Where this country is heading - do you have any hope ?

[Lord Nemesis]

I don't respond to hype and exaggerations and neither do others.

Yeah, I have already get that for disgusting mentalities like yours, everything is hype and rapes of children as little as 6 months is pretty normal and expected behavior in every country
Many of these rapists are also people with same kind of dangerous mentality who just at some point transitioned from mere talk, trivializing rape to actions of their own.

People like you won't show the kind of attitude when it comes to their own family members.They won't have the confidence to think that its perfectly safe for the women in their own families to travel alone at mid-night.. But when bad things happen to somebody else, they don't mind labeling it as mere hype and trivializing it.

As I said before, Your kind of mentality is common enough in this country, which is why this country is destined to remain the shit-hole that it is today.

It's been pointed out that there are issues with the methodology used in this report. Its based entirely on perceptions. It's a friggin' opinion poll! you've got to be kidding me...

And i've yet to find out how India went from sixth to top spot.

Sorry, I don't see anything wrong with the methodology. The poll is done by a reputed organization and using experts. Data that such people have access to is way better than the lies and partial truths presented by any govt controlled media like in India. An opinion poll of 500 knowledgeable people is better than conclusions made on incomplete and unreliable data from govt sources. If somebody wants to say otherwise, what exactly are their own qualifications and what data are they presenting and is that data reliable? The govt source is NCRB data which is unreliable due to the extremely poor reporting rates for crimes like rape. Should it be multiplied by 100 or 200 or 500 to get more realistic numbers?

Also, their conclusions are not just based on crime like rapes. Its based on many other criteria like slavery/bonded labor, forced prostitution, abductions of under age girls for slavery (usually in the name of marriage which is prevalent in Rajasthan), human trafficking, which are all rampart in India. Many of the women of north Indian origin working as laborers or other small jobs in cities like Hyderabad/Bangalore/Chennai etc are bonded laborers and don't get paid for their work. This was shown on TV too.

There is also a high rate of crime like rape against tourists, especially women traveling by themselves. Targeting tourists for rape is so common place that even back in 2004, there was a travel advisory about rape and murder for american women traveling to India and particularly to New Delhi. At that time, many tourists were getting robbed, raped and sometimes murdered on the way from airport itself. Most of the incidents come out locally, but suppressed from national media so that people like you do not need to feel ashamed and can keep trivializing these crimes.

The numbers from NCRB are scary by themselves even without the necessary extrapolations. In-spite of the minuscule rate of reporting for crimes like rape and the active suppression and the very narrow legal definition of rape in India compared to other countries, the recorded numbers are high. The conviction rate is mere 18% and we already see from the Nirbhaya case itself that even conviction doesn't necessarily mean punishment..

 

[blr_p]

Yeah, I have already get that for disgusting mentalities like yours, everything is hype and rapes of children as little as 6 months is pretty normal and expected behavior in every country
Many of these rapists are also people with same kind of dangerous mentality who just at some point transitioned from mere talk, trivializing rape to actions of their own.

People like you won't show the kind of attitude when it comes to their own family members.They won't have the confidence to think that its perfectly safe for the women in their own families to travel alone at mid-night.. But when bad things happen to somebody else, they don't mind labeling it as mere hype and trivializing it.

As I said before, Your kind of mentality is common enough in this country, which is why this country is destined to remain the shit-hole that it is today.

I've said none of the above. I do get that the slightest dissent with valid challenges gets you slammed. Do not question. That's how dictatorships work. This kind of binary thinking doesn't work in free countries and topics like this.

Sorry, I don't see anything wrong with the methodology. The poll is done by a reputed organization and using experts. Data that such people have access to is way better than the lies and partial truths presented by any govt controlled media like in India. An opinion poll of 500 knowledgeable people is better than conclusions made on incomplete and unreliable data from govt sources. If somebody wants to say otherwise, what exactly are their own qualifications and what data are they presenting and is that data reliable? The govt source is NCRB data which is unreliable due to the extremely poor reporting rates for crimes like rape. Should it be multiplied by 100 or 200 or 500 to get more realistic numbers?

