The Aam Admi Party

[red-devil]

If it is an alliance, the BJP being the largest party should extend/ask the support of Congress to form the government; the same applies to Congress too, having shamed themselves in the election. AAP has already told that they are happy sitting in the opposition, as their main goal is to fight against the corrupt parties, not form government with them.

This is democracy at its finest, but some people are still irrational, just seeing the end goal in sight, and not the process by which you reach there. The best part about the hung verdict is that a party which is known to "horse-trade" MLAs in other states doesn't want to do that in Delhi, because the people have also voted for a party which stands against those practices. Just imagine, the parties are afraid of what the people might think about such practices. Suddenly, BJP wants to be an effective opposition, while all these years they played gloves in hands with Congress. And Congress, haha, not even worth talking about them now.

If no alliance is possible, then going for re-elections is the last resort. Delhi will be safe in the hands of president rule for 6 months, or even a year; after all, the CM in Delhi is virtually useless as far as running the state is concerned. Most of the development and law and order tasks are handled by the lieutenant Governor, and the municipal corporations do the rest of the civic duties.

Even if AAP loses a few seats in the re-election and allows BJP to form the government, they would still have won a major victory.

Well if you go by that yardstick of why people would vote for parties that indulge in 'horse trading' then I should actually wonder why the BJP even got any number of seats! (remember what happened with operation lotus in karnataka and the subsequent Yeddy govt and the Yeddy fiasco? BJP now wants him back to the part fold FFS!)
BJP, I believe is only sacrificing Delhi with the bigger Delhi gaddi in mind (2014) {and so is Kejriwal I guess}

And you're right about the Congress part though

 

[blkrb0t]

^^Because the people like to vote in cycles, and their decisions are emotional appeals rather than rational ones. They think BJP deserves a chance, not realising that they were enjoying their stay in the opposition all this while.

Also, the biggest cynics of AAP are the adherent bot bhakts of BJP. They are quick with their whataboutery and tu quoque fallacies when BJP is criticised, and would gladly accuse you of being a Khangressi and Sickular with false dichotomies. In the long run, they are more dangerous than even adherent Congress' supporters (are there even any left? I haven't seen or heard from any). It's good that AAP has emerged in time to give them a proper opposition, though they need to organize quickly into a national party to be more effective.

 

[blr_p]

If it is an alliance, the BJP being the largest party should extend/ask the support of Congress to form the government; the same applies to Congress too, having shamed themselves in the election. AAP has already told that they are happy sitting in the opposition, as their main goal is to fight against the corrupt parties, not form government with them.

Which means AAP is going to be opposing every one. Check

The best part about the hung verdict is that a party which is known to "horse-trade" MLAs in other states doesn't want to do that in Delhi, because the people have also voted for a party which stands against those practices. Just imagine, the parties are afraid of what the people might think about such practices. Suddenly, BJP wants to be an effective opposition, while all these years they played gloves in hands with Congress. And Congress, haha, not even worth talking about them now.

What is wrong with horse trading, this is how differences get solved. Loosens the blockage. Otherwise we end up with washed out sessions of shouting, jumping and nothing getting done.

If no alliance is possible, then going for re-elections is the last resort.

BJP & AAP won't touch congress with a ten foot pole

Delhi will be safe in the hands of president rule for 6 months, or even a year; after all, the CM in Delhi is virtually useless as far as running the state is concerned. Most of the development and law and order tasks are handled by the lieutenant Governor, and the municipal corporations do the rest of the civic duties.

Even if AAP loses a few seats in the re-election and allows BJP to form the government, they would still have won a major victory.

I fear the AAP will be better than the commies when it comes to blocking things. This obsession with clean politics is a chimera. Democracies do not come for free and neither do elections and running for office. We don't allow more money because then only people with lots of money will be able to compete. So anything above the legal limit is black, this they call corruption. No, its just how things work.

 

[TheIndian]

I am hearing some people say that AAP is too rude and immature for not accepting alliance with either of the big (read corrupt) parties. Well, if it is so, why don't BJP and Congress join hands and form the government? An effective opposition is far fruitful than being in a ineffective ruling alliance.

