Times Now First Denies Airing Doctored Video, Then Concedes it Did

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drkrack said:
Gandhi stopped Non Cooperation movement because of violence & went to fast opposing it , his dedication to non violence was iconic. Neither Gandhiji or Bhagat singh did not harm those unmotivated fellow citizens. it is not comparable anyway.
Islamic terrorism cannot be justified by anyway, so is killing of Gandhiji, Burning of train with Karsevaks, Riots that followed it, Parliament attack or Dadri Lynching, Violence cannot be justified period. There is nothing called as Good Violence by civilians, Similarly anti national sloganeering or supporting a terror convict cannot be justified , So is Patiala HC violence !
If you justify one act of violence , the other will be automatically justified , I Just denounce all acts of violence, whether it is committed by Jaish or Gau Suraksha Dal.

I personally don't have any issues with anybody consuming anything , neither anybody consuming beef at their homes. The act of hosting a beef party (though you have a constitutional right to do so) is like trying to irritate a feelings of majority community. Similarly hosting a Pork party in front of a Masjid (again you have the right to do so) will be condemned, because they are acts to irritate a particular community in a communally sensitive country like India. It is not freedom of expression, but it is freedom to irritate the feelings of certain community to suit your political inclinations that's all. Which is what VHP & Bajarang Dal do all time , so no much difference.

We are not a Secular country ( Secularism without a Universal Civil code is a Joke !) nor a mature democracy ( The democracies we compare routinely with our own are at least 200 yrs older than us). The ruling party just supports the popular view at the time , so what saves the Minority from wrath of a Majority in case of a fallout ? it is the percentage of moderates & the Just thinkers in the Majority community ( Some places in India Hindus are in Majority, in Certain places Muslims are ). Because law enforcement agencies & evidence can be manipulated in a such a way that nobody could be punished. Take any Riot or acts of Mob violence in recent past, are the real culprits ever punished ? So prevention of such issues are better than trying to arguing on the basis of constitutional rights and freedom of expression etc.

The problem with our country is the believers of Communal harmony are not aggressive enough, it is time that practitioners of communal harmony be vocal and aggressive about its implementation nationwide and Denounce any forces that try to divide us . Until we mature our democracy to that level of tolerance some sensitive handling of such issues is mandatory.
Role of media is very important in a mature democracy, but unfortunately our media is very Manipulative, it destroys the news and tries to deduce conclusions in favor of the political party they support. Relying too much on media has been our biggest drawback in recent years.
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Our thoughts are so similar. If you think I am saying that Gandhiji and Bhagat Singh were terrorists or traitors then that's not what I am saying. I am saying that they were treated as such by the then government, because they were against such a regime.
Similarly there are people today who might protest peacefully for independence from the current Indian regime. You can't say that our regime is so perfect that there aren't people who are sick of it. So if there are a majority of people in an area in India who feel that way and want freedom from current Indian regime, you just can't say that because this would break the nation, they can't feel that way or fight for it.

You might say that they are being anti-national, but it won't be the first time a big country is splitting up due to gross incompetence in governance.

Having said all this, I don't think it is ever gonna happen that we will see an Independent Kashmir/North East and that's because as soon as India leaves them, they will be usurped by Pakistan and China. And this is something that the people over there need to contemplate on. Also the Indian govt should try and normalize life in those areas at the earliest. We should employ latest technologies to safeguard our borders so that cross border infiltration can be reduced to zero. All military should then be slowly moved to the borders so that the people can move about freely in their own cities. And this needs to be done ASAP and with lots of promotion so that the misguided people can see that change is in the air.
 
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rdst_1 said:
Our thoughts are so similar. If you think I am saying that Gandhiji and Bhagat Singh were terrorists or traitors then that's not what I am saying. I am saying that they were treated as such by the then government, because they were against such a regime.
Similarly there are people today who might protest peacefully for independence from the current Indian regime. You can't say that our regime is so perfect that there aren't people who are sick of it. So if there are a majority of people in an area in India who feel that way and want freedom from current Indian regime, you just can't say that because this would break the nation, they can't feel that way or fight for it.

You might say that they are being anti-national, but it won't be the first time a big country is splitting up due to gross incompetence in governance.

Having said all this, I don't think it is ever gonna happen that we will see an Independent Kashmir/North East and that's because as soon as India leaves them, they will be usurped by Pakistan and China. And this is something that the people over there need to contemplate on. Also the Indian govt should try and normalize life in those areas at the earliest. We should employ latest technologies to safeguard our borders so that cross border infiltration can be reduced to zero. All military should then be slowly moved to the borders so that the people can move about freely in their own cities. And this needs to be done ASAP and with lots of promotion so that the misguided people can see that change is in the air.
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No I didn't think that way, Other than the charges from respective Govts & the word "Freedom" nothing similar in Afzal etc Vs our esteemed freedom fighters. I am pretty confident that you know the difference.
Yes , we do think similar, you have already correctly pointed out my next argument , if Kashmir , Arunachal were to be free.

Our armed forces need to be strengthened, each and every soldier is precious for the country, we need latest technologies and some tactical spending in defense purchases , especially get rid of middlemen in such dealings. This achievement by current defense minister is noteworthy.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com...saved-rs-49300-crore/articleshow/51366381.cms

This is the kind of debate I was looking from JNU side, not pro Afzal demonstrations and sloganeering. It is the intellectual battle of highest order that every country has to fight on its own. Farmers are harassed to suicide for Loan of Rs 10000 Rs & Person with loan of 10000 Cr walks away unquestioned. This inequality in our system needs to be addressed, JNU seriously lost this great ideological battle by making it Ruling vs opposition debate !


