Front loading or top loading washing machine?

[thugz_doge]

Avoid LG front loaders with touchscreen panels as they're known to fail. Search LG touchscreen problem on youtube for more details.

 

[bhp91]

How high is your water tank from the floor where the machine will be used?

I live on the top floor so the water tank is one floor above.
Also, where do you get all these details like motor rpm, drum volume, whether the drum is sealed, etc? I was looking at this on LG's website and can find none of these details on there.

 

[lockhrt999]

That's some unreal amount of knowledge right there. Thanks for taking time @blr_p

Your suggestion on using washing less often to preserve the life of the machine is correct. When I use the machine, I usually do whole week's laundry at once. I can tell other family member to do the same.

These machines have a depth of 45cm. You want a depth of 55cm and no less.

This actually changed how I'm looking at things now. I originally thought more kg capacity meant bigger drum. Boy, I have been wrong. The KG capacity only means power of the motor. If I'm not wrong, diameter of the drum is same for all capacities. Only length of the drum (ie depth of the machine) changes. I think some companies are using same drum for 6-8 kg models. It's a good suggestion to load up the clothes by looking at how much drum volume they fill instead of relying on weight.

With touch panels on LG's those give trouble is less than 5 requiring opening the panel and replacing pads. Course they will tell you to change the whole panel which if you read earlier posts isn't necessary.

I have experience with LG panels. The touch membrane of my LG oven stopped working. No spares available. I shorted the relay responsible for microwave mode and used the oven in always on mode for more than 7 years.

1. You can soak as long as you want but it requires intervention. So once you load up the machine, select the pre-wash modifier, let the water fill and soap mix. Halfway through the prewash cycle or 2.5 mins later, switch it off at the mains. Simulate a power cut. Now soak as long as you want and then resume the power.

I'm already doing that with current machine. I was expecting companies might have added longer soaking functionality by now.

2. Clean thoroughly is a question of the stain and appropriate pre-treatment. All the machine does is agitate clothes. It's not a miracle worker. You need an understanding of the kind of stain, its chemistry (see attached) and then use appropriate pre-treatment if necessary so it comes out clean. Enzymes are already present in Ariel & Surf which is why they caution not to use them with woollens. Enzymes will eat natural fibres like wool. But it's important to wash at a minimum of 40 degrees so enzymes can be fully activated. Oxidising is what Vanish does depending on the stain. Builders also are present and will take care of mud stains or particulate. Greasy stains are also handled by the detergent.

If the machine can handle a normal jeans then it's fine for me already. My current machine does very poor job washing normal jeans. I agree some stains will need specialized treatment. Thanks for sharing the vanish pdf. It seems I don't know a few things.

4. I always discourage the use of fabric conditioners because it just leads to smell problems later. All models have a compartment to use and it typically is dispensed during the last rinse cycle. Make your own with citric acid crystals. 20% concentration with water in a bottle. Shake well so it is completely dissolved. Use 10ml per wash.

I already have citric acid crystals. Never knew this can be done.

2. Use 400rpm if humidity is less than 60% and 800 rpm above. Skip the higher speeds as that just increases wear and tear on the bearings. Higher rpms are useful if you are going to put the clothes into a dryer which you will not do anyway. See here for more

Aye aye captain. Higher RPM has diminishing returns.

Still there are people who prefer them like this lady.

I don't like this lady. Indian youtubers have habit of presenting spec sheet as their own personal experience.

5. Machines usually come with rat screens these days.

Good to know. I already have levelled the tiles below washing machine using spirit level.

--
1. Many models now include steam cleaning. Is it any useful or just a gimmick?

2. If I go by online number of ratings, I think LG is selling slightly more units than Samsung. Again it may not be correct because companies reuse their old listings that already had high reviews. But, is one better than the other in terms of quality and service? Or either is okay to go with? I have bad experience with both of these brands (not washing machine though). And how is IFB compared to koreans?

3. Can we keep dry clothes in front loading machine for a few days? I know top loading drums are suspended by springs so it might not be ideal for them but what about front loaders?. I was thinking to keep loading the machine until it reaches like 50% drum before starting the cycle.

4. If I could get 55cm depth machine, I think even 7kg capacity will be more than enough for us. We hardly use half of 5.5 of the current machine. Plus we don't even leave house as like before. 7kg should give us 20-30% extra buffer for edge cases.

How about this? https://www.amazon.in/dp/B09KGY7S81 samsung 7kg but 55cm depth, 2022 model and no touch panel.

If possible, I'd like to avoid touch panel stuff because our current machine which has membrane panel had stopped working for more than 10 days this month because of the high humidity. But this is the time where we need the machine the most.

 

[blr_p]

I live on the top floor so the water tank is one floor above.
Also, where do you get all these details like motor rpm, drum volume, whether the drum is sealed, etc? I was looking at this on LG's website and can find none of these details on there.

It's not motor rpm but spin speed which is listed on the panel.

Drum volume I measured in shops years ago with a measuring tape and calculated myself. The only place that lists drum volume is LG germany's website but then the models sold there are not the same as the ones here.

Sealed drum or not comes from @adder , with Bosch you can figure this out as they show you the parts blowup on their site. Otherwise, this info comes from searching spare parts websites abroad or service manuals which appear a few years after a model is launched. Or you will discover it when you need to do fixes. It's picked up from what people say.

That's some unreal amount of knowledge right there. Thanks for taking time @blr_p

Most of it is thanks to the people who run the ukwhitegoods website. It's advice from the pov of the repair man. You can learn all you want there. eg. this is about washing machines. They have lots of guides for other whitegoods. This is the best place I've found that cuts through a lot of BS and gives it to you straight.

Your suggestion on using washing less often to preserve the life of the machine is correct. When I use the machine, I usually do whole week's laundry at once. I can tell other family member to do the same.

Or you can sort your laundry into whites and colours for the whole family by getting some wash baskets and just run full loads.

This actually changed how I'm looking at things now. I originally thought more kg capacity meant bigger drum. Boy, I have been wrong. The KG capacity only means power of the motor. If I'm not wrong, diameter of the drum is same for all capacities. Only length of the drum (ie depth of the machine) changes. I think some companies are using same drum for 6-8 kg models. It's a good suggestion to load up the clothes by looking at how much drum volume they fill instead of relying on weight.

In the US, washing machines are sold by cubic foot ie. volume not by weight like they are in the rest of the world Their machines are double the volume capacity we get here but I found volume a much more intuitive way to figure out machine size. You can use a packing box and put your clothes in to understand what your requirement is in terms of volume. kg is the ISO way of doing it and is unintuitive.

