Graphic Cards Nvidia kills GTX285, GTX275, GTX260

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^^ And I also gave reasons why they will drop it (i.e if they are sensible). My reasons are just as good as yours. You cannot claim that your reasons are completely non-speculative, especially if are assuming that GT300 is going to be a sure shot success even before you even saw a single retail chip in action and that labrree will flop.
Then on what basis are saying that your reasons are based on reality while mine are not?

You cannot deny that AMD and Intel have a definite strategic advantage unless you go into the realm of speculation and assume that they that they will not be able to make much of it. You cannot deny that if they are indeed going to make something of it, the only way that nVidia would escape sudden extinction is that they venture into other areas where they establish their dominance. You cannot deny that they will need a lot of investments for that.

Also by your last statement do you mean to imply that nVidia has unlimited funds to invest. Their investments are fixed, it just means that they want to move past GPU's they have to divert their funds from what they are currently investing that in which automatically means less research/work on pure GPU architectures. That is what I am calling reduced focus. If their alternative strategy becomes successful and they stand to profit from it, its a matter of business sense that they will push most of their investments into that and completely pull of from a business that they are not getting as much at they would expect.

As I said, my own company has landed in a similar dire situation after enjoying a more major and longer market dominance (in the respective field) than nVidia ever did in its. So if I were a well wisher for nVidia (which I am after having had used so many nVidia GPU's in the last 11 years, though I am not a nVidia fanboi since I bought a few ATi GPU's as well ;)), I would hope that they would take such drastic steps as would secure their future.
 
whatever it is.......

at the end of the day it is just speculation.........no hard facts no bold claims nothing just assumption though some obvious and some not so obvious

though i agree that nvidia sees more profits with less investment in areas less ventured like tegra and also in areas where there is tremendrous profits but require a lot of investments like gpgpu

its a wait and watch game guys

but one thing is sure that nvidia wont leave the 3d games as long 3d games are being made on pc's cos their market share and the brand name nvidia is enough to drive then atleast for the next 5 years in my opinion

they might lower the investments in this area they might change their strategies, they might play catch up with ati(if "Hecatoncheires" codename for next generation dx11 gpu's are successful)

but they just wont leave the business

again even i cant be sure of this........no one can be sure off............cos no one can prophesize the future we can only predict........

good night guys sweet dreams...:)
 
Lord Nemesis said:
Then on what basis are saying that your reasons are based on reality while mine are not?
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nvidia has said that they are not leaving the high end gpu business. fact.

just because they said it now, that doesn't mean it will hold in the future. this is true. but you are claiming that they WILL drop the gpu business. that is speculation.

nvidia has the largest gpu marketshare in the world. fact.

gt300 can/will fail causing them financial problems. speculation.

nvidia is very strong financially. fact.

ati/intel have a top secret masterplan that gives them strategic advantage and will somehow destroy nvidia's advantage. speculation.

Lord Nemesis said:
You cannot deny that AMD and Intel have a definite strategic advantage unless you go into the realm of speculation and assume that they that they will not be able to make much of it.
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tell me what this definite strategic advantage is that guarantees nvidia's death in the gpu market in the next 2-3 years? from what i know, all 3 companies have been around for a while, and nothing has suddenly changed.

Lord Nemesis said:
Also by your last statement do you mean to imply that nVidia has unlimited funds to invest. Their investments are fixed, it just means that they want to move past GPU's they have to divert their funds from what they are currently investing that in which automatically means less research/work on pure GPU architectures. That is what I am calling reduced focus.
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except, you never said it was going to be a reduced focus. you said that their gpu business would be a negligible focus. implying they would work on other things rather than the gpu business. companies can have multiple products for multiple markets you know. expanding markets/scope of a company doesn't necessarily mean that the older market has to be abandoned.
 
Remember you and me are talking about the future and this is what you want to speculate from your facts while I am speculating differently from mine.

spindoctor said:
nvidia has said that they are not leaving the high end gpu business. fact. So they will not leave that business (speculation)

just because they said it now, that doesn't mean it will hold in the future. this is true. but you are claiming that they WILL drop the gpu business. that is speculation.

nvidia has the largest gpu marketshare in the world. fact. So it will stay that way always regardless of the situation (speculation)

gt300 can/will fail causing them financial problems. speculation.

nvidia is very strong financially. fact. so it will stay that way always (speculation)

ati/intel have a top secret masterplan that gives them strategic advantage and will somehow destroy nvidia's advantage. speculation.
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spindoctor said:
tell me what this definite strategic advantage is that guarantees nvidia's death in the gpu market in the next 2-3 years? from what i know, all 3 companies have been around for a while, and nothing has suddenly changed.
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Both AMD and Intel have general purose multi core CPU design capabilities, both have GPU design capabilities. This is a major thing and alows these companies integrate GPU cores into a CPU or in case of AMD even design better and cost efficient GPU's.

nVidia has only GPU design capabilties in contrast. In addtion both these companies have plans to integrate high end GPU capabilties on to CPU's. This is a major strategic advantage for both these companies. In addition both AMD and Intel make their own chipsets. nVidia has bot been very successful in this are recently (at least on the Intel front). Their chip set licenses work because of agreements. If Intel and AMD choose to alienate nVidia (which is very unlikely), they can easily do that. They have their own GPU's, Chipsets and CPU's. You would be fooling yourself if you think nVidia is not worried about all this.

