Need help with double glazing, UPVC windows

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Casement for large rooms where space for opening will not be a hindrance (with Mosquito Net) unless you use valcero on the frame itself... ..

Will upload a pic soon...

EDIT: -

Here are the pictures....

Need to change 4x of these...






As you can see they are casement type but quite large, The wood is going bad due to direct sunlight as its west facing..

Options other than Fenesta...

http://www.lingelwindows.com/

http://www.veka.in/

http://www.koemmerling.co.in/

http://www.lghausys.com/in/product/windows/upvc-windows.jsp

http://www.magnusupvc.com/

http://www.fbs.co.in/index.php

http://www.rehau.com/in-hi/

http://www.duroplast.org/
 
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@gauravH , @HailStonE , Any idea how beneficial and effective are fabricated glass viz-a-viz dg glass? I had the person from lingel fabricators to take measurements and he told me the difference is marginal. But how much is it in terms of cost?

@HailStonE, this was his reply to your query.

I wouldn't say no, looks like things can be worked out. But since its a wooden frame he shall have to remove out the window and put a marble stone on the border just like your window sills.
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^^ i have no knowledge of the effectiveness of fabricated glass and i never heard of DG glass before. all searches point to Dolce&Gabbana :D

all i know is that factory-made dual pane windows are far effective as the glass seal is uniform.
 
gauravH said:
^^ i have no knowledge of the effectiveness of fabricated glass and i never heard of DG glass before. all searches point to Dolce&Gabbana :D

all i know is that factory-made dual pane windows are far effective as the glass seal is uniform.
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When i asked him he said the difference between DG and fabricated glass is that in the former the 2 glass panes are seperated by 'dry air' while in the latter you have a laminated sheet which in effect would be equivalent to 3 glass panes. I wanted to know how effective are the two types wrt each other while keeping costs in check.

Wouldn't all uPVC windows be factory made? After all they take the dimensions and your style requirements and then tailor it to meet them effectively in the factory, don't they?
 
i've seen the effectiveness of Argon-filled dual pane windows and they are good for both sound and weather insulation. gas (or air) creates a good heat insulation and the same mechanism prevents mist formation in winters. dual panes should be more effective in sound insulation because they can absorb vibrations easily. ask your fabricator if by dry air he meant Argon or Krypton gas... as using air inside dual panes is meaningless.

though i haven't seen the fabricated glass up close but if i rely on your fabricator's definition then it should be similar to a car windshield. with a lamination in between, it becomes a sandwich of 3 panes. it's possible that for home use, this sheet of lamination is much thicker. but i have no real experience with them.

uPVC: ideally, when ordering from a reputed company, there shouldn't be a difference between readymade and customized windows but i am always apprehensive about the indian quality. so far, i've used only the standard sizes.

please pay attention to your window frame as well. factory made windows have their own frames which are vibration and weather resistant. your existing frame may not be that effective in these areas. just focussing on the type of glass may not serve your purpose well. installers from big companies stress upon mending the existing frames. to cut corners, some local installers put paper/cardboard in the uPVC frames.

as it's going to be an important change in your house, i'd suggest you to check out the installations carried out by your fabricator. order it only if you are satisfied with their work. i am not sure about your area but here in Gurgaon, these fabricators happily take you to client locations to show their work.
 
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@gauravH, @HailStonE
Ok, so I got a quotation from one of the dealers. He is providing me with 5-10-5 clear toughened glass. Would this be fine? I think i should go for laminated ones as it provides better
sound dampening property. Besides, what should be the breakup of the glass viz-a-viz gap between them. I mean is 5-10-5 better than 6-4-6? How exactly is this ratio calculated?
 
i don't think those figures denote a gap in the laminated glass... it must be the thickness of resin sheet (lamination) between two layers of glass. if the numbers are in mm then one option has too thick lamination (10) and another is just okay (4). there's a difference of just 1 mm for glass between both the options, so the overall thicker glass (5-10-5) would be better.
 
gauravH said:
i don't think those figures denote a gap in the laminated glass... it must be the thickness of resin sheet (lamination) between two layers of glass. if the numbers are in mm then one option has too thick lamination (10) and another is just okay (4). there's a difference of just 1 mm for glass between both the options, so the overall thicker glass (5-10-5) would be better.
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The above mentioned spacing was for DG glass. Besides 6-4-6 was just my own rough approx since it is generally said that thicker the glass the better sound reflection. Besides its been mentioned to go with asymmetrical glazing to achieve better noise insulation hence tinkering with the thickness. Now that he has quoted me for ''12mm laminated glass'' I am confused. How exactly would the breakup be done because in DG its 5-10-5 so clear distinction is present but not for laminated glass.
Any thoughts on this one? And you were right, laminated sheets similar to the ones in windshield, I lack my exposure in this field.
 
Tejas01 said:
I think i should go for laminated ones as it provides better
sound dampening property.
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i didn't understand your query... are you getting a air filled dual pane glass but with lamination?

