Front loading or top loading washing machine?

[Kaleen Bhaiya]

IFB after purchase products are damm expensive. They literally rip-off the customers by charging 3-4 times the amount of what the competition offers and their own products on Amazon.
This lady literally got ripped-off after purchasing her 8kg machine. I mean ~7000 bucks!! Her husband was pretty annoyed when he was told the descaler would cost ₹2000. No way I am going to purchase it at those prices. Would rather get it from Amazon.

 

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IFB after purchase products are damm expensive. They literally rip-off the customers by charging 3-4 times the amount of what the competition offers and their own products on Amazon.
This lady literally got ripped-off after purchasing her 8kg machine. I mean ~7000 bucks!! Her husband was pretty annoyed when he was told the descaler would cost ₹2000. No way I am going to purchase it at those prices. Would rather get it from Amazon.

Similar story here

Check out this Amazon review of IFB 7.5 Kg 5 Star Fully-Automatic Front Loading Washing Machine (Elite Plus SXR, Silver, Cradle wash, 3D Wash technology)

Superior product but expensive installation

www.amazon.in

Do you need a stand? No. Since you're getting a front loader look for a two-foot spirit level. Don't buy it online. You will have to go to the shops and test out a few to see if it is true.

Do you need a cover? your call

Do you need a water filter? Is your borewell water brown-coloured coming out of the tap? then you need a sediment filter.

Do you need their branded liquid detergent and they only sell liquid and no powder? I'd prefer to go branded MNC

Don't take any magnetic gadgets they sell. Tell them you're getting a Kent water softener.


Besides their machines already have magnets installed that will magically deal with hard water

Do you need descaler? yes, 100gm every month in a boil wash but you could use citric acid

Do you need a voltage stabilizer for the washing machine? you have to monitor whether your voltage is stable or not? If it fluctuates then over what range?

V-Guard VM 500 Voltage Stabilizer for Washing Machine, Microwave Oven, Treadmill (Grey) : Amazon.in: Home & Kitchen

V-Guard VM 500 Voltage Stabilizer for Washing Machine, Microwave Oven, Treadmill (Grey) : Amazon.in: Home & Kitchen

www.amazon.in

When people lose their main boards within five years it means they have bad power.



Now all IFB washing machines whether top or front load have this voltage protection. But it is just a safety cutoff. It's not a built-in stabilizer.

She's got the Senator WSS Steam 8kg. Nice machine but the problem is it comes with a touchscreen. Touchscreens cannot be operated if either your fingers or the screen is moist for any reason. A fingerprint magnet needs to be kept clean like any phone. I dislike touchscreens because there is no tactile feedback

What else do we already know about touchscreens?

So the new machine is a 8kg one with touch panel. Used daily, working as expected. But the touch panel sometime picks up ghost touches (someone passing nearby?) and switches off. This is only gripe and I'd not prefer a machine with touch panel in future if I have option.

Yes. That's how my problem started. Ghost touches and then later it developed problem of not registering touches at all. Notice only the switch off/on button is registering ghost touches and not other buttons. Reason being the copper sponge deteriorates with use and that button is the most used one. But at least you know the root cause now. This is a widely reported issue with LG front loaders with touch screen panels. Yet they haven't change the design in last 4 years.

Seeing the repair video touchscreens can be repaired. It's the membrane panel type you want to completely avoid.

2) It happened with me. I've got a LG front load washing machine. One day it stopped working out of the blue. Refused to turn on irrespective of what I did.Called LG and they quoted 7k over phone. And they were providing only 3 months warranty after spending that 7k. A 22k 4 years old washing machine costing around 8k for repair didn't seem right. I did some research and apparently this was a very common issue and was fixed by replacing the contact sponge behind touchscreen by a metal spring. This didn't even cost 50INR. The youtube video which detailed this fix has lots of comments from people asking the same thing why LG is asking 7k for fixing such a small issue. That's how I got to know that mine was not an isolated incident. And mind you, they don't even provide any annual maintenance contracts.

They rip you off with the repair though. As he mentioned the fix did not require replacing the entire panel.

