Random IEM / Headphone Rants
- Thread starter esanthosh
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having used the HD650 for a month now i can say, While other headphones may have some aspects better than HD650 , , but when listening to music, HD650 reigns supreme.
yeah its colored , treble is laid back , certainly not neutral. but what they have very natural presentation , drums are placed at a distance , vocals are forward, just great imaging and soundstage.
while i do feel the bass is somewhat loose, compared to HE6 and Miracle , but great value for money, IMO.
at first i thought i might sell them after i get the LCD2/3 ( not near future) , but now their great soundstage has me thinking .
@santosh, will post pics and a short note on the i.sound soon. It lasts horribly long is what i can say, as of now, charge once and forget.
yeah its colored , treble is laid back , certainly not neutral. but what they have very natural presentation , drums are placed at a distance , vocals are forward, just great imaging and soundstage.
while i do feel the bass is somewhat loose, compared to HE6 and Miracle , but great value for money, IMO.
at first i thought i might sell them after i get the LCD2/3 ( not near future) , but now their great soundstage has me thinking .
@santosh, will post pics and a short note on the i.sound soon. It lasts horribly long is what i can say, as of now, charge once and forget.
esanthosh
Herald
After owning MS1i for nearly 20 months and PMX-60 for over 2 years, I finally decided to "burn" them in :ashamed:
And in the process, get Burson HA-160 do the manufacturer recommended 'burn-in'. I am not sure how many hours are recommended, but it's going to finish 200 hours before my next not-so-exciting headphone hits home.
For the last 2-3 weeks, I've been scratching my head about the sudden noise in STX's output. No matter what I tried, there was background hiss and the output was terribly low via headphone out as well as RCA out to Burson. I did not remember it to be like this, because it fed my speaker setup just fine for so long. I've also used it for comparing a few headphones long back. Last night post mid-night, I was reading head-fi and found out another person had the same issue. One of the recommendations was to check if mic was switched on. I had already tried every other thing mentioned (remove card, re-insert op-amps, re-insert card, check power supply etc.,). I suddenly remember that I had switched on the Mic for checking out RMAA last month and had forgotten about it. Great relief once I fixed it around 1 AM. Now that I have fixed the source side of things, time to do a shoot-out later on...
@strategy,
Looking forward to your i.sound notes. I am still forced to look at Energizer, but they haven't got back to me on a few technicalities yet. Hopefully, I should complete my brick-stack by the end of the year.
And in the process, get Burson HA-160 do the manufacturer recommended 'burn-in'. I am not sure how many hours are recommended, but it's going to finish 200 hours before my next not-so-exciting headphone hits home.
For the last 2-3 weeks, I've been scratching my head about the sudden noise in STX's output. No matter what I tried, there was background hiss and the output was terribly low via headphone out as well as RCA out to Burson. I did not remember it to be like this, because it fed my speaker setup just fine for so long. I've also used it for comparing a few headphones long back. Last night post mid-night, I was reading head-fi and found out another person had the same issue. One of the recommendations was to check if mic was switched on. I had already tried every other thing mentioned (remove card, re-insert op-amps, re-insert card, check power supply etc.,). I suddenly remember that I had switched on the Mic for checking out RMAA last month and had forgotten about it. Great relief once I fixed it around 1 AM. Now that I have fixed the source side of things, time to do a shoot-out later on...
@strategy,
Looking forward to your i.sound notes. I am still forced to look at Energizer, but they haven't got back to me on a few technicalities yet. Hopefully, I should complete my brick-stack by the end of the year.
esanthosh
Herald
Got my not-so-interesting headphone yesterday. Thanks to bennysachdev for getting them for me and later, BF1983 for shipping them.
