PC Peripherals Where the Problem is now? in PSU or ...

Emperor

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Friends After more than 1 years I again get the PC shut down problem while Switch Off the Fan.

When PC is ON at that time if I switch FAN off, the Fan Switch make sound like Sparkling Inside the box, but when PC is Off but FAN is on and while Switching the fan off I didn't hear any Sparking Sound inside the Box.

All wiring/switch are just 1 year old (I use Anchor Fireproof wires and Fan Regulator. Just today I change all Switches in Board Today and the New one is from Anchor)

Is PSU going to Kaput and Signaling me to get replaced it?

My System is:

P IV, 2.4 processor Pentium,
Sony DVD RW DRU 800, Floppy Drive, 80 GB Samsung HDD, 512+128 mb RAM.
Samsung 793s monitor, Logitech Keyboard, MS Basic Optical Mouse.

If PSU is problem which one will you suggest, I use my PC for Office work, average 12-15 hrs a day.

Any other suggestion for solution or I need to replace PSU?

Thanks:)
 
I think U should state which PSU your comp has at present !! If it is a no name PSU which came bundled with Rs. 1000 cabinet, then it should have been changed long time ago.
 
vijayshimla said:
I think U should state which PSU your comp has at present !! If it is a no name PSU which came bundled with Rs. 1000 cabinet, then it should have been changed long time ago.
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It's Xtech Model - LWT 2505 for P4-350W-A 2.03. It's Iball Cabinet and it cost me 2.5k
 
Hey ur Pc 's config is basic one but ur usage is for long hrs i'll sugegst u to go for the good one's. but not more then 450W. like cooler master (380/430), power safe (380/450).

It'll really help u out.
 
Dear Guru/Expert and Techie Friends,

All Switches Makes Sparking Sound with Spark - Just seen spark with sound while Switching FAN ON.
I was out for 3 hrs so meanwhile PC is shutdown. I return to home and as soon as I start it and just after 30 seconds I Turn FAN On , I hear and see sparkle with sound in FAN Switch and PC get Restarted Automatically Flashing following Message/Warning.
"The CPU was previously shutdown due to thermal event (overheating). Service the unit right now to resolve this"
But as I said earlier PC was Shutdown for 3 hours than how as soon as I start it and CPU get so much heat that it restart the PC?
I have same issue with OLD PC with same configuration (just mother board was changed- previously I had D845GBVSR - it's capacitors get Leaked - as this make of MOBO was porn to such problem as per Intel Website)

Do the Problem Really with PSU or anything Else.

I got 1475-1550 Quote for Powersafe 400 PSU with Golden Color

and Rs.1100/- for PowerSafe 400 PSU with Silver color, but the lady who attend the phone agree that Gold have better options than Silver.

I am neither know silver psu nor about gold, so please suggest which one to go if you all thinks problem with PSU.
Please help me.
 
Crazy_Eddy said:
Have you tried turning on the Fan first and then turning on the PC?
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Problem occurs randomly.

If I first start the fan than there is no spark in switches. Even if PC is Shut Off and at that time I start FAN no spark.

But as soon as I Turning ON the PC, with each ON strike on Switches, over all electricity acquired by PC. As Tube light in my Room get little dim for second and OK as soon as PC completely starts.

So I think PC requires more Voltage and PSU not capable to handle this and all problem occurs.

Other switches on another boards in my house is OK only have problem with PC Board Switches?

What should I do now?
 
In that case it doesnt look like there's anything wrong with your PSU. Rather with the electrical system at your place - its not able to supply enough juice for both your PC and your fan. Does this happen at all sockets in your house?

If your PSU isnt able to handle the PC's load, then your system will BSOD/ hang or your PSU will burn-out. Since the voltage is evidently dipping for other devices in your room (your tubelight), its evident that your PSU is passing on the load properly to your electrical socket - its your electrical system unable to take up the load. The 1 sec dip in voltage when your power-on your PC is *normal* with any PC during startup : there's a huge amount of 'inrush current' at boot, which is why power draw at bootup is maximum for any PC.

