Need Help - Buying a 5.1 Setup for TV

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So, Sei and I were roaming around in Reliance Mart/Ezone/Chroma trying to browse through whatever limited range of 5.1 Speaker systems that we could hook up to our TV sets. We came across a few models from different brands(we were basically looking for audiophile brands), these were the ones available at RM :

1. ONKYO - HTS 3400 - 27 k
2. Pioneer - HTP 071 - 25k
3. ONKYO - HT 3300 - 20 k
4. Yamaha - HTS 196 - 21 k (My Pick)

Basically my budget is around 15-20k, i will be going to Vijay Sales to check out some more models and also going to RM for a demo of the above systems.

If any of you guys have had any good/bad experiences with the same, please advise on which one to zero in on. :yes:
 
All of the above are the cheapest HTiB offerings from mass-market manufacturers. I wouldn't label Onkyo or Pioneer 'Audiophile' brands, not even close.

At your budget you will get far better sound from a pair of high quality bookshelf speakers/nearfield monitors and a small amplifier. Run off a PC or even a half-decent DVD player, you will be far happier with the sound than with 6 mediocre speakers and a mediocre control amplifier such as the ones you have determined.

All it will take for you to be disgusted is one audition of a good system.

Specifically, the 3300 which I have heard, sounds like 5 tin cans coupled with a untuned drum. Far better than the Bose system selling at 3 times the price (or the Logitech a few price points below), but that's like saying a turd is much better than a stinking turd. I eventually bought a JBL speaker set with a Pioneer receiver (I forget the exact model numbers), but even that I sold off as soon as I could get myself a decent setup. For surround duties I now have two systems, one is a branded system for movies with a DIY 8-subwoofer array that hits 21Hz at concert levels, and the other is a full custom build for my gaming system with Aurasound drivers. Both are passable for music - and having spent a lot of cash on these, I'm not joking when I say they can't do music all that well.

On topic, I would wager that a high quality analog HT system like the best ones from Edifier (again, forgive me for forgetting the model numbers - 550D?) will beat the crap out of the cheap all-in-ones.
 
cranky said:
All of the above are the cheapest HTiB offerings from mass-market manufacturers. I wouldn't label Onkyo or Pioneer 'Audiophile' brands, not even close.

At your budget you will get far better sound from a pair of high quality bookshelf speakers/nearfield monitors and a small amplifier. Run off a PC or even a half-decent DVD player, you will be far happier with the sound than with 6 mediocre speakers and a mediocre control amplifier such as the ones you have determined.

All it will take for you to be disgusted is one audition of a good system.

Specifically, the 3300 which I have heard, sounds like 5 tin cans coupled with a untuned drum. Far better than the Bose system selling at 3 times the price (or the Logitech a few price points below), but that's like saying a turd is much better than a stinking turd. I eventually bought a JBL speaker set with a Pioneer receiver (I forget the exact model numbers), but even that I sold off as soon as I could get myself a decent setup. For surround duties I now have two systems, one is a branded system for movies with a DIY 8-subwoofer array that hits 21Hz at concert levels, and the other is a full custom build for my gaming system with Aurasound drivers. Both are passable for music - and having spent a lot of cash on these, I'm not joking when I say they can't do music all that well.

On topic, I would wager that a high quality analog HT system like the best ones from Edifier (again, forgive me for forgetting the model numbers - 550D?) will beat the crap out of the cheap all-in-ones.
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Thank you for replying here. I was going to tag you anyway if you hadn't. :)

There is a big limitation with the both of us here - small apartments for both. Living room is just around 9 x 7 sq feet I think; at least in my case.

I can't justify spending more than 15-20k as of now.

I also understand the fact that I'll get what I pay for. Saying that we both are audiophiles is like commending Congress on it's ability to prevent scams and inflation (It's a big NO in both cases). We have been watching movies for the past year using the inbuilt speakers on our LCD/LED TVs so even an Intex 5.1 would be a big upgrade right now.

Why I thought to go this way is to understand the basic technology and eventually upgrade to a better system (or a custom build) once I get sick of this.

I agree on the fact that an audition will let us know what we are getting into. I have auditioned some Sony/Samsung systems and I literally had my nose turned up in disgust. I hope these are somewhat better than those.
 