There were the usual power cuts and the rain and hence could not try the Burson. So, had to resort to using the HD600 with my brick-stack of QA350: Digital Out -> UHA-6S first. UHA-6S in high gain mode had enough to drive the HD600 to my listening levels at 10 'o clock. From what I've heard, I won't say that HD600 is the be-all-and-by-all of headphones, but it is a nice all rounder. These days, I am staying off the routine of running test tracks, so I just listened to whatever album I wanted to listen. The combo, despite not being a proper desktop setup, sounded really nice. While ideally I'd have liked a bit more at both ends (a bit more sparkle for my treble-head), HD600 did not disappoint me at all. There were no terrible weaknesses that jumped at me nor was there any issues with the overall frequency balance or sound stage + imaging. The only problem was the 1/4" to 1/8" cable I was using. I need to get that cheap eBay adapter soon. I even thought of getting the original HD600 cable (which I think has the 3.5mm termination) or have a shorter custom cable made with 3.5mm plug. But, that's an option to think about if I end up (or forced to - due to power cuts) using my transportable combo more often than not with HD600.
Early today morning, I tried them via STX (49720NA x 2 -> LN6172) -> Burson HA-160. This was an even better combo for HD600. So far, I have not written anything about the Burson much. That largely has to do with the fact that I am not good at judging things stand-alone. If I had a few amps to compare, probably I would have figured what Burson does better or worse in relation. But, as of now, I can only say that I liked this chain. I am not sure if it's just me, but I feel that despite being a "lowly" sound card, STX has been a good source and the DACs I've tried so far have not been hugely satisfactory. I am thinking long and hard about getting a 'better' DAC, just not sure what it is.
Changing topic.....
When head-fi has a thread like this - REVIEW: The best headphone/amp combo known to man
I react like this
These guys were doing some mods on the Bravo amps. Guess they extended that experience into building a similar tube amplifier. But that review's title is a little too misleading
There were the usual power cuts and the rain and hence could not try the Burson. So, had to resort to using the HD600 with my brick-stack of QA350: Digital Out -> UHA-6S first. UHA-6S in high gain mode had enough to drive the HD600 to my listening levels at 10 'o clock. From what I've heard, I won't say that HD600 is the be-all-and-by-all of headphones, but it is a nice all rounder. These days, I am staying off the routine of running test tracks, so I just listened to whatever album I wanted to listen. The combo, despite not being a proper desktop setup, sounded really nice. While ideally I'd have liked a bit more at both ends (a bit more sparkle for my treble-head), HD600 did not disappoint me at all. There were no terrible weaknesses that jumped at me nor was there any issues with the overall frequency balance or sound stage + imaging. The only problem was the 1/4" to 1/8" cable I was using. I need to get that cheap eBay adapter soon. I even thought of getting the original HD600 cable (which I think has the 3.5mm termination) or have a shorter custom cable made with 3.5mm plug. But, that's an option to think about if I end up (or forced to - due to power cuts) using my transportable combo more often than not with HD600.
Early today morning, I tried them via STX (49720NA x 2 -> LN6172) -> Burson HA-160. This was an even better combo for HD600. So far, I have not written anything about the Burson much. That largely has to do with the fact that I am not good at judging things stand-alone. If I had a few amps to compare, probably I would have figured what Burson does better or worse in relation. But, as of now, I can only say that I liked this chain. I am not sure if it's just me, but I feel that despite being a "lowly" sound card, STX has been a good source and the DACs I've tried so far have not been hugely satisfactory. I am thinking long and hard about getting a 'better' DAC, just not sure what it is.
Changing topic.....
When head-fi has a thread like this - REVIEW: The best headphone/amp combo known to man
I react like this
These guys were doing some mods on the Bravo amps. Guess they extended that experience into building a similar tube amplifier. But that review's title is a little too misleading
titana
Forerunner
Good to see the talk finally drifting to full-sized headphones.
I owned the HD580 with HD600 grilles (effectively an HD600) for about a year & it remains my favorite dynamic headphone.
The HD650 is technically even better, much smoother & refined, & if one can build a synergistic system around it can probably scale even better.
I owned the HD580 with HD600 grilles (effectively an HD600) for about a year & it remains my favorite dynamic headphone.
The HD650 is technically even better, much smoother & refined, & if one can build a synergistic system around it can probably scale even better.
bennysachdev
Discoverer
Wow, i'm kinda disappointed with your reaction for the HD600. I mean they aren't a revelation when it comes to headphones but they are one pair of headphones that scales really well hooked into a good rig. Probably you can try MS2(if you still have it) -> Burson -> HD600(to add that treble sparkle as the ms2 is brighter than the STX)
I had them for close to a month before I sent them off to you and there was never a moment when I had them on, that I did not think of changing my mind. Hehe. Sowweee.