The other thing is the power button is combined with the Program select button. So if you are not careful and you bump into the program button which sticks out then you will switch the machine off. A separate power button is better.

Senator is a good Series but many variants are missing Rinse Hold which is a negative.

Senator VSS & SXS and Senator Plus VXS, SRS & SXS have Extra Rinse, Time Saver & Time Delay. The VXS has discrete buttons which is a plus.

Senator WSS Steam has Rinse Hold but comes with a touchscreen

The earlier Senator WXS has RInse Hold but comes with a touchscreen and has a drum volume of 53 litres. That is for the 8kg model. It has two jets at the entrance so hard water residue could block them. The fix could be as easy as a toothpick and poking

So the deal with the Senators is either you get a model with buttons and forego Rinse Hold or you get one that has Rinse hold and forego buttons for a touchscreen

 

[Kaleen Bhaiya]

Do you need a stand?

I think stand will be helpful. It will allow to increase the height by a few margin which will help to drain waste water into the bathroom more effectively. The bathroom also has a marble slab over which the drain pipe will pass so a greater elevation is needed to drain water effectively.
Regarding other products, I was just stating how IFB robs people. I have no intention of purchasing them except for stand and/or descaler.

 

[lockhrt999]

I think stand will be helpful. It will allow to increase the height by a few margin which will help to drain waste water into the bathroom more effectively. The bathroom also has a marble slab over which the drain pipe will pass so a greater elevation is needed to drain water effectively.

FL have a dedicated pump for draining. The mouth of the drain pipe is advised to be kept between 1 to 2 feet high from the floor. I think it's suggested because there should always be some water in the drain pipe.

 

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IFB manual



LG manual



Samsung manual

 

[Kaleen Bhaiya]

I have this kind of tap arrangement in the kitchen. Will it fit the water inlet hose? The part which screws onto the tap.

tap-details hosted at ImgBB

Image tap-details hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

 

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1) Another possibility is the IFB Elite ZXS 7kg 1,000 RPM model



All buttons. The photo looks good. Gives the impression the fascia is matte. But it's glossy so will be a fingerprint magnet as can be seen in the videos for Elite ZXS & Elite MXS

ZXS is a 1000 RPM model

IFB 7 Kg 5 Star Fully-Automatic Front Loading Washing Machine (ELITE ZXS, Silver, In-Built Heater, 3D Wash technology) : Amazon.in: Home & Kitchen

IFB 7 Kg 5 Star Fully-Automatic Front Loading Washing Machine (ELITE ZXS, Silver, In-Built Heater, 3D Wash technology) : Amazon.in: Home & Kitchen

www.amazon.in

IFB 7 kg Fully Automatic Front Load Washing Machine with In-built Heater Silver Price in India - Buy IFB 7 kg Fully Automatic Front Load Washing Machine with In-built Heater Silver online at Flipkart.com

Buy IFB 7 kg Fully Automatic Front Load Washing Machine with In-built Heater Silver for Rs. online. IFB 7 kg Fully Automatic Front Load Washing Machine with In-built Heater Silver at best prices with FREE shipping & cash on delivery. Only Genuine Products. 30 Day Replacement Guarantee.

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IFB Elite ZXS 7 Kg Fully Automatic Front Load Washing Machine Online at Best Prices

Buy an IFB 7.0kg Fully Automatic Front Load washing machine ELITE ZXS Dual tone (Silver/Black) with ✓Fitness Wear ✓Anti-Allergen ✓3D Wash Technology ✓In-built heater ✓Buy Now!

www.ifbappliances.com

ZSS, MXS are 1,200 RPM models and include steam cycles

All Elite models have Rinse hold and button interfaces. The downside I find compared to the Serena candidate is the Options were clearly displayed as text. With the Elite series, there is no text and options are displayed as icons on the panel. I won't remember what option the icon denotes and its just a bit confusing

Text is easier. The elite has one jet at the opening so that is something that can block up with hard water residue. Course if a toothpick clears it then maybe not a big deal.