5 years ago a 7kg machine would have been good enough. They upped the rating by 1kg so today an 8kg machine has the exact same volume as a 7kg did years ago. So you see kg changes with time. the volume will not because it's a hard limit. An 8kg machine 5 years ago is a 9kg machine today and is approx 65 litres. The jump from 7 to 8 is more significant than the one from 8 to 9 if we're talking Korean machines.

With Bosch or belt drive machines the volume is more because it does not have a direct drive motor at the top. You might get away with less cost and similar volume with Bosch because of it. The thing with Bosch is their drums are sealed (no bearings change possible) except for their smallest models which I'm telling you to avoid.

I have experience with LG panels. The touch membrane of my LG oven stopped working. No spares available. I shorted the relay responsible for microwave mode and used the oven in always on mode for more than 7 years.

The fix for a touch panel is like a keypad of a cordless phone. If you can access underneath the touch panel you can fix it the same way. Why not try to fix your LG oven? Then you will have the confidence to fix the LG washing machine when its touchpanel also breaks.

I'm already doing that with current machine. I was expecting companies might have added longer soaking functionality by now.

A simpler way without pulling the power is to push the pause button. But with my machine, this does not work. After a while, it just drains out the water. That is why I came up with the power trick.

If the machine can handle a normal jeans then it's fine for me already. My current machine does very poor job washing normal jeans. I agree some stains will need specialized treatment. Thanks for sharing the vanish pdf. It seems I don't know a few things.

Because its a top loader I guess. The clothes get swirled around instead of being tossed around. To clean jeans in a top loader you will have to add more jeans so they rub against each other. In a front loader, this happens by default.

I already have citric acid crystals. Never knew this can be done.

Credit for the idea goes to a Japanese youtuber. But I don't think this will do what you expect from a fabric conditioner.

Which begs the question why do you use fabric conditioner in the first place?

I don't like this lady. Indian youtubers have habit of presenting spec sheet as their own personal experience.

Oh! I find her one of the better ones. She likes her washer dryer. She likes putting clothes in at night and taking out dry clothes in the morning. The thing is I can't post comments with links in her channel as google keeps deleting them, thinking they are spam (!)

1. Many models now include steam cleaning. Is it any useful or just a gimmick?

They use steam at 60 degrees. It's billed as anti-germ in India. We already know washing in any soap kills viruses but to kill bacteria nothing short of boiling works. And you can kill bacteria with laundry sanitisers like Dettol provided you can hold that last rinse cycle long enough. Well, many machines don't come with rinse hold these days so I don't know how you do it with them. Needs a 20-minute soak at least. Normally the rinse cycle only lasts about 6 minutes. That is not enough dwell time for a biocide to do its work.

Another use is stain removal. Protein stains like blood should not be treated with heat as it sets them in. Might work for other stains.

And lastly, it kills odour-causing bacteria. I don't think 60 degrees is hot enough to do that. Maybe it is. Might remove sweat odours. But a biocide as above will do it at 40 and save your elastic. But you need to buy Dettol sanitizer. This is an in-built feature with no recurring cost assuming it works to remove odours. YMMV.

UKWG says this about them. How effective is the question? I would not use it on anything that has elastic.

CR says it made no difference to stain removal and questioned whether it can sanitise.

I don't have it on my LG and don't want for it. I think this is just an attempt to compete with clothes steamers and will not give the same result. But you get to say its a feature

2. If I go by online number of ratings, I think LG is selling slightly more units than Samsung. Again it may not be correct because companies reuse their old listings that already had high reviews. But, is one better than the other in terms of quality and service? Or either is okay to go with? I have bad experience with both of these brands (not washing machine though). And how is IFB compared to koreans?

What put me off with IFB early on was the number of service complaints I found online about them. Back in the 200s they had a collaboration with Bosch and made good stuff then that partnership ended and Bosch went its own way having learnt enough from the experience about the Indian market. The result is people shifted from IFB to Bosch. So IFB has to offer double the warranty to hold on to and incentivise sales with discounts. I know people who swear by IFB but they are going by older experience. Parts and service is available if you're in a tier 1 city. The question is how often do you need those parts. What struck me with the complaints was the reliability of IFB in comparison to foreign brands.

My preference is for LG over Samsung because I think they've been in this business longer. LG's products don't look the most attractive but they work. Samsung will create a better impression in looks and even feel. Slam the door of a Samsung and its sounds solid compared to an LG. The industrial design is also better. But reliability depends on what's inside and I think LG with its emphasis on engineering over design wins out. This impression comes from their phones. LG was ahead of Samsung in areas that mattered to me. They don't have an advertising budget to speak of. But if you say LG in this country, people instantly think of fridges or appliances. There must be a reason.

I find LG's UI simple.

I do note with regret that the latest models are missing a couple of functions I have on mine which are rinse hold and medic rinse. The latter is just an extra rinse, so 3 instead of two with the last one done in 40 degree water. But rinse hold is very useful and I don't see it on machines anymore these days. It allows to halt the machine before the spin cycle happens. So if it is raining I just select rinse hold and when the rain stops, use the spin cycle. Or when I want a longer soak rinse with laundry sanitizer.

If you're looking for an alternative I saw Panasonic being mentioned by that Vineet Malhotra guy. It's not available in my city and I've no idea about service.

3. Can we keep dry clothes in front loading machine for a few days? I know top loading drums are suspended by springs so it might not be ideal for them but what about front loaders?. I was thinking to keep loading the machine until it reaches like 50% drum before starting the cycle.

I usually keep dirty clothes in a basket and only put them in the machine when there is enough. I've never kept dirty dry clothes in the machine. I think airing them helps reduce the smells which would otherwise remain if kept in a confined space. If there is any liquid spills this is definitely better.

As for loading read this

That is what fully loaded in a front loader looks like. Just enough space to put your hand in between the top of the clothes and the top part of the port opening.

4. If I could get 55cm depth machine, I think even 7kg capacity will be more than enough for us. We hardly use half of 5.5 of the current machine. Plus we don't even leave house as like before. 7kg should give us 20-30% extra buffer for edge cases.

How about this? https://www.amazon.in/dp/B09KGY7S81 samsung 7kg but 55cm depth, 2022 model and no touch panel.

If possible, I'd like to avoid touch panel stuff because our current machine which has membrane panel had stopped working for more than 10 days this month because of the high humidity. But this is the time where we need the machine the most.

My machine is a 7kg. So the older ones that are 55 litres should be ok. You asked about soaking, This machine has a 'bubble soak' option according to this review. I can actually read the options on the real machine whereas on amazon you only see icons. Apparently, it soaks for 30 minutes. Good enough? no need to fiddle with the power.