To me they sound very neutral, very in between(not too harsh, not too laidback in any part of the spectrum), the perfect headphone which does not do anything perfectly. Lol. They are more comfy then my Denon's D5k(cause I wear specks and the senns somehow sit comfy on my head). Everything about them is replaceable.
I had them for close to a month before I sent them off to you and there was never a moment when I had them on, that I did not think of changing my mind. Hehe. Sowweee.
To me they sound very neutral, very in between(not too harsh, not too laidback in any part of the spectrum), the perfect headphone which does not do anything perfectly. Lol. They are more comfy then my Denon's D5k(cause I wear specks and the senns somehow sit comfy on my head). Everything about them is replaceable.
esanthosh
Herald
^ Nothing much to do with source / treble sparkle, but more to do with the fact that I am not really that excitable any more with respect to headphones or IEMs. You can try giving me LCD-3. I'll have the same unexciting reaction
Read : If I don't complain, it must be good to my ears.
Yep! HD600 is somewhat of a jack of all trades. It does everything well, does not excel greatly in any one area, yet as a whole package, it impresses far more than most.
Read : If I don't complain, it must be good to my ears.
Yep! HD600 is somewhat of a jack of all trades. It does everything well, does not excel greatly in any one area, yet as a whole package, it impresses far more than most.
titana
Forerunner
esanthosh said:
I still have DT880(It came as a gift so I am not inclined to sell it) however my opinion of the beyer has dwindled since I have ventured into higher end orthos & the EHHA came along.
When I had the HD580 , I thought that the DT880 had comparatively more energy at top end & better extension in sub-bass. The mids were no contest, the HD580 was clearly superior.That was the impression with the STX headphone out, a tube amp would help with the excess treble energy & sweeten up the dry mids but you already have the Burson.
In any case, I won't recommend it as a replacement for a grado. I never liked the build quality of the grados though.
Brendon
Galvanizer
Well glad to know it reached you safely. Yes I too liked the headphones. So much so that I realised my HD650 pads are not in the best of shape. So I am spending 3.5k just to buy replacement pads for them.
Was thinking of getting a replacement cable for the HD650 but I am not convinced that it would sound better than the stock cable as most replacement cables are pretty pricy.
Was thinking of getting a replacement cable for the HD650 but I am not convinced that it would sound better than the stock cable as most replacement cables are pretty pricy.
esanthosh
Herald
^ I doubt cables will affect the SQ that much. But I was considering them more as a matter of convenience. The stock cable length is good enough when I am using the Burson because you need at least that length to move about freely. However when I am using the QA-UHA combo, it's difficult to walk with a long cable . It's either on my desk or in my hand while walking. I'd suppose about 3ft of cable with 3.5mm termination should do the job just fine. I checked the cost of replacement cables and they all cost a bomb :O
I learned that my HD600 is the older model, which means it's supposedly not bright and clear as the newer versions. Also, according to one poster, old HD600 and old HD650 would sound much closer than the newer ones. More on this here. The "brightness" of new ones and the 'smoothness' of old ones may just be due to age, wear and tear though!
Considering the age of the headphones, they are in very good condition. I have them right now and ran a few test tones from the QLS-UHA combo as well as STX->Burson combo. It has a slight dip around the sibilance range (5-7Khz) and there's some drop after that too significantly at 10Khz - something this graph corroborates. In a way, it's the reverse of CK10 with respect to 10Khz. Where CK10 had a terrific spike, it has a dip, hence the rendering of cymbals is a lot different between the two.
I am so used to IEMs spiking up the 5Khz and 8Khz ranges in order to give more 'details'. But this kind of 5-7Khz dip is very rare to come across. From memory, I have observed something of this sort with PX-80 as well as Hippo Pearl. In fact, PX80 was my primary headphone for a long while. I was so used to the sibilance free sound that I had a hard time getting used to RE0. I did not much terms back then, I was thinking 'why the f*** is he sssss-ing so much in this ear phone?'. On one hand, this ensures long fatigue free sessions, especially with sibilance prone recordings. But, on the flip side, a slight 'bite' is missing at times.