Intex is only an upgrade from deafness. I suspect they are less enjoyable than even speakers built into LCDs.

Look then at a higher quality stereo setup. Trying to squeeze a set of 6 speakers into a room that small will lead to spaghetti wiring and very unrealistic surround, like you were in a cave. Plus, most television material will be stereo anyway - the only good bit about a surround setup is a center speaker, but given that your speakers may be not more than 5 feet from each other, in your case even that is not needed.

I would recommend the Edifier 730D with a DVD player, should be just at the 20k mark. The Audioengine 5, if you can find it, is also a great alternative and easier to set up, with less wires. I don't normally recommend nearfield monitors for home listeners, but at your budget they aren't a bad option. Also try looking at used products, they may offer significant savings. Finally, there are some options from brands like Wharfedale and Monitor Audio where the speakers should cost you about 15k the pair.

You will unfortunately have to couple them with an amplifier from Norge or other Indian brands, I don't know about the others but Norges in particular are terribly put together, mostly incorrectly copied from copyrighted material. I suspect DIY is not your thing else I would have suggested that path for the amplifier at least.

To be frank, it's been a while since I've been in that budget range so I'm not really sure what else is out there.
 
cranky said:
Intex is only an upgrade from deafness. I suspect they are less enjoyable than even speakers built into LCDs.

Look then at a higher quality stereo setup. Trying to squeeze a set of 6 speakers into a room that small will lead to spaghetti wiring and very unrealistic surround, like you were in a cave. Plus, most television material will be stereo anyway - the only good bit about a surround setup is a center speaker, but given that your speakers may be not more than 5 feet from each other, in your case even that is not needed.

I would recommend the Edifier 730D with a DVD player, should be just at the 20k mark. The Audioengine 5, if you can find it, is also a great alternative and easier to set up, with less wires. I don't normally recommend nearfield monitors for home listeners, but at your budget they aren't a bad option. Also try looking at used products, they may offer significant savings. Finally, there are some options from brands like Wharfedale and Monitor Audio where the speakers should cost you about 15k the pair.

You will unfortunately have to couple them with an amplifier from Norge or other Indian brands, I don't know about the others but Norges in particular are terribly put together, mostly incorrectly copied from copyrighted material. I suspect DIY is not your thing else I would have suggested that path for the amplifier at least.

To be frank, it's been a while since I've been in that budget range so I'm not really sure what else is out there.
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That is exactly the thing. If I start adding up the components individually, the price will go up drastically. That is what I would like to do too but my teeny budget does not permit me to do so.

I think that I will go for an audition today and see (or rather hear) for myself first. Hope I don't go with a biased ear after reading your replies :(

- - - Updated - - -

Tagging you here Sirjee @Renegade

I'm also going to demo an Onkyo today. Your impressions please! :)
 
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If I start adding up the components individually, the price will go up drastically
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I was suggesting a combination within 20k or so... maybe a thousand either way.

onlyravi said:
Check out Logitech Z906.
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In my opinion, those don't really have any virtues apart from playing incredibly loud, and providing both a set of digital inputs and 6 speakers at the lowest possible cost (it is the cheapest system to offer both simultaneously). They are not even remotely close to delivering decent performance with anything apart from games (which is probably what they were designed for).

In that budget one can do lots better. Unless, of course, digital inputs and surround are both required. I am of the firm opinion that the quality of sound is the first priority when purchasing a sound system (at any budget, even the smallest), and the system build is composed around that. Cheap HTiB and analog surround systems have to cut corners severely to be able to cram dozens of features and impressive-looking specs on the box, so the final goal of actually getting great sound is lost.

I respect the fact that you own these speakers, but I feel that the 3300 selected by the TS, with all its shortcomings, is far better than the Z906/Z5500 class of speakers. That would mean that he would be downgrading from what has already been shortlisted, by your suggestion.
 
Considering that I have limited exposure to speakers (not the high end ones anyway), I am fairly satisfied with the 3400. Based on the research that I did I could not afford anything better than this in that budget (which I had extended by double in the first place).

