery of term 'genocide' when the IDF is just as trigger happy as any other rogue militant organization.

Actually it's not. The global average for urban warfare is 9 civilians to 1 combatant. In Iraq the average was 3 to 5 civilians for 1.

Stop Comparing Israel's War in Gaza to Anything. It Has No Precedent

Let's put away our military history books. There is no comparison to what Israel has faced in Gaza—certainly none by which Israel comes out looking the worse.

www.newsweek.com

This conflict is like no other and you'd be surprised to know the ratio is somewhere between 1 to 1.5 civilians to each combatant. The lowest on record.

When this conflict is over you will know the real numbers and which sides claims are true.

The IDF has killed close to 200 humanitarian aid workers in Gaza,

Yeah? How many Hamas operatives in there. These people aren't in uniform which makes it difficult to distinguish civilians from combatants. They frequently use ambulances to transport their wounded. That's already a couple of war crimes.

including 7 as recent from World Central Kitchen (WCK), even when the WCK staff co-ordinated their movement with the IDF, killing nationalities from Australia, UK, and US.

The Israeli PM acknowledged it, the chief of staff has apologised, a couple of colonels dismissed and two general's of 1 and 2 stars reprimanded.

Don't forget they mistakenly also shot three of their own hostages by accident. Such is the complexity of this battle where a split second error means either your life or those you command instead.

To date, the IDF has lost 10-20% of their own personnel to friendly fire. Name me any conflict where this doesn't happen. Didn't we also lose some during the Balakote operation that too inside India.

There is a famine currently ongoing at Gaza, and Israel is not even letting innocent aid workers to work in peace and providing safe human passage. How is that acceptable to any normal citizen?

There is plenty of aid getting in. The trouble is once in it gets looted by Hamas and then sold in the black market at two three times the price instead of free.

Don't you find it odd that one warring party has to provide aid to in effect an enemy population and gets the blame otherwise.

Providing aid in an active war zone is like trying to play in a road with traffic. It's very risky.

Who is responsible for this? Hamas. So why is Israel getting blamed.

In all of this talk what about the hostages. Are they being fed. Why no one mentions them.

This thread has derailed into something else entirely. like every other thread about these topics.

Actually it hasn't. This is how lies are spread and countered.

One sentence with numerous lies takes several minutes or paras to debunk.

How do you counter that? Are people going to listen to the explanations. Or will they just continue to parrot false slogans.

Many of these protesters abroad don't even know the basics of what they are protesting about. But they saw it on Tiktok so it must be true. You only have to see the number of disruptions in unrelated venues of numerous countries to appreciate the gravity.

This is a well funded, coordinated information warfare campaign. Everybody had their talking points on Oct 8. Israel hasn't even geared up yet. Is that natural grassroots opposition or, organised astroturfing?

 

[6pack]

I'm talking about a foreign power controlling what you see and tweaking it to their advantage which likely isn't in your favour. And if you try to counter with your own content they find excuses to block. The algorithm the does the rest.

Use it against them?

Youtube uses their stupid AI to moderate comments and a lot of my comments gets deleted. So those bots don't get far.

forgot - just read any comments on Indian news channels like First Post, Hindustan Times, Indian Express. Lot of chinese bots with fake indian names and fake ai generated profile pics spouting nonsense against India and govt. Youtube does not delete their posts or comments.

 

[blr_p]

Use it against them?

Correct me if I got it wrong.

He's saying use the same hashtag created on an anti-India post and then hijack it by posting some thing counter.

This then requires a clued up bunch of people to retweet it which then grows geometrically.

Hack plus counter punch

I want to impress on you the difference between anti-India posts vs anti-Jewish.

The former might hurt your sense of pride but no Indian abroad or institution will be protested or worse attacked.

The way it is with Jews now is their lives could be in danger by lone wolves or larger if they are visible as Jews. Anywhere in the west.

There are many Indians abroad too. A particular set of circumstances that forces the Indian state to act and that lot are in the same boat too.

Yeah the Israeli problem right now is 10x if not more serious than the Indian one.