Moving to lower ranges, I don't feel much below 40Hz. With the Burson, I am able to hear the 31Hz tone and hence bass response is better with the desktop setup (may be just a question of loudness?). I wonder how HD600 will respond to EQ. If the difference between the 'old' and the 'new' driver is one of tuning, I should be able to match it with EQ by filling the dips and flattening the curve. Edit: Did try EQ. Increasing the 10Khz and above range + a slight uptick of 1.2K, 5K in foobar "fixed" lot of things.
In general, HD600 is snappy, very balanced and good with the sound stage and imaging. I've mentioned about sound stage height a few times with IEMs, but with a headphone a sound stage height and depth are much easier to feel. Among the headphones I've heard, I knew that AD700 had width, but none so far with a well rounded sound stage like this. With certain parts in the music, I felt that I could not hear the micro-details clearly. May be it's just the infamous "sennheiser veil" people talk about.
For now, I would say this - HD600 feels a whole lot balanced, but the meat is still in the mid range. I've not heard a whole lot of headphones, so it's tough to say where I'd place it. Among the ones I have, I already like certain things better than the MS1i, though I'd like to confirm it after long hours of listening and some A:B. I feel that HD600 is somewhat equivalent to the tier occupied by GR07 and the ilk - better than most, but not the best. I can also say that it's much easier for somebody to have HD600 as their only headphone for a long time. I'd need a bit more time to see if I can fall in that category or not.
. It's either on my desk or in my hand while walking. I'd suppose about 3ft of cable with 3.5mm termination should do the job just fine. I checked the cost of replacement cables and they all cost a bomb :OI learned that my HD600 is the older model, which means it's supposedly not bright and clear as the newer versions. Also, according to one poster, old HD600 and old HD650 would sound much closer than the newer ones. More on this here. The "brightness" of new ones and the 'smoothness' of old ones may just be due to age, wear and tear though!
Considering the age of the headphones, they are in very good condition. I have them right now and ran a few test tones from the QLS-UHA combo as well as STX->Burson combo. It has a slight dip around the sibilance range (5-7Khz) and there's some drop after that too significantly at 10Khz - something this graph corroborates. In a way, it's the reverse of CK10 with respect to 10Khz. Where CK10 had a terrific spike, it has a dip, hence the rendering of cymbals is a lot different between the two.
I am so used to IEMs spiking up the 5Khz and 8Khz ranges in order to give more 'details'. But this kind of 5-7Khz dip is very rare to come across. From memory, I have observed something of this sort with PX-80 as well as Hippo Pearl. In fact, PX80 was my primary headphone for a long while. I was so used to the sibilance free sound that I had a hard time getting used to RE0. I did not much terms back then, I was thinking 'why the f*** is he sssss-ing so much in this ear phone?'. On one hand, this ensures long fatigue free sessions, especially with sibilance prone recordings. But, on the flip side, a slight 'bite' is missing at times.
Moving to lower ranges, I don't feel much below 40Hz. With the Burson, I am able to hear the 31Hz tone and hence bass response is better with the desktop setup (may be just a question of loudness?). I wonder how HD600 will respond to EQ. If the difference between the 'old' and the 'new' driver is one of tuning, I should be able to match it with EQ by filling the dips and flattening the curve. Edit: Did try EQ. Increasing the 10Khz and above range + a slight uptick of 1.2K, 5K in foobar "fixed" lot of things.
In general, HD600 is snappy, very balanced and good with the sound stage and imaging. I've mentioned about sound stage height a few times with IEMs, but with a headphone a sound stage height and depth are much easier to feel. Among the headphones I've heard, I knew that AD700 had width, but none so far with a well rounded sound stage like this. With certain parts in the music, I felt that I could not hear the micro-details clearly. May be it's just the infamous "sennheiser veil" people talk about.
