what are cuesheets how to use them ?

[FaH33m]

i usually download most of the a state of trance episodes which as many of u know are 2 hour tracks with various trance tracks being played.

and recently ive been downloading some old classics of ASOT .which ive missed before.like 217-239 all episodes.

and mega episodes like .250,200 etc.

i find it very difficult to keep in sync with the tracks being played while listening to the episode..

even using the track list doesnt help much.

and recently i came across..a zip file which contained something called cue sheets of all the ASOT episodes till date...

the files have *.cue extensions..

but i dont know which application to use to open them or how to use the cue sheets..

so what i wanted to know is..

what exactly is a cue sheet ??how to use them. ?

how is it different than the normal track list?

does it display the name of the track being played corresponding to the total running time of the track or something ??

i am actually looking for something which automatically displays the name of the track..when the 2 hour episode is played ...

is cue sheet capable of doing this ?or any other way to this .. ??

and one final question..can the cue sheets be used with the ipod ??

also when i open the cue file in a normal text editor this i what it looks like...

PERFORMER "Armin van Buuren"

TITLE "[ASOT 001 (01-06-2001)]"

REM ** [url]www.fotolog.com/intrancewetrust[/url] ** 

FILE "Armin Van Buuren [ASOT 001 (01-06-2001)] - Part2.mp3" MP3

  TRACK 01 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "Drax & Scott Mac"

    TITLE "Sublime (Darkstar rmx)"

    INDEX 01 00:00:00

  TRACK 02 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "Orion"

    TITLE "See Me Here"

    INDEX 01 06:46:00

  TRACK 03 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "Praha pres Xian"

    TITLE "Pachinko Part Two"

    INDEX 01 13:28:00

  TRACK 04 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "Rising Star"

    TITLE "Clear Blue Moon"

    INDEX 01 19:00:00

  TRACK 05 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "Ralphie B"

    TITLE "Massive"

    INDEX 01 27:37:00

 TRACK 06 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "Members Of Mayday"

    TITLE "10 In 01 (Paul Van Dyk rmx)"

    INDEX 01 36:02:00

 TRACK 07 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "Rank 1"

    TITLE "Such Is Life"

    INDEX 01 42:19:00

 TRACK 08 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "S.O.L.I.S."

    TITLE "Dolphins (Classified Project rmx)"

    INDEX 01 48:39:00

 TRACK 09 AUDIO

    PERFORMER "Armin"

    TITLE "Blue Fear"

    INDEX 01 56:24:00

 

[Neotheone]

A cue sheet, or cue file, is a metadata file which describes how the tracks of a CD or DVD are laid out. Cue sheets are stored as plain text files and commonly have a ".cue" filename extension. CDRWIN first introduced cue sheets, which are now supported by many optical disc authoring applications and media players.

For an audio CD, a cue sheet specifies titles and performers for the disc and its tracks as well as the names of one or more audio files to be used. MP3, WAV and BIN files are often used, although some programs support other formats. Cue sheets are especially useful when burning or listening to live sets where all tracks are recorded in one file.

Cue sheets are also used for many types of CDs in conjunction with an image file. The image file generally has a ".bin" extension.

Source(Wikipedia) : Cue sheet (computing) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I guess you always have a bin file along with the cue which has all the data....you can mount either via daemon tools to have the disc in the virtual drive... ..but the cue and the bin should be in the same directory , I guess.

 

[blr_p]

so what i wanted to know is..
what exactly is a cue sheet ??how to use them. ?
how is it different than the normal track list?
does it display the name of the track being played corresponding to the total running time of the track or something ??

i am actually looking for something which automatically displays the name of the track..when the 2 hour episode is played ...
is cue sheet capable of doing this ?or any other way to this .. ??

and one final question..can the cue sheets be used with the ipod ??

lots of questions in there

A cue sheet typically is used for live music or dj mixes, when tracks segue into each other. Now for a long time, the only way to get a mix to be perfectly gapless was to use a cuesheet and rip an album as one big file. Because mp3 is not a gapless format, that means if you seperate the tracks of a mix you will hear small pops during track transitions.

If you rip as one big file, then it will play perfectly gapless and the cue sheet acts as a list of the track names and with an appropriate plugin will display track names when they come up. The result to the user is no different than using any other playlist. If you use winamp there is a cue plugin for it or with FB2K its supported natively with its own plugins. As mentinoed above cdrwin was the prog that brough the cue format into use, if used with cdrwin, you can make an audio-cd and the track markers will automatically be placed on the disc when written.

THe same idea applies with video episodes as well, tho i'm less experienced with cue+video.