Where is their report ? where is the transparency. You're big on that. Why are you giving them a pass here because they are 'experts'. Appeals to authority fallacy much ?

Also, their conclusions are not just based on crime like rapes. Its based on many other criteria like slavery/bonded labor, forced prostitution, abductions of under age girls for slavery (usually in the name of marriage which is prevalent in Rajasthan), human trafficking, which are all rampart in India. Many of the women of north Indian origin working as laborers or other small jobs in cities like Hyderabad/Bangalore/Chennai etc are bonded laborers and don't get paid for their work. This was shown on TV too.

There is also a high rate of crime like rape against tourists, especially women traveling by themselves. Targeting tourists for rape is so common place that even back in 2004, there was a travel advisory about rape and murder for american women traveling to India and particularly to New Delhi. At that time, many tourists were getting robbed, raped and sometimes murdered on the way from airport itself. Most of the incidents come out locally, but suppressed from national media so that people like you do not need to feel ashamed and can keep trivializing these crimes.

I don't deny any of this goes on. I'm questioning how India gets the prize for most dangerous to women IN THE WORLD. How exactly that conclusion was reached. Pertinent question

The numbers from NCRB are scary by themselves even without the necessary extrapolations. In-spite of the minuscule rate of reporting for crimes like rape and the active suppression and the very narrow legal definition of rape in India compared to other countries, the recorded numbers are high. The conviction rate is mere 18% and we already see from the Nirbhaya case itself that even conviction doesn't necessarily mean punishment..

I posted figures from the NCRB & UN trends in that graphic from 2013. Do you contest them ?

I don't support the death penalty. Hanging one murderer creates another and so on.

I don't support treating juveniles as adults but subramaniam swamy has changed that

I don't want to see knee jerk reactions every time some atrocity gets committed because of popular pressure. eg. death penalty to rapists will ensure every rape ends up as a murder

 

[Party Monger]

You two and @Party Monger please stop feeding the troll.

At first it was the usual political discusions and bjp vs congress etc. But when this absolutely disgusting and inhuman person starts trivialising and defending rapes in india, you need to understand the character of whom you're responding to. And then stop. I have.

You're correct.

 

[Lord Nemesis]

I've said none of the above. I do get that the slightest dissent with valid challenges gets you slammed. Do not question. That's how dictatorships work. This kind of binary thinking doesn't work in free countries and topics like this.

No, you are not just questioning. You have repeatedly to portray a picture that rapes in the country don't matter and that they are trivial or just being over hyped. As long as some other country has shows a higher stat, you think it is perfectly fine. You made light of child rapes. Even when Kathua rape case was brought up, you had no concern that the a 8 year old child was raped and killed and that the police tried their best to suppress it and instead you said that the case is being hyped by the media. You don't think that the rape of a child and its subsequent suppression are important enough to be covered in the media to such an extent. For you, rapes and rapes of children are expected and not a issue worth being concerned about. If the statistic for other country is higher, its all good.

That's why I reached the conclusion that you are utterly disgusting.

Where is their report ? where is the transparency. You're big on that. Why are you giving them a pass here because they are 'experts'. Appeals to authority fallacy much ?

I don't need their data. As I said, I had already reached the same conclusion myself based on other comparisons. I only said that I don't have any problem with their methodology. I have no doubts that even if not number one, India has to be at the top positions in the list with maybe just war torn countries like Syria above it

I don't deny any of this goes on. I'm questioning how India gets the prize for most dangerous to women IN THE WORLD. How exactly that conclusion was reached. Pertinent question

Since it is a poll of experts, it will be based on their perceptions. Here are some points.