Still prefer the older all white Serena WX over these Elite series


2) Already mentioned the Senator 1,200 RPM Senator Series, here is an earlier one without the S, the 8kg Senator Plus VX. (Can't tell whether the S means steam or Silver)

I saw the buttons and thought yah, buttons. But they are not buttons. THIS IS A TOUCH DISPLAY !!! They faked it !! The specs say 'Touch' interface.

So I guess that rules out the Senator Series

IFB 8 kg SENATOR PLUS VX (White Door) (Amazon) (Archive listing of Specs shows it HAS Rinse hold and you can see it does have it in the above video Notice how he 'taps' instead of presses the buttons. I don't hear a click sound )

IFB 8 kg SENATOR PLUS VXS (Black Door) (Specs say NO Rinse Hold under Wash options, because they added the 'Steam' option and then ran out of display space (!) so Rinse hold had to go. As seen in this video for the 1,400 RPM SXS variant)

It's got laundry jets and no separate power button. According to IFB's catalogue, the more recent Senator plus models no longer have the 'rinse hold' due to adding the steam option

So senator plus VX is a second choice in addition to the all-white Serena WX

The Serena has a 'Hot Rinse' option which is absent on the Senator+ VX. The Senator has a 'Soak' option instead of 'Hot Rinse"

Senator also has a 'Laundry Add' feature which Serena does not. This allows adding clothes after a wash begins. Pause the wash, open the door and add. I don't have it on my LG and don't really miss it.

The Serena WX has a tactile interface with REAL buttons. This Senator has a touch interface.

The 8kg Senator VX says 2:38 for a Cottons wash. The 7kg Serena WX says 1:57 for a Cottons wash.

I'm surprised the time is shown for all the programs. Does this mean IFB washing machines have no fuzzy logic? they do not!

Meaning light load or full load the wash is still going to take 2h38 on the Senator VX? well with the LG time varies depending on the weight. A full load on the LG is 2h30 a lighter one could be as low as 1h11 then 1h30 is the next step and so on

With IFB, for lighter loads, you're supposed to choose the 'time saver' option. The Senator VX drops from 2:38 to 1:24 and the Serena drops from 1:57 to 1:30 but deactivates the prewash option. Which is fine. Just don't use 'time saver' on a full load or the wash might not be as good.


3) Higher end models like Executive all have touch screens so nothing to see there.

 

[lockhrt999]

I have this kind of tap arrangement in the kitchen. Will it fit the water inlet hose? The part which screws onto the tap.

tap-details hosted at ImgBB

Image tap-details hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

Nope. You'll need something like this. Even regular tap will also work fine but it needs to have a flat bottom and a straight sidewall on which screws will clamp on. Go to any hardware shop and tell them you need a tap for washing machine. Get the cheapest from presented options. If you are fitting it yourself then you'll also need a teflon tape. Or you can ask demo guy to install it.

 

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^doesn't have a nozzle

The search terms you want are nozzle bib cock

See attached for an example. Off and on is only a quarter turn. I always close it after a wash otherwise it puts pressure on the valves in the machine.

 

[lockhrt999]

^doesn't have a nozzle

The search terms you want are nozzle bib cock

See attached for an example. Off and on is only a quarter turn. I always close it after a wash otherwise it puts pressure on the valves in the machine.

That nozzle is to directly attach a garden hose. It'll sorta work for washing machine but not ideal.

 

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The way I see it is it funnels into the inlet pipe and has less chance of leaking. Also provides more mechanical support as you have a backbone of sorts going into the pipe.

You could attach a hose to it too.

The washing machine taps have the same ridge for the pipe's screw clamps to attach to. But they save on not having to provide a tapering nozzle.

I'd recommend a metal tap over plastic as plastic is going to get pinched over time.

 

[lockhrt999]

For my last machine I was using similar tap which was meant for garden hose. But I didn't keep that quick disconnect adapter of the machine's pipe. I cut it away from the pipe and connected the pipe directly.

 

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You'd have needed a screw clamp to hold the pipe in place then. The pipe would get loose over time I'd expect and just fall out.

