Demonetisation and its Aftermath

[adventureguy]

50% more for a population like India can be significant. There is a school that opposes giving so much power to some small entity. I don't get the logic here. If already we are outsourcing currency production abroad because we lack the expertise & skill then how does allowing Canada or Australia to do it endanger interests. Maybe they think the Paks might be able to penetrate them easier than say the UK but this doesn't really wash. Maybe they are taking the cheap way out and relying on changing currency more often in the future to stymie the Paks.

I did have some Canadian currency for a while but after the initial novelty of plastic wore off it just felt strange. Also its quite small like these new Indian notes. That physical downsizing gives the impression of devaluation. It reminds me of coins. The 5 rupee coin was thick and heavy then it started to get lighter and it won't be long before it weighs as much as a one rupee coin. Remember what that looked like earlier ? Heavier metal and bigger unlike the parking token of light metal used these days.

we already did testing of plastic notes in 2014. then suddenly we havent heard anything. we've been interested in plastic notes since 2011. you would get used to plastic notes just like you did get used to colorful notes we have now.

and 50% more is something we can afford if we can afford to do largescale experiments like demonitization. Also we print our own currency, we don't outsource our currency production abroad. that would be a huge national security risk. also these new plastic notes can be of standard indian size notes, not necessarily be canadian size notes.

 

[Party Monger]

Why not use all the waste plastic for that. Melt and reuse if possible. Get rid of trash instead of killing trees literally for money.

 

[adventureguy]

plastic notes, infact, are recyclable

 

[Crapmypants]

i can understand changing the color/pattern etc. but changing the size of the notes caused a lot of delays in getting money to atms.
however, they are still releasing new notes of differing dimensions to the old ones.
i think this is a long term plan to replace all old notes since atms will be configured to distribute the new notes hereon.

 

[blr_p]

Also we print our own currency, we don't outsource our currency production abroad. that would be a huge national security risk.

With the present run you mean ? maybe this explains why they look so cheap

Pretty sure i read the last series were made in the UK and are compromised. Also thought i read the present series are also made abroad

 

[chiron]

Wait, why are we talking bank notes now? Aren't we going cashless?

 

[adventureguy]

With the present run you mean ? maybe this explains why they look so cheap

Pretty sure i read the last series were made in the UK and are compromised. Also thought i read the present series are also made abroad

I think you're talking about De La Rue, UK company. We stopped using them in 1998 and also stopped using their paper stock in 2011. We now print our own currency thru govt subsidiary company

Its a national security risk having our currency printed in other countries. De La Rue, mentioned above, is also mentioned in Panama papers and is involved in shady shit. Small countries like Nepal, sri lanka, bangladesh can afford to print their notes at china, not us. These countries will also move their printing in house once they develop more[DOUBLEPOST=1556681293][/DOUBLEPOST]

Wait, why are we talking bank notes now? Aren't we going cashless?

Nothing can never replace cash. (unless its authoritarian state like china where govt mandates it)

 

[blr_p]

I think you're talking about De La Rue, UK company. We stopped using them in 1998 and also stopped using their paper stock in 2011. We now print our own currency thru govt subsidiary company

Yes that's the company i was thinking of. Now, one of the perils of wiki. It says we print our notes, so follow the references and it links to a document from 2007. There are no current documents in the references that state we print the new notes. So i'm still wondering whether we do it or not

Its a national security risk having our currency printed in other countries. De La Rue, mentioned above, is also mentioned in Panama papers and is involved in shady shit. Small countries like Nepal, sri lanka, bangladesh can afford to print their notes at china, not us. These countries will also move their printing in house once they develop more

Yes but you balance one risk against another ie the ease of counterfeiting. Here what they did was change the notes, its creates a setback which can be overcome with time because despite the hype i don't think the new notes have anything harder to copy than the previous notes. Will just take effort.

Nothing can never replace cash. (unless its authoritarian state like china where govt mandates it)

And even there they won't do it.

 

[adventureguy]

Yes that's the company i was thinking of. Now, one of the perils of wiki. It says we print our notes, so follow the references and it links to a document from 2007. There are no current documents in the references that state we print the new notes. So i'm still wondering whether we do it or not

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bharatiya_Reserve_Bank_Note_Mudran
New notes are printed in mysore and salboni by BRBNMPL, subsidiary of RBI

Yes but you balance one risk against another ie the ease of counterfeiting. Here what they did was change the notes, its creates a setback which can be overcome with time because despite the hype i don't think the new notes have anything harder to copy than the previous notes. Will just take effort.

Fake notes of new denomination are already found in circulation within months of their introduction. Infact I'd argue that fake notes of new denomination are easier to be confused as genuine since genuine notes looks so cheap with tacky colors

And even there they won't do it.

Mobile payments are the norm in chinese cities now. can't function without alipay/wechat cash. this push is obviously on behalf of chinese who want data on citizens.

cash will never be replaced but it'll come near close.
https://www.thebeijinger.com/blog/2017/08/17/rise-chinas-cashless-society-mobile-payment-trends-2017

https://www.businessinsider.in/one-...in-a-cashless-future/articleshow/64333165.cms

 

[blr_p]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bharatiya_Reserve_Bank_Note_Mudran
New notes are printed in mysore and salboni by BRBNMPL, subsidiary of RBI

Again, an assertion is made with no references. I looked at the most recent reference there and there is no mention of printing new notes. I'll accept that we've been printing our previous notes.