AAP have mentioned that they wont form alliance with eighter BJP or Cong.

Why are they after AAP to for an alliance,

IF they are so keen why don't Congress and BJP form an alliance?

And Re-elections have happened before, this is not the first time.

 

[filmguy]

thankfully the voters are less cynical & more open minded than most of us on this forum (going by the previous thread on this same subject). give the new guy a chance. if he delivers, then great. if he doesnt, well, then it cant be much worse than where we were headed anyways

 

[blkrb0t]

Why are they after AAP to for an alliance,

IF they are so keen why don't Congress and BJP form an alliance?

And Re-elections have happened before, this is not the first time.

Because they want to trap AAP and game them to death. They want to stop this menace before it gets out of their control. What better way to do that than give AAP restrictive control of the government, and then market that AAP is as ineffective as themselves when it comes to dealing with corruption?

 

[Superbad]

Which means AAP is going to be opposing every one. Check


What is wrong with horse trading, this is how differences get solved. Loosens the blockage. Otherwise we end up with washed out sessions of shouting, jumping and nothing getting done.


BJP & AAP won't touch congress with a ten foot pole


I fear the AAP will be better than the commies when it comes to blocking things. This obsession with clean politics is a chimera. Democracies do not come for free and neither do elections and running for office. We don't allow more money because then only people with lots of money will be able to compete. So anything above the legal limit is black, this they call corruption. No, its just how things work.

agreed and to add to this.
while it was easy to criticise and bash evrybody from the outside, getting in and cleaning the system is important.
whenever mr. kejriwal was asked about the plans, he had a single answer, BJP and congress are corrupt/they are the two sides of the same coin.

for one i dont know how they can pass the janlokpal by winning the state elections?
that matter can be handled only by the centre.

if they do manage to get power, they have promised to provide free water and electricity at fraction of the current costs.
how can anyone manage getting things for free.

we have an example made out from congress itself.
they indulged in distributing free power to farmers in mahrashtra. then no companies were interested to set up shops to generate electricity, the power deficit increases and then they have to resort to load shedding, buying electricity at expensive rates.

i See the AAP showing the people , the leftist/naxalite dream.(everybody is corrupt)
the same thing which lead to strikes in mills in mumbai, closed down the mills then.
if AAP does what it promised to do with regard to providing freebies, we will be repeating history again.

 

[red-devil]

I fear the AAP will be better than the commies when it comes to blocking things. This obsession with clean politics is a chimera. Democracies do not come for free and neither do elections and running for office. We don't allow more money because then only people with lots of money will be able to compete. So anything above the legal limit is black, this they call corruption. No, its just how things work.

Exactly. Clean politics does not exist! There has to always be a bit of wiggle room - not everything can and should go by the rule book and not everything should be black or white.
I see AAP in particular trying to show off being so good and honest and clean - I wonder if they end up hyping up the aspirations of the people only to fall hard..

I was watching this interview with barkha dutt on ndtv and kejriwal didn't seem to want to say anything about his policies regarding finance, Kashmir etc..all his talk was "those guys are bad we are good and we will clean this system". How? He never said..

And I fully agree with @Superbad's post above..well said mate.

 

[Party Monger]

agreed and to add to this.
while it was easy to criticise and bash evrybody from the outside, getting in and cleaning the system is important.
whenever mr. kejriwal was asked about the plans, he had a single answer, BJP and congress are corrupt/they are the two sides of the same coin.

for one i dont know how they can pass the janlokpal by winning the state elections?
that matter can be handled only by the centre.

if they do manage to get power, they have promised to provide free water and electricity at fraction of the current costs.
how can anyone manage getting things for free.

we have an example made out from congress itself.
they indulged in distributing free power to farmers in mahrashtra. then no companies were interested to set up shops to generate electricity, the power deficit increases and then they have to resort to load shedding, buying electricity at expensive rates.

i See the AAP showing the people , the leftist/naxalite dream.(everybody is corrupt)
the same thing which lead to strikes in mills in mumbai, closed down the mills then.
if AAP does what it promised to do with regard to providing freebies, we will be repeating history again.

