Anyone here in the Agriculture/farming field?

[rdst_1]

But what if all the fields in the vicinity of the land are using chemical fertilizers and pesticides and all?

You have to discard some of the land adjoining those lands, something not possible in our small fields in Himachal, but possible in the plains. But this is only needed if you want to get certification and even then there should be ways to do it.

Bigha sizes are different in different states and sometimes even among different districts in the same state. The system is just so old. An acre is 4046 m2. Here is Himachal it is 5 Bighas to an acre but in Punjab and Haryana it is 4Bighas to an acre from what I remember.

 

[iPwnz]

But what if all the fields in the vicinity of the land are using chemical fertilizers and pesticides and all?

I'm not sure but for organic farming I asked the director of the institute which I attended for a while and he said it will take 3 years for a farmer to be granted "organic farmer" license and certification. I assume they will do a regular soil check every once in a while.
If you are interested to pursue it further build a compost pit asap and throw in all the organic waste you can find including cowdung. Vermicompost costs 20rs a kg in my area and I bought about 25 kg of peat moss for about 40rs per 5kg. The good thing is you don't need to have a big farm, you can just make a small veggie garden.

Well, I always wanted to know about Agriculture from practical perspective but my father never told me jack about it

It might be because your dad is a traditional farmer. My grandparents and father were too. Even some of my own relatives are still into traditional farming. But farming has changed so much over the years.
While I'm at it I just want to add that one of the main threats to traditional farming is climate change. Many parts in my state didn't get proper rain and a huge amount of crops were destroyed which increased the price of food grains for a long time like 60rs per kg for rice and potatoes to over 100rs per kg. If you can somewhat adapt to bad climate by using scientific and technological method its going to help a lot. Indoor hydroponics systems for example.

2. Is Polyhouse necessary for "organic farming" ?

No. But its good for winter. Hilly areas are too damn cold.

 

[Fenix]

Don't go big unless you have crores to spend. Start with small, try with terrace farming and then expand.

 

[skoka123]

I am into agriculture. Supplied vegetables to super markets in Hyderabad and Big Basket. Stopped for a while. Now starting in a big way once again in Polyhouse, poly tunnels and open fields. I have been to Israel in 2018 to study their practices and understand the reality to a small extent. Visited IIHR scientists in Bangalore and learnt a lot from them. Visited a few progressive farmers too. Agriculture is not easy. I have my own stories of failures that I wish someone warned me of beforehand.

Start small. Do your research. Be prepared to burn some cash initially. Understand your risk appetite. Establish market connections. Know who your customer is and what they want. Think of transport and market access. Think of alternate markets and ways to divert excess production when the markets are down. It is a huge learning curve.

 

[iPwnz]

It's a paddy field land. No terrace/building. lmao wtf was I thinking xD

Don't go big unless you have crores to spend. Start with small, try with terrace farming and then expand.

The ONLY way to do it unless you are an oil prince and sneeze out gold coins.

I have been to Israel in 2018 to study their practices and understand the reality to a small extent.

Awesome! Israel is an inspiration to many groups and companies out there. Many give credit to them.
Can you tell us more about the polyhouse from your own personal experiences? Set up, materials, costs and everything involved.[/s][/s]

 

[skoka123]

Awesome! Israel is an inspiration to many groups and companies out there. Many give credit to them.
Can you tell us more about the polyhouse from your own personal experiences? Set up, materials, costs and everything involved.

Israel is good at innovating new technologies and even better at marketing them. On our visit to Israel everyday we were accompanied by a member of ministry of agriculture to ensure that we only get to see what they want us to see. With the kind of technological innovations Israeli farmer should be prosperous but they too have a hand to mouth survival much like the rest of the world.

Polyhouses is a very broad subject. If you have specific questions I can either answer them or guide you to resources. Cost of a polyhouse varies from Rs 1,000/sq mt to Rs 4,000 /sq mt depending on requirements of the crops.

 

[iPwnz]

Polyhouses is a very broad subject. If you have specific questions I can either answer them or guide you to resources. Cost of a polyhouse varies from Rs 1,000/sq mt to Rs 4,000 /sq mt depending on requirements of the crops.

Ok. First please tell me about the poly materials first, their quality and costs. Then the frames. I've seen some videos in which diy enthusiasts make their own frames like, they bought some metal frames and then bent them. And also your recommendations/advices.

 

[skoka123]

I do not claim to be an expert but I will try to bring out points that you need to consider as inputs for Polyhouse construction.

