Local Body Tax (LBT) creating havoc in Pune

[Rahul++]

oh. it must have been implemented secretly in the year that passed. same thing will happen in pune too then. they'll stop the bandh saying they wont implement it and then pass it after a few months when everyone's forgot about it.

Nope, it won't happen. If they apply LBT, shopkeepers and other business owners will get to know about that. They will have to pay the levy..


If you think wisely, this will affect development of city. If Municipal corporation does not get any tax from shop keepers, businessman. City will not be developed. Example, Kolhapur does not have Octroi, LBT. KMC does not have any strong source of income. After effects, no proper roads, underdeveloped city. :-( Beautiful place without proper amenities, well maintained roads (Thank god we have MORE THAN enough water). People are willing to make country tax free. If we were developed country, I would have supported "tax free" thing.

All we need is "Holy Puret government and supporting public".

 

[onlyravi]

oh. it must have been implemented secretly in the year that passed. same thing will happen in pune too then. they'll stop the bandh saying they wont implement it and then pass it after a few months when everyone's forgot about it.

That's exactly what CM Chavan tried to do yday.... When the association members went to meet him to discuss this issue he said he will look into it and has appointed a committee(the usual textbook action netas take) and requested them to call off the bandh. The association declined the offer.

 

[onlyravi]

Nope, it won't happen. If they apply LBT, shopkeepers and other business owners will get to know about that. They will have to pay the levy..
If you think wisely, this will affect development of city.

Agree with first statement but completely disagree with the next one.
PMC has enormous sources of income. I will get tired of listing only the ones which I know.... Leave aside the COMPLETE list.
For starters: PMC earns huge sums of rent for the places they lease.
Biggest income comes from Property taxes which everyone has to pay. I pay Rs9631/year as property tax for a 1BHK.
Do you know every developer has to pay Rs150/sqft as development fee to PMC for every sqft they construct. Apart from that they also have to leave open spaces(given to PMC) in all their schemes.
One cant even imagine how many places they have like this. Apart from that in many areas they are now charging for water bills using meters.
The tons and tons of amount earned in registering properties. The stamp duty goes to state or central govt I am not sure but the Reg charges and other charges go to PMC.
The PMPML (City bus service) is also a huge source of income. Its their stupidity and mismanagement that they are not in good profit. All due to negligence and corruption.
Apart from that they get paid even if some company(private or state owned) digs roads.
Octroi is also a very large source of income. Some 1200CR were collected last year.
Infact Pune is such a blessed city that touch wood we dont have water problems/rainfall is good and city has many fresh water bodies nearby to supply the entire year but its only the mismanagement and corruption of the PMC that some areas such as Kharadi and Chandan Nagar (on nagar road) still face huge water crisis.
Probably many dont know but the water tanks built at chandan nagar are funded by world bank but still the area runs dry. WHY? Tanker Mafia. Kharade Patil and Pathare brothers own 1500 tankers.
So its more complicated than it seems but still its all artificial and neta made not natural problems.

BTW a share of LBT goes to the State Govt and thats the reason State Govt is not going to help here.

 

[raksrules]

Back from reliance mart in Aundh. Lots of rush there but everything is available including veggies and fruits. No milk pouches and only the toned ones.
Everything else is still closed.

 

[abhifusion]

Food Bazaar is also open on the Baner Road with half shutter down... Purchased groceries just a day back...

BTW isnt traders opposing this LBT just because there is less chance of black income now ?? Doesn't shopkeepers already charge us the Octroi on the goods we purchase ?? Infact in few cases its even lower than Octroi ...

From TOI :

"Highlights of LBT in PimpriChinchwad
* No LBT on domestic LPG. Cost per LPG cylinder may reduce by Rs 21.25
* Petrol and diesel may become cheaper by 50 paise as LBT is only 2 % as against the previous 2.5 % octroi charges.
* Edible oil may become cheaper as LBT is 0.5 % as against the earlier octroi charge of 1 %.

* Cigarettes, pan masala, tobacco products to cost more
* Glass, wood; spare and secondary parts used in industries and trade establishments; plastic pipes, tyre tubes; casting material and its spares; machinery and their spares; electronic machinery and its spares; electric fittings, sewing machines to cost less"

 

[ashvarybabul]

God save Pune.. Never even understood that Octri thing also, just read about it in Ebay where sellers said you would need to pay additional amount for octri crap

 

[sharktale1212]

Food Bazaar is also open on the Baner Road with half shutter down... Purchased groceries just a day back...

BTW isnt traders opposing this LBT just because there is less chance of black income now ?? Doesn't shopkeepers already charge us the Octroi on the goods we purchase ?? Infact in few cases its even lower than Octroi ...

