Was going through this thread
http://www.techenclave.com/gaming/pes-2011-fifa-11-pc-demo-175055.html
and the direction to where the discussions were heading. Though I'd write a mini review to sort the matters out. I have also posted this on the thread above, but thought I'd start a new thread, because the title of thread linked above doesnt do justice to what I want to say.
OK. Here are my mini reviews of both the games, mind you, I'm will only be comparing the PC versions.
FIFA 11
Personally, I've been a little sceptical about FIFA since FIA 99, so I might be a tad little opinionated. FIFA 11, just like FIFA 10, 09, 08, is a game with all the bells and whistles i.e. The Features. FIFA excels when it comes to graphics, a close to reality tele experience, great sound (Pro Evo cant even come close to FIFA on this), commentary, licensing, online play, support etc. Now, what do I have to say about FIFA's trademarked features such as Pro Passing etc?
They just sound cool, but they dont really portray themselves truly into the game, as in, dont justify what they're intended to do. With FIFA 11, the deal is, you play 30 games, and then you'll know exactly how to score, the exact spots from where to shoot. Also, almost all the goals in FIFA 11 look just the same. Its not a game to build up and develop to. You learn the tricks, do them at the right time, bang, you're past the defender, it couldn't get any easier.
Players are not even close to their real life counterparts. Their animations might be exact, but I'm not talking about that. Take Drogba for example, or Ibrahimovic. These players are bulky and swear by their physique for goalscoring. In FIFA, they're not like that. Take David Villa for example, Villa scores through dummy runs, draws defenders, and also through his excellent vision in positioning. Villa in FIFA 11 isnt like that. In FIFA 11, have a player that runs fast, has good shooting stats, and thats it, score goals to glory. See this is all it depends on, stats. Drogba is such a great scorer, but if you have him in FIFA you cant really do much, thats because his Speed stats are low, thus he cant run fast. Now thats something what I call a flawed 'heart'. And theres a reason why I've noticed all hardcore FIFA players use the Sprint button during 100% of the time spent playing. This is what EA can never understand. Look at all their games, they market them through bogus trademarked features with cool names.
Now, the defending. Again, defending is not all about speed, agility. There's a whole lot of tactics and mentality involved in defending. Example: Spain and Barca defender, the young Gerrard Pique, big tall guy, with big feet, defends excellently in FIFA, and he is a good defender in real life. Now, take John Terry for example, John Terry is more of a steal and interception kinda guy, not a one-on-one dogfighter defender. And thats something FIFA cant show in his defending character.
Another major flaw I saw in FIFA 11: I decided to have a little fun with it, with Barcelona as my team, playing against Real Madrid (yes, El Clasico baby!), playing online with this Polish player @Kotikolakraw (5 star rated). He had Real, so he had the advantage of stats, with Ronaldo, Higuain, Kaka, Benzema etc.. I was just chilling, wanted to have some fun. I made Messi my goal keeper, Valdes (originally a keeper) and Pique (DF) my strikers, Iniesta (AMF), Xavi (CMF), Busquets (DMF) and Villa (CF) my defenders, had 2 DMFs, Pedro(WF) and Bojan (CF), 1 CMF, Maxwell (LB), and 1 AMF, Puyol (CB). So here's what happenned during the match: Messi's goalkeeping was totally formidable! I did concede 4 goals, mainly because the opponent was firing high flying curve shots from C.Ronaldo, but Messi did save some 10 shots, diving all over the place. I lost the match, 4-3, but I still dominated possession for most of the game. Iniesta, a thin little man, who'd I swear drop at the touch of fly, was an excellent defender through all times, tackling Kaka till his knees ran out. Puyol, my main playmaker of the game, made some excellent through balls and lobbed passes, setting up goals for Valdes, to score.
See the point? This is what I'm talking about. The FIFA 11 engine failed to differentiate between players in this scenario. Valdes (who is actually a goalkeeper) scored 2 goals for me, one from an excellent bicycle kick, which frankly I find it hard even with Villa or Messi. FIFA couldnt understand this. And this proves that players are not programmed to be how they actually are. Its just certain limited parameters set in the engine and that decides what a player should do. This makes the game scope very limited.
I'm not saying FIFA 11 is bad. It is a HUGE, I mean a HUUUGE improvement over the previous FIFA versions. I never expected to EA to really come up this high. They did infact surprise me. But when it comes to being a close to the real thing, an actual good football 'simulator', nah.
Plus, the heart of the game, is not something you can build and develop yourself on. Soon, you'll get to know the quirks of the game and this will only lead to you winning 10-0 all games even at the highest difficulty. I'm sure ALL, and I mean ALL, of you FIFA players out there have experienced this.
Verdict: Go for FIFA if graphics, sound, commentary, presentation is your main priority. FIFA is something you can show off with. But the engine is undeveloped, and more precisely, flawed. You can enjoy the game now and then, but for long term playing, plus playing with real serious challenge in mind, this game doesnt cut it.
