Linux Stop saying that the linux desktop looks bad!!!

KingKrool said:
Then that is a badly designed driver there mate. It should be possible for the driver to shutdown xwindows and bring it back up I guess. If I can do it manually (usig kill)I do not see why the driver cannot do it.
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i downloaded those drivers from the nvidia site itself..theres one more puzzling thingy about FC3..i invoke the console (using cntrl + alt + F1) and when i log in..and type PS, the processes show only Bash and PS..no Xserver..
i mean....i invoked the shell after logging into Gnome..i tried installing drivers from here but still same thing about the xserver running ..so had to boot into the shell directly
 
Typing ps lists the processes started by the current shell, so that is only bash and ps. Type "ps -A" to get the complete list. To shut down the X server temporarily, all you need to do is get to a virtual console (ctrl+alt+f2) and type "killall X" :)
 
use ps -aux to get a much better list

ps only indicates current user and current console

I know you dlded the drivers from there, I just mean that apparently these guys don't go to any lengths to make he drivers user friendly because they assume that anyone using linux must be a linux guru.
 
IMHO This is exactly where linnies fall far behind us winnies. They give a damn to usability and thus lose out the mass appeal. Wats the use of having a truckfull of goodies if the truck is parked on the everest and only the mountaineers could reach their.

C'mon guys wake up if u sayin the os is for the community then simplify it.
 
^^^Well said sarang hit the nail in the head.

I can start/stop services,config anything via the GUI in windows.The main use of a console is for diagnostics etc. (and telnet if ur a netadmin).

As the computing power increases why lug the console along?just dump it like M$ did it with real mode DOS in 2000/XP.

For linux to get good mass acceptance,improove the GUI part more for example the process of installing software.I know that linux was *not* meant to be an OS for the average joe user but when u r targetting the joe user,make things easy for him.

Another thing i find is how polished the XP UI feels WRT KDE/Genome which i still find as ameteurish.
 
That's coz MS windows is an OS for which u need to pay for the license!(what's that?:rofl: )

which is why MS can afford to hire Usabilty engg Phd gurus to do their job....

Fortunately (or unfortunately) that's not true for Linux......

so this bullet bites both ways :p

OT: IMHO, Linux is the right choice for basic users (who just need a comp to browse the net, view pics, chatting and sending mails) while at the other extreme, if you are comfortable with the whole routine of compile/build (and sometimes edit the src code), you are better off with Linux....

Unfortunately, a very large percentage of users who are low-moderate computer literate (inclding myself and most folks at TE) fall somewhere in between and hence have to stick to windows

C'mon guys wake up if u sayin the os is for the community then simplify it.
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It's not as easy to replicate the point & click ease of install/uninstall in Linux because of the simple reason that there is no single standardized distri of Linux unlike windows.....

Since every copy of Win XP on the planet is built around the exactly same kernel, app/driver developers don't really need to rack their heads building a distribution package.....

However, since Linux come in so many different flavors (way more than the flavors ur neighborhood Baskin Robbins), builing this kind of ease in the packages is easier said than done

IMHO This is exactly where linnies fall far behind us winnies
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You can perhaps quote other reasons to take this debate forward, but basing this judgement simply on the basis of difficulties associated with packages installation etc. is fallacious logic

It's kinda like:

Overheard on an airport waiting lounge

IMHO, this is where we commies win over you democracies....you folks have so many complications arising out of the choices that you have

(forgive me for the bad analogy, am sleepy and my mental faculties aren't really upto it)
 
Thats what.....when people can buy a crap branded PC and pay that money on the crap they give,they can buy an OS for the usability sake alone.

Even for advanced Windows OS Users working on linux is a nightmare (personal experiance) if they are not well versed with linux.

for people who r the n00best of n00bs such as my mom who has just learnt to use a mouse recompiling,editing the source code is scary (atleast its for me).
 
Actually i poster the reply before u edited your post.