From TOI :

"Highlights of LBT in PimpriChinchwad
* No LBT on domestic LPG. Cost per LPG cylinder may reduce by Rs 21.25
* Petrol and diesel may become cheaper by 50 paise as LBT is only 2 % as against the previous 2.5 % octroi charges.
* Edible oil may become cheaper as LBT is 0.5 % as against the earlier octroi charge of 1 %.

* Cigarettes, pan masala, tobacco products to cost more
* Glass, wood; spare and secondary parts used in industries and trade establishments; plastic pipes, tyre tubes; casting material and its spares; machinery and their spares; electronic machinery and its spares; electric fittings, sewing machines to cost less"

you can read one page back. @onlyravi has given a quite good explanation of why it is not about the "black income."

 

[abhifusion]

you can read one page back. @onlyravi has given a quite good explanation of why it is not about the "black income."

Read it; it mostly addresses how difficult it'll be for traders to get used to it... Whatever tax is levied they pass on to customers anyway... Only reason I see for the opposition is higher regulations which will dent their black income...

 

[sharktale1212]

Read it; it mostly addresses how difficult it'll be for traders to get used to it... Whatever tax is levied they pass on to customers anyway... Only reason I see for the opposition is higher regulations which will dent their black income...

Read it again. Its not about how "higher regulations = less black income" its about how high regulation = pain for everyone including the traders who might have to grease some palms so that he can remain open to sell = black money in hands of the babus and government.
Then one fine day there will be another thread - Pune/MH government is so corrupt and how the amenties - road/water is bad. if you still think its about the big black money then I rest my case.

 

[abhifusion]

Speaking from Consumer POV I think its beneficial to the end user... If trader is not engaging in any illegal activity there is no need for him to grease hands of babus n govt IMO...
"Now there will be no LBT on bicycles, tricycles, cycle rickshaws and its parts like tyres and tubes. Newspapers, agriculture implements, aids and implements used by handicapped persons, contraceptives used for family planning and treatment of cancer and HIV&AIDS, electricity, water and human blood have been exempted from LBT for the convenience of citizens while prices of fabrics will remain the same," Wardhane said.
The other exempted goods include school textbooks, betel and beedi leaves, cattle feed, Gandhi cap, clay lamps, handlooms, paddy, rice, wheat and pulses in whole grain, split or broken form, wheat flour, rice and pulses, cotton and silk yarn in hank, buttermilk, earthen pot and red earth, firewood, fresh plants and saplings, garlic and ginger, bangles, idols, musical instruments, milk, national flag, organic manure, poha, lahya and churmura, judicial and non-judicial stamp papers, eggs in sheel, sheep, goats, poultry and cattle, raw meat, raw wool, seeds, lottery tickets, PDS foods, currency notes and coins and solar energy devices." - Source

 

[W@rrier]

I live at wakad and i am student, living with some other guys and for the first 2 days of the strike, we had no other option than McD to eat.
Breakfast lunch dinner all at McD.. And the local goons made them close the day before yesterday.

Some restaurants are open in the evenings.. And I haven't been able to get even a few packs of biscuits as not a single general store is open

Thankfully petrol pumps in the highway side are open. I was stranded on the road on 2nd day as my bike's petrol ran out :-(

Local shopkeeper I know, told me that this can go on for another week.

During what time is the reliance mart open?

 

[raksrules]

@W@arrier

Since you stay at wakad i suggest you go towards Hinjewadi to Dmart. While coming from wakad side you would see Dmart is closed but you still go there and the small door on left side (not entirely visible from main road) is open and people are shopping there.
If this fails, travel to Aundh and the reliance mart there is open. Although the mall people have lined up the shopping crates outside the mall to sort of showcase that entrance is blocked, shopper are allowed to go through the basement parking.
I went there yesterday and did shop for things we wanted. I believe it is open entire day.
Expect huge crowds since only handful of places have stock for groceries.

[DOUBLEPOST=1365130826][/DOUBLEPOST]

During what time is the reliance mart open?

 

[axeman]

LBT has come to Thane also, but no repercussions by dealers yet

 

[Rahul++]

Agree with first statement but completely disagree with the next one.
PMC has enormous sources of income. I will get tired of listing only the ones which I know.... Leave aside the COMPLETE list.
For starters: PMC earns huge sums of rent for the places they lease.
Biggest income comes from Property taxes which everyone has to pay. I pay Rs9631/year as property tax for a 1BHK.
Do you know every developer has to pay Rs150/sqft as development fee to PMC for every sqft they construct. Apart from that they also have to leave open spaces(given to PMC) in all their schemes.
One cant even imagine how many places they have like this. Apart from that in many areas they are now charging for water bills using meters.
The tons and tons of amount earned in registering properties. The stamp duty goes to state or central govt I am not sure but the Reg charges and other charges go to PMC.
The PMPML (City bus service) is also a huge source of income. Its their stupidity and mismanagement that they are not in good profit. All due to negligence and corruption.
Apart from that they get paid even if some company(private or state owned) digs roads.
Octroi is also a very large source of income. Some 1200CR were collected last year.
Infact Pune is such a blessed city that touch wood we dont have water problems/rainfall is good and city has many fresh water bodies nearby to supply the entire year but its only the mismanagement and corruption of the PMC that some areas such as Kharadi and Chandan Nagar (on nagar road) still face huge water crisis.
Probably many dont know but the water tanks built at chandan nagar are funded by world bank but still the area runs dry. WHY? Tanker Mafia. Kharade Patil and Pathare brothers own 1500 tankers.
So its more complicated than it seems but still its all artificial and neta made not natural problems.