User Manual

Water pressure requirement is low. Least is 50kPa. My LG goes as low as 30kPa but all LG's these days start at 100kPa because they have steam wash and turbo wash. That means the tank must be at least two storeys above your machine. If it's 30kPa you can get away with tank above the machine. I think 50 is borderline.

Also, this has just a spin function. So if you want to dry anything wet that is easy. On the LG there's a hack to get this working. No direct dial.

In principle, this sammy fits your requirements. It's big enough and costs less than the 31k I paid back in 2016 for my also all white LG. Wonder what got minused !!

Sammy always offers features, features & more features. You are never wanting for features on a sammy. How well they work is another question.

The thing with sammy is the drum is sealed according to adder so if a bearings change is required it won't be possible later on. Otherwise looks good.

How high is your water tank from the machine? Front-loaders come with timers because they have a heater. If the water they need does not arrive in time they throw an error. Top loaders that don't have a heater won't throw an error. The error is to protect the heating element from getting burnt out.

Was chatting with someone that picked up a 9kg sammy. He said that while doing one of his washes and nearing the end the power went out. Instead of resuming the machine got stuck at the main menu as if you just turned it on. It did not resume in this case from the spin cycle. I found that strange. When speaking to the customer service people they said the auto-resume works if the power cut is of short duration but longer was not supported.

Anyone with a sammy care to confirm what the auto resume on sammy front loader is like?

 

[tech.addict]

Remember samsung machines have the spider arm that holds the drum made of aluminum. This corrodes with time and when it fails you have to change the whole assembly which includes the drum too. This costs about 7k for 6kg machine. Usually happens in about 5-6 years. My brother have to change it. There are many such reports. In LG drum, the spider support , bearing etc are all separate and can be changed individually. Although I didn't had any problem with 10+ year old earlier machine which was used everyday.

 

[lockhrt999]

@blr_p: thanks again.

Today I went to see the front loaders in person. Man, 45cm depth machine have tiny drums. I'm glad I didn't rush with the purchase and asked here. If you hadn't told me I would have never known. There were some 7 and 8kg models from samsung, ifb with 55cm depth and their drums looked acceptable. I won't say big but yeah acceptable.

I don't think anyone sales front loader with belt drive these days so motor is going to occupy some space too. Direct drive should be more reliable than belt drive. So I think this tradeoff is okay.

The fix for a touch panel is like a keypad of a cordless phone. If you can access underneath the touch panel you can fix it the same way. Why not try to fix your LG oven?

That thing had a membrane panel and we can't fix it. It's like thick sheet of plastic and buttons are sealed inside that sheet. Opening the membrane panel destroys it. First time, I soldered tactile buttons for regular functions like start/stop, time+ etc. But after a year the motherboard also went bad. Finally I shorted the relay which turns on microwave mode which made my oven to always start in microwave mode if you power it on. Used it for 5-6 years. The magnetron failed. Then I shorted the relay responsible for grill mode and sold it on OLX as grill only oven.

My preference is for LG over Samsung because I think they've been in this business longer. LG's products don't look the most attractive but they work. Samsung will create a better impression in looks and even feel. Slam the door of a Samsung and its sounds solid compared to an LG. The industrial design is also better. But reliability depends on what's inside and I think LG with its emphasis on engineering over design wins out.

That's always been the case. LG always been ahead in innovations. LG's always going to make more reliable products because Samsung is always ahead in terms of overall sales and brand perception. I have always seen that if someone's sitting at the helm doesn't try hard because they don't need to struggle (remember intel). It's usually #2 or #3 players trying to one up.

If you're looking for an alternative I saw Panasonic being mentioned by that Vineet Malhotra guy. It's not available in my city and I've no idea about service.

No panasonic. I don't think it has any service. I blocked that malhotra guy's channel. He lies a lot. He doesn't check the actual products but tells the viewers as if he did. He recommends any brand which gives him the most amazon affiliate commission.

My machine is a 7kg. So the older ones that are 55 litres should be ok. You asked about soaking, This machine has a 'bubble soak' option according to this review. I can actually read the options on the real machine whereas on amazon you only see icons. Apparently, it soaks for 30 minutes. Good enough? no need to fiddle with the power.

I think samsung has removed that ecobubble feature since 2021. Now, there's only soak button. Let's hope it also soaks for longer.

Water pressure requirement is low. Least is 50kPa. My LG goes as low as 30kPa but all LG's these days start at 100kPa because they have steam wash and turbo wash. That means the tank must be at least two storeys above your machine. If it's 30kPa you can get away with tank above the machine. I think 50 is borderline.

Mine's 20 ft above. So it's barely meeting 50kPa requirement. (50kPa = 0.5 bar pressure and 11 meters of water height creates 1 bar pressure. Mine is little over half bar). If new LG machines require 100kPa minimum then it's no good. For 100kPa or 1 bar pressure, the tank needs to be at 11 meters height. That's more than 3 storeys.

The thing with sammy is the drum is sealed according to adder so if a bearings change is required it won't be possible later on. Otherwise looks good.

Remember samsung machines have the spider arm that holds the drum made of aluminum. This corrodes with time and when it fails you have to change the whole assembly which includes the drum too. This costs about 7k for 6kg machine. Usually happens in about 5-6 years. My brother have to change it.

I won't say we live in a very humid place like mumbai. But we live at the ground floor and that means in heavy rains, the humidity meter is above 95%. If someone is living in apartment is my area, the humidity won't go above 80% during the same condition. The humidity is much more near the ground. Above 90% humidity for multiple days freezes electrical appliances like my current washing machine, induction cooker, microwave oven. I need at least washing machine running during high humidity days to dry the clothes. This is also why I'm replacing my current machine.

As I see now, I can have either have non-working LG machine during very humid days or big cost of drum replacement with samsung after 5+ years. And not to mention, with LG, I might have to spend 4-5k extra installing pressure pump if it really requires 100kPa pressure. And bigger drum is available only with 8kg+ models in LG. It looks like, I have to spend 7-8k extra with LG situation right now compared to samsung. I think samsung is a better calculated risk .

I read in a few places that bearings can be changed with sealed drums. It's already happening in poorer countries. We Indians are jugaadu too. We'll find a way.

I personally don't have great experience of Samsung electronics. 2x TV, 1x fridge, 1x laptop were very bad (and no spares were available). Samsung CRT monitor and HDD were great though. 2 of my relatives have samsung top loading washing machines which are going super strong even after 10+ years. So I'm gonna take the blue pill this time. Plus, it doesn't look like I have many options.

 

[adder]

I should point out that I have the LG front load 8kg, which mentions the minimum pressure of 100kpa which is 10 meters or 33 feet tank height requirement.
But I ran mine with less then 10 feet of height (from the tap to the overhead tank outlet height) and there is no issues running it with such pressure.