What starts with the Jews, doesn't end with them - late Rabbi Lord Jonathan Sacks

 

[TEUser2K1]

@blr_p
Palestine issue may have mythological roots upto 'Curse of Ham', (Ham, son of Noah).

 

[AINDRASIS_GUPTA]

Actually it's not. The global average for urban warfare is 9 civilians to 1 combatant. In Iraq the average was 3 to 5 civilians for 1.

Stop Comparing Israel's War in Gaza to Anything. It Has No Precedent

Let's put away our military history books. There is no comparison to what Israel has faced in Gaza—certainly none by which Israel comes out looking the worse.

www.newsweek.com

This conflict is like no other and you'd be surprised to know the ratio is somewhere between 1 to 1.5 civilians to each combatant. The lowest on record.

When this conflict is over you will know the real numbers and which sides claims are true.

Except you have already made the prejudice of quoting a random ratio that no one knows whether it is true, and ultimately saying that it is lowest on record.

A war is a war. Comparing innocent casualties of one war and then using it to justify other ones is just pure savage. Where is your morality mate?

Yeah? How many Hamas operatives in there. These people aren't in uniform which makes it difficult to distinguish civilians from combatants. They frequently use ambulances to transport their wounded. That's already a couple of war crimes.

The Israeli PM acknowledged it, the chief of staff has apologised, a couple of colonels dismissed and two general's of 1 and 2 stars reprimanded.

Don't forget they mistakenly also shot three of their own hostages by accident. Such is the complexity of this battle where a split second error means either your life or those you command instead.

To date, the IDF has lost 10-20% of their own personnel to friendly fire. Name me any conflict where this doesn't happen. Didn't we also lose some during the Balakote operation that too inside India.

The perpetrator (here Israel) cannot be the judge of its own crimes.

You need an independent investigation why these humanitarian workers were killed, even when their location were coordinated with the IDF. But, again your prejudice here is clouding your judgement.

There is plenty of aid getting in. The trouble is once in it gets looted by Hamas and then sold in the black market at two three times the price instead of free.

This is not the question of 'how much aid' is getting there.

The question is - why innocent aid workers are being targeted countless number of times and hampering the safe human corridor protocols?

Don't you find it odd that one warring party has to provide aid to in effect an enemy population and gets the blame otherwise.

Providing aid in an active war zone is like trying to play in a road with traffic. It's very risky.

The aids are from foreign countries, which Israel has no right to interfere with. Maybe that's why the IDF have killed close to 180 UNRWA members in retaliation.

And the population you have already marked as 'enemy' also consists of innocent people who are caught in the crossfire. Mate, have you ever done social service in your life or you just hate people who practice it?

Who is responsible for this? Hamas. So why is Israel getting blamed.

In all of this talk what about the hostages. Are they being fed. Why no one mentions them.

The reason Israel is getting the blame because they have ignored multiple ceasefire talks. If Netanyahu really cared for their hostages, we wouldn't have been having this conversation and hostages would have been traded months back.

 

[blr_p]

So that makes it right to take over another piece of land that has been settled by other people because your religion and book tells you that you're the chosen people of God ?

Yeah find that answer in the Playlist.

Same goes for your Hasbara sponsored playlist

Difference being what they say is legally sound. Can you claim the same with your source? No, so spare me the moral equivalence.

I'm not interested in wasting my time arguing with someone that defends a country based on backward beliefs, their eventual goal is to fulfill their retarded prophecy flatten the mosque and build their third temple,

In Search of the Apocalyptic Red Cow

Lawrence Wright’s 1998 report on a Pentecostal cattle breeder from Mississippi and an Orthodox rabbi from Jerusalem who believe that a red cow could bring on End Times.

www.newyorker.com

The Red Heifer and the Third Temple in End-Time Prophecy | Messianic Bible

Throughout almost 1,900 years of exile, the Jewish people yearned to return to Israel, build the Third Temple in Jerusalem and restore the Temple service.

free.messianicbible.com

Amazing to read that bolded bit here but good you brought it up.

This just another recycling of the 'Al Aksa is in danger' libel dating back to the 1920s started by none other than the grand mufti.