Fake notes of new denomination are already found in circulation within months of their introduction. Infact I'd argue that fake notes of new denomination are easier to be confused as genuine since genuine notes looks so cheap with tacky colors

Are they any good though ? Its hard enough for the mints to make them in number to the required standard. I'm also surprised that it didn't take long to counterfeit them if we control the entire process now ?

Mobile payments are the norm in chinese cities now. can't function without alipay/wechat cash. this push is obviously on behalf of chinese who want data on citizens.

cash will never be replaced but it'll come near close.
https://www.thebeijinger.com/blog/2017/08/17/rise-chinas-cashless-society-mobile-payment-trends-2017

https://www.businessinsider.in/one-...in-a-cashless-future/articleshow/64333165.cms

I suppose paytm sponsors have a good deal of chinese investment explains it but it might be cultural

Germany is the exact opposite, the main reason is its easier to live on a budget if you know much you have left. Cards & epayments make it easy to spend they are great for business.

https://www.dw.com/en/times-change-but-german-obsession-with-cash-endures/a-43718626

 

[smnrock]

but it might be cultural

Most of the Nordic countries already living cashless lifestyle. Sweden leading and others are not far from it.

 

[Soyab0007]

Wait, why are we talking bank notes now? Aren't we going cashless?

Cash is irreplaceable

 

[blr_p]

Most of the Nordic countries already living cashless lifestyle. Sweden leading and others are not far from it.

Requires 24/7 uninterrupted power & server redundancy cos if any one of those fails you're never getting authenticated. Loss of business

I prefer cash every day, any day. Only way to get robbed is physically. There is no other way.

I don't need any tech neither does the seller

 

[chiron]

One way is if you have cash with you and the govt decides its worth nothing anymore.

 

[smnrock]

Requires 24/7 uninterrupted power & server redundancy cos if any one of those fails you're never getting authenticated. Loss of business

Don't you think, Sweden not thought about this simple thing before deciding to go with 100% cashless in 2023?

Almost two years of my life in Norway, only once I needed cash when I was buying a home server from an individual. This was about couple of years before...

 

[blr_p]

Don't you think, Sweden not thought about this simple thing before deciding to go with 100% cashless in 2023?

Almost two years of my life in Norway, only once I needed cash when I was buying a home server from an individual. This was about couple of years before...

Try making it work in India [DOUBLEPOST=1556737926][/DOUBLEPOST]

One way is if you have cash with you and the govt decides its worth nothing anymore.

they will never do that. It amounts to destroying wealth. Even the whole notes ban thing could be seen as a black money white washing day.

 

[smnrock]

Try making it work in India

Obviously it will take time... How can you compare Sweden with India? BS!

My reply to you was, you simply pointed that culture could be the reason and gave Germany as a reference for cash is king, hinting that cash cannot be eliminated.

So i gave you another reference from same schengen region where cash is going away.

And now you bring unrelated discussions as usual everywhere else you do.

 

[blr_p]

Obviously it will take time... How can you compare Sweden with India? BS!

My reply to you was, you simply pointed that culture could be the reason and gave Germany as a reference for cash is king, hinting that cash cannot be eliminated.

So i gave you another reference from same schengen region where cash is going away.

And now you bring unrelated discussions as usual everywhere else you do.

Thought you said you were in Norway a post or two back

The example of Germany i've used whenever Brits harp on about making payments with a phone. It came as a surprise to me that a major economy thinks otherwise. That on its own tells me cash is here to stay

People use phones here and making payments isn't much of a stretch but it requires a robust network to be usable. What difference is there with phones between eu & India now ? we've got way more people.

 

[toocool6600]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-etf-lending-program-leaving-market-perplexed

Japan now owns 77 % of etf in its own market and most stocks also

Free market no more


Was it ever free market?

 

[adventureguy]

Again, an assertion is made with no references. I looked at the most recent reference there and there is no mention of printing new notes. I'll accept that we've been printing our previous notes.

New currency notes cannot be printed by a private company after Govt bought currency production under RBI (Indian Ministry of Finance)

and only BRBNMPL has the tech to produce new notes. So its common sense that new notes are printed by them?

https://m.rbi.org.in/Scripts/AnnualReportPublications.aspx?Id=1235

RBI annual report. Gives the exact figure how many notes were printed.[/QUOTE]

Are they any good though ? Its hard enough for the mints to make them in number to the required standard. I'm also surprised that it didn't take long to counterfeit them if we control the entire process now ?

Yes. they're good enough. Earlier dull colors were easier to spot but now these outlandish colors makes shopkeepers check twice before accepting them.

I suppose paytm sponsors have a good deal of chinese investment explains it but it might be cultural

Germany is the exact opposite, the main reason is its easier to live on a budget if you know much you have left. Cards & epayments make it easy to spend they are great for business.

https://www.dw.com/en/times-change-but-german-obsession-with-cash-endures/a-43718626

Its not cultural. Its a push by chinese government to monitor population and keep dissent in check. Both alibaba and tencent receive massive amounts of money by chinese govt and these companies are also required by law to give data to goverment.[/QUOTE]