I can't understand why the nozzle didn't work for you though. You should not have had to modify the pipe at all.

 

[lockhrt999]

You'd have needed a screw clamp to hold the pipe in place then. The pipe would get loose over time I'd expect and just fall out.

I can't understand why the nozzle didn't work for you though. You should not have had to modify the pipe at all.

Opposite was the case. That nozzle doesn't let pipe to get loose as it's way thicker than the pipe. I didn't bother much to screw adapter on that nozzle as cutting the pipe was easy thing to do.
@Kaleen Bhaiya you got your machine? I would suggest not buying stand from the demo guy as he'll over charge you. You can get it online beforehand. Do get it before you get the machine because front loaders are really heavy for a single guy to handle. FLs have same dimensions so it won't be too hard to find a stand online. And you'll have a few months before you need a descaler so no need to buy it from demo guy either.

 

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And you'll have a few months before you need a descaler so no need to buy it from demo guy either.

He'll have less than that with his 600 ppm water. Descaler after a month, every month with IFB's 95 degree tub clean. 100gm or two heaped detergent scoops of Citric acid will do.

Wish he had an IR thermometer, would be interesting to see how close the wash temperatures are to stated

At 600 ppm and without a softener I wonder how long until his clothes get stiff?

What does he do next? fabric softener to the rescue. Take note of what that does below

One more thing is, Ever since people in the house started using fabric softners, the whirlpool machine pressure switch tube hole gets blocked. Thus far it has happened 2 times, since the last 7 or 8 years out of the 14 years the machine was in use. Prior to the 7 or 8 years of the machines life no fabric softner was used and no clogs.

This happens when excess fabric softner is used, or when people dump the softner in other compartments. Or when there is a long power cut during or before cycle was finished.

For clearing the gunk in pressure switch, you can blow compressed air in it for a quick fix, but that only clears the tube and can reoccur very soon.

So i remove the door gasket, then the plastic comparment screwed into the tub, that has a plastic hose nipple and air chamber that the rubber hose from the pressure switch is connected to. The amount of pink comfort softner gunk is unbelievable, the tub bottom is filled with that stuff.

Its only after I showed them the gunk did people in the house stopped using that crap.

So this is why I suggest to use only powder detergent. It leaves a white residue but not the crappy gunk that the softner and potentially liquid detergents leave behind.

That was with fabric softener, its anyone's guess what sensors scale will block without regular maintenance

 

[Kaleen Bhaiya]

@lockhrt999 No, not yet. Hopefully should get it today.

 

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I think stand will be helpful. It will allow to increase the height by a few margin which will help to drain waste water into the bathroom more effectively. The bathroom also has a marble slab over which the drain pipe will pass so a greater elevation is needed to drain water effectively.

I don't understand what you are saying here.

The only point of a stand is to move the machine around. Once it is in place there is no need or further use of a stand. If the purpose is to move the machine around the house tell them to use it and take it back with them. No need to buy it.

As for draining water, the pump in the machine should drain the water wherever.

Take a look at post #545, and see the drain pipe exiting from about half the height of the machine. That slab can't be higher than the point where the drain outlet on the machine is. Or is it?

LG's & IFB's drain pipe is half way up the machine. The Sammy looks like it exits closer to the base. Is that true @lockhrt999 ?

The delivery people had a two wheel trolley and moved my machine into place. The shop I bought it from told me not to use a stand. Why? the owner said it wasn't needed. What he didn't tell me is it could void the warranty

f) If defects arise with optional accessories like trolleys, rat mesh, machine cover, on-line filter, inlet/exhaust extension hoses, tap adapter, extended power supply cable, adjustment feet cover etc.

Check the warranty

 

[lockhrt999]

LG's & IFB's drain pipe is half way up the machine. The Sammy looks like it exits closer to the base. Is that true @lockhrt999 ?

It's a range, yes. Half way up also works.

 

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Sammy's drain pipe also exits half way up like the other two

 

[lockhrt999]

Sammy's drain pipe also exits half way up like the other two

View attachment 159315

Oh you are talking exit from the machine? I misread. Image seems to be correct.