Health & Fitness Corona is in full swing and its not Joke !

[TEUser2K1]

@NotMyRealName

> Thought you'd be done with your bullshit trivialising the seriousness of this pandemic after so many lakhs have died. Fine if you have l337 opinions and contrary to fact. But at least have some respect for those who are suffering and stfu instead of being that annoying prick.

Rafi Ahmed, an immunologist at Emory University in Atlanta, Georgia:

“We’re early in the game. We’re not looking at five years, ten years after infection.”

is the line after what you quoted. Why you are ignoring the context ?

Where is disrespecting the victims in the article ? Didn't he raised very valid concerns ? Everybody respect emotions of those who suffered, why you have to ignore scientific research and concerns and have to be this harsh ?
Only if people in general were as careful and cautious not to spread this pandemic far and wide with such caustic care. Then, it may have got contained in very few areas only and saved the world.

 

[JMP]

they compare it after two doses of both vaccines, I'm quoting some bits from the link below

I believe this is the PHE study I was referring to, In the bottom of the article it says -

Asked about the discrepancy between the Pfizer and AstraZeneca vaccine results, she said a key factor to consider was that the "different vaccines were given to slightly different groups of people".
"The Pfizer vaccine was rolled out initially, because it had to be kept at ultra-low temperatures, to - for example - healthcare workers, who tended to be younger," she said.
"This is an all-age study. Whereas AstraZeneca went out to older groups of individuals who were unable to come into main centres."

The study itself says the timing of the vaccines was different as well, so, AstraZeneca was not given the same time after second dose as Pfizer.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

 

[psyph3r]

Thought you'd be done with your bullshit trivialising the seriousness of this pandemic after so many lakhs have died. Fine if you have l337 opinions and contrary to fact. But at least have some respect for those who are suffering and stfu instead of being that annoying prick.

Hey annoyed prick, stop getting triggered just because someone posts scientifically backed articles opposing your world view, a forum post doesn't make it 1337 or trivial.
There was another 1337 study from 10 other scientists done over the past year that arrived at the same conclusion, will post the link here if I find it again.

Lasting immunity found after recovery from COVID-19

The immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection.

www.nih.gov

 

[NotMyRealName]

No, for a long time now you've been posting in the same vein, there were similar people doing likewise on other forums too. So you're not that 1337.

I thought you'd stopped after seeing the insane number of deaths in this 2nd/3rd wave, but no, you're still at it hard.

At least have some respect for those who do accept reality and cut the crap. Even the bhakts are not denying the severity or seriousness of the pandemic unlike you.

And the irony is the title of the thread you're posting in.

Just because your perspective is different doesn't make it true.

@NotMyRealName

> Thought you'd be done with your bullshit trivialising the seriousness of this pandemic after so many lakhs have died. Fine if you have l337 opinions and contrary to fact. But at least have some respect for those who are suffering and stfu instead of being that annoying prick.

Rafi Ahmed, an immunologist at Emory University in Atlanta, Georgia:

“We’re early in the game. We’re not looking at five years, ten years after infection.”

is the line after what you quoted. Why you are ignoring the context ?

Where is disrespecting the victims in the article ? Didn't he raised very valid concerns ? Everybody respect emotions of those who suffered, why you have to ignore scientific research and concerns and have to be this harsh ?
Only if people in general were as careful and cautious not to spread this pandemic far and wide with such caustic care. Then, it may have got contained in very few areas only and saved the world.

If you know his post history you would know what I'm talking about...

 

[NotMyRealName]

And for some more perspective, even an around 1% CFR as is being officially touted in India, is a staggering amount of deaths when the assumption is that at least 80% of the 140 crores population has been or will be infected. My personal guess is that it will be very close to 100% considering all the asymptomatics.

It's not a very deadly virus compared to MERS or even SARS 1, but the infectivity is off the charts. In retail it would be called 'low margins, high volumes'.

 

[psyph3r]

No, for a long time now you've been posting in the same vein

So you'd rather ignore the science when it doesn't match your perception ? Cool
That research actually bodes good news for people like me who recovered from covid, you'd rather expect the worst and continue posting the same doom & gloom articles for years even when presented with a hint of good news that's scientifically backed.