Tejas01 said:
Now that he has quoted me for ''12mm laminated glass'' I am confused.
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for me 12 mm laminated glass means a sandwich of: 4mm glass|4mm resin|4mm glass... or 5mm glass|2mm resin|5mm glass... or any such combination.

if this lamination thing has altogether a different meaning for your fabricator? is he referring to sun/privacy/clear film coated glass as laminated glass?
 
gauravH said:
i didn't understand your query... are you getting a air filled dual pane glass but with lamination?

for me 12 mm laminated glass means a sandwich of: 4mm glass|4mm resin|4mm glass... or 5mm glass|2mm resin|5mm glass... or any such combination.

if this lamination thing has altogether a different meaning for your fabricator? is he referring to sun/privacy/clear film coated glass as laminated glass?
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No No, I have fixed up on 2 dealers who are providing me with following PVB(laminated sheets) dimensions-
1. "5mm Frosted +1.52 PVB+5+10 AGP+5 Clear Toughened Glass" (Can you help me understanding this dimension)
2. "6 mm glass + 1.52 mm PVB film (Polyvinyl Butyral) + ‎6 "(This dimension makes sense to me)
The former one is provided by Lingel fabricators while the later one is by Kommerling. Do you have any idea, knowledge as to which one is better in the long run. I am confused between the two companies.

Edit: yes you were right. He is providing me with 5 mm inner frame + 1.52 mm PVB resin gap + 5 mm + 10mm Air gap + 5mm outer frame. He told me that it would provide both thermal insulation(hence air gap) as well as noise insulation(hence PVB sheet). Any idea on these new changes?
 
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the first option sounds like "insulated dual pane glass"... the outer frame insulates the whole window which extends the life of window as a whole unit. i've no idea about the term AGP... could be something proprietary. in general, more gap between the panes means better insulation.

both of your fabricators are well known; so it'll be difficult to choose one without seeing their products in person. just check out the quality/size of the seals from both of them. also, they should've some in-shop setup to showcase/demo their stuff.
 
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gauravH said:
the first option sounds like "insulated dual pane glass"... the outer frame insulates the whole window which extends the life of window as a whole unit. i've no idea about the term AGP... could be something proprietary. in general, more gap between the panes means better insulation.

both of your fabricators are well known; so it'll be difficult to choose one without seeing their products in person. just check out the quality/size of the seals from both of them. also, they should've some in-shop setup to showcase/demo their stuff.
Click to expand...

Any idea why Veka AG is so costly? They are quoting me around roughly 85k + for my specifications while Kommerling and Lingel are around 20k cheaper. Such a massive difference has really left me confused. I know Veka has a brand name so its bound to be costly but I presume that the main reason apart from brand are material used which increases the price. The original quote from Veka is Ru 76,649 excluding 12.5% Vat+ 12.36% for service work.
 
veka 2000/sq feet(balcony) 5113(bathroom)
kommerling 1634.01(balcony) 1996.67(bathroom)
lingel 1524.29(balcony) 1996.67(bathroom)
All dimensions in /sq feet. Besides only Kommerling provided the actual /sq feet rate while others I calculated manually. The bathroom rate has been provided only by veka and Kommerling as DGU was not mentioned in the quote by lingel.
 
@Criminal, @HailStonE
I have finally ordered the windows from Lingel which were set up yesterday. However one of them is damaged(it has a fracture, refer the photo). So I wanted to get it replaced with a new one. However there is a clause in the agreement which states
"Any Demarcations/scratches/damages on windows & doors during masonry works shall be replaced only on request and the costs incured to be borne by the customer"
Now I am worried that will I have to borne the expenses for a new one despite the product being damaged during transit. This was confirmed by the guy from the installation team. That would be utterly ridiculous.
front_fracture.jpg Rear view fracture.jpg

I have dispatched a mail to both person in charge Mumbai division and the main head of the company, Mario Schmidt stating the damages. Is there anything else I should be looking for?
 
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^^ i've lived in houses with uPVC doors and windows but can't comment on the effectiveness of the doors. none of the doors were exposed to any noises, so i've no experience in gauging their performance.

in my current house with solid wooden doors, i was able to dampen the noise by fixing the gaps. i am going to upholster the doors this winter to take care of the vibration issues. i'll also use some weather-stripping.

people look for alternatives to wooden windows because windows are more exposed to the environment in comparison to the doors. windows are supposed to provide light and air, so one cannot cover them up to the same extent as doors. i think you can first try fixing your existing door before investing in a new uPVC door. also, the door frame plays a great role in minimizing the noise. so, replacing the door while keeping the existing frame in place won't help much.
 
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Criminal said:
^^ i've lived in houses with uPVC doors and windows but can't comment on the effectiveness of the doors. none of the doors were exposed to any noises, so i've no experience in gauging their performance.

in my current house with solid wooden doors, i was able to dampen the noise by fixing the gaps. i am going to upholster the doors this winter to take care of the vibration issues. i'll also use some weather-stripping.

people look for alternatives to wooden windows because windows are more exposed to the environment in comparison to the doors. windows are supposed to provide light and air, so one cannot cover them up to the same extent as doors. i think you can first try fixing your existing door before investing in a new uPVC door. also, the door frame plays a great role in minimizing the noise. so, replacing the door while keeping the existing frame in place won't help much.
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I agree to your point. For the current door there exists sizable gap at the bottom and a tiny amount at the top which leads to leakage. How did you manage to fix the gaps? Any suggestions for the same?And how you intend to take care of the vibration issue?
I did ask the fenestration person if he could suggest me some measures to dampen noise from the door. He couldn't. We intend to ask the main dealer but he would propose for UPVC door. I do not want to rely on a single solution unless deemed necessary and would try something else.
Is it possible to change the frame keeping the door intact?
The issue in my case is that the adjacent hall is close to my door so all the noise from TV, ppl easily infiltrate into my room. And it gets further compounded when I close all my windows only to realise noise coming in from the door.
 
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