1 India is at the top of slavery index for modern day slavery. At an estimated 18.3 million, India has 6 times the number that of china which has a similar amount of population.
2.India has high rate of crime against women. Women are vulnerable to rapes right from 4 months old which is the least age I have heard of a victim and no upper limit. 97 is highest age I have heard of a rape victim so far.
3. Very poor response form legal system. Conviction is poor and slow. Punishments are inadequate and enforcement of punishments is poor. Many rapists are repeat offenders and in many instances, rapists had committed subsequent offenses while on bail for an earlier offense
4. General indifference and Victim blaming in case of rapes is common.
5. Atrocities committed by Kangaroo courts like Khap Panchayats against rape victims.
6.Rampart female foeticide which is almost unique to India.
7.Abductions and Forced prostitution.
8. Indian cities like Hyderabad are emerging as the major Hubs of Human trafficking for slavery and prostitution in Asia.

The difference between India other other counties like US is that rape culprits are caught and given the harshest of punishments. Molesting a child could end up with culprit spending this entire life in jail. They don't passively (or actively) encourage these crimes like in India.
The difference between India and Syria is that Syria is a war zone and every life is under threat and people know what to expect there. From just perception, India is worse than Syria because it is in the same sort of lawless state without being war torn and ravaged.

I posted figures from the NCRB & UN trends in that graphic from 2013. Do you contest them ?/QUOTE]

Yes, the definition of rape in India compared to other counties quite different. This has improved a bit with amendments from 2013, but its still not the same. In addition report rates are extremely poor and NCRB numbers cannot be used in comparisons directly. The report rates of rape in other counties ranges from 40-60% as per estimations.. In India, there are no official estimations. Based on old reports, the crime report rates for rape could be below 1% of actual. So, whatever number you see from NCRB has to be multiplied by 100 at least to get more realistic numbers.

 

[Party Monger]

No, you are not just questioning. You have repeatedly to portray a picture that rapes in the country don't matter and that they are trivial or just being over hyped. As long as some other country has shows a higher stat, you think it is perfectly fine. You made light of child rapes. Even when Kathua rape case was brought up, you had no concern that the a 8 year old child was raped and killed and that the police tried their best to suppress it and instead you said that the case is being hyped by the media. You don't think that the rape of a child and its subsequent suppression are important enough to be covered in the media to such an extent. For you, rapes and rapes of children are expected and not a issue worth being concerned about. If the statistic for other country is higher, its all good.

That's why I reached the conclusion that you are utterly disgusting.



I don't need their data. As I said, I had already reached the same conclusion myself based on other comparisons. I only said that I don't have any problem with their methodology. I have no doubts that even if not number one, India has to be at the top positions in the list with maybe just war torn countries like Syria above it



Since it is a poll of experts, it will be based on their perceptions. Here are some points.

1 India is at the top of slavery index for modern day slavery. At an estimated 18.3 million, India has 6 times the number that of china which has a similar amount of population.
2.India has high rate of crime against women. Women are vulnerable to rapes right from 4 months old which is the least age I have heard of a victim and no upper limit. 97 is highest age I have heard of a rape victim so far.
3. Very poor response form legal system. Conviction is poor and slow. Punishments are inadequate and enforcement of punishments is poor. Many rapists are repeat offenders and in many instances, rapists had committed subsequent offenses while on bail for an earlier offense
4. General indifference and Victim blaming in case of rapes is common.
5. Atrocities committed by Kangaroo courts like Khap Panchayats against rape victims.
6.Rampart female foeticide which is almost unique to India.
7.Abductions and Forced prostitution.
8. Indian cities like Hyderabad are emerging as the major Hubs of Human trafficking for slavery and prostitution in Asia.

The difference between India other other counties like US is that rape culprits are caught and given the harshest of punishments. Molesting a child could end up with culprit spending this entire life in jail. They don't passively (or actively) encourage these crimes like in India.
The difference between India and Syria is that Syria is a war zone and every life is under threat and people know what to expect there. From just perception, India is worse than Syria because it is in the same sort of lawless state without being war torn and ravaged.

He feeds on the attention and replies we give him. Ignore his replies via the forum. Stop feeding the troll and he wont have incentive to flood the forum with such filth.

