Car & Bike best sedan car to buy

thomasjude47 said:
ours is a 1.4 NA and its mileage is 13.9 overall till date with 75% AC ,as per MID.ODO-5700kms

Tjet should deliver around +1-1.5 kmpl over 1.4NA

9.5kmpl in city for a petrol sedan isnt bad IMO..
That's not possible. Even on the optimistic figures by any auto show/magazine, it doesn't put linea's mileage above 11. Plus the other owners I talked to confirm that. 13.5 is a highway figure for sure unless you have a diesel (Which gives around 13-14 in city).

9.5 is pathetic for a mid size sedan. I mean even the civic gives 11 in city. Honda City, Maruti SX4 and VW Vento give better mileage.
 
mjumrani said:
That's not possible. Even on the optimistic figures by any auto show/magazine, it doesn't put linea's mileage above 11. Plus the other owners I talked to confirm that. 13.5 is a highway figure for sure unless you have a diesel (Which gives around 13-14 in city).

9.5 is pathetic for a mid size sedan. I mean even the civic gives 11 in city. Honda City, Maruti SX4 and VW Vento give better mileage.

a lot depends on the way of driving.. so saying "that's not possible", doesn't prove he is saying wrong.. my merc c220 CDI gives me an average of 20kmpl .. now is this too not possible??
 
mjumrani said:
That's not possible. Even on the optimistic figures by any auto show/magazine, it doesn't put linea's mileage above 11. Plus the other owners I talked to confirm that. 13.5 is a highway figure for sure unless you have a diesel (Which gives around 13-14 in city).

9.5 is pathetic for a mid size sedan. I mean even the civic gives 11 in city. Honda City, Maruti SX4 and VW Vento give better mileage.
A difference of 1-2 units in mileage equates to just about under 20k per year, if you do about 15k kms a year (which is high enough running for a petrol car). In a matter of 5-7 yrs ownership of the car, the difference will be a figure about 1.5 Lakhs even if you consider the increasing prices of petrol etc. I really don't think it's a significant amount to be considered as a deal breaker when a person is buying a car for 10-12 lakhs.

I do believe comparing mileage point to point for choosing a car just makes you feel good psychologically rather than giving any real economic benefit. Besides just going by the mileage, it's important to also look at the other aspects of the car. What I mean here is, we all know Honda engines are fuel efficient than most others. Just that one gets 1-2 km/ltr more on the Honda City, that one decides to buy the City against the Linea, Vento etc. is not very wise IMO, because you get similar features in other cars for less price. So the extra price you're paying automatically negates the money you're saving for fuel.

To put the things into perspective, we get a Linea MJD Emotion Pack for almost the same price as Honda City, as well as Vento Diesel Highline for a little more, where the Linea & Vento here will give more mileage than the City and they run on Diesel, so even less fuel costs. Since you own the Linea already, I don't need to tell you what a hell of a car it is.
 
kauzy said:
my merc c220 CDI gives me an average of 20kmpl .. now is this too not possible??
That is definitely NOT possible coming from you and that little garage of yours! Did you mistake it with the mileage of your Matiz? :p
 
I wouldn't know how a diesel is supposed to respond. I was just talking about the cars I own.

I'd rephrase to say that "the mileage of 13.5kpl on a fiat linea petrol seems hard to achieve and even harder to maintain in a realistic/practical environment on a day-to-day basis" Kudos to the owner who did.

--- Updated Post - Automerged ---

arun687 said:
To put the things into perspective, we get a Linea MJD Emotion Pack for almost the same price as Honda City, as well as Vento Diesel Highline for a little more, where the Linea & Vento here will give more mileage than the City and they run on Diesel, so even less fuel costs. Since you own the Linea already, I don't need to tell you what a hell of a car it is.
I would say I love my City because it can give me the speed when I need it. Seats are great so is the low stance. I love my Linea for the things I did not mention for City. If you get TJet, city does not have much going for it. But if I had a choice I would still buy City, don't know why.

The looks of both are subjective. City is aggressive. Linea has more of a classic look.
 
Diesel is more fuel efficient than the petrol counterparts. This is what i have myself observed and known to many.
From what i know from reading more diesel sedans are sold in europe than petrol inspite of diesel being expensive than petrol in europe.
Regarding the 20kmpl claim i think it might be true since i have always seen mercs been driven responsibly in the city not so on the highways though.
 
Yeah i know that even the laurazz :p skoda laura does clock 20km to a litre on a highway. The sx4 diesel has an arai figure of 21.4kmpl and the altis gives about 24. That is the beauty of new gen diesels. :)
 
^ Wish my Cruze would give me that much mileage. It gives me 12 in the city with the AC on. No regrets however. I was well aware of these figures before I bought the car! The engine is a beast!
 
ggt said:
Yeah i know that even the laurazz :p skoda laura does clock 20km to a litre on a highway. The sx4 diesel has an arai figure of 21.4kmpl and the altis gives about 24. That is the beauty of new gen diesels. :)

Not to forget the earth shattering 87 bhp which altis produces.
 
I bought the T-jet.

Once you're behind the wheel you pretty much forget the mileage.