The reason they say to use a 100kpa pressure is if you use the turbo function, where nozzle located in the drum door gasket spray water during the start of the cycle so that the cloths can get wet faster.

Once the clothes are wet. The nozzles or high water pressure serve no function.
Infact before I put a thermostatic valve to get hot water from solar, I used to pour hot water from solar from a tap located in bathroom to washing machine located else where via mug. I used to turn the washing machine cold tap a little, so that the machine doesn't chime the closed tap error and then pour the hot water via the detergent tray.

The machine only calculates the time taken for it to fill and if its really high it will give a closed tap error IE.

Pressure and flow are two separate things. I could in theory close the tap fully and just put a hose or a funnel in detergent tray and fill the machine with a bucket with zero pressure and get no error.

Regarding drum sizes vs Kg, LG uses the same drum size from sizes 7 to 9kg in machines that have the same depth.

Whirpool have different drum sizes for 7, 8, 9kg but have a sealed drum. Their fresh care line have biggest drum size for 8 to 9kg class, since it uses a belt drive but with brushless motor vs some of the other models which use a direct drive.

Regarding Samsung, they have the highest failure rate for spyder, its like they designed it to fail. So avoid buying samsung.

Panasonic uses removable drum, but service may be a issue in some places.

So that is the reason I choose LG plenty of service centers and removable drum.

 

[blr_p]

@blr_p: thanks again.

Today I went to see the front loaders in person. Man, 45cm depth machine have tiny drums. I'm glad I didn't rush with the purchase and asked here. If you hadn't told me I would have never known. There were some 7 and 8kg models from samsung, ifb with 55cm depth and their drums looked acceptable. I won't say big but yeah acceptable.

Now you understand yet my cousin back in 2011 thought a 45cm Samsung was perfectly acceptable for a household of 4 because it was 10k less than a 55cm. The sales guys always push the 45cm because they have a higher chance of a sale than something bigger. I've found people here ver the years insist on 45 cm because they don't have much to wash every day. Well, you will double your cycles with a smaller machine, this they do not realise. Saving 10k now only to repay 30k for a new machine some years later that you could put off for longer is a false economy.

What is the size of your videcon top loader tub? that is pertinent information. Measure the height from the top gasket to the bottom and the diameter and let's figure out the volume.

You expect to match the capacity or have more if needed. For that, you will need to consider front loaders with a depth of 65cm. I notice these days that size starts at 12kg. Five years ago an 8kg machine had that depth. See, how they play with the kg ratings. A 9kg sammy has the same volume as the 7kg you linked earlier because it has the same 55cm depth. You don't need the higher kg rating, but you need the volume.

I don't think anyone sales front loader with belt drive these days so motor is going to occupy some space too. Direct drive should be more reliable than belt drive. So I think this tradeoff is okay.

Bosch & IFB are belt driven. Panasonic too I think. Only the Koreans are direct drive. But Sammy does not mention direct drive yet Sammy's drum dimensions are the same as LG. Reliability from what I can see is better with the Koreans. One of the guys here had bearings problems with a Bosch in just 5 years. That is surprising. It means the bearings were built to a price point not a standard.

That thing had a membrane panel and we can't fix it. It's like thick sheet of plastic and buttons are sealed inside that sheet. Opening the membrane panel destroys it. First time, I soldered tactile buttons for regular functions like start/stop, time+ etc. But after a year the motherboard also went bad. Finally I shorted the relay which turns on microwave mode which made my oven to always start in microwave mode if you power it on. Used it for 5-6 years. The magnetron failed. Then I shorted the relay responsible for grill mode and sold it on OLX as grill only oven.

Check the LG touchpanel repair video posted earlier and see whether its the same as your oven. I don't think it is because the guy managed to fix it.

That's always been the case. LG always been ahead in innovations. LG's always going to make more reliable products because Samsung is always ahead in terms of overall sales and brand perception. I have always seen that if someone's sitting at the helm doesn't try hard because they don't need to struggle (remember intel). It's usually #2 or #3 players trying to one up.

That lady, Saumya's Samsung washer dryer did not cost more than 40k. Crazy. To get an LG equivalent you're looking at 55k or more. Same capacity and features. Why is the LG more? If it's an import from Korea then it will be still more at 80k. Sammy makes it locally. LG has to import.

I wanted a fridge with a light in the freezer. The smallest capacity LG fridge that had that was 400L. But Sammy would give you one at 350L and for less. Both are made in India.

Sammy is building to a price point, not a standard. They are very aggressive with pricing. Sammy makes a lot of their stuff in the country. The Chinese are not going to push Sammy out of the Indian market anytime soon. Could be the other way as one by one these Chinese companies have to raise their prices to compete. Just like that new restaurant that started up and gave you the best portions for less, after a year they've burnt out their kitty so they either close shop or reduce the portions.

Price is more with LG for the same which implies better quality for me since I'm not trying to save pennies on these purchases. You get what you pay for and if the price is still higher with a laughable marketing budget in comparison to Sammy, then the LG is the better quality appliance. Not by a lot but by some way. Look at both company's products across different sectors. You will see some patterns emerging.

No panasonic. I don't think it has any service. I blocked that malhotra guy's channel. He lies a lot. He doesn't check the actual products but tells the viewers as if he did. He recommends any brand which gives him the most amazon affiliate commission.

His top pick was Bosch. Why the need for that exaggerated tone I don't know. Does it sound more credible? not to me. Sounds like a hustler. It's not affiliate commission from amazon with these guys which will be peanuts. They likely get an offer from companies to push their products.

I notice quite a few Indian YouTubers recommending Bosch front loaders of late. They're behind this curve. Bosch was all the rage with people here on the board back in 2015. Started with Gannu back in 2012. Then a few years later the realisation hit them.

I think samsung has removed that ecobubble feature since 2021. Now, there's only soak button. Let's hope it also soaks for longer.

Half hour, confirmed by that lady whose review I linked to. If you need longer then you'll have to pull the power or use a programmable switch.

Mine's 20 ft above. So it's barely meeting 50kPa requirement. (50kPa = 0.5 bar pressure and 11 meters of water height creates 1 bar pressure. Mine is little over half bar). If new LG machines require 100kPa minimum then it's no good. For 100kPa or 1 bar pressure, the tank needs to be at 11 meters height. That's more than 3 storeys.

Mine is a second storey above. Little more than yours. @rdst_1 used to have this low-pressure water problem with his Bosch. He'd just restart the machine if it gave an error.

I won't say we live in a very humid place like mumbai. But we live at the ground floor and that means in heavy rains, the humidity meter is above 95%. If someone is living in apartment is my area, the humidity won't go above 80% during the same condition. The humidity is much more near the ground. Above 90% humidity for multiple days freezes electrical appliances like my current washing machine, induction cooker, microwave oven. I need at least washing machine running during high humidity days to dry the clothes. This is also why I'm replacing my current machine.