1. Location Location Location.... - Where are you going to locate the polyhouse? The requirements for cold weather region like HP will be a lot different from a hot weather region like Telangana. I am assuming you are in one of the cold weather location like Imphal. Hence, I think the max temperature is below 30 during summer.
2. What is the crop you are planning to grow? If you are growing crops that can be grown in the open fields then does the additional expense of a polyhouse justify itself? If you are planning to grow out of season crops or crops alien to your region then you need to plan for the market.
3. Do you really need a Polyhouse for your crops? Can you not manage with Poly tunnels? See what crops can be grown in poly tunnels.
4. As you are in a cold weather region you do not need any A/C, Fan/Pad system. Explore if your crops need heating instead in the winters.
5. What will you do with regards to pollination? Does your crop need pollination? If so, think about it.
6. Are you go to the Hydroponics route or organic or chemical? If Hydroponics then your costs would increase due to various automation requirements.
7. One of major costs in the steel structure. What is the life of the structure you need? Generally the structure is made of Mild Steel and aluminum. Tata A class is a lot more expensive than B and C. Tata C is likely more expensive than a local company A class steel. It depends on the gauge and quality. I suggest Tata B class for 20 years life. If you are looking for a short term polyhouse and do not mind regular maintenance then there are designs using Bamboo that you can find of Agricultural university websites. They work out far cheaper than the steel structures.
8. The next major cost is Polythene sheet. There are dozens of varieties to choose from. Each color has a very specific purpose. While in India most people use the white poly sheet yellow and orange are advised for certain crops. Again there are variations in these poly sheets. Some trap heat inside a bubble in the sheet and only lets the sunlight in the 300 to 800 nm to passthrough. While some are designed specifically for cold climates where you want every ray of sun to heat up the poly house. You should be prepared to replace it every 4 years and repair after storms.
9. The other costs would involve irrigation such as sprinklers, misters, humidifiers, drip etc.

In my next project that I will undertaking shortly I do have access to couple of poly houses and dozens of poly tunnels. I cannot really justify the cost of setting up poly house from scratch. Here in Telangana the govt was giving subsidy of ₹800/sqm. That is for ₹32 lakhs / acre they invited contractors to build poly houses for farmers. Not one poly house was built at that rate. The lowest cost is ₹1,200 /sq mt. Our poly house costed us ₹2,000 / sq mt in 2004 for 1/4 acre for our specific requirements. So, the cost varies a lot due to design, quality and requirements.

 

[iPwnz]

To quickly answer your questions,
1. Location will be in the hills and not in the town.
2. Tomatoes, cabbages, potatoes etc. The others which I want to plant is food grains like barley (I was recommended oats though I don't know why), wheat for fodder system and the grains. Whatever I can do. I mean it.
3. I honestly don't know as I've never used any. But I do want to grow veggies throughout the year regardless of the climate or weather outside.
4. I assume tomatoes would need it most or am I wrong? I do know that they need constant sunlight and heat. That's one of the reasons why I want the polyhouses.
5. Not sure.
6. Organic only. This I hope will also make it easier to market them if my chance I get surplus production. If at all.
7. Thanks. I'll look into it. Where can I get suppliers in private? I think main problem will be the transportation. If there any dealers in Guwahati then it will be good. We already have one polyhouse in the village btw.
8. Any suggestions for medium household usage? Not for large commercial purpose. Just for trials.

 

[skoka123]

Reliable power supply is required for poly house. None of the crops that you want to grow need a polyhouse. All that you see on Youtube are highly inflated success stories. Potatoes and Cabbages are cold season crops. Tomatoes can be grown in varied conditions. You need to take into consideration if you want a long duration (indeterminate) , short duration (determinate) or medium duration (Semi-determinate) tomatoes. If you are looking for organic then you cannot grow Hybrid varieties which severely limits your choice of seeds. Tomatoes seeds should be selected based on the local climate and transportation needs. Demands of your market also needs to be kept in mind.

Point 8: Polyhouse not worth the expense. The basic reason why you get a good yield in polyhouse is not the sheet but the micro climate and quality of light (300 to 800 nm range). For you to have a good micro climate a small household poly house is of no use as trial.

 

[iPwnz]

If so then it will save me a lot of money which is a big relief.
But what sort of plants need polyhouses?
Btw can someone tell me where you can get cocopeat in bulk? I contacted a distributor but he hasn't replied till now. I can source lots of raw green coconut husk but not dry ones. Each block (weighs around 4-5 kg) is available for 260rs.
And how feasible are raised bed gardens? Wood price is high. I read about "birdies raised beds" which are said to use galvanized steel but I couldn't find this locally. Because the soil in the place which I'm to be based in isn't good I will need to get the soil from elsewhere and I want to keep it separate from the soil in the area.
As for the other plants and grain crops they will be planted in other villages. I'll be giving the villagers the seeds but I still haven't found the seeds till now. Basically like leasing the paddy field.