PES 2011
The Japs call their version of the game Pro Evolution Soccer, sounds cheesy, just like everything Japanese, but then again, is deep, and precise, just like everything Japanese. The graphics of PES 2011 have seen an improvement, but still their lighting effects are not something to rave about. The stadium, the pitch, the audience, are all strictly above average. The presentation, I must say, has improved a million strides over last year. Its superb! Plus the tactics menu, is again, brilliant, no-nonsense, and gives you the options you want to fiddle with. There is a hidden philosophy in the PES system, it invites to change the way your team plays, and to try different playing styles, like possession football like most Spanish teams, attacking football like the Dutch, midfield run throughs like the Argentines, or simple through passing tactics like the British.
The player stats are what sets this game apart. They have some 30 various rated stats, like Attack, Defence, mentality, speed, Short Pass Accuracy, Short Pass Speed etc. Each player has these things like 'Pokemon cards' kinda thingys, introduced only last year, like 'Extra Attacker' for Pique, who occasionally comes up front to help score, Incisive Run for Messi, means cutting through the side into box to score, Dummy Runner for Villa, Enforcer for Mascherano, Goal Poacher for Torres etc. This is what makes these players unique.
Messi is Messi, Drogba is Drogba. When you make runs with Drogba, you can feel his physical presence on the defenders, the way he goes through them. He is slow, but that doesnt seem the issue, just like his real life counterpart. You have someone like Darren Bent, sneaking past defenders from out of the box to receive a pass inside and score, and this is actually how he seems in PES. Iniesta, always making a presence everywhere in the pitch, has the Free Roaming pokemon card, and does behaves likewise.
Next, the major improvement in PES 2011, THE PASSING! The freedom to pass the 'EXACT' way you want to with the new passing system, plus some change in the game mechanics here and there, is totally AWESOME! (I rarely use the word awesome but I couldnt resist this time).
PES wants you see the beauty of this game called football. Wants you to find you own style of play, whether wide, narrow, possession, etc, and develop it, and see what works out best for you. This is where its sense of realism comes into play. Its a refined system, built on and improved for years and years, exploring depths which let me tell you, is hard for game developers of any genre to go into, never can you find games this deep in their engine. Some games are, for sure, but PES is something special.
The beauty in the PES engine is unbelievable. Sometimes me and my friends, after a nice long session of PES, just admire and discuss about how deep the game is. The players, the passing, the defenders (which was a weak point a few years back), and the goalkeepers (huge improvement again this year).
In PES, ALL GOALS you score are scored differently. There is no 'sweet spot' to shoot from. Keepers may behave in an exactly similar situation differently from how they behaved before, it depends on countless factors, and this is what actually counts.
Conclusion: PES 2011 is the closest football sim to what one can get of the real thing.
ADIOS AMIGOS.
http://www.techenclave.com/gaming/pes-2011-fifa-11-pc-demo-175055.html
and the direction to where the discussions were heading. Though I'd write a mini review to sort the matters out. I have also posted this on the thread above, but thought I'd start a new thread, because the title of thread linked above doesnt do justice to what I want to say.
OK. Here are my mini reviews of both the games, mind you, I'm will only be comparing the PC versions.
FIFA 11
Personally, I've been a little sceptical about FIFA since FIA 99, so I might be a tad little opinionated. FIFA 11, just like FIFA 10, 09, 08, is a game with all the bells and whistles i.e. The Features. FIFA excels when it comes to graphics, a close to reality tele experience, great sound (Pro Evo cant even come close to FIFA on this), commentary, licensing, online play, support etc. Now, what do I have to say about FIFA's trademarked features such as Pro Passing etc?
They just sound cool, but they dont really portray themselves truly into the game, as in, dont justify what they're intended to do. With FIFA 11, the deal is, you play 30 games, and then you'll know exactly how to score, the exact spots from where to shoot. Also, almost all the goals in FIFA 11 look just the same. Its not a game to build up and develop to. You learn the tricks, do them at the right time, bang, you're past the defender, it couldn't get any easier.
Players are not even close to their real life counterparts. Their animations might be exact, but I'm not talking about that. Take Drogba for example, or Ibrahimovic. These players are bulky and swear by their physique for goalscoring. In FIFA, they're not like that. Take David Villa for example, Villa scores through dummy runs, draws defenders, and also through his excellent vision in positioning. Villa in FIFA 11 isnt like that. In FIFA 11, have a player that runs fast, has good shooting stats, and thats it, score goals to glory. See this is all it depends on, stats. Drogba is such a great scorer, but if you have him in FIFA you cant really do much, thats because his Speed stats are low, thus he cant run fast. Now thats something what I call a flawed 'heart'. And theres a reason why I've noticed all hardcore FIFA players use the Sprint button during 100% of the time spent playing. This is what EA can never understand. Look at all their games, they market them through bogus trademarked features with cool names.
Now, the defending. Again, defending is not all about speed, agility. There's a whole lot of tactics and mentality involved in defending. Example: Spain and Barca defender, the young Gerrard Pique, big tall guy, with big feet, defends excellently in FIFA, and he is a good defender in real life. Now, take John Terry for example, John Terry is more of a steal and interception kinda guy, not a one-on-one dogfighter defender. And thats something FIFA cant show in his defending character.