 

[blr_p]

No, you are not just questioning. You have repeatedly to portray a picture that rapes in the country don't matter and that they are trivial or just being over hyped. As long as some other country has shows a higher stat, you think it is perfectly fine. You made light of child rapes. Even when Kathua rape case was brought up, you had no concern that the a 8 year old child was raped and killed and that the police tried their best to suppress it and instead you said that the case is being hyped by the media. You don't think that the rape of a child and its subsequent suppression are important enough to be covered in the media to such an extent. For you, rapes and rapes of children are expected and not a issue worth being concerned about. If the statistic for other country is higher, its all good.

That's why I reached the conclusion that you are utterly disgusting.

I don't get worked up when atrocities occur. What is the point. Tomorrow and day after worse will happen. Then what. Kathua i've already discussed with you. There are many unanswered questions and a story put out that i suspect. Will we know more i doubt it, because its a 'sensitive' issue.

Rape is a strange topic, when it comes up on def boards. People lose the plot entirely. It's an excuse to have a collective freak out. People who can discuss quite coherently conflict which involves the deaths of many cannot handle this subject in a rational manner. People that have been in wars get weak in the knees about this subject. Its quite odd. When i pressed a few people i learnt some one in their family was affected. These were americans btw and clearly traumatised.

I have never said they don't matter or trivial . What i have said is its a dead end topic with little perceptible improvement in the mid-term. Meaning it will take a generation or more. It's possible the problem has spiked due to the reasons Ashish Nandy mentioned. Most coherent explanation i ever heard

I don't need their data. As I said, I had already reached the same conclusion myself based on other comparisons. I only said that I don't have any problem with their methodology. I have no doubts that even if not number one, India has to be at the top positions in the list with maybe just war torn countries like Syria above it

They have to release the report. All i get are verdicts with no possibility to challenge whatsoever. Its curious they have not released it or maybe its pay only.

Since it is a poll of experts, it will be based on their perceptions. Here are some points.

How valid is such a poll based on perceptions ? what are their bases.

Does anything we've done to remedy the situation even get considered. What then are we supposed to do. Govts need that kind of information. When the two national womens orgs in the country reject the findings this report isn't helping us at all is it.

1 India is at the top of slavery index for modern day slavery. At an estimated 18.3 million, India has 6 times the number that of china which has a similar amount of population.
2.India has high rate of crime against women. Women are vulnerable to rapes right from 4 months old which is the least age I have heard of a victim and no upper limit. 97 is highest age I have heard of a rape victim so far.
3. Very poor response form legal system. Conviction is poor and slow. Punishments are inadequate and enforcement of punishments is poor. Many rapists are repeat offenders and in many instances, rapists had committed subsequent offenses while on bail for an earlier offense
4. General indifference and Victim blaming in case of rapes is common.
5. Atrocities committed by Kangaroo courts like Khap Panchayats against rape victims.
6.Rampart female foeticide which is almost unique to India.
7.Abductions and Forced prostitution.
8. Indian cities like Hyderabad are emerging as the major Hubs of Human trafficking for slavery and prostitution in Asia.

1. Here, in terms of absolute numbers we are top, more meaningful is as a percent of population, we are fourth with NK on top, if you look down the list, there are at least another thirteen countries with a similar %. I find interesting that SL is a seventh of our figure as % or similar to China. Why ? What i mean is SL is similar to us culturally speaking. What is SL doing right here. China has been socially engineered. Not SL.

2, 3, 4, 5, 6 yes
7,8 if you say so

What can we do ? see my earlier reply. Not a whole lot. Or maybe we make an example of a few to send a message. Will it work. maybe who knows. In publicised cases they have convicted people. We did that in the nirbhaya case with all the screaming national headlines. But unless we resorted to medieval punishment i doubt the baying mob would be satisified. Quick fix. People want quick fixes and to hell with everything else. This is a tribal mentality. This is what goes on with khaps & Taliban. You have to admit their punishment is swift. When rape happens in the gulf they want 7 male members or something ridiculous to testify in support of rape. That nobody knows. I followed the case of an english woman who got raped in Dubai, and this is what transpired. Does anybody bash the Arabs about this lack of justice. Oh no.