I had to look this up. And it turns out you're incorrect. Humid air is less dense than dry air so humidity will be more higher up than at the ground floor. This has to be true else we'd have no rain because there'd be no clouds. Hence it is more humid higher up in the sky where the clouds are as that's where moisture accumulates.

I'm on the ground floor of a house not appt and when it rains it says close to 80%. In fact this entire month I don't think I saw it go below 75%.

The machine does not dry the clothes it just squeezes them. The clothes dry with time and for me, if put out early in the morning will be dry 24h later.

I read in a few places that bearings can be changed with sealed drums. It's already happening in poorer countries. We Indians are jugaadu too. We'll find a way.

Saw some people from Bosnia saying they could do it.

I personally don't have great experience of Samsung electronics. 2x TV, 1x fridge, 1x laptop were very bad (and no spares were available). Samsung CRT monitor and HDD were great though. 2 of my relatives have samsung top loading washing machines which are going super strong even after 10+ years. So I'm gonna take the blue pill this time. Plus, it doesn't look like I have many options.

My cousins Sammy 45cm FL was bought in 2011 and lasted till 2018 when they replaced it because it kept complaining the weight was too much. It was just 5.5kg. I don't know the reason it was replaced but they went with a Bosch because it had a higher kg rating.

I've learnt with family it does not matter what you recommend they will do whatever they want and then whine after

I should point out that I have the LG front load 8kg, which mentions the minimum pressure of 100kpa which is 10 meters or 33 feet tank height requirement.
But I ran mine with less then 10 feet of height (from the tap to the overhead tank outlet height) and there is no issues running it with such pressure.

The reason they say to use a 100kpa pressure is if you use the turbo function, where nozzle located in the drum door gasket spray water during the start of the cycle so that the cloths can get wet faster.

Once the clothes are wet. The nozzles or high water pressure serve no function.
Infact before I put a thermostatic valve to get hot water from solar, I used to pour hot water from solar from a tap located in bathroom to washing machine located else where via mug. I used to turn the washing machine cold tap a little, so that the machine doesn't chime the closed tap error and then pour the hot water via the detergent tray.

The machine only calculates the time taken for it to fill and if its really high it will give a closed tap error IE.

Pressure and flow are two separate things. I could in theory close the tap fully and just put a hose or a funnel in detergent tray and fill the machine with a bucket with zero pressure and get no error.

It's not clear to me whether you are using the inbuilt heater with your LG FL or not. Since you have a solar water heater and thermostatic valve already.

If you don't use the heater I don't think there will be an error.

But what if you do use the inbuilt heater then what is the result with the tank just overhead?

 

[tech.addict]

My current machine is a lg 8kg. In Kolkata the humidity during the monsoon is >85% when it rains. I stay in the top floor and the water tank is about 20 ft high. I haven't faced any problem in my 2+ years with the present machine.

 

[adder]

It's not clear to me whether you are using the inbuilt heater with your LG FL or not. Since you have a solar water heater and thermostatic valve already.

If you don't use the heater I don't think there will be an error.

But what if you do use the inbuilt heater then what is the result with the tank just overhead?

Inbuilt heater is not used in summer. In rain days its used.
The error I am taking about is IE error which comes on when water flow is less or when you forget to turn on the inlet tap or if the filter is clogged.

Tank overhead height as no effect on whether you use heater function or not.

There is no sensor in any of the washing machine inlet, just a AC powered solonoid valve from there the water goes to detergent dispener and drops to the drum. In Lg machines with turbo function it also diverts from the solonoid valve to the orange nozzles in the door gasket top side.

The way the waching machine knows its getting the water filled or not is via the pressure switch located near the heating element at the bottom of the plastic tub that contains the stainless steel drum. As the water gets filled inside, the air in the tube connecting the pressure switch to the tub, gets compressed which triggers the solonoid to shut off the incoming water.

The MCU calculates the time it gave the signal to turn on the inlet solenoid valve to the time it recieves a signal from the pressure switch. If it takes too long to recieve the signal from the pressure switch it triggers a IE error code. So washing machines calculate the flow of water by using time as reference.


One more thing is, Ever since people in the house started using fabric softners, the whirlpool machine pressure switch tube hole gets blocked. Thus far it has happened 2 times, since the last 7 or 8 years out of the 14 years the machine was in use. Prior to the 7 or 8 years of the machines life no fabric softner was used and no clogs.

This happens when excess fabric softner is used, or when people dump the softner in other compartments. Or when there is a long power cut during or before cycle was finished.

For clearing the gunk in pressure switch, you can blow compressed air in it for a quick fix, but that only clears the tube and can reoccur very soon.

So i remove the door gasket, then the plastic comparment screwed into the tub, that has a plastic hose nipple and air chamber that the rubber hose from the pressure switch is connected to. The amount of pink comfort softner gunk is unbelievable, the tub bottom is filled with that stuff.

Its only after I showed them the gunk did people in the house stopped using that crap.

So this is why I suggest to use only powder detergent. It leaves a white residue but not the crappy gunk that the softner and potentially liquid detergents leave behind.

 

[lockhrt999]

I ordered that Samsung 7kg machine with 55 cm depth. Thanks to Amazon prime days sale, I got that machine at ~22.8k on Flipkart (after exchange + exchange discount + bank discount + prepaid discount). Same model was available at reliance digital at 31k. These local guys still using old tactics to fool customers saying online platform sale old and defective models etc. Anyway, whatever monies I save now will be used to replace drum/spider/bearing when it fails. It's like buying a volkswagen on a discount. Discount will eventually be used to replace DSG transmission once it fails.

What is the size of your videcon top loader tub?

Full load volume is ~32 liters. Capacity is 5.8 kg. And in top load you get low quality wash if you fully load the machine.

Bosch & IFB are belt driven. Panasonic too I think. Only the Koreans are direct drive. But Sammy does not mention direct drive yet Sammy's drum dimensions are the same as LG. Reliability from what I can see is better with the Koreans.

I have some experience of fixing gears and clutch of the current machine. If clutch goes and if there are no spares available then the machine becomes useless. Direct drive should be more reliable than belt system.

Check the LG touchpanel repair video posted earlier and see whether its the same as your oven. I don't think it is because the guy managed to fix it.

Right. Ovens have different membrane keypads. These look like plastic stickers.

There's nothing behind this sticker. This sticker itself houses the buttons. It is glued to body of the oven. It's easy to replace but you need to get a spare.

It's not affiliate commission from amazon with these guys which will be peanuts. They likely get an offer from companies to push their products.