spindoctor said:
except, you never said it was going to be a reduced focus. you said that their gpu business would be a negligible focus. implying they would work on other things rather than the gpu business. companies can have multiple products for multiple markets you know. expanding markets/scope of a company doesn't necessarily mean that the older market has to be abandoned.
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The next step of reduced focus is obviously neglibible foucs which is bound to happen unless their main game plan fails and they are forced to rely on GPU sales again. Also this is not an area where you put a one time investment and its going to pay off for the rest of the time. They have a fixed amout to invest and either they put it all on GPU's or divert some of it on to other projects. If they reduce investment form GPU's for other other projects, the GPU design is obviously going to suffer that much. Remember every time cost to create a design a new and more complicated GPU always increases, that's why they will shift the focus gradually, not all of a sudden. What they are trying to do right now is to convert their GPU technology into a more generic processor/co-processor. They will start adding non GPU features gradually at the expense of GPU specific features so that they can keep selling it off as a GPU to the bulk of the desktop market while at the same time targeting their other market. At some break even point, it will cease to be a GPU.
 
@Lord Nemesis: It was very nice reading posts by both of you at first, but honestly, don't you think last few posts have been... erm... essentially sort of re-runs of the show.

I understand your point, that main crux of both of you's debate was based on speculations, which were derived from past market trends and current scenarios. But don't you think, tell me honestly, it's time to drop the topic, when despite your constant requests other party haven't bring forth anything that is substantial fact? or provided just few PR words, without any numbers or market fact to back them, labeled as fact?

Do carry on this debate if you really wish... just thought I would relay my thought to you seeing how this is going already (from past few posts).... maybe it's just me, but the word Deja vu comes to my mind.
 
^^ Well both of us are just speculating about the future based on some facts we have, but while I have my facts separate from speculation, spin doctor wants to include his speculations in his facts. :hap5: He wants me to prove my speculations as facts while he already assumed his speculations to be proven facts.

In any case, I see already see that there is no point in making further comments on the topic other repeating the same things again. So that was my last post on the topic.
 
you entire argument is that things might change in the future. but your conclusion is based on the predicate that it will happen.

nvidia's gt300 might fail. they might leave the business. they might not be the world leader in marketshare. they might lose money. all this might happen.

and then you say that nvidia will drop focus from the gpu. because, somehow you know the future where everything that might happen to nvidia actually will happen.
 
Eh both of you guys cut some slack already!

nVidia hasn't killed the GT2XX series cards yet and that's fine.
 
AnandTech said:
At the end of our Radeon HD 5850 Review we included this update:

“Update: We went window shopping again this afternoon to see if there were any GTX 285 price changes. There weren't. In fact GTX 285 supply seems pretty low; MWave, ZipZoomFly, and Newegg only have a few models in stock. We asked NVIDIA about this, but all they had to say was "demand remains strong". Given the timing, we're still suspicious that something may be afoot.”
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AnandTech said:
NVIDIA could get into a price war with AMD, but given that both companies make their chips at the same place, and NVIDIA’s costs are higher - it’s not a war that makes sense to fight.

NVIDIA told me two things. One, that they have shared with some OEMs that they will no longer be making GT200b based products. That’s the GTX 260 all the way up to the GTX 285. The EOL (end of life) notices went out recently and they request that the OEMs submit their allocation requests asap otherwise they risk not getting any cards.

The second was that despite the EOL notices, end users should be able to purchase GeForce GTX 260, 275 and 285 cards all the way up through February of next year.

If you look carefully, neither of these statements directly supports or refutes the two articles above. NVIDIA is very clever.
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AnandTech: NVIDIA's Bumpy Ride: A Q4 2009 Update :P
 
this points to two things

either nvidia has fermi boards ready so they are making space for them in the market

or they cant lower the prices any lower for the gtx series or else they will be selling for loss..........so i guess they decided that not selling is better than selling for loss
 
Hi,
Well it just could be that Nvidia is preparing for a future and playing a wait n watch while it works on different segment. The entire thing about GPUs moving inside CPUs will definitely change things. With further Technology scaling integrated GPUs will become more powerful. So targeting only GPU card may not work well financially. So its targeting a GPGPU which might create a new segment with high profit potential. Nvidia will have advantage in it if it moves early, and hence the diversion. It dosent mean it will abandon High segment GPUs. It dosent necessarily need to do complete new design. It can increase shaders and processing cores and phsycsX core n the general processing cores. Thus Nvdia can play with it and still bring performing GPUs:ohyeah:. Well one extreme way to see it could be Nvidia may be ;) entering some processor segment!!! :ohyeah:

So in short its getting ready for future without suddenly stepping out from GPUs. I think GTX 300 could come out by Dec! ;) u never know!!
 
taher said:
this points to two things

either nvidia has fermi boards ready so they are making space for them in the market

or they cant lower the prices any lower for the gtx series or else they will be selling for loss..........so i guess they decided that not selling is better than selling for loss
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all signs indicate that it is the latter. if nvidia had fermi boards ready, there would be a lot more noise about them as they would leak specs/benchmarks etc. to stop people from heading to the ati camp. lowering production of an old model when a new one is about to come out makes sense though, so let's see what happens.
 
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