But , again blaming a two year old Govt for everything bad in India currently & conveniently forgetting the 60 yrs of misrule is shear hypocrisy . Not a single mention of Congress misrule & atrocities either by Kanhaiyya or Sainath, just to suit your current political inclinations ? This is not expected of a academician or an intellectual, yes it is expected in a political battle which you have reduced it to. You have become much similar to the forces you are planning to fight against.
Opposition & JNU doesn't understand the difference between anti Modi & anti National; just because they don't belong to your ideology , you can't go to the extent of abusing your own country & celebrating a terrorist, on the basis of freedom of expression. RSS has its ideolgy and supporters , they too have a freedom of expression, This bigotry on freedom of expression is unfortunate for JNU.
 
drkrack said:

But , again blaming a two year old Govt for everything bad in India currently & conveniently forgetting the 60 yrs of misrule is shear hypocrisy . Not a single mention of Congress misrule & atrocities either by Kanhaiyya or Sainath, just to suit your current political inclinations ? This is not expected of a academician or an intellectual, yes it is expected in a political battle which you have reduced it to. You have become much similar to the forces you are planning to fight against.
Opposition & JNU doesn't understand the difference between anti Modi & anti National; just because they don't belong to your ideology , you can't go to the extent of abusing your own country & celebrating a terrorist, on the basis of freedom of expression. RSS has its ideolgy and supporters , they too have a freedom of expression, This bigotry on freedom of expression is unfortunate for JNU.
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^WTF does this guy smoke? You want to blame congress even 2 yrs after BJP comes into power? There is an expiry date to how long you can blame the past party for your incompetence. You think people gave them votes to hear them whine and crib about the 60 past years? LOL Modi said Achhe din Ayege. No one put a gun to his head and asked him to say it. So GTFO and find some work to do instead of giving lectures with an agenda here. Friggin bhakt telling a guy like Sainath what he should be saying and not saying. Hilarious bhakts. Everything is pseudo pseudo for these numbnuts. When you dont agree with rational thoughts just add pseudo something to their name and they think people will believe their propaganda and not the sane people. God I cant wait for 2019. If these jokers manage to get even what congress got in 2014 that'll be an achievement. Biggest flop in Indian History. At the end of 5 yrs they wont even match the shitty congress that they love to abuse. That's how incompetent this govt is. All they care about is creating drama, commenting on fake tweets. Its like a live Saas Bahu show .


And talking of 60yrs of Misrule. LOL Im not a congress fan, but I think India made far more progress in those 60 yrs than it has in the last 2 years. All these idiots have done is increase tax and subsidized corporates. Im all for more corporates and jobs but Make in India is just a PR exercise for Modi to click selfies. MOU's are signed and even the best bhakt media out there only expect 10% to convert to real deals. And what actually happens is 0%. What happened to all the deals with China and japan and god know all the bullshit that was spread via media. These guys dance around a lot, try to get good headlines but when it comes to execution they are worse than congress. God save us for the next three years of this miserable govt and its antics.
 
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Party Monger said:
^WTF does this guy smoke? You want to blame congress even 2 yrs after BJP comes into power? There is an expiry date to how long you can blame the past party for your incompetence. You think people gave them votes to hear them whine and crib about the 60 past years? LOL Modi said Achhe din Ayege. No one put a gun to his head and asked him to say it. So GTFO and find some work to do instead of giving lectures with an agenda here. Friggin bhakt telling a guy like Sainath what he should be saying and not saying. Hilarious bhakts. Everything is pseudo pseudo for these numbnuts. When you dont agree with rational thoughts just add pseudo something to their name and they think people will believe their propaganda and not the sane people. God I cant wait for 2019. If these jokers manage to get even what congress got in 2014 that'll be an achievement. Biggest flop in Indian History. At the end of 5 yrs they wont even match the shitty congress that they love to abuse. That's how incompetent this govt is. All they care about is creating drama, commenting on fake tweets. Its like a live Saas Bahu show .


And talking of 60yrs of Misrule. LOL Im not a congress fan, but I think India made far more progress in those 60 yrs than it has in the last 2 years. All these idiots have done is increase tax and subsidized corporates. Im all for more corporates and jobs but Make in India is just a PR exercise for Modi to click selfies. MOU's are signed and even the best bhakt media out there only expect 10% to convert to real deals. And what actually happens is 0%. What happened to all the deals with China and japan and god know all the bullshit that was spread via media. These guys dance around a lot, try to get good headlines but when it comes to execution they are worse than congress. God save us for the next three years of this miserable govt and its antics.
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You Just told a PM of the country to GTFO before term, and feeling uncomfortable with myself pointing out the partisan selectivity of Prof Sainath ?? (BTW Ambedkar was a biggest critic of Communists, sloganeering LOL Salam and Jai Bheem together is an insult to his ideology. )
We do have a difference of opinion and let's agree to disagree.
You want this debate to be reduced to Bhakt vs Anti-national , Please Go ahead you'd be alone here.
Kindly understand the spirit of the discussion and be considerate to the views of others, contribute if possible; ignore if not (Which is what I'd be doing ).

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