I can assure you that it's not peanuts. It's much more than income from Google Adsense/adword income. I worked with such affiliate based SEO company. There's a whole world out there of affiliate based websites and videos.

Half hour, confirmed by that lady whose review I linked to.

That's good to know. If there's no such feature then I'd be pulling the plugs.

I had to look this up. And it turns out you're incorrect. Humid air is less dense than dry air so humidity will be more higher up than at the ground floor. This has to be true else we'd have no rain because there'd be no clouds. Hence it is more humid higher up in the sky where the clouds are as that's where moisture accumulates.

I'm on the ground floor of a house not appt and when it rains it says close to 80%. In fact this entire month I don't think I saw it go below 75%.

Air density doesn't change (for a few storey height) a whole lot to affect the humidity that much.

But then why am I claiming so much humidity? (I have 2 humidity monitors in the house)

At ground level, you have something around your house that you don't find for apartment house and that's ground. We have a lot ground around us. Rain falls on it. Soil saturates and after a point, water has nowhere to go but up. Practically it's like swimming tank surrounding your house. You don't have that going at 10th floor. My friend, who lives in same city and has the same humidity meter show him max humidity 75% at his 10th floor flat when for us it has practically reached 95%. Again this situation is super rare like once in 2 years. But it happens.

Humidity does affect electrical items like I mentioned previously. Addition to that in my experience motherboards from asus are much more susceptible to humidity (lots of BSODs) compared to gigabyte and msi.

I've learnt with family it does not matter what you recommend they will do whatever they want and then whine after

Story of my life. Nowadays, I don't even bother recommend them anything.

The way the waching machine knows its getting the water filled or not is via the pressure switch located near the heating element at the bottom of the plastic tub that contains the stainless steel drum. As the water gets filled inside, the air in the tube connecting the pressure switch to the tub, gets compressed which triggers the solonoid to shut off the incoming water.

Yup. I have changed this sensor from my top loading machine. It's very sensitive. If you remove even a few liters of water, the machine knows.

 

[blr_p]

Inbuilt heater is not used in summer. In rain days its used.
The error I am taking about is IE error which comes on when water flow is less or when you forget to turn on the inlet tap or if the filter is clogged.

Tank overhead height as no effect on whether you use heater function or not.

IE error is the one i'm referring to

There is no sensor in any of the washing machine inlet, just a AC powered solonoid valve from there the water goes to detergent dispener and drops to the drum. In Lg machines with turbo function it also diverts from the solonoid valve to the orange nozzles in the door gasket top side.

The way the waching machine knows its getting the water filled or not is via the pressure switch located near the heating element at the bottom of the plastic tub that contains the stainless steel drum. As the water gets filled inside, the air in the tube connecting the pressure switch to the tub, gets compressed which triggers the solonoid to shut off the incoming water.

The MCU calculates the time it gave the signal to turn on the inlet solenoid valve to the time it recieves a signal from the pressure switch. If it takes too long to recieve the signal from the pressure switch it triggers a IE error code. So washing machines calculate the flow of water by using time as reference.

What do you do if you get an IE error ? is there any workaround or is a pump the only solution?

I'm not able to figure out why some people need a pump like @technofast whereas you and @tech.addict are perfectly fine without one.

One more thing is, Ever since people in the house started using fabric softners, the whirlpool machine pressure switch tube hole gets blocked. Thus far it has happened 2 times, since the last 7 or 8 years out of the 14 years the machine was in use. Prior to the 7 or 8 years of the machines life no fabric softner was used and no clogs.

This happens when excess fabric softner is used, or when people dump the softner in other compartments. Or when there is a long power cut during or before cycle was finished.

For clearing the gunk in pressure switch, you can blow compressed air in it for a quick fix, but that only clears the tube and can reoccur very soon.

So i remove the door gasket, then the plastic comparment screwed into the tub, that has a plastic hose nipple and air chamber that the rubber hose from the pressure switch is connected to. The amount of pink comfort softner gunk is unbelievable, the tub bottom is filled with that stuff.

Impossible to do what you did with a sealed tank. The UKWG guys were complaining they could not even fish out a bra wire with these sealed tanks.

Its only after I showed them the gunk did people in the house stopped using that crap.

So this is why I suggest to use only powder detergent. It leaves a white residue but not the crappy gunk that the softner and potentially liquid detergents leave behind.

Bingo! in addition to smell problems there are also these clogging issues to deal with and I don't think even cleaning with Vanish can address clearing of the pressure switch tube hole. It requires a dissemble to get access to that part. Maybe hot water, some patience and prayers might dislodge the clogging. Can't use boiling water because it might deform the plastic. I don't know if a boil wash or more is enough to do it. That's all a user can do.

What a mess this industry is getting into. I doubt the next LG I get will still have an unsealed tank

Something else I wanted to tell you. You mentioned a while back that clothes rinsed and spun in 40 degrees dry faster. The reason for that AFAIK is cotton extracts the most water at around 40 degrees in the spin cycle. I guess the threads expand a little more in the fabric at the higher temperature so more water can be extracted. The same phenomenon will also assist in better cleaning. But to get the benefit you need to spin at a higher speed say 800rpm.

400rpm won't take full advantage of it. I was able to simulate this somewhat with the medic rinse option since the last rinse is heated to 40 degrees. What consumed 0.25unit for a 40-degree cottons cycle goes up to 0.4 units with the medic rinse modifier on. Seems to dry faster. with that option on and 800 rpm.

I really think you should make a post about your solar water heater and thermostatic valve setup. This ought to be the default washing/home setup for everyone as it saves on heating costs and gives the best results whether front or top loader

I ordered that Samsung 7kg machine with 55 cm depth. Thanks to Amazon prime days sale, I got that machine at ~22.8k on Flipkart (after exchange + exchange discount + bank discount + prepaid discount). Same model was available at reliance digital at 31k. These local guys still using old tactics to fool customers saying online platform sale old and defective models etc. Anyway, whatever monies I save now will be used to replace drum/spider/bearing when it fails. It's like buying a volkswagen on a discount. Discount will eventually be used to replace DSG transmission once it fails.

You moved fast. When it arrives, take a photo of the label on the box with the barcodes. It has a lot of info in one place that could be handy for later reference. Where it was made etc. This info you won't find anywhere else and we all get rid of that box. I usually send it back with the installers.

At least you got a 55cm for that price. Most would have ended up with a 45cm. This machine has the soak feature you wanted which LG to my knowledge does not offer and it does not have a touch panel. The one thing I thought of later was a 1,400 rpm machine would have a stronger drum support compared to this 1,200rpm and be made of thicker gauge steel to handle the higher rpms. A machine like that would have cost more but given a longer life span. I think you will be fine with the one you have. Just never use the highest spin speed. Max 800 rpm otherwise 400 rpm. At least the Koreans offer you a choice of spin speed. The cheaper Bosch's don't offer any choice. It's 800 rpm or nothing. So they will have bearings problems sooner in the future which can't be fixed.