The short answer to whether an iPod supports cue is NO.

Cos turtleneck for reasons best known to him decided to re-invent the wheel and come out with thier own version of gapless playing using iTunes. So you will have to copy the big file in its entirety and not have any track info whilst playing on the ipod. (assuming you don't have the source to re-rip from).

The rockbox ppl have not been much use in this area either, cue support has been on their reqs list since 2002 but to date has been ignored.

Bear in mind if you are using a more recent lame encoder it already has a hack to include gapless info so a cue sheet technically isnt required anymore all that is needed is that the player is sufficently upto date to make use of the gapless info stored in the mp3 file header. Rockbox, my sources tell me is gapless aware in this manner. The ipod with stock firmware is not, but with later versions of iTunes can be coaxed into doing so. Thing is then the mix has to be split into seperate tracks, YMMV.

To my knowledge there is not a single existing portable player that supports cue sheets and i think thats a great pity

so you get to decide whether u need to know which track is playing or whether, the playback, being gapless matters more, course if you have the source, then re-ripping with a more recent encoder, ie one with support for gapless headers, into seperate tracks will give you best of both worlds

Be advised that if you want to split the big file into individual tracks there are splitters that can do it using a cue sheet but you will lose gapless playback in this case as there is no way to insert gapless header info into the seperated tracks. Given the music you are listenig to is trance, this may not be a good option.

 

[FaH33m]

errr..no i only have the .cue files..in one folder..while the asot sets are in .mp3 format stored in another folder..also file names of both files ie-cue file and mp3 file is different...

any idea how to use it ?

 

[FaH33m]

so you get to decide whether u need to know which track is playing or whether, the playback, being gapless matters more, course if you have the source, then re-ripping with a more recent encoder into seperate tracks will give you best of both worlds

hey thanx for such a big and nice explanation..was quiet useful then what i found on wiki.:hap2:reps added.

err but i dint get what u mean exactly by gapless playback..and that i tunes gapless part also is a bit confusing..

anywayz ...keeping the i pod part aside..how do i use the cue sheet while playing music on my PC..is it possible to open them in foobar..cause i play the live sets using foobar..and dont use winamp..

also..coming ro the ripping the 200 mb live set into various tracks...

can u tell me how can i do that exactly ??

i mean is it possible that the software will automatically recognize where track one starts and where it ends..using the cue sheet...?

and then it will split the full live set into perfect 15-20 tracks or something ?

if thats possible it would be gr8..but again would be time consuming and create lots of problems specially with more than 50-60 live sets..

but still wont mind knowing the procedure..

 

[blr_p]

how do i use the cue sheet while playing music on my PC..is it possible to open them in foobar..cause i play the live sets using foobar..and dont use winamp..

- make sure cue file+mp3 are in the same folder.
- open cue sheet in a txt editor and make sure where it says FILE (should be in the first 5 lines) matches the filename of the mp3.

so FILE "Armin Van Buuren [ASOT 001 (01-06-2001)] - Part2.mp3"

the filename must be "Armin Van Buuren [ASOT 001 (01-06-2001)] - Part2.mp3"

- then just drag cue file into FB2k and enjoy.

also..coming ro the ripping the 200 mb live set into various tracks...
can u tell me how can i do that exactly ??
i mean is it possible that the software will automatically recognize where track one starts and where it ends..using the cue sheet...?

You can use cdrwin for this or even a recent version of nero, the track markers will automatically be placed..for a audio cd.

and then it will split the full live set into perfect 15-20 tracks or something ?
if thats possible it would be gr8..but again would be time consuming and create lots of problems specially with more than 50-60 live sets..
but still wont mind knowing the procedure..

For an audio cd, the max is what 74 mins, or you get 90min cd-r now right.

2hr mix unfortunately wont work for audio cd.

You can burn the mix as a file to the cd-r or dvd-r and then its the same way to playback from FB2K. I'd advise to check the above conditions mentioned above *BEFORE* writing to cd/dvd.

so when do you graduate from the Van buren stuff eh :tongue: , my bad, after all, you *are* acting your age.

 

[FaH33m]

so when do you graduate from the Van buren stuff eh :tongue: , my bad, after all, you *are* acting your age.

thanx for the info again...

for splitting the set into individual tracks..i found this..