Why the electrical system isnt able to handle the load, i'm not too sure.. though you could check if your cabling is capable of handling the needed current draw (which is why i suggested trying anothe room's socket).
 
^^ Thats' what I thought too. Apparently the whole story is not being told.

The electrical system has been worked on and fixed, and the system worked perfectly for about 13 months, then it abruptly shut down, and has never been the same since. Plus he's had to already replace one motherboard. I would point at least one finger at the PSU, and maybe another at this little electrical 'trick' that he's done.

Stick - I PM'ed you my answer y'day. Would suggest you be a little more descriptive about the issue on the thread as well, at least as much as you put in the PMs - a bit of history, and a bit about that board you got made for the PC. Maybe you would get a few more helpful replies.

It's normal for the lights to dip very briefly at the point when you switch on a PSU, or any heavy load. VERY briefly, less than half a second. I had suggested you cart your PC over to someone's place and check it - do you want to do that to see if there is an issue with it?
 
Actually the problem arise 2 yrs before with my OLD SYSTEM when it was just 7 days old.

At that time I notice one thing that till I used Metal Spike Guard PC never Shutdown due to Any Switch ON on any Board in my House. But the day it get rusted and give sparking sound (after 5 years) I replace it with plastic body Spike and noticed THE Shut OFF Problem.

I called to my Friend who is in BSES doing Fault Solution Work. He said Wiring get old and need to replace.

He use Anchor Fire Proof wires (18 gaze) and fittings, even switches used is from Anchor with ISI marks.

Still Problem not solved, mean while Friend get transfer to other City.

I hire another Certified Electrician (who doing Industrial wiring with big industries), he said use another sperate board for PC connections I do same and Problem solved for Just 30 days.

Meanwhile old MOBO capacitors get leaked and after replacement from Intel I sold it out and Buy New One.

This New PC never give me problem in last 13 months but from January 22-23/07 it shutoff Randomly Twice.

I went to dealer with System, he inspect all and said that MOBO and CPU is perfect and said due to sudden Power OFF (in Dec-06 major cabling work undertaken by Reliance in my Building at that time 3 time sudden power off noticed) may be PSU get damage or didn't pass .... he use some technical word I can't remember.

While switching any Button (switch) from Separate Box, which I get installed only for PC connection, I hear sparking sound with spark too.

Even when I start PC tubelights get dim for second but after PC starts all get Normal.

As you said to check PC with Friends house, I did with old one and even at his house old pc get same problem. But old PC Shutdown on each and every strike of any Switches but Existing PC didn't so much sensitive as my discussion with you all in last 7 days I only notice for Twice (it restarts as soon as I ON/OFF the FAN- fan switch exist on same board where other Switches for PC is.)
 
What about using a CVT (Constant Voltage Transformer) in such problem situations ? I do not understand these things fully but an elctric engineer friend mentioned to me that a CVT isolates the computer from the incoming line by feeding it clean voltages (like an Online UPS ? ) and should be capable of rectifying this problem. Downside to CVTs is the cost ... I think they are a little costly compared to Stabilizers. I know they used to be sold by a company named Elent.

From what I understood about CVTs .....a CVT is to a Servo Stabilizer like what an Online UPS is to a Line Interactive UPS.

Just my 2 paisa info....
 
Chaos said:
Did you try the machine in another plug point in the house in another room? Worst case, just get a cheap 2000 rupee ups.
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Yes I did it year ago, as I have my first PC connection with Overall Connection Board in House i.e. all Switches was from one board only, I used Extension board for PC at that time.

When first time Problem Struck, after six month I call electrician and get Sperate Board Only for PC connections, thinking that PC requires more voltage and so makes problem due to all connection in One Board.

Did you say UPS or want to say PSU :- just to confirm
 
Well I would say try to clean the heatsink/fan assembly, reapply some thermal paste on the CPU, check all the connections inside the cabinet and make sure you have a enough air flow.

Also it would be wise to check with a different PSU.