For now, I would say this - HD600 feels a whole lot balanced, but the meat is still in the mid range. I've not heard a whole lot of headphones, so it's tough to say where I'd place it. Among the ones I have, I already like certain things better than the MS1i, though I'd like to confirm it after long hours of listening and some A:B. I feel that HD600 is somewhat equivalent to the tier occupied by GR07 and the ilk - better than most, but not the best. I can also say that it's much easier for somebody to have HD600 as their only headphone for a long time. I'd need a bit more time to see if I can fall in that category or not.
bennysachdev
Discoverer
After reading your post, all I can say is that your spot on about the sound sig of the hd600 and now I know your liking also.
If you ever go for really top tier cans, skip the lcd2, the hd650, the dt880 and go for the beyer tesla T1. The bright, analytical, perfect imaging nature of the T1 will suit ur taste better I feel.
If its between the dt880/990, got for the 990 as it is brighter.
If you ever go for really top tier cans, skip the lcd2, the hd650, the dt880 and go for the beyer tesla T1. The bright, analytical, perfect imaging nature of the T1 will suit ur taste better I feel.
If its between the dt880/990, got for the 990 as it is brighter.
bennysachdev
Discoverer
Just sold the protector and the p5 and got a burson ha-160 with beryllium copper power cable and a RCA to pallics 1/4" adapter for connecting it to the LO of the STX to the D5000.
Fingers crossed abt the SQ.
Fingers crossed abt the SQ.
esanthosh
Herald
I think I am the only one who has heard them so far.
I am not sure how Xears would cope up with running + travel. The reason being they are not that well built. That said XE200 comes with a "cloth cable", which seemed decent enough though I did not put it through any stress test. XE200 does not isolate too much either if isolation on travel is very important.
As far as SQ is concerned, I'd rate them high in the Xears line-up. I've heard about 7 of their IEMs + 2 of their discontinued Playaz models and this is the one which sounded the most balanced. It has lesser bass quantity compared to other Xears (if you were looking for bass, TDIII v2 / N3i), an open sound stage, slightly recessed but smooth mids, decent treble sparkle and detail, a typical Xears thick sound - in all, SQ wise a good deal for the price of 38 Euros. Has got more fans than many models in the long Xears appreciation thread.
@benny,
Waiting for your impressions. I've read somewhere that Burson improves with a better power cable, though I am not sure myself.
And......
Arrow 4G is back on the site. Claims 80 hours battery life with no voltage conversion :O (Low impedance headphones and IEMs?)
I am not sure how Xears would cope up with running + travel. The reason being they are not that well built. That said XE200 comes with a "cloth cable", which seemed decent enough though I did not put it through any stress test. XE200 does not isolate too much either if isolation on travel is very important.
As far as SQ is concerned, I'd rate them high in the Xears line-up. I've heard about 7 of their IEMs + 2 of their discontinued Playaz models and this is the one which sounded the most balanced. It has lesser bass quantity compared to other Xears (if you were looking for bass, TDIII v2 / N3i), an open sound stage, slightly recessed but smooth mids, decent treble sparkle and detail, a typical Xears thick sound - in all, SQ wise a good deal for the price of 38 Euros. Has got more fans than many models in the long Xears appreciation thread.
@benny,
Waiting for your impressions. I've read somewhere that Burson improves with a better power cable, though I am not sure myself.
And......
Arrow 4G is back on the site. Claims 80 hours battery life with no voltage conversion :O (Low impedance headphones and IEMs?)
esanthosh said:
SO which IEM would you recommend for running and travel? Decent SQ, genres = rock + some oldies, My Chemical Romance, Kings Of Leon, AC/DC, Police etc.
Budget = ~4k max. Don't mind ordering from outside as well.
--- Updated Post - Automerged ---
Ordered the HiSoundaudio Crystal 2 IEMs from eBay. Should be here in a week or so.
Not much into IEMs, curious to see how these pan out.
bennysachdev
Discoverer
I'm getting computer noise through the Burson. Its weird since I'm not getting the noise when i'm connecting my headphone to STX's HO.
Anyone has any ideas on how to get rid of computer noise?
I checked, my mic is disabled from the control panel.
Anyone has any ideas on how to get rid of computer noise?
I checked, my mic is disabled from the control panel.
esanthosh
Herald
Did you try Burson with any other source? Is this only with STX?
Somewhat related (?) issue: Asus Essence STX HDD Crosstalk
Somewhat related (?) issue: Asus Essence STX HDD Crosstalk
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