Both Cranky and Sarang will tell you to rather go for a good bookshelf setup but I was still adamant on a surround setup. Respect you both with audio advice but still went the other way. :P

I spent my Saturday watching a lot of TV (HD channels) and a couple of downloaded movies in 720p (MI4 and Madagascar3). Thoroughly enjoyed myself. Then yesterday I was watching a movie on the TV speakers and I felt I was listening to laptop speakers. So Onkyo 3400 are definitely a good upgrade.

On a related note, I see that the AVR has two outputs for setting up Speaker A (5.1 setup) or Speaker B (2.0 setup). You can choose between the two with the remote. So in this case, would it not be possible to hook up a really good bookshelf 2.0 setup for listening to music? Not that I am worried about music playback but it could be an option for the overly concerned.
 
how about a good quality sound bar which can produce virtual 5.1/7.1 surround? no clutter either. Yamaha is recognized well for its sound bars.
 
Sei said:
^ All sound bars are pretty expensive.
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And the ones priced decently sound crap. like the samsung one which has wireless woofer.

I did see many people having the opinion that Z906 are crap but honestly I am not an expert and I did not find any problems with Z906. Also as compared to AVR It consumes less power and uses less space.
3400 is a good choice in your price frame and req. What is the room size in which you would be installing them.
There is one Pioneer AVR displayed at Ezone Phoenix mall. They dont have any variety.
You can check that also.
And RD has a good display of AVRs in action in the same mall but I find the prices little high there. (Though they were ready to negotiate for 3400).
 
They do not have digital inputs AFAIK. Any 5.1 system without digital inputs are pointless IMO. No provision for decoding Dolby D/DTS signals.
 
So, we went to this amazing shop today at DP road which goes by the name of AVX (::: AVXellence ::: Audio, Video, Speakers, Amplifiers, Home Theatres - India). This guy deals only in Audio and Visual solutions , and had a huge 120 inch screen with Full HD projector and an awesome Denon HT connected to it.

The guy was definitely more knowledgeable than our standard sales-guys at Chroma and its likes. Basically, he gave us two options to chose from in the entry range :

1. Denon 1312XP (Active Woofer)
2. Onkyo HT-S3500 (Passive Woofer)

Both are at same price point of around 30k. We need to chose from the
 
I've owned the 1311xp (Same speakers older receiver) and frankly the speakers suck. The combo that cranky had (HK + JBL) is far better. The Onkyo again is a big NO NO. The plastic speakers they bundle is an abomination. If you are anyway looking to spend 30Kish why not consider the option Cranky suggested above? You could safely net a Marantz PM5004(16k) + either of Tannoy Mercury v4/Wharfedale 9.1-10.1/PSB Alpha B1 (13-16k). Use your HTPCs for the time being.
@Sei why not drop in at my place and see for yourself if the 5.1 sounds better or a simple stereo setup? I have a similarly small room (9ft x 10ft) for the stereo setup. 5.1 would really be a waste in such a small space.
 
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@sarang, I'm so glad you replied in this thread. I was going to message you yesterday but I forgot. I've been reading mixed reviews all over. I'm currently quite busy but I would love to audition your setup in the coming weeks.


The prices you have quoted - are they available in Pune for outright purchase? Also, if I want, can I add more speakers and upgrade to a 5.1 setup in the future?
 
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@Sei one more place to consider would be Audio Palace on MG Road Camp. He has some Denons in his shop and can provide other models on request. Though I found his rates to be little higher than mumbai rates.... you can still check it out and bargain later...
 
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Audio Palace is a sort of rip off for HT stuff. Stay away, if you want proper bill n warranty. Try SoundFactor - East Street, Aquarius East Street and for PSB/NAD/Marantz Lakozy (Rohit Enterprises) Shukravar Peth. AVX is a good place as well and you've already seen it.

The Marantz would be slightly more expensive locally, the speakers are available at those prices. Recently bought a Alpha B1 for a friend for ~16k. You can always get an AVR later and add other speakers (Center/Surr/Sub).

Sei said:
sarang, I'm so glad you replied in this thread. I was going to message you yesterday but I forgot. I've been reading mixed reviews all over. I'm currently quite busy but I would love to audition your setup in the coming weeks.


The prices you have quoted - are they available in Pune for outright purchase? Also, if I want, can I add more speakers and upgrade to a 5.1 setup in the future?
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