Apple secures 50% of TSMC 5nm production

The CPUs & GPUs that are short in supply are all 7nm chips. I still don't get why its Apple's fault.
look at the pie chart

most of nvidia and amd would like to advance the node to 5 nm , but wont be able to pull of the market demand , look at the current order share , if we are facing issues with this share hat will happen when apple has 50 % of it

more scarcity / new procs would be stuck on 7nm and apple could pull out some thing like m1 and say more efficient fastest etc
 
Apple sold 218 million iphone 11s in 2018. If you extrapolate that data to GPUs you're looking at around 6.5 million GPUs. That isn't a small number.
 
If nvidia and AMD were slacking and Apple (or someone else) pulled ahead then who does the problem lie with?

This may not necessarily be the perfect analogy but how is it different from say I complaining at the year end as to why I did not get the promotions and good increments instead of the one who actually delivered through the year?
 
Don't forget Intel... it seems they are also going to capture tsmc advanced node capacity.

I guess tsmc is well within their rights to cater to whoever has the deeper pockets.
 
If nvidia and AMD were slacking and Apple (or someone else) pulled ahead then who does the problem lie with?

This may not necessarily be the perfect analogy but how is it different from say I complaining at the year end as to why I did not get the promotions and good increments instead of the one who actually delivered through the year?
Did you even read the article ,the allocation was done on the basis of bidding , they out bid them . Grey area of financial fair play
Don't forget Intel... it seems they are also going to capture tsmc advanced node capacity.

I guess tsmc is well within their rights to cater to whoever has the deeper pockets.
true but than ... bad for the whole world , i hope that intel fixing 7nm is true , even if they have fixed it they would not relinquish that slot ,just to make sure that amd wont be able to outsell them.
 
Did you even read the article ,the allocation was done on the basis of bidding , they out bid them . Grey area of financial fair play

true but than ... bad for the whole world , i hope that intel fixing 7nm is true , even if they have fixed it they would not relinquish that slot ,just to make sure that amd wont be able to outsell them.
I did - although I am not sure why I even needed to.
X was outbid by Y. X wins. Fact of life in practically every sphere.

How is that a gray area? You (or I)) do the same when putting up an item for sale on the TE forums as a simple example - Don't you?
 
I did - although I am not sure why I even needed to.
X was outbid by Y. X wins. Fact of life in practically every sphere.

How is that a gray area? You (or I)) do the same when putting up an item for sale on the TE forums as a simple example - Don't you?
deep pockets would kill the small players

Classic example would be jio free services , than fair pricing and when the competition is done and dusted increase the price

Flipkart and amazon killing off snapdeal (shady sellers over there though)

NVidias arm deal is the most interesting it is under regulators scanner thank god
 
deep pockets would kill the small players

Classic example would be jio free services , than fair pricing and when the competition is done and dusted increase the price

Flipkart and amazon killing off snapdeal (shady sellers over there though)

NVidias arm deal is the most interesting it is under regulators scanner thank god
nvidia/ Intel are small?

Anyway, bigger fish eating small is a fact of life (and in business)

Is it fair ? I don't know.. Neither is wealth disparity fair I suppose.
What I do know is that complaining about this is just rhetoric.
 
We need to start looking at PC components and their inputs for what they truely are at the end of the day. They are Commodities.

As is the case with any commodity, price will be determined by demand and supply. There will always be ups and downs in the price year on year.

In the case of semiconductors, there is more than enough capacity if you look at higher node sizes. The problem is there isn’t enough at 7nm/5nm and lower. No one wants to really use the higher node sizes as their products wouldn’t be competitive. Yet, a lot are forced to as a result of the shortages. Supply is allocated to whoever is willing to buy the highest quantity at the the highest price. Isn’t that how the world works?

As others point out, I fail to understand how Apple is to be blamed for its technological and cost leadership in this instance.

Also the decision is TSMC’s, not Apple’s . They can sell to whomever at whatever price. They can drop Apple and become a supplier to startups and smaller companies if they choose to. However I suspect this will never happen, nor should it.

But ain’t nobody blaming the TSMC’s & Samsung’s of the world - so why blame apple?
 
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Apple has been innovating in the processor (SoC) space for a long time now. That's was pretty much evident with their M1 Macs.

If we want the industry to move forward, we have to support what Apple has been doing.

Also, Apple & AMD has been TSMC's major client for some years now.
 
Apple has been innovating in the processor (SoC) space for a long time now. That's was pretty much evident with their M1 Macs.

If we want the industry to move forward, we have to support what Apple has been doing.

Also, Apple & AMD has been TSMC's major client for some years now.
Well to be fair. A LOT of Apples M1 magic comes from its Node which is ultimately at the plight of TSMC. I genuinely believe intel could do wonders on TSMC 5nm. But I don't think they'll decouple the fabs from their chips and TSMC has publicly stated they don't want to work with short term clients(read: intel). But we should be getting intel 7nm this year. I am really hoping for some good competition.

We should support whoever gives us the best product for the lowest price. (In the case of H/W - Price/performance - A category Apple is surprisingly amongst the leaders in - who would've thought?). But I'm really hoping this isn't the case for long. If despite the Apple Tax, the M1 Macs are performing so well, it is quite evident that there is sufficient margin for other players to be able to create some kick-ass products at affordable prices if given access to the fabs at prices similar to what apple must be paying. This will eventually happen as supply starts ramping up. But by then Apple will be chilling on TSMC 3nm and we will be having this discussion again =P. Apple will probably have Node Superiority until TSMC does. Which they should retain for the next 5, maybe even 10 years with ease. I believe you can't really go lower than 1nm which we may get to by 2030. Only competition is Samsung & maybe Intel if they pull off something spectacular on their 3 & 1.5nm gens which will anyways be years behind TSMC & Samsung.