BTW a share of LBT goes to the State Govt and thats the reason State Govt is not going to help here.

Well, I was not talking about Pune only. It was in general statement I know how rich and wealthy Pune and Pimpri Municipal corporation are. Some cities (like Kolhapur) have not so wealthy municipal corporations. Where no source of income exists since they have waived most of the tax for the goodness of citizen.

 

[onlyravi]

Speaking from Consumer POV I think its beneficial to the end user... If trader is not engaging in any illegal activity there is no need for him to grease hands of babus n govt IMO...
"Now there will be no LBT on bicycles, tricycles, cycle rickshaws and its parts like tyres and tubes. Newspapers, agriculture implements, aids and implements used by handicapped persons, contraceptives used for family planning and treatment of cancer and HIV&AIDS, electricity, water and human blood have been exempted from LBT for the convenience of citizens while prices of fabrics will remain the same," Wardhane said.
The other exempted goods include school textbooks, betel and beedi leaves, cattle feed, Gandhi cap, clay lamps, handlooms, paddy, rice, wheat and pulses in whole grain, split or broken form, wheat flour, rice and pulses, cotton and silk yarn in hank, buttermilk, earthen pot and red earth, firewood, fresh plants and saplings, garlic and ginger, bangles, idols, musical instruments, milk, national flag, organic manure, poha, lahya and churmura, judicial and non-judicial stamp papers, eggs in sheel, sheep, goats, poultry and cattle, raw meat, raw wool, seeds, lottery tickets, PDS foods, currency notes and coins and solar energy devices." - Source

Dude apart from the bicycles, tubes and spares other items were already excluded from Octroi.
Health treatment and most of the food products and direct agricultural products like vegetables and fruits were never in the octroi scope.
Please just dont go quoting someone.... specially not from TOI.
Read between the fine lines. Did you know there is ONLY ONE center in Pune that does PET Scan of the bones.(its in the lane opp to Mangeshkar hosp). The single radioactive material (Think of like what a ink toner is to a printer) costs about 7L and has to be brought from Gujarat. The Octroi on that stuff was 36%. Can you imagine that? Do U think the doc pays from his pocket? no they inturn pass the charge to the customers.
Same will happen after LBT only thing being that now local bodies will torture retailers in and out of their shop.
Just imagine how many issues we individuals face when our couriers are hanging in the octroi. Many times they disregard the declaration and charge as per their choice else they just seize the package untill we pay. Just multiply the agony for the retailers.

And is there any guarantee from the PMC that they wont hike the LBT rates for some fixed period say atleast a year??
NO.... they can hike it even next week. So please again dont argue just for the sake of arguing.... LBT / Octroi shd not be in place in the first order.
As per the association's statement which they gave to the CM on wednesday they proposed that they are ok with a hike in VAT on some categories but they dont want additional overheads which will add cost and confusion both.

 

[onlyravi]

Just IN: My lawyer calls me up and says that I need to pay 1% LBT for the flat I purchased last month.
We did the Agreement to sale in Feb and paid the Stamp Duty and Registration. The only thing remaining was the sale deed which was to happen after I get the disbursement from the bank. It was scheduled for 2moro but they are now asking for 1%LBT. Like for a flat of 10L it will be additional 10k.
Link to all LBT rates in Pune PDF

 

[abhifusion]

Well I agree that these taxes (LBT/Octroi) should not be there at first place... Hope they roll out GST in this decade atleast !

 

[Rahul++]

Just IN: My lawyer calls me up and says that I need to pay 1% LBT for the flat I purchased last month.
We did the Agreement to sale in Feb and paid the Stamp Duty and Registration. The only thing remaining was the sale deed which was to happen after I get the disbursement from the bank. It was scheduled for 2moro but they are now asking for 1%LBT. Like for a flat of 10L it will be additional 10k.
Link to all LBT rates in Pune PDF

Read list of goods exempted from LBT charges..

Especially 2nd last page.. Good no. 42..

Spoiler

Semen including frozen semen.. no LBT

 

[soggy316]

^ The govt. would be looking to mop up the tax on that

 

[onlyravi]

yet no decision from the govt....
I heard the market will own normal from Monday irrespective of the govt's stand on this issue....