 

[red dragon]

Had COVID? You’ll probably make antibodies for a lifetime

People who recover from mild COVID-19 have bone-marrow cells that can churn out antibodies for decades, although viral variants could dampen some of the protection they offer.

www.nature.com

This is not " scientific research" by any stretch of imagination.
There are 3 studies published earlier and this article basically combined these 3.
1. National Cancer institute
2. PHE
3.La Jolla institute of immunology
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7326402/
This is how a "scientific research" paper is written.
Instead of reading a 15-20 lines of generic statements about antibody response, if you're really interested, read real papers including supplementary references.
The article you posted is not only very superficial but also written very very poorly.
It doesn't even mention the strangest short lived extremely high affinity but non neutralizing antibodies seen upto 6 weeks after symptoms.
People are actually dying in hospitals after 4 weeks of inhouse treatment, they recovered from initial cytokine storm, got better, extubated, even off oxygen..and suddenly dying..what we are calling secondary infection is probably not true.
If you want to really understand immunology, you must read everything from a physiology textbook first.
What happening in covid ( at least in some people) is defying all known principles.
I don't know if a person with no medical background can understand immunology easily, but as techies you guys are very intelligent ( way more than us), you may even understand better than us.
Covid immunity after a natural infection is not that simple buddy, it's one of the most difficult part of the whole problem along with completely asymptomatic infections ( that's even crazier)

 

[NotMyRealName]

So you'd rather ignore the science when it doesn't match your perception ? Cool
That research actually bodes good news for people like me who recovered from covid, you'd rather expect the worst and continue posting the same doom & gloom articles for years even when presented with a hint of good news that's scientifically backed.

What's the science you talk about? Did you even read the quote I've mentioned in my post above from your own linked article where he says whatever level of antibodies you have, the amount of protection is unclear.

The real science is whether cell-mediated immunity has any significant effect on the coronavirus. Current vaccines are just a stop-gap, something's-better-than-nothing approach. Not a real or lasting solution.

This is not doom and gloom, it's being realistic. If you'd rather bury your head in the sand then fine. But don't be insensitive to others by continuously trivialising the seriousness of it.
_________________________________________

I'm not going to claim this is science, but just an opinion (with backing research):

Opinion | Covid’s Deadliest Phase May Be Here Soon (Published 2021)

A new, more transmissible variant could devastate countries without vaccines.

www.nytimes.com

And we seem to be at the epicenter of it. But forget all that, let's just be happy and gay...

 

[psyph3r]

This is not " scientific research" by any stretch of imagination.
There are 3 studies published earlier and this article basically combined these 3.
1. National Cancer institute
2. PHE
3.La Jolla institute of immunology
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7326402/
This is how a "scientific research" paper is written.
Instead of reading a 15-20 lines of generic statements about antibody response, if you're really interested, read real papers including supplementary references.
The article you posted is not only very superficial but also written very very poorly.
It doesn't even mention the strangest short lived extremely high affinity but non neutralizing antibodies seen upto 6 weeks after symptoms.
People are actually dying in hospitals after 4 weeks of inhouse treatment, they recovered from initial cytokine storm, got better, extubated, even off oxygen..and suddenly dying..what we are calling secondary infection is probably not true.
If you want to really understand immunology, you must read everything from a physiology textbook first.
What happening in covid ( at least in some people) is defying all known principles.
I don't know if a person with no medical background can understand immunology easily, but as techies you guys are very intelligent ( way more than us), you may even understand better than us.
Covid immunity after a natural infection is not that simple buddy, it's one of the most difficult part of the whole problem along with completely asymptomatic infections ( that's even crazier)

I just posted this as general info, the article is just a summary. If you'd bother scrolling down you'd see citations and links to peer-reviewed research on the same, Here I've done it for you.

https://static-content.springer.com/esm/art%3A10.1038%2Fs41586-021-03647-4/MediaObjects/41586_2021_3647_MOESM2_ESM.pdf

Here's another one of them for your perusal, I don't save links because I don't have intentions of arguing with strangers on the internet.
I will post the other links if and when I find them.

SARS-CoV-2 antibody-positivity protects against reinfection for at least seven months with 95% efficacy

Reinfection is rare in the young and international population of Qatar. Natural infection appears to elicit strong protection against reinfection with an efficacy ~95% for at least seven months.

www.thelancet.com

 

[rockstah]

I believe this is the PHE study I was referring to, In the bottom of the article it says -

Asked about the discrepancy between the Pfizer and AstraZeneca vaccine results, she said a key factor to consider was that the "different vaccines were given to slightly different groups of people".
"The Pfizer vaccine was rolled out initially, because it had to be kept at ultra-low temperatures, to - for example - healthcare workers, who tended to be younger," she said.
"This is an all-age study. Whereas AstraZeneca went out to older groups of individuals who were unable to come into main centres."