The difference between India other other counties like US is that rape culprits are caught and given the harshest of punishments. Molesting a child could end up with culprit spending this entire life in jail. They don't passively (or actively) encourage these crimes like in India.
The difference between India and Syria is that Syria is a war zone and every life is under threat and people know what to expect there. From just perception, India is worse than Syria because it is in the same sort of lawless state without being war torn and ravaged.

yet it still happens over there but for some reason we are bad people isn't it. Nobody points a finger at them for rape but its becoming more common for them to say that about us. I see the increase in reported cases as a positive because they are coming out whereas in the past it would not.

 

[nimod]

He feeds on the attention and replies we give him. Ignore his replies via the forum. Stop feeding the troll and he wont have incentive to flood the forum with such filth.

Right.
I did it.

 

[Lord Nemesis]

Already added to ignore list. First time I had to use it in the 13 years that I have been a member on TE. It is disgusting to see people ass kissing politicians, but its still tolerable to an extent, but trying to portray that rapes are hype is taking it a bit too far.

In any case, saw this on Reddit today. The irony of it.

 

[NotMyRealName]

Already added to ignore list. First time I had to use it in the 13 years that I have been a member on TE. It is disgusting to see people ass kissing politicians, but its still tolerable to an extent, but trying to portray that rapes are hype is taking it a bit too far.

In any case, saw this on Reddit today. The irony of it.

View attachment 75516

I'm not at all surprised that the Union Minister of Women & Child Development would reject such reports. She's a bjp politician after all ! and not one of the (very few) good ones.

And yeah, that one page from TOI should give enough food for thought for all those barking. But knowing bhakts, they will lie and "fake news" their way out of this too...

 

[blr_p]

The opposition isn't too enamoured by this poll either. But they don't count

https://www.thehindu.com/news/natio...vey-as-sweeping-statement/article24277634.ece

Congress leader Shashi Tharoor has dismissed as a “sweeping statement” a new survey that ranked India as the world’s “most dangerous” country for women, asserting that he was astonished that Afghanistan, Syria and Pakistan fared better than India on the list.

Mr. Tharoor said there had been an awful lot of unpleasant incidents against women in India in recent years.

“Something which shames every Indian, no question about that, particularly every Indian male. But a sweeping statement like the most dangerous country in the world for women is a bit difficult to swallow,” Mr. Tharoor said at an event here.

Shashi calls it sweeping, i call it hype. it's certainly set off a lot of reactions and got people buzzing. Wouldn't have acheived that without India topping the list according to these 'experts'

There is no report on their site. It's just a poll.

https://www.myind.net/Home/viewArti...ex-is-not-only-not-right-it-is-not-even-wrong

Does a good job critiquing the way this poll was conducted. Unbelievable (!)

 

[cellar_door]

I dunno. I would chose to focus on the positives.

The country hasnt become more rape-y, corrupt or intolerant recently. But rather those incidents are now being called out more vociferously than they were previously. So you tend to hear more about them. One of the reasons the number of rapes reported has gone up if you check decade over decade graphs is because the stigma around it is being reduced. 30 years ago the social and political climate would have forced a woman to keep quite after a sexual assault. This is less likely to happen now. The more the stigma around rape dissolves, the more cases you will see being filed for it.

Corruption in bureaucracy is infinitely lower than what it used to be as well. People under 30 will not know how every interaction with a civil servant was built around the concept of offering them a bribe. The fact that you can get a water/electricity/bank account/etc today without palming some bribes is a concept that would have been foreign to most people in the 80s and 90s and before.

Quality of life today in India is immeasurably better than it was 10-20-30 years ago. Yes, you will get the occasional few years of stagnancy due to mismanagement and poor governance. But by and large the trend will continue upwards.