For the detailed answers you have to follow arvinds interview on the same.

For example about the free water thing-
Here's what AAP has promised - Free water upto 600/700ltrs(I forgot the exact number, just a google search away). If you EXCEED that, you pay for the whole amount.

When asked about increased usage due it being free he said, people will try to limit it to 600lrs or else they'l pay full. So they will be encouraged to save water.

When asked about money to fund it. He said, there are plenty of corruption in contracts govt awards which will release significant money(And I can vouch for this, my neighbour is a corporation waterworks contractor. His people take fake signaures, multiple the amount of work by atleast 4 to get more money out.)

Secondly the Delhi water board has a surplus of 500cr. Which initself will be enough used to counter the cost. Again knowing how budgeting works, I think its a completely sane proposal.

 

[avi]

And I can vouch for this, my neighbour is a corporation waterworks contractor. His people take fake signaures, multiple the amount of work by atleast 4 to get more money out

I can also vouch for this. Happens here too.

 

[Superbad]

For the detailed answers you have to follow arvinds interview on the same.

For example about the free water thing-
Here's what AAP has promised - Free water upto 600/700ltrs(I forgot the exact number, just a google search away). If you EXCEED that, you pay for the whole amount.

When asked about increased usage due it being free he said, people will try to limit it to 600lrs or else they'l pay full. So they will be encouraged to save water.

When asked about money to fund it. He said, there are plenty of corruption in contracts govt awards which will release significant money(And I can vouch for this, my neighbour is a corporation waterworks contractor. His people take fake signaures, multiple the amount of work by atleast 4 to get more money out.)

Secondly the Delhi water board has a surplus of 500cr. Which initself will be enough used to counter the cost. Again knowing how budgeting works, I think its a completely sane proposal.

they had surplus because ,they had others paying for the water.
if fake signatures can be managed, then fake water connections can be managed too. this will in turn lead to consumption of more amount of water, and no money coming back to pay the bills.

 

[6pack]

Giving something for free never works in long run. Someone will always have to pay for it. The govt or municipal corporation won't be able to bear the cost without increasing taxes in other slabs or other areas.

Its the mantra of loosing political parties. After getting votes or winning they only have to ignore their agendas and look at making the most of their terms in office.

 

[Lord Nemesis]

^^ Its almost always the tax paying middle class people who finally have to take the brunt of such incentives. Be it electricity, water, gas, food grains or any other such thing.

In any case, voting self deluded people with weak morals into power like this is not going to help anybody. It is only going to lead to more chaos.
The main difference between them and other parties is that while other parties just deny wrong doing when they are caught doing it, these people are either too deluded to realize that what they are doing may be wrong or try to justify it by sugar coat wrong doing as right doing.

When Kiran Bedi was caught forging documents to avail Travel allowance, she still tried to justify her actions saying that she has always done such things in the past and that the money she gets though such illegitimate means goes into her trust. People like Aravind Kejriwal and his followers are of a similar nature. For them, it is perfectly fine if they do something wrong as they always have a nice way to sugar coat it for the people. Its the wrong doing of other parties or people that matter.

 

[blr_p]

Its the mantra of loosing political parties. After getting votes or winning they only have to ignore their agendas and look at making the most of their terms in office.

The secret to success in politics is not to rock the boat. If you attempt to change the status quo the people will kick you out at the next election.

 

[Party Monger]

Giving something for free never works in long run. Someone will always have to pay for it. The govt or municipal corporation won't be able to bear the cost without increasing taxes in other slabs or other areas.

Its the mantra of loosing political parties. After getting votes or winning they only have to ignore their agendas and look at making the most of their terms in office.

Maybe they should charge for air too? Water distribution charges are negligible. Once the inrastructure is set, it lasts for decades together with minor changes. Its a basic necessity.

These arent politicians that arrive at figures randomly or through some lame logic. They have commities that are forging policies, doing their own research. Check this article before going out and bashing http://economictimes.indiatimes.com...iumph-and-validation/articleshow/27232375.cms

AAP has kept all its promises till now. Even if it meant not taking the chance at forming a govt. I dont see why they wont fulfill their promises?