 

[rdst_1]

If so then it will save me a lot of money which is a big relief.
But what sort of plants need polyhouses?
Btw can someone tell me where you can get cocopeat in bulk? I contacted a distributor but he hasn't replied till now. I can source lots of raw green coconut husk but not dry ones. Each block (weighs around 4-5 kg) is available for 260rs.
And how feasible are raised bed gardens? Wood price is high. I read about "birdies raised beds" which are said to use galvanized steel but I couldn't find this locally. Because the soil in the place which I'm to be based in isn't good I will need to get the soil from elsewhere and I want to keep it separate from the soil in the area.
As for the other plants and grain crops they will be planted in other villages. I'll be giving the villagers the seeds but I still haven't found the seeds till now. Basically like leasing the paddy field.

Just make raised beds without any boundary of wood/brick/concrete/steel. That's the way I and many others have done it. They will only require a little maintenance from time to time.
First things first, don't buy anything special, like Cocopeat etc. Don't waste a lot of money. Just get good seeds, good compost and begin by growing something in one corner and gradually grow from there.

 

[Fenix]

To quickly answer your questions,
1. Location will be in the hills and not in the town.
2. Tomatoes, cabbages, potatoes etc. The others which I want to plant is food grains like barley (I was recommended oats though I don't know why), wheat for fodder system and the grains. Whatever I can do. I mean it.
3. I honestly don't know as I've never used any. But I do want to grow veggies throughout the year regardless of the climate or weather outside.
4. I assume tomatoes would need it most or am I wrong? I do know that they need constant sunlight and heat. That's one of the reasons why I want the polyhouses.
5. Not sure.
6. Organic only. This I hope will also make it easier to market them if my chance I get surplus production. If at all.
7. Thanks. I'll look into it. Where can I get suppliers in private? I think main problem will be the transportation. If there any dealers in Guwahati then it will be good. We already have one polyhouse in the village btw.
8. Any suggestions for medium household usage? Not for large commercial purpose. Just for trials.

Answer to 4th one - Tamatar ka season gaya bhai. We have already grown them. We have also grown bhindi and aarbi.

 

[red dragon]

@rdst_1 , man!! You do have a great great work and business. Wanna trade places?

 

[rdst_1]

@rdst_1 , man!! You do have a great great work and business. Wanna trade places?

Haha.. I am happy where I am, but you are welcome to visit anytime.

 

[Fenix]

Not demotivating anyone reading this thread but Farming is long time investment and this is not just from Money Perspective but hard-work and persistence. But it does bear some good fruits and you'll love to see what you've grown or accomplished.

 

[iPwnz]

Not demotivating anyone reading this thread but Farming is long time investment and this is not just from Money Perspective but hard-work and persistence. But it does bear some good fruits and you'll love to see what you've grown or accomplished.

I agree. I'm in for the long haul. But I can't say its wise for one, like myself for example, without an already own field/land. I'm just stubborn.

 

[rdst_1]

I agree. I'm in for the long haul. But I can't say its wise for one, like myself for example, without an already own field/land. I'm just stubborn.

You can also choose and volunteer at permaculture farms in your vicinity and learn the basics first without investing too much money. Just post in the FB group and you might find some farm in NE. I know for sure a couple of permaculture farms are there who even do courses.

 

[LaatSahab]

You can also choose and volunteer at permaculture farms in your vicinity and learn the basics first without investing too much money. Just post in the FB group and you might find some farm in NE. I know for sure a couple of permaculture farms are there who even do courses.

Any such in South East Himachal/North East Haryana?

 

[rdst_1]

Any such in South East Himachal/North East Haryana?

Check out MeenaBagh Ratnari. It's around 2-3hrs after Shimla. That is a posh homestay situated in Apple orchards but also a permaculture farm. But he has only recently started his permaculture journey.

Closest to you would be Aanandaa Farm near Morni Hills. Don't know if theh are taking volunteers, but they do teach permaculture principles. - https://www.aanandaa.com/

There is also Shunya Farms very close to me in Bir-Billing, Himachal and they are very experienced guys who teach 2-3 courses every year and I plan to do one with them when I can find time.

The thing is that mostly new upcoming farms will take volunteers and you are expected to do lots of manual labor during the stay. So a course will be better if one can pay.

Lastly, there are hundreds of resources available on Youtube as well as books and advice is available through multiple FB groups. So one can learn and apply at home as well.

Another person who I want to learn from is Malvikaa Solanki who runs the project called Swayyam.

Lastly many people also love Charles Dowding (https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCB1J6siDdmhwah7q0O2WJBg) who does no-till farming on raised beds and runs a proper vegetable business in UK. His principles are being followed by many including me.

Edit - All these sources I have mentioned are about Permaculture in which natural farming and regenerative agriculture is the main driving force. These have nothing to do with commercial agriculture.