/Shrug

Now the environment though. We are ****ed on a global scale there.

 

[blr_p]

Quality of life today in India is immeasurably better than it was 10-20-30 years ago. Yes, you will get the occasional few years of stagnancy due to mismanagement and poor governance. But by and large the trend will continue upwards.

Exactly, compare with the past. How many remember how long it took just to get a landline connection ? then things were liberalised and all changed overnight

 

[NotMyRealName]

I dunno. I would chose to focus on the positives...

Nothing personal, but i really don't understand what people mean when they say things like this. I can understand having a positive, 'can-do' attitude and being proactive. But saying 'focus on the positives' sounds a lot like sweep all the shit under the carpet.

No person or country or whatever has ever improved by glossing over their problems and only highlighting their positive achievements. I mean think about it, by proudly stating one's positive achievements, what does one really gain other than a boost in ego?

It's when you take a long, hard look at the bad, the problems, and decide first of all, there is a problem, and it must be solved, that any real growth or improvement can happen.

Yeah, India has come a long way since the dark ages, and there's no harm in proudly mentioning all the achievements. But till we acknowledge and decide to fix (some major) issues, we will remain this third world cesspool that's being compared to war ravaged countries, and with good reason.

Now people need to look at this post positively instead of finding things wrong with it [DOUBLEPOST=1530311092][/DOUBLEPOST]P.s. certainly ended up 'dangerous' for Tharoor's wife. Too soon?

 

[blr_p]

If you don't focus on positives all there is left is shit. When i hear people constantly harping only about negatives i suspect agenda. As if nothing has improved, and bonus points if you can spin its actually getting worse, this is complete lies.

The inability to find a single thing positive in any story is a very recurrent theme here. Bias much ? Negative is great for sales, TRP's gets people's attention. Americans as far as i can remember are constantly told they are doomed. If they weren't going to get nuked off the map then the terrorists would get them or failing that the weather.

Sushma got trolled, did anyone mention she liked over 70 of the posts that abused her

I prefer to hype positives instead of negatives. It makes me feel good and quite frankly everybody needs that. Otherwise nothing will improve because where is the sense of ownership or pride. Every time there is a success some wet blanket shows up and kills it. Lots of problems discussed have no ready solutions, what am i supposed to do ? feel depressed for the next few decades

haha eff that!

 

[Lord Nemesis]

But saying 'focus on the positives' sounds a lot like sweep all the shit under the carpet.

It is exactly that. This mindset is the reason why this India has no hope of ever getting better. Just sweep everything under the carpet and pretend like it doesn't happen.

They will tell a rape victim too to focus on the positive side of it and would like nothing better than for them to shut up and keep quiet so that the image of the country is not tarnished. After all that is more important than the issue of 50+ child rapes per day reported in the country. Its all good as long as these incidents don't come out.

 

[NotMyRealName]

It is exactly that. This mindset is the reason why this India has no hope of ever getting better. Just sweep everything under the carpet and pretend like it doesn't happen.

They will tell a rape victim too to focus on the positive side of it and would like nothing better than for them to shut up and keep quiet so that the image of the country is not tarnished. After all that is more important than the issue of 50+ child rapes per day reported in the country. Its all good as long as these incidents don't come out.

Bunch of friggin ostriches...

 

[nimod]

It is exactly that. This mindset is the reason why this India has no hope of ever getting better. Just sweep everything under the carpet and pretend like it doesn't happen.

They will tell a rape victim too to focus on the positive side of it and would like nothing better than for them to shut up and keep quiet so that the image of the country is not tarnished. After all that is more important than the issue of 50+ child rapes per day reported in the country. Its all good as long as these incidents don't come out.

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/sto...im-s-kin-to-thank-party-mp-1273668-2018-06-30

 

[cool_cat]

India is almost irreversibly getting polarized. The seculars, liberals should change their views - mellow down or keep mum - Enough lynching videos available for your enjoyment.