How do I cut MP3 album using CUE sheet? | Split MP3, MP3 Cutter, Splitter

but i dont think i will split my collection into tracks..

and lolzz..what do you mean by

"graduate from the Van buren stuff eh :tongue: , my bad, after all, you *are* acting your age.":ashamed:



so according to you what should i listen to in order to graduate from AVB stuff ?

i dont know but from da day i first heard asot 18 months ago..i ve fell in love with some of the very good episodes..and this electronic uplifting and progressive trance music makes me feel good..and i can listen to it for long hours..

its not like i only listen to avb but a lot and lots of other trance artists .

and some non trance muzik too like hip hop English songs..and even LP..

i know ..most of da hardcore rock fans dont like LP but i really love da lyrics of old LP songs..and find them meaningful.

and if according to u graduating to better stuff means the metal rock kind off thing..like Iron maiden and all..

err i cant stand such rock for long hours a few tracks once in a while ..is ohk..

but some1 shouting in my ears ..and that too something i dont understand what he is trying to say ..is not my kind of music..

maybe u r right..lolzz its about age ..when i start my graduation course..i may...:bleh:

and yeah no offense meant to any of the rock fans ..in the above statements..

err we are going out of topic..:rofl:

 

[FaH33m]

also i found this posted by one of the members on pure trancers forum..

t would be great to find tracklists for my iPod that do the following:

I downloaded a podcast, I think is was David Guetta's Podcast... On the line that marks the point where you are in the set there were little stripes marking the switch of songs. With every new song, the name was displayed on top of the bar.

anyone has any idea about the above thing ?

 

[blr_p]

i was certainly not implying by graduating from avb, that you go into rock..

thats a totally dif genre, i meant graduating to better, in the same genre or related. But then ur profile says 18 so yeah, at this age i think thats what ppl do but not necessarily.

was just pulling your leg, there's loads better trance or even electronic artists out there. Start a thread on it and i think you will get lots of suggestions. Unfortunately i cant be of much help here as i got tranced out back in '99 after an Oakie overdose. Happens to all trancers, there's this point where you love it (first thing on, in the morning), then listen to so much where you snap and can't take it anymore. Other genres become more interesting.

also i found this posted by one of the members on pure trancers forum..

t would be great to find tracklists for my iPod that do the following:
anyone has any idea about the above thing ?

Unless they are using a cuesheet i'm at a loss to understand what's being said here, can you post a link to the thread.

Otherwise you have to find the transitions yourself and make your own cuesheet given the playlist.

 

[FaH33m]

i was certainly not implying by graduating from avb, that you go into rock..

thats a totally dif genre, i meant graduating to better, in the same genre or related. But then ur profile says 18 so yeah, at this age i think thats what ppl do but not necessarily.

was just pulling your leg, there's loads better trance or even electronic artists out there. Start a thread on it and i think you will get lots of suggestions. Unfortunately i cant be of much help here as i got tranced out back in '99 after an Oakie overdose. Happens to all trancers, there's this point where you love it (first thing on, in the morning), then listen to so much where you snap and can't take it anymore. Other genres become more interesting.

Unless they are using a cuesheet i'm at a loss to understand what's being said here, can you post a link to the thread.

hmmm i see..and i agree with you..once in a while even i get bored of trance..and i listen to other stuff.

and i already told you that i just dont listen to armin stuff...

there are lots of other better artists i listen to..like

sean tyas ,PVD,above and beyond,markus schulz,ferry corsten,kyau vs albert,John O Callaghan ,cosmic gates ,stoneface etc..

by da way what kinda muzik do u listen to ..after getting tranced out ?

and yeah coming back to the topic..

this is the link to the thread

PureTrancers.com • View topic - Inserting Cue sheets for your ipod

see the 4th post in that thread.

even i didnt get what dat guys talkin about.

http://www.puretrancers.com/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=22239

 

[blr_p]

I think the podcast had a cue file embedded into it and when used with a cue capable player it automatically displayed the track info. You can do that with your file+cue as well..but i prefer to keep them seperate for compatibility reasons. Some players might complain about it or not work properly.

But that will only work on the desktop, no way to get it to work on a portable and least of all the ipod. There you have to split the files and only if ur player has upto date firmware, use itunes to generate the gapless info so that the ipod can play it gapless.

This means if you have big file +cue then you can only put the big file on and thats it.

you can experiment with splitting and then seeing how well itunes can stitch it up but it will be hit or miss, works sometimes like during a quiet transition and not so well if its louder at the track boundaries. Ideally if you have the source as lossless or even the cd, if you rip into sep tracks with lame 3.97 then it will have the gapless info and should work with rockbox.

Where did i go after trance ?