And NO fabric conditioner !!! You have been warned.

Full load volume is ~32 liters. Capacity is 5.8 kg. And in top load you get low quality wash if you fully load the machine.

I meant the tub only. Must be closer to 60L

The full load volume for your new FL is the same 30+ litres also btw.

Right. Ovens have different membrane keypads. These look like plastic stickers.

View attachment 140725

There's nothing behind this sticker. This sticker itself houses the buttons. It is glued to body of the oven. It's easy to replace but you need to get a spare.

Looks like a cheap part if you can find it. Did you have any luck contacting the LG service centre for it? they want part numbers for everything before they will entertain you.

I can assure you that it's not peanuts. It's much more than income from Google Adsense/adword income. I worked with such affiliate based SEO company. There's a whole world out there of affiliate based websites and videos.

Yes, that is there but companies give these guys kickback agreements when they review if they manage to sell x number of machines as a result of their videos at least for the bigger guys.

Air density doesn't change (for a few storey height) a whole lot to affect the humidity that much.

But then why am I claiming so much humidity? (I have 2 humidity monitors in the house)

At ground level, you have something around your house that you don't find for apartment house and that's ground. We have a lot ground around us. Rain falls on it. Soil saturates and after a point, water has nowhere to go but up. Practically it's like swimming tank surrounding your house. You don't have that going at 10th floor. My friend, who lives in same city and has the same humidity meter show him max humidity 75% at his 10th floor flat when for us it has practically reached 95%. Again this situation is super rare like once in 2 years. But it happens.

I have a garden so there is space for water to collect but it does not stay long. Max I've seen is 80% when it is raining with the humidity meter placed outside.

95% is like being in a steam room. I guess the temperature must be a good ten degrees higher where you live.

Humidity does affect electrical items like I mentioned previously. Addition to that in my experience motherboards from asus are much more susceptible to humidity (lots of BSODs) compared to gigabyte and msi.

Agreed, which is why these machines won't allow you to fix their circuit boards. They will be covered with epoxy for longevity. All potted.

 

[lockhrt999]

You moved fast. When it arrives, take a photo of the label on the box with the barcodes. It has a lot of info in one place that could be handy for later reference. Where it was made etc. This info you won't find anywhere else and we all get rid of that box.

That's a good idea. I'll also measure the actual volume of the drum.

I meant the tub only. Must be closer to 60L

Full metal tub is closer to paltry 44L. I too thought top loading will have higher volume tub but measurements tell a different story.

And NO fabric conditioner !!! You have been warned.

No fabric conditioner. No liquid detergent.

The full load volume for your new FL is the same 30+ litres also btw.

That's plenty enough. 30L of FL is more than 30L of TL because TL should use much more water.

Looks like a cheap part if you can find it. Did you have any luck contacting the LG service centre for it? they want part numbers for everything before they will entertain you.

They didn't have it. Companies makes 50 different versions of the same product. They can't maintain spares for all.

95% is like being in a steam room. I guess the temperature must be a good ten degrees higher where you live.

Steam room should be beyond 100% humidity but yeah 95% makes everything sticky. Temperature was chilly 24 though. Humidity % is inversely proportional to temperature. Colder air gets saturated with water vapour very easily. Humidity % doesn't tell us how much water vapour there is in the air but how much capacity of the air been used to hold water vapour. As humidity approaches 100% the water becomes visible because air can't hold more water. At lower temperature you see dewing and at higher temperature you see visible steaming.

 

[adder]

What do you do if you get an IE error ? is there any workaround or is a pump the only solution?

I'm not able to figure out why some people need a pump like @technofast whereas you and @tech.addict are perfectly fine without one.

The reason they could get IE error has to be due to their plumbing, the pipes can be choked with dirt, or if its galvanized pipes rust built up would have further reduced flow, choked filters in the washing machine inlet or in the tap outlet.
Using a pressure pump is band aid, to the true problem.
Some people have really small diameter pipes, distributing water. Which causes poor flow.
Those leaving in apartment on the top floor will have poor flow, due to poor plumbing practice by the builder. A properly designed plumbing will ensure every floor will get the same flow, but one can't help with pressure which is irrelevant for washing machine.

Impossible to do what you did with a sealed tank. The UKWG guys were complaining they could not even fish out a bra wire with these sealed tanks

.
The pressure sensor chamber area is removable even in a sealed tub. But obviously the gunk at the bottom of the tub cannot be taken out.

I really think you should make a post about your solar water heater and thermostatic valve setup. This ought to be the default washing/home setup for everyone as it saves on heating costs and gives the best results whether front or top loader

Nothing really just a regular thermostatic valve and solar water heater.

 

[blr_p]

That's a good idea. I'll also measure the actual volume of the drum.

Has to be legible so ensure its tack sharp in the photo. Could come in handy for service later on when they ask which model machine you have.

Full metal tub is closer to paltry 44L. I too thought top loading will have higher volume tub but measurements tell a different story.

So if you were using a full load of 32L then out of 44L you were loading at 70%. I think max loading on a top loader should remain 50-60%. Less wear and tear on the clothes and you get some wash action. Meaning the clothes move around. No wash action then cleaning won't be good. I find almost nobody that reviews a top loader will show me what the wash action is like. They don't even know what it means. But if you put some coloured socks in a load of whites you should see those socks move around in a timelapse video. If they do not then either you overloaded it or the machine just does not have very good wash action, to begin with. Or you chose the wrong program for the wash.

Most people undersize to save money and end up with a suboptimal experience. Top loaders can withstand more abuse than front loaders so you don't even realise.

They didn't have it. Companies makes 50 different versions of the same product. They can't maintain spares for all.

So much for their vaunted service then. It's just bad engineering design. Planned obsolescence

Steam room should be beyond 100% humidity but yeah 95% makes everything sticky. Temperature was chilly 24 though. Humidity % is inversely proportional to temperature. Colder air gets saturated with water vapour very easily. Humidity % doesn't tell us how much water vapour there is in the air but how much capacity of the air been used to hold water vapour. As humidity approaches 100% the water becomes visible because air can't hold more water. At lower temperature you see dewing and at higher temperature you see visible steaming.

Yes colder air gets saturated easier but warmer air holds more. A given volume of air at 20 degrees holds twice as much as at 10 degrees.

24 is like the weather I have. I don't know why it went as high as 95%. Are there any rivers nearby where you live or open water bodies ? In places like Cal this is a real problem.