I still think, Congress and UPA cannot win in India anymore. It's not about their PM candidate being portrayed as an Amul Baby or other reasons. The reason has more to do with toxic ideologies injected with religion as a tool by the groups who wanted India, as a land of the pure (100% suddh). When you are more interested in the WhatsApp propaganda about dar-ul-harb and dar-ul-kufr and missionaries (ayyo..IT cell calls them ricebag converts) stealing sheeps, and keeps a blind eye on the fascists, nothing can change. Most of the population *may* have became like that. After all, thousands of crores are being pumped for this propaganda purpose. It's no more the Yahoo! groups or Orkut days where a few handful of "sickular", "naxalite" calling deshbhakts. Social media is engulfed by the rightwing troll army. Fake news are spread across to your rural Rajasthan or Assam to even Tamilnadu, irrespective of internet available or not. No recovery, until perhaps 2030 or 2040. Perhaps, we may experience a famine and that too can be easily be blamed on Vatican, Mughals, Britishers etc etc.

 

[Party Monger]

India is almost irreversibly getting polarized. The seculars, liberals should change their views - mellow down or keep mum - Enough lynching videos available for your enjoyment.

I still think, Congress and UPA cannot win in India anymore. It's not about their PM candidate being portrayed as an Amul Baby or other reasons. The reason has more to do with toxic ideologies injected with religion as a tool by the groups who wanted India, as a land of the pure (100% suddh). When you are more interested in the WhatsApp propaganda about dar-ul-harb and dar-ul-kufr and missionaries (ayyo..IT cell calls them ricebag converts) stealing sheeps, and keeps a blind eye on the fascists, nothing can change. Most of the population *may* have became like that. After all, thousands of crores are being pumped for this propaganda purpose. It's no more the Yahoo! groups or Orkut days where a few handful of "sickular", "naxalite" calling deshbhakts. Social media is engulfed by the rightwing troll army. Fake news are spread across to your rural Rajasthan or Assam to even Tamilnadu, irrespective of internet available or not. No recovery, until perhaps 2030 or 2040. Perhaps, we may experience a famine and that too can be easily be blamed on Vatican, Mughals, Britishers etc etc.

What are you saying bro. Mudi is already getting buried in shit tonnes of dirt of his own making. The tide has turned. All we needed were high oil prices for the illusion to break. And after that came out the historic incompetence of this man and his party. Now that combined with his huge claims have made him a laughing stock. Today I was at a shop. This guy used to do pretty well. Now he's talking about how the market has turned shit. And people talk to you like you're shit. Its cause Mudi has been telling people that businesses are thieves and he treats them like thieves. All the black money and other propaganda has had a very real effect and shit tonnes of people are very very unhappy. And this, when till 2014 BJP was the party of businessmen small and large. THIS is their real base talking.

You can polarize people but you cant convince them that you're good at governance, when under your watch they and those around them are becoming poorer and dying.

As for polarisation, in field, there is very little polarisation in the sense you're talking. There is communal polarisation and the results of which can be controlled by good police work. But the polarisation where a base permanently shifts to a party has not happened. Apart from twitter trolls, most that promoted modi in 2014 have dropped the whole idea. They're like "meh" now. All that is needed is a GOOD candidate. That candidate might well be Kejriwal. But its definitely not going to be RG.

 

[NotMyRealName]

...when till 2014 BJP was the party of businessmen small and large...

Fixed that for you.

They are in cahoots with and earn enough revenue from big business. Who also want said small businesses to fail so that their all-in-one mega stores and businesses can profit unhindered. This is all part of the plan. Who cares if the nation is looted as long as they and their cronies get rich and unstoppably powerful.

When you ask, what about vote banks, they've now learnt to game the system through social media and their IT cell and fake news etc. so winning elections is no longer an issue for them.

It's a win-win situation for the bjp. The real losers are we the people. Yet some simple minded foolish sheep keep blindly supporting them thinking 'positive' things and 'feeling good' about themselves...