People have such weird thinking. Its like, we'l happily go with the corrupt ones but if we dont understand new ideas of a new party we wont bother to research, just blame them. -_-

 

[Superbad]

Maybe they should charge for air too?

if the air reaches to your household in a pipe.

Water distribution charges are negligible. Once the inrastructure is set, it lasts for decades together with minor changes. Its a basic necessity.

same goes for the internet data. but then we do pay monthly charges and that is the same here or any part of the world which has the cheapest broadband.

AAP has kept all its promises till now. Even if it meant not taking the chance at forming a govt

keeping the government is supended animation is not going to help anybody (not the corrupt nor the honest)
.

I dont see why they wont fulfill their promises?

they still have to be in power to walk the talk. as of now it is all talk, which will help them because they need to perform.
if they accept the congress unconditional support, then they would have to work and own upto their promises.if that does not work , they are sure to get a big reaction in the may national elections.
they are playing it safe and want to keep their pressure.

 

[6pack]

Water distribution charges are negligible?
If people don't pay water tax properly, where will money to fund new pipelines come from? Where will money to install inline pumps, water filtration systems, repair broken or rusted pipes, pay staff, contractors etc come from? Electric charges for running pumping stations don't run on credit. Each government body has to look after their finances at an individual level. Don't believe everything written in some online article written like an ad printed in a newspaper.

 

[TheIndian]

The disparity of income and living standards between the rich and the poor in India is ALARMING, and that is putting it mildly.

Charity seems to be an alien word to most Indians, the wealthier they are, the more alien it is, and most tend to look down upon the down trodden as a nuisance.

While total freebies forever is a bad idea, I see nothing wrong in making the well off give a helping hand to their lesser fortunate brethren. Especially extra charges for their excesses and gluttony, which may be directly applied as a discount to the lesser fortunate.

Payment in the form of taxes just goes into the bottomless pit called Government Expenditure.

 

[pradeep200417]

I don't think this is just against the Congress. The BJP has bathed itself in plenty of corruption scandals. Who can forget Tehelka Scandal in the 2000-2010 ? Check Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tehelka And then there is the famous rate hike of BSNL call rates to accommodate Reliance into the telecommunication game.. I think its time for these parties to reap what they have sowed with decades of corruption.

While China finishes very big and ambitious infrastructure projects well before time, in my own city a prominent flyover project is still being built at a snails pace for more than 15 years at significant multiples of the cost predicted earlier.

The BJP is a part of the same rot. There is no denying that. But some of the more conservative people will prefer the 'atleast not as bad as Congress' party ie. BJP over AAP till they are firmly established. In Delhi, the BJP very curtly changed its CM candidate in Delhi who had a criminal background and brought in the current candidate as a saving grace. Unless you arm twist even the BJP is not willing to be honest.

Had AAP had been here longer say 2-3 years, they would have swept the floor clean off both BJP and Congress.

Just saw this today that Tehelka has fabricated and misleaded in the Barak Missile Case.
The CBI is closing the case. It is not surprising, considering the kind of person Tejpal is, in light of recent events.

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com...nst-tehelka-says-bjp/articleshow/27225042.cms

 

[sharktale1212]

The disparity of income and living standards between the rich and the poor in India is ALARMING, and that is putting it mildly.

Charity seems to be an alien word to most Indians, the wealthier they are, the more alien it is, and most tend to look down upon the down trodden as a nuisance.

While total freebies forever is a bad idea, I see nothing wrong in making the well off give a helping hand to their lesser fortunate brethren. Especially extra charges for their excesses and gluttony, which may be directly applied as a discount to the lesser fortunate.

Payment in the form of taxes just goes into the bottomless pit called Government Expenditure.

Doesn't that already happen for electricity bills? At least I know it does happen in Karnataka, wherein the electricity rates keeping increasing as you go up your slab. Once you cross the first slab, the next slab is rated higher. A similar approach to water etc would really help instead of free or pay (should we call it freemium )