Anyway lets just come to a conclusion

all that im saying is that linux is not "yet" suitable for a n00b.
 
all that im saying is that linux is not "yet" suitable for a n00b
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What you say is valid, though I still maintain that Linux is suuitable for n00bs and geeks...It's only the middle-of-the-road users who find it frustrating at times....
 
There is no need for an end user to modify source code of linux. You are under some misconception. TRY SUSE or Ubuntu. You will be surprised.
 
^^ not the kernel source....I was tlking abt the src code/ini files for drivers

tryng to install drivers for my wireless USB card on Mandrake (ATMEL WLAN) turned out to be a frustrating experience, as the drivers seems to ne not recognizing the device.....finally i had to add my device's schipset number within the src for the driver, then do a make/install after which it runs fine
 
Yeah, I remember that now... driver support for such stuff is the one place linux lacks, ESPECIALLY for laptops. But the situation is somewhat improved now, t least for the Centrino platform. Intel's 2200 is supported in the latest kernel (2.6.15), as compared to earlier where you had to have a separate module for it (which may or may not have been included in your distro).
 
ujjwal said:
Typing ps lists the processes started by the current shell, so that is only bash and ps. Type "ps -A" to get the complete list. To shut down the X server temporarily, all you need to do is get to a virtual console (ctrl+alt+f2) and type "killall X" :)
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That won't work if you are running gdm or another login manager like it as it'll respawn X again. In fact to simply kill X, the easy way is ctrl+alt+backspace but this'll spawn X again for the same reason. The correct way is to type init 3 or telinit 3. I gave up on linux not cos of its slowness which can be easily corrected, not cos of command line or any such thing. I gave it up for the lack of a single IDE that is half as good as VS. The lack of a decent IDE is one of the reasons why linux loses a lot of very talented programmers. Initially I missed latex and gs tools but well even those exist on windows now.

@Smith: If you think installing NV drivers is hard, try ATI :p. For the record, I've been able to install it successfully only once after 11 tries :p.
 
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I like eclipse personally. Hate VS .NET IDE, prefer 6.0 - very good.

But you are right, there are few really good IDEs. Most of them lack in one or two features, and the debugging support sucks for some strange reason, because GDB is made to be integrated into other front ends.
 
KingKrool said:
I like eclipse personally. Hate VS .NET IDE, prefer 6.0 - very good.
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I knew someone was gonna say eclipse... its buggy as hell. I'd rather use emacs than eclipse. Also it doesnt generate common code like VS which is the basic reason to use an IDE.
 
That won't work if you are running gdm or another login manager like it as it'll respawn X again. In fact to simply kill X, the easy way is ctrl+alt+backspace but this'll spawn X again for the same reason. The correct way is to type init 3 or telinit 3.
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Yeah I now realise that would be the correct way on fedora. I am used to simple text mode logins, and so far I have only used xdm as a service instead of having it in a seperate run level. init 3 wont work on all distro's btw.

I agree with superczar here. Learning Linux is especially tough for those who are fairly well versed with windows, as one needs to unlearn quite a bit of stuff first.

This link belongs to this thread - http://www.linuxedge.org/?q=node/55
 
KingKrool said:
What does that mean?
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kingkrool, With all due respect to chaos
I think he means code like events, forms initializers, or even better if you are writing interfaces either COM or COM+ these things are breeze man. Try burning your hair with CORBA interfaces with eclipse and u'll know wat i mean here.

BTW for some strange (Money of course) reason Borland ppl have developed their IDE BDS exceptionally well and eclipse still remains the old sucker. This is where i pity you open source comarades (forgive the pun). you contribute a beautiful piece of code offcourse not worth a damn to common ppl and some bigshot joins hands takes up da code makes a product, makes millions outta it and gives back nickels worth code to the community (see khtml - apple)

Just for the records all you linAholics go checkout wat avalon has to offer.
MS still rules for common ppl.
 
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