Another major flaw I saw in FIFA 11: I decided to have a little fun with it, with Barcelona as my team, playing against Real Madrid (yes, El Clasico baby!), playing online with this Polish player @Kotikolakraw (5 star rated). He had Real, so he had the advantage of stats, with Ronaldo, Higuain, Kaka, Benzema etc.. I was just chilling, wanted to have some fun. I made Messi my goal keeper, Valdes (originally a keeper) and Pique (DF) my strikers, Iniesta (AMF), Xavi (CMF), Busquets (DMF) and Villa (CF) my defenders, had 2 DMFs, Pedro(WF) and Bojan (CF), 1 CMF, Maxwell (LB), and 1 AMF, Puyol (CB). So here's what happenned during the match: Messi's goalkeeping was totally formidable! I did concede 4 goals, mainly because the opponent was firing high flying curve shots from C.Ronaldo, but Messi did save some 10 shots, diving all over the place. I lost the match, 4-3, but I still dominated possession for most of the game. Iniesta, a thin little man, who'd I swear drop at the touch of fly, was an excellent defender through all times, tackling Kaka till his knees ran out. Puyol, my main playmaker of the game, made some excellent through balls and lobbed passes, setting up goals for Valdes, to score.
See the point? This is what I'm talking about. The FIFA 11 engine failed to differentiate between players in this scenario. Valdes (who is actually a goalkeeper) scored 2 goals for me, one from an excellent bicycle kick, which frankly I find it hard even with Villa or Messi. FIFA couldnt understand this. And this proves that players are not programmed to be how they actually are. Its just certain limited parameters set in the engine and that decides what a player should do. This makes the game scope very limited.
I'm not saying FIFA 11 is bad. It is a HUGE, I mean a HUUUGE improvement over the previous FIFA versions. I never expected to EA to really come up this high. They did infact surprise me. But when it comes to being a close to the real thing, an actual good football 'simulator', nah.
Plus, the heart of the game, is not something you can build and develop yourself on. Soon, you'll get to know the quirks of the game and this will only lead to you winning 10-0 all games even at the highest difficulty. I'm sure ALL, and I mean ALL, of you FIFA players out there have experienced this.
Verdict: Go for FIFA if graphics, sound, commentary, presentation is your main priority. FIFA is something you can show off with. But the engine is undeveloped, and more precisely, flawed. You can enjoy the game now and then, but for long term playing, plus playing with real serious challenge in mind, this game doesnt cut it.
PES 2011
The Japs call their version of the game Pro Evolution Soccer, sounds cheesy, just like everything Japanese, but then again, is deep, and precise, just like everything Japanese. The graphics of PES 2011 have seen an improvement, but still their lighting effects are not something to rave about. The stadium, the pitch, the audience, are all strictly above average. The presentation, I must say, has improved a million strides over last year. Its superb! Plus the tactics menu, is again, brilliant, no-nonsense, and gives you the options you want to fiddle with. There is a hidden philosophy in the PES system, it invites to change the way your team plays, and to try different playing styles, like possession football like most Spanish teams, attacking football like the Dutch, midfield run throughs like the Argentines, or simple through passing tactics like the British.
The player stats are what sets this game apart. They have some 30 various rated stats, like Attack, Defence, mentality, speed, Short Pass Accuracy, Short Pass Speed etc. Each player has these things like 'Pokemon cards' kinda thingys, introduced only last year, like 'Extra Attacker' for Pique, who occasionally comes up front to help score, Incisive Run for Messi, means cutting through the side into box to score, Dummy Runner for Villa, Enforcer for Mascherano, Goal Poacher for Torres etc. This is what makes these players unique.
Messi is Messi, Drogba is Drogba. When you make runs with Drogba, you can feel his physical presence on the defenders, the way he goes through them. He is slow, but that doesnt seem the issue, just like his real life counterpart. You have someone like Darren Bent, sneaking past defenders from out of the box to receive a pass inside and score, and this is actually how he seems in PES. Iniesta, always making a presence everywhere in the pitch, has the Free Roaming pokemon card, and does behaves likewise.
Next, the major improvement in PES 2011, THE PASSING! The freedom to pass the 'EXACT' way you want to with the new passing system, plus some change in the game mechanics here and there, is totally AWESOME! (I rarely use the word awesome but I couldnt resist this time).
PES wants you see the beauty of this game called football. Wants you to find you own style of play, whether wide, narrow, possession, etc, and develop it, and see what works out best for you. This is where its sense of realism comes into play. Its a refined system, built on and improved for years and years, exploring depths which let me tell you, is hard for game developers of any genre to go into, never can you find games this deep in their engine. Some games are, for sure, but PES is something special.
The beauty in the PES engine is unbelievable. Sometimes me and my friends, after a nice long session of PES, just admire and discuss about how deep the game is. The players, the passing, the defenders (which was a weak point a few years back), and the goalkeepers (huge improvement again this year).
In PES, ALL GOALS you score are scored differently. There is no 'sweet spot' to shoot from. Keepers may behave in an exactly similar situation differently from how they behaved before, it depends on countless factors, and this is what actually counts.
Conclusion: PES 2011 is the closest football sim to what one can get of the real thing.
ADIOS AMIGOS.