CPU's likely need to be reimagined within this decade - Will most likely involve getting off semiconductors altogether.
 
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1. AMD & NVIDIA are already not able to pull off the market demand of their current products. They first need to put their current 7nm supply chain lineup in order. 5nm can wait. Despite the demand for Apple products, especially when early iPhones launched in 2008, Apple has been able to maintain inventory and prevent large-scale scalping. While in 2020-21, Intel, AMD & even Sony heavily mismanaged their ordering systems, could not prevent scalpers and bots and still cannot manage their supply chain and prevent authorised sellers from selling products at heavily jacked up prices.
2. AMD & Intel make very specific products (CPUs & GPUs). Intel has its own fabrication facilities but all these companies took their market share for granted and did not innovate their facilities to support 5nm production. Intel was selling the same CPUs with new names for the past 3-4 years, drunk on its market share. Apple makes a wide range of consumer products supplied by various OEMs including TSMC, Intel & AMD. They cannot (and should not) be investing in their own chip manufacturing facilities so it makes sense for them to be bidding competitively.
3. Apple makes great products and an ecosystem, for which there is no competition. People are ready to buy its products at the price they sell it for. Its pure business and there is nothing wrong with it.
 
so we have to hate apple because others like intel are idiots and cant forecast their supply into future?

Apple invested in TSMC heavily and hence their first dibs on latest nodes. FYI they also booked out entire 3n capacity of tsmc til 2023.

silicon wafers work like commodity futures in the stock market and the fabs buy those futures based on the order commitments from their clients.

Initially AMD was hoping to make global foundries make their chips for the zen architecture and also invested alongside saudis. but global foundries didn’t deliver so they moved to tsmc.

well, intel is being intel so no need to discuss their next nodes.
 
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Well to be fair. A LOT of Apples M1 magic comes from its Node which is ultimately at the plight of TSMC. I genuinely believe intel could do wonders on TSMC 5nm. But I don't think they'll decouple the fabs from their chips and TSMC has publicly stated they don't want to work with short term clients(read: intel). But we should be getting intel 7nm this year. I am really hoping for some good competition.

We should support whoever gives us the best product for the lowest price. (In the case of H/W - Price/performance - A category Apple is surprisingly amongst the leaders in - who would've thought?). But I'm really hoping this isn't the case for long. If despite the Apple Tax, the M1 Macs are performing so well, it is quite evident that there is sufficient margin for other players to be able to create some kick-ass products at affordable prices if given access to the fabs at prices similar to what apple must be paying. This will eventually happen as supply starts ramping up. But by then Apple will be chilling on TSMC 3nm and we will be having this discussion again =P. Apple will probably have Node Superiority until TSMC does. Which they should retain for the next 5, maybe even 10 years with ease. I believe you can't really go lower than 1nm which we may get to by 2030. Only competition is Samsung & maybe Intel if they pull off something spectacular on their 3 & 1.5nm gens which will anyways be years behind TSMC & Samsung.

CPU's likely need to be reimagined within this decade - Will most likely involve getting off semiconductors altogether.
Correct, CPUs need to be reimagined...Current, foundary issues aside, which have even crippled the automakers manufacturing capacity. Who would have thought years ago that assembly lines in automobile industry would have to slash production because there were some issues with semiconductor industry? These both industries were more or less independent.
I would even go to the extent to say that the whole concept of computing is going to witness some major changes in the upcoming years....On the hardware front, Moore's law is slowing. However, it's expected to continue for the next couple of years...ARM architecture has entered the high performance territory, conventionally reserved for x86 architecture. Even supercomputers like the current fastest, Fugaku, are using ARM. Nvidia's acquisition and the resulting foray into CPU and the questions arising over ARM's neutrality are something to watch for. Apple has been spearheading the transition of Personal Computing to ARM, bolstering the credentials of RISC, with Microsoft still stuck at having a smooth transition to ARM with regards to the near ubiquitous Windows OS.

On the software front, OSs and softwares are now increasingly moving from 'as a product' to 'services'. Thanks to/blame Microsoft, Adobe etc.. Mobile OS and cloud computing are generating more and more revenue than ever...Then the concept of getting every app/device connected online ie., IoT. Role of regulators and the legislations in protecting consumer interests, ensuring level playing field for firms...etc..
 
Correct, CPUs need to be reimagined...Current, foundary issues aside, which have even crippled the automakers manufacturing capacity. Who would have thought years ago that assembly lines in automobile industry would have to slash production because there were some issues with semiconductor industry? These both industries were more or less independent.
I would even go to the extent to say that the whole concept of computing is going to witness some major changes in the upcoming years....On the hardware front, Moore's law is slowing. However, it's expected to continue for the next couple of years...ARM architecture has entered the high performance territory, conventionally reserved for x86 architecture. Even supercomputers like the current fastest, Fugaku, are using ARM. Nvidia's acquisition and the resulting foray into CPU and the questions arising over ARM's neutrality are something to watch for. Apple has been spearheading the transition of Personal Computing to ARM, bolstering the credentials of RISC, with Microsoft still stuck at having a smooth transition to ARM with regards to the near ubiquitous Windows OS.

On the software front, OSs and softwares are now increasingly moving from 'as a product' to 'services'. Thanks to/blame Microsoft, Adobe etc.. Mobile OS and cloud computing are generating more and more revenue than ever...Then the concept of getting every app/device connected online ie., IoT. Role of regulators and the legislations in protecting consumer interests, ensuring level playing field for firms...etc..
We will end up at ARM or RISC V in near future ,and the fates are in the hand of nvidia
 
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