The study itself says the timing of the vaccines was different as well, so, AstraZeneca was not given the same time after second dose as Pfizer.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

Ya it needs more research as the one you shared had only 28 participants which I think is too low and the one I shared with 1000 participants is not that high either. It's all good as long as both vaccines are protective, as they said this variant shows partial resistance to antibodies.

 

[red dragon]

I just posted this as general info, the article is just a summary. If you'd bother scrolling down you'd see citations and links to peer-reviewed research on the same, Here I've done it for you.

https://static-content.springer.com/esm/art%3A10.1038%2Fs41586-021-03647-4/MediaObjects/41586_2021_3647_MOESM2_ESM.pdf

Here's another one of them for your perusal, I don't save links because I don't have intentions of arguing with strangers on the internet.
I will post the other links if and when I find them.

SARS-CoV-2 antibody-positivity protects against reinfection for at least seven months with 95% efficacy

Reinfection is rare in the young and international population of Qatar. Natural infection appears to elicit strong protection against reinfection with an efficacy ~95% for at least seven months.

www.thelancet.com

Did you even bother to read the pdf files yourself!!? Yes, please don't argue about something, you know nothing about.
I don't save links to argue with strangers either. I work in this field and get paid for doing statistical analysis for papers and PhD thesis.
But not everyone is a stranger to me in this forum. I've spoken/ chatted with many over phone in this forum and actually treated a few with covid related illnesses ( mostly over phone/ Zoom) and 2 members from Kolkata physically.
And will continue to point out rubbish and misleading articles posted by anyone.
A statement like " natural covid infection gives long term protection" is borderline Ramdev kind of statement...I've seen enough reinfection in real life and even a Lancet or NEJM article claiming this won't change the reality.
Also I've enough training and experience in bio statistics to pick up studies with manipulated data, don't even need a computer, a scientific calculator is adequate when you know your thing inside out (and part of my PhD thesis was on data manipulation in indexed journals...it's still available in Google scholar and referenced more than 500 times, used as the first reference in the breakthrough paper on the Cholesterol Lie...a paper which challenged Lipitor trial and established fat in general can not produce atherosclerosis. In fact in 20th edition of Harrison's Principles of Internal Medicine incorporated that study. I'm of course a random internet stranger to you, but not really in medical academic and statistics community)

The real science is whether cell-mediated immunity has any significant effect on the coronavirus. Current vaccines are just a stop-gap, something's-better-than-nothing approach. Not a real or lasting solution.

This!!!! This is the best post among all covid immunity related posts. Straight to the point, no bullshit...
Proud of you man!! Forgot the stop- gap word. Julian, mate! I'm having a strong suspicion that you're either a doctor ( a very good one, not those who are still measuring antibodies) or a PhD in immunology.

 

[psyph3r]

A statement like " natural covid infection gives long term protection" is borderline Ramdev kind of statement...I've seen enough reinfection in real life and even a Lancet or NEJM article claiming this won't change the reality.

You asked me to go read a textbook, I presented you links to those who have read all their lives.
The burden of proof is on you, if you want to offer a rebuttal against their Ramdev like statements go publish your findings on Lancet to counter their research and share it amongst your peers to be reviewed instead of insinuating it as manipulated on a tech forum.

 

[NotMyRealName]

...you're either a doctor ( a very good one, not those who are still measuring antibodies) or a PhD in immunology.

I'm neither. And i know very little. I just have a little bit of common sense and more importantly, courtesy to those suffering around me even though i've never been infected (that i know for sure) or recovered.

Honestly i'm tired of this guy's nonsense. He was absolutely silent for the last few weeks when the whole country was reeling under an unprecedented caseload. If he'd opened his mouth back then, he would have been blasted by many others on the forum. Now that things are quieting down again, he's started spouting his 'positivity' again. Shameful...

 

[red dragon]

@quaratineinthesejeans

> If more educated/ privileged people were dependent upon Ayurveda, it possibly won't last the attack. Vatta, Pitta, Kapha...no lawyer could defend something based on these...there is no proper textbook, just word of mouth mostly which are mentioned in those scriptures. If at all those works.

As mentioned earlier, more educated people should learn to disregard books and scriptures written thousand of years back and use their scientific temper to research and discover which specific compounds from specific herbs can help treat human ailments. No, don't tell that is not going to work because tons of work already happened and well known MNCs are still working on that.

Didn't say DRDO invented 2DG, I said DRDO 'supported'. As far as early usage of 2DG, already checked wikipedia and few other articles on that. Not checking about it's effect on tumor treatment now, but for Covid19 treatment of course.