Been replayed countless times by various Palestinian leaders to a gullible audience to rabble rouse as a pressure tactic. Any time there is unrest about the mosque some one has pulled this stunt.

“Al-Aksa Is in Danger” Libel Advocate Grand Mufti Haj Amin al-Husseini

The claim that the Jews were scheming to destroy the Al-Aksa and build the Temple, was started by Mufti Haj Amin al-Husseini

jcpa.org

And here we are a hundred years later with Al Aksa still standing and likely will for a very long time to come.

Red heifers to please some orthodox and pretext for Oct 7 is again the same crap.

Keep 'em coming. Let's see what else you got

 

[psyph3r]

Can you claim the same with your source? No, so spare me the moral equivalence.

That video basically compiled footage posted by Israeli soldiers, the gruesome ones can be found elsewhere.
If you want to willingly ignore something just because it doesn't fit your worldview, it isn't my problem.

Israel continues to get bolder to trigger a broader conflict in the region and it soon won't be able to hide behind the "6 million jews" or "anti-semitism" shield to hide its actions anymore.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/02/world/europe/interpreter-israel-syria-embassy.html

 

[blr_p]

Except you have already made the prejudice of quoting a random ratio that no one knows whether it is true, and ultimately saying that it is lowest on record.

Time will bear this out

A war is a war. Comparing innocent casualties of one war and then using it to justify other ones is just pure savage. Where is your morality mate?

You said Israel was trigger happy when it's exactly the opposite.

Why don't you ask that question of Hamas and it's supporters. 70% of which in Gaza support Oct 7 and the figure is even higher in the west bank.

Where is their morality?

Who started it. Who broke an existing ceasefire. Hamas. I don't see you condemning them.

The perpetrator (here Israel) cannot be the judge of its own crimes.

You need an independent investigation why these humanitarian workers were killed, even when their location were coordinated with the IDF. But, again your prejudice here is clouding your judgement.

Fat chance any sovereign military will accept an 'independent investigation'

There is no prejudice. Fog of war. Target misidentified. Fault admitted. Action taken. Move on.

This is not the question of 'how much aid' is getting there.

You said famine

The question is - why innocent aid workers are being targeted countless number of times and hampering the safe human corridor protocols?

Easy for Hamas to hide under this label of aid worker isn't it and then be able to move their people about. That's the problem.

An opponent that does not wear uniforms is a war crime because they refuse to distinguish from civilians.

Most militaries put themselves in front of their people. Hamas puts their people in front.

The aids are from foreign countries, which Israel has no right to interfere with. Maybe that's why the IDF have killed close to 180 UNRWA members in retaliation.

Israel isn't interfering with foreign aid. Several air drops already and a makeshift port us coming up.

UNRWA has got a lot of Hamas working for them. This why a number of countries have stopped funding it. UNRWA doesn't really do aid. They are more into teaching and social services. I should say indoctrination of children to kill Israelis. Starts young. This has already been presented to the US senate committee by Hillel Neuer of UN Watch. you might want to look up.

WCK & the UN food program do aid. The Israelis wanted WCK to replace UNRWA. yeah, war sucks especially when you hit the wrong target.

And the population you have already marked as 'enemy' also consists of innocent people who are caught in the crossfire. Mate, have you ever done social service in your life or you just hate people who practice it?

People that can't move to designated safe zones because they will be fired upon by Hamas. When they get there Hamas embeds themselves within and fires off at Israel. Making the collective a legitimate military target.

That's two war crimes by Hamas already. Or is it only Israel that commits them?

Attempting social service in a war zone comes with risks which you refuse to accept. This whole charade is to force a ceasefire which means Hamas survives.

The reason Israel is getting the blame because they have ignored multiple ceasefire talks. If Netanyahu really cared for their hostages, we wouldn't have been having this conversation and hostages would have been traded months back.

The deal is release 800 convicted terrorists of which a hundred are on death row for just thirty hostages.

What about the remaining 100 hostages? I'm sure similar exchange ratios will be demanded

Yeah, which government can agree to such a deal.

In fact this is something India has had experience with.