And make sure you have a decent UPS. When I try to power on my computer, the UPS goes crazy and the lights flicker like hell. After a while everything comes back to normal, the building where I stay is pretty old, so I know the wiring is in a mess. But the APC UPS does the job.:eek:hyeah:
 
Shakensoul said:
Well I would say try to clean the heatsink/fan assembly, reapply some thermal paste on the CPU, check all the connections inside the cabinet and make sure you have a enough air flow.
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Already did it, even open PSU and clean it like NEW. About thermal paste really don't know from where to get it? and at what price?

Shakensoul said:
Also it would be wise to check with a different PSU.
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Have to buy New to check with old one, as my friend give me 2 PSU lying with him but both are DEAD.

Shakensoul said:
And make sure you have a decent UPS. When I try to power on my computer, the UPS goes crazy and the lights flicker like hell. After a while everything comes back to normal, the building where I stay is pretty old, so I know the wiring is in a mess. But the APC UPS does the job.:eek:hyeah:
Click to expand...

Tubelights in House didn't flicker, it get dim little just for second.

Still you suggest me to use UPS. Did it really help to get problem solved?

OK by using UPS may be dimming of Light can controlled but what about the SPARK with Switches. One of my Electrician Friend said "Sparking is there with each and every Switches - but we didn't every time get noticed for same" he further said "In many hospitals wiring I used to put 35-50 Switches on One Main Board but never get such complaint from them as they to have PC connection in same board"

UPS consumes EXTRA Power? Is it right?

Here I give you some more specs about temperature (used PC for 60 minutes before this Snap) using Intel Active Monitor:- (Please see Attachment)
 
This is gonna be a long one.

"Spark is always there with each and every switch" is absolutely correct. Whenever you make current flow into anything, the natural reaction is to oppose the flow of electricity. After some time, once the device getting power has reached operating level, the current flow is normal and the system operates in spec. The problem with the switch is that it's only a contact, and the contact reacts to the flow with a pretty violent reaction - and this is manifested as a spark.

Sometimes the spark may be caused by a loose mechanical connection between a wire and a contact, or a defective or misaligned switch. In normal current draw it may not be very noticeable, but once the current draw increases, the switch system may start sparking.

Sometimes the spark is visible, sometimes not. But it's always there, and it always generates an EMI field (EMI = Electro-Magnetic Interference. Google is your friend). This EMI field is sometimes heard as a sound on a playing radio or music system, and sometimes visible on televisions.

Thumb rule is that if you can see the spark and/or hear it, please get it checked. It just takes one spark to start a fire.

Sparking also creates havoc in low-quality computer PSUs that don't have an input EMI filter (99% don't) and/or improper primary and secondary filtering and reservoir capacitors. The system cannot cope with the high level of interference, and will either have its regulation wrecked for an instant, or simply shut down. The spark does not need to be generated on the computer switch, it can be generated anywhere.

The idea is to ensure that the PSU gets as clean a supply as possible, which can be achieved in a number of ways, some of which the other posters on this thread have pointed you to - CVT, UPS, etc. Alternatively or additionally, to replace the PSU with a higher quality unit that offers a little more safety for the internal circuits.

Now here's the second part.

You have indicated earlier that the sparking only happens if the fan is switched while the PC is on. Is that correct?

If so, that 'separate board' must go. It is probably wired incorrectly (either a neutral/earth reverse or unearthed) and in an unsafe condition. Would definitely advise you run the PC off a line that can actually take the load. Change your electrician if you have to, because this is a life and death matter. Treat electricity with respect.

On the issue of Gold Vs. Silver power supplies. I have opened both and yes, the gold one does have more Molexes, a 24-pin native connector, a second 80 mm fan. But the silver one is definitely better built, heavier, and has good quality components. This is probably the first time I am seeing a supply of this quality at that price (I paid a little more for it though, got it for 1300). Both have active PFC and input filtering. The only porblem with the silver one is that if you have a 24-pin mobo, this supply comes with an adaptor to convert the 20-pin connector to 24-pin. It's a hack. Since the application was for a b**ch rig with a 20-pin connector, I didn't really care. So that's what I bought...

I hope you now have enough suggestions and information to make a decision. All the best, and let us know how it turns out.
 
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