If it gets this humid where you are then make sure that washing machine door stays open after a wash and for several hours, it will help to control mildew buildup.

This is yet another reason it is not a good idea to store dirty clothes in the washer. The machine needs to air out as well.

 

[technofast]

IE error is the one i'm referring to

What do you do if you get an IE error ? is there any workaround or is a pump the only solution?

I'm not able to figure out why some people need a pump like @technofast whereas you and @tech.addict are perfectly fine without one.

Well, it was with the Bosch WM when I needed that pump. I'm in the top floor and the overhead tank is some 60mts away from where the WM was placed. The water flow was normal from the tap and a 20ltr bucket can be filled within a minute but when it came to this Bosch WM it was always finicky and throws up IE error. I had to install this pressure pump to over come this situation and then as you know the drum/bearing problem happened and the rest is history. I have not faced this problem with LG for the couple of years I have been using the front loader. Surprisingly I was able to use the LG WM with a contingency tank placed inside my house and it worked perfectly even with very low pressure.

 

[lockhrt999]

Well, it was with the Bosch WM when I needed that pump. I'm in the top floor and the overhead tank is some 60mts away from where the WM was placed. The water flow was normal from the tap and a 20ltr bucket can be filled within a minute but when it came to this Bosch WM it was always finicky and throws up IE error. I had to install this pressure pump to over come this situation and then as you know the drum/bearing problem happened and the rest is history. I have not faced this problem with LG for the couple of years I have been using the front loader. Surprisingly I was able to use the LG WM with a contingency tank placed inside my house and it worked perfectly even with very low pressure.

German products are unreliable. They are like high maintenance girlfriend. They only do their best for lab ideal conditions. They are not tested in the real world. You need to constantly treat them to keep them in functioning order. They lack Asian - shut it forget it attitude.

So if you were using a full load of 32L then out of 44L you were loading at 70%. I think max loading on a top loader should remain 50-60%. Less wear and tear on the clothes and you get some wash action. Meaning the clothes move around. No wash action then cleaning won't be good. I find almost nobody that reviews a top loader will show me what the wash action is like.

We don't load it fully but if we did then that's the of the full load water level. It's not easy to see action washing action on top loading washing machines because top lid isn't fully transparent and if you open the lid, the machine stops. I have disabled the lid ajar sensor on my machine though.

So much for their vaunted service then. It's just bad engineering design. Planned obsolescence

Exactly. That's why I don't like to buy expensive TVs, mobiles etc or any stuff that shouldn't need maintenance. Because when expensive gadgets need maintenance they cost the price of another such new device. My 2x chinese smart TVs have been bullet proof reliable compared to my 2x samsung dumb TVs. All mobiles in the house are chinese origin and never needed any maintenance apart from the battery change. Some still give more than enough battery backup even after 6+ years. Current oven is from Godrej which hasn't requried any service unlike our last oven which was from LG which needed some part replacement just a few months into the warranty. And it's not like we keep buying new stuff. We, rather keep using stuff until it breaks totally and can't be repaired anymore.

24 is like the weather I have. I don't know why it went as high as 95%. Are there any rivers nearby where you live or open water bodies ? In places like Cal this is a real problem.

No rivers nearby. It's mostly dry but there comes a situation once every few years when you have continuous rain for a few days. That's when the humidity get that high.

 

[blr_p]

We don't load it fully but if we did then that's the of the full load water level. It's not easy to see action washing action on top loading washing machines because top lid isn't fully transparent and if you open the lid, the machine stops. I have disabled the lid ajar sensor on my machine though.

How well a top loader agitates clothes is down to impeller diameter to tub diameter ratio. The larger that is the more the clothes will turnover. So it follows the larger the impeller is in relation to the tub the better the wash action or turning clothes over will be.

if the impeller diameter is half the tub diameter the wash action will not be as good as the machine that has an impeller that is 70-80% or more (more is better) of the tub diameter.

See how loading makes a difference with top loaders.

Full load, hardly moving. Nothing is happening here. Lousy washing.

Half load, see the difference. He then speeds up the video 8x and watch those microfiber towels as they bloom from the centre and work their way to the outside of the tub.

Try that with your top loader and see how well it moves. NO reviewer shows this with their top loader. This is what you need to know. Some will do better than others.

Now if only half the load gets you the best wash then you need a pretty big top loader to get clothes as clean as a smaller front loader. So the cost argument of top loaders versus front loaders needs to be reviewed if we're talking wash quality. And I'm not even getting into washing at 40 degrees here which most top loaders cannot do.

Disabling the sensor is a matter of using a magnet placed in the right spot. Then you can run the machine with the lid open.

No rivers nearby. It's mostly dry but there comes a situation once every few years when you have continuous rain for a few days. That's when the humidity get that high.

I had that a few weeks ago. Rained every evening and it's that kind of rain that goes on all night long.

 

[lockhrt999]

Full load, hardly moving. Nothing is happening here. Lousy washing.

Half load, see the difference. He then speeds up the video 8x and watch those microfiber towels as they bloom from the centre and work their way to the outside of the tub.

Yup, I know. That's why I said full load is pointless and much less washing quality.

Now if only half the load gets you the best wash then you need a pretty big top loader to get clothes as clean as a smaller front loader. So the cost argument of top loaders versus front loaders needs to be reviewed if we're talking wash quality.

Without using front loading machine even once I can tell you the washing quality is going to be better on the front loader. Top loaders aren't that great with big load. And not to mention, if any of your clothes is less dense, it'll keep floating to top.

 

[blr_p]

Yup, I know. That's why I said full load is pointless and much less washing quality.

It means the minimum tub size to consider for a top loader is 60L if you expect to clean anything more than normal soil.

Otherwise, forget heavily soiled. That will take soaking which I suppose people get used to doing.

And I have no idea which machine will give you that. What kg ratings or dimensions. People rarely answer these volume questions when I ask.

In addition, you need one that has the biggest impeller you can find.

Without using front loading machine even once I can tell you the washing quality is going to be better on the front loader. Top loaders aren't that great with big load. And not to mention, if any of your clothes is less dense, it'll keep floating to top.

What if you put in a laundry bag with some heavier items. That should weigh it down. If it floats its a delicate and should be put in a laundry bag anyway.

In my twin tub pretty much everything floats. They get swirled around. The impeller is on the side and is good at swirling. It's about a third the diameter of the tub.

Avoid LG front loaders with touchscreen panels as they're known to fail. Search LG touchscreen problem on youtube for more details.

If @adder wants to avoid this problem he should use the app to configure the machine.

Don't touch the touch panel, it can't go bad. If it does go bad there is still an alternative way to control the machine.

I guess that would make the case for wifi enabled to a certain extent.