Which, by the way, is not too bad given the size, weight and sheer fun the car is. I got 11.5 in Delhi with the ACC set to 24 degrees, the car has just 400ks on the odo so I see no reason to disbelieve the claimed figures of 13-14 which the car should give. I have already clocked it at 14 on the highway at 90km/h in 4th gear or 120 in 5th, the second is probably not something you can actually achieve on a regular basis but nevertheless the car delivers much better than the Opel I used to drive. In the much shorter 3km run between home and work in Gurgaon, I struggle to break 9. The trundle in 2nd and 3rd gear doesn't help matters. However, the kit list is extremely long and it's a hoot to drive, after a cross-city run of Delhi traffic I didn't feel tired at all.

I had the Vento as the only other alternative as I didn't like the City (too light and a vague steering and ride). The SX4 was impressive but the blind spots were very disconcerting, plus I didn't want to pay so much for a Suzuki. The Fiesta was too long in the tooth, but an excellent car to drive and not very fussy to maintain. The Vento diesel offered the right mix of pretty much everything but it had a 4-month wait, and the EPS was a big question mark for me. If you do not have a problem waiting and like the looks of the car (cars are one category where the cosmetics play a very big part even for me), this is your bet.

The Sunny is something you might want to wait for or the new Fiesta. If you're already at 12 the Cruz may be a possibility if you're willing to stretch - I couldn't so I had to settle for the T-Jet, and I don't mind the decision at all. Then there's a used Civic or Accord, both of which will be bigger and nicer cars.

If mileage is what you're chasing, then nothing but a diesel will do. Remember that typically (Fiat's T-Jet being an exception) diesels are always more expensive than the petrol and do cost a bit more to run, so unless you are clocking lots of kilometers petrol is a better bet. Variant to variant the difference is in the range of 60-90K, plus an additional 10K for maintenance over a 4-year car life. So for the 100K difference, you would need to have run many more ks on the diesel car.

Also remember that with very few exceptions (the Vento TDI and the Cruz notably) diesel cars are dogs on the highway. They run out of breath very quickly and the nice torquey city drive is replaced with panting for breath. In the end it all depends on what you really want out of the car. If you want a barnstormer the only two options are the Vento TDI and the T-Jet (or the Cruz, if you stretch). If you want a relaxed cruiser used mostly in the city for 4-5 people and the occasional weekend jaunt, pretty much any car mentioned here will work so just pick one in your favorite colour. Nowadays cars are fairly well-built, so you should be able to get through 3-4 years without any major expense.

Remember that for Fiat the problem is the after-sales-service. They have tried improving this and personally I have yet to face a problem with the service itself but the fact that I had to resort to using it within an hour of owning the car is a telling sign.
 
+1 Cranky, I think too that the Tjet is a sweet option these days :) Fiat are doing very well here... After all, they own Ferrari, don't they? :D
 
cranky said:
Also remember that with very few exceptions (the Vento TDI and the Cruz notably) diesel cars are dogs on the highway. They run out of breath very quickly and the nice torquey city drive is replaced with panting for breath.

What do you mean by this?
they run slower after sometime.

just trying to understand characteristics of Diesel car.
 
torque is pulling power and diesels are good at that no wonder you have heavy trucks with diesel engines but to race on a highway the petrols do it better ;)
 
cravikum said:
torque is pulling power and diesels are good at that no wonder you have heavy trucks with diesel engines but to race on a highway the petrols do it better ;)

they will do good on flat straight roads but in ghats and hilly terrain you will see the diesel glide through.
 
^^Depends totally on driving style. I averaged about 100km/h in ghat sections around Mumbai, using a tiny little Opel Corsa. On flats it was closer to 120. This is not top speed, but door-to-door average with very early starts.

Diesel starts struggling very quickly at higher altitudes due to the higher freezing point of the fuel. It thickens and the engine efficiency drops off rapidly. Which is why almost all diesels have a preheater to warm up the fuel in cold conditions when required. Petrols grow asthmatic due to the thinner air, but modern ECUs compensate for this quite efficiently. I've never experienced a loss of power significant enough to require a change in driving style.

Diesel scores very high on moving high amounts of load at low rpm (which is a measure of torque). Overall a diesel engine is much easier to tailor for low-end grunt, whereas a top-end screamer is easier to do with petrol due to the higher power index of the fuel itself.

OTOH there are notable exceptions. The Alto is a dog of a petrol engine, and for a long time the fastest racer in the Le Mans 24H was a 'diesel' - the Audio R10 TDI.

In general however, as the revs climb petrols earn their living much better, the wider power band helps a lot in most driving situations. Diesels are a one-trick pony, the trick is a fantastic one but nonetheless they're generally a little more limited due to the heavier fuel (takes more effort to burn it).
 
^And so was the JCB Dieselmax - for a brief period of time, this streamliner held the record for the fastest piston-driven land-driven vehicle. :D
 
Also, most of the diesels are turbo charged whereas their petrol counterparts are NA. I really wish we see more turbo charged petrols. See with the Linea T-jet, the turbo gives it a massive 207 NM of torque for just a 1.4 L petrol engine.
 
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