..prog house, think digweed, then that sound got stale by '02, then tech-house came to the rescue, mostly germany's plastic city think timewriter & terry lee borwn, worked till '05. Then god awful electro-house happened and i quit the dance scene at that point and went into more loungey stuff + lo-fi, ie slower BPMs. And turned the clock even further backward and got into soul, funk & jazz. I still listen to the older mixes from time to time but no where as often as before.

its kinda sad in a way cos nothing hits the spot as much as those prog sets did back in the day, high intensity stuff, like crack, ages very quick tho cept for a rare few exceptions, got to constantly look for new fixes, and then you get tired of it.

i posted bout this some time back in the listening electronica thread

 

[FaH33m]

you can experiment with splitting and then seeing how well itunes can stitch it up but it will be hit or miss, works sometimes like during a quiet transition and not so well if its louder at the track boundaries. Ideally if you have the source as lossless or even the cd, if you rip into sep tracks with lame 3.97 then it will have the gapless info and should work with rockbox.

err there's no rockbox for ipod nano. 3rd gen.

anywayz i found a solution to my problem in this small piece of software called cue splitter. will be useful for some1 who is in a similar problem ..and wants to have the name of the tracks in the live sets being played on the pod.

cue splitter is a free ware and can be downloaded from here.

Medieval Software - Medieval CUE Splitter

using this i just split the big mp3 file to individual tracks with the help of the cuesheet..

also note that

1)it hardly takes few seconds ..to split the live set(no changes in original file)...

2)there is no re encoding and therefore no loss in quality was noticed and the total file size remained exactly same..

3)and all the new tracks get renamed automatically to their original track names.(from the cuesheet)

next thing i transfered the 24 tracks to the i pod .while transferring there is a option in i tunes ..

select all the tracks and then click on info >> select the option part of gapless album

voila thats it..now when the 24 tracks are played continuously ..there is no transition/gap between the tracks..and it runs perfectly as the original single live set did..

in fact i cant notice any difference at all ...the stitching done by itunes/ipod is perfect ...

and the best thing i can get to see the name \artist of the track being played and can also delete a single or multiple tracks from a live set which i dont like..

first i had decided not to split the livesets with the fear of quality loss and time consuming work..but now i guess i can easily do the job..

cue splitter came to the rescue..

thanx everyone for the help hyeah:

 

[blr_p]

There is no quality loss no, but i think you might want to try this split method for some time to really have a better idea how well it works. You won't need to strain too hard either, it will be obvious, a beat skipped here or there. You choose whether this glitch is a problem or not.

A sample of just one, is rarely enough

having said that i have not read too much literature about how exactly Apple accomplishes this 'stiching'

 

[FaH33m]

hmmm...yeah till now ive done it with only one of the live set..
hmm maybe if after splitting 5-7 livesets..i find problems ...then i will have to revert back to originalz..
will report back ..after ive tried it..

by da way for the first one which i did ..there is no glitch or skipping of beats at the end\start of the tracks ...i mean it was really flawless as if i am playing the complete set of 2 hours
..hope it is the same for other files too..

having said that i have not read too much literature about how exactly Apple accomplishes this 'stiching'

now u said that sarcastically right ??..
lolzz i am a tube light and at times take time to understand what people say:ashamed:

 

[blr_p]

No sarcasm intended, i've heard good reports of Apple's 'stiching' but the technical details (when i looked) were scant. Given that you listen to mix music on a regular basis, i trust you will be able to spot what i said, you get into a groove with the beats and a skip suddenly hits you.

In any case always keep the orginal ie unsplit file.

by stiching i mean, how apple manages to output a gapless stream from 2 tracks, when you split the files as you did there is no gapless header info so they are doing some magic here, which makes me suspect it will work often but not always. If Apple was doing the splitting then it has prior info to how the files were constructed but this is not the case here.
If your tool allows, always split on a frame boundary as that would theoretically be the cleanest cut.

The acid test to know whether the merge is indeed perfect (if you want something more objective) is to record as a wav, the output of the merged files from your ipod and compare with the orginal wav of the big file.

There should be no difference

 

[blr_p]

The rockbox ppl have not been much use in this area either, cue support has been on their reqs list since 2002 but to date has been ignored.

I just noticed that rockbox has supported CUE files for over a yr now !! :ashamed:

If you own a supported player would be interesting to hear feedback

 

[Anish]

by stiching i mean, how apple manages to output a gapless stream from 2 tracks, when you split the files as you did there is no gapless header info so they are doing some magic here, which makes me suspect it will work often but not always. If Apple was doing the splitting then it has prior info to how the files were constructed but this is not the case here.

The s/w is probably reading off the track waveform. The part with a signal lower than -40dB (Or whatever threshold they've set) will be automatically chopped off.