Not expecting magic from it but real world statistics, immaterial of whether that is good or bad.

1. Once you analyse the herbs for chemical composition, most of the time it will show some existing pharmacological compound.
2. No!! Not many MNCs are studying herbs. It's another hogwash from Modi and sidekicks.
It take decades to introduce a new pharmacological element.
Remember Thalidomide or even heroin ( it was available as cough syrup from Beyer)
3.2DG is a 2nd step inhibitor of glycolysis (prevents generation of glucose 6 phosphate)
The idea to use it against covid is same as cancer treatment. To stop the glycolysis in the virus laden cells. But it's a very crude method as 2DG can't differentiate between a normal or abnormal cell ( virus laden here, increased mitotic cells in neoplasm), another compound has to be added to it to tag the infected cells..it's a very simple thing conceptually but impossible in reality.
It was just another distraction for common people ( India is getting better than China in this)
India may promote DRDO as a premier R&D organization, they simply don't have labs and personnel qualified enough to develop a virus tagger and antimitotic combination.
A nation growing virus in a BSL3 lab...developing ventilator that can't deliver tidal volume or doesn't have C-PAP mode!!
Come on man!! Get real!!

You asked me to go read a textbook, I presented you links to those who have read all their lives.
The burden of proof is on you, if you want to offer a rebuttal against their Ramdev like statements go publish your findings on Lancet to counter their research and share it amongst your peers to be reviewed instead of insinuating it as manipulated on a tech forum.

What proof? I already posted one extensive study.
Please buy a subscription for Lancet and NEJM and have a look at how many I have there already!!
Can't buy, drop a PM will gladly share mine.

 

[psyph3r]

He was absolutely silent for the last few weeks when the whole country was reeling under an unprecedented caseload.

Yea because people have a life offline instead of arguing on the internet, you're asking people to look at my post history ? 90% of your posts aren't even tech related and are probably in that other govt. bashing thread.

What proof? I already posted one extensive study.
Please buy a subscription for Lancet and NEJM and have a look at how many I have there already!!
Can't buy, drop a PM will gladly share mine.

Sure go ahead.

 

[red dragon]

I'm neither. And i know very little. I just have a little bit of common sense and more importantly, courtesy to those suffering around me even though i've never been infected (that i know for sure) or recovered.

Honestly i'm tired of this guy's nonsense. He was absolutely silent for the last few weeks when the whole country was reeling under an unprecedented caseload. If he'd opened his mouth back then, he would have been blasted by many others on the forum. Now that things are quieting down again, he's started spouting his 'positivity' again. Shameful...

Oh!! He's one of those "positivity" guy?? Nah, won't share my subscriptions of Lancet and other journals with him.
Thought he's a doctor or medical student and offered it as he has strong doubts about my qualifications.

 

[sauravghosh]

Most recent studies show SARS-Cov2 is airborne and has been detected up to 10 meters away. Research also shows risk of infection outside is very low due to ample air circulation and hostile conditions for the virus. Viral load is also an important factor in probability of infection. So, the highest risk is indoors with inadequate circulation / recirculated air. I don't know if such social distancing is possible in India. Agreed on your point of keeping the mass public transport shut (buses) for next 2 months.

Hmm thanks for informing this. I've stopped reading these Covid related articles, they just make me more depressed. Whatever happens, happens is my outlook from now on. But that 10 metre thing is extremely concerning! Indoor air circulation I've heard before. That one must always keep windows open etc. but I'm under AC most of the time so it's all recirculated air. It's me and my mum only, and distancing is not possible (I mean technically it's possible as I can just stay in my room and she in hers but I still spend a lot of time with her), so I guess it's better to start wearing masks at home. Agh!

 

[psyph3r]

Lmao you guys are just proving my point, how are you guys any different than a bhakt ? Any differing opinion and the person is instantly assumed to be on the opposite side of the political spectrum.
If you'd bother going through my post history I've probably bashed the govt./BJP here more than anyone else.
If you cannot take a simple post as apolitical, I don't know what to say.

 

[red dragon]

90% of your posts aren't even tech related and are probably in that other govt. bashing threads.

What's so special about this government that can't be bashed!?
This government is working as textbook example of what should not be done in an epidemic.

 

[psyph3r]

What's so special about this government that can't be bashed!?

Nothing, that guy just randomly even brought up positivity insinuating I'm a bhakt just because I posted a link to an article when in fact I'm one of the biggest bhakt bashers on here lol.