Health & Fitness Corona is in full swing and its not Joke !

> If this simple vaccine works, it will save mankind ( very easy to manufacture and cheap in bigger facilities like serum institute)


"...Oxford University surprised and pleased advocates of overhauling the vaccine business in April (2020) by promising to donate the rights to its promising coronavirus vaccine to any drugmaker..."

A few weeks later, Oxford—urged on by the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation—reversed course. It signed an exclusive vaccine deal with AstraZeneca that gave the pharmaceutical giant sole rights and no guarantee of low prices—with the less-publicized potential for Oxford to eventually make millions from the deal and win plenty of prestige.

Melinda Gates on whether Oxford should’ve allowed their vaccine to be open sourced Melinda Gates on whether Oxford should’ve allowed their vaccine to be open sourced


Following criticism that the Gates Foundation encouraged Oxford to sell exclusive rights to its vaccine to AstraZeneca instead of allowing it to be open sourced, Melinda Gates that Oxford needed to partner with a pharmaceutical company to produce its vaccine. She added that the Gates Foundation can now work to ensure the vaccine is affordable.

The whole episode is a scandelous eff up, not just in India but almost everywhere. WHO totally lost their credibility in multitude of ways even otherwise, they reap what they saw. Anthony Fauci have some shady allegations against him.

India, the so called pharma manufacturing hub could've done far far better, but here we are.
 
tech.addict said:
Actually there is a case in Supreme court seeking raw data of all vaccine approved in India. That is why they may be forced to publish.
But apart from the manufacturing process what about the immunogenicity data? Did you get a chance to review it?
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I have 35 pages of rubbish, dealing with how rabies vaccine works!!
The idiots either don't know how to write or hiding things.
Basically they had 138 volunteers, half of them got covaxin ( double blind study) they followed them for 5-6 months ( exactly that's how it's written)
7 out of the vaccinated became PCR positive, 18 of the placebo became positive. That's basically their analysis!! Nothing about population density of the case/ control group, nothing about the incidence rate among general population in that area ( in fact their area of study was not even mentioned, how they sampled was not mentioned, basically nothing was mentioned...felt like people like Modi/ Amit Shah wrote the thing)
The Architecture of Inactivated SARS-CoV-2 with Postfusion Spikes which must be studied by Cryo-EM and Cryo-ET was never even mentioned once. People need the Cryo study results first ( to ensure inactivation) followed by in-vitro studies. Absolutely NOTHING was mentioned.
They have been requested to cut the crap and send inactivation results first. If they can provide that, other things will be requested. We are not idiots working for WHO. All of us have spent decades in medical schools, have published papers ourselves, went through thousands of pages of raw data to process them. Most of us can see through the bullshit Bharat Biotech is giving us within seconds. But since it's a crucial thing, people couldn't believe their own eyes and cross checking with others.
Animal studies were even crazier ( 2 pages of complete non sense) and I'm not going there.
 
Ruling politicians en masse were blaming opposition for criticizing utter lack of research on Bharat Biotech vaccine.

No wonder the research papers didn't get released at that time. People wouldn't have touched it with a ten foot pole.
 
Prole73 said:
> If this simple vaccine works, it will save mankind ( very easy to manufacture and cheap in bigger facilities like serum institute)


"...Oxford University surprised and pleased advocates of overhauling the vaccine business in April (2020) by promising to donate the rights to its promising coronavirus vaccine to any drugmaker..."

A few weeks later, Oxford—urged on by the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation—reversed course. It signed an exclusive vaccine deal with AstraZeneca that gave the pharmaceutical giant sole rights and no guarantee of low prices—with the less-publicized potential for Oxford to eventually make millions from the deal and win plenty of prestige.

Melinda Gates on whether Oxford should’ve allowed their vaccine to be open sourced Melinda Gates on whether Oxford should’ve allowed their vaccine to be open sourced


Following criticism that the Gates Foundation encouraged Oxford to sell exclusive rights to its vaccine to AstraZeneca instead of allowing it to be open sourced, Melinda Gates that Oxford needed to partner with a pharmaceutical company to produce its vaccine. She added that the Gates Foundation can now work to ensure the vaccine is affordable.

The whole episode is a scandelous eff up, not just in India but almost everywhere. WHO totally lost their credibility in multitude of ways even otherwise, they reap what they saw. Anthony Fauci have some shady allegations against him.

India, the so called pharma manufacturing hub could've done far far better, but here we are.
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Please try to read the mechanism of action of Covishield.
I'm not supporting what Oxford did, but it's fact that Covishield is the most complicated vaccine available today. It's not easy/ cheap to manufacture it either.
What does WHO has to do with Oxford's decision?
Please understand WHO doesn't decide anything, it can only recommend or not recommend vaccines based on what's delivered to them.
India can vaccinate with whatever they feel like. What does WHO got to do with anything?
 
WHO's top leader was dilly dallying with their advises, allegations about his and entire org's connections with China, etc. WHO's utter lack of leadership and timely guidance actually caused this pandemic to spread far worse.

www.reuters.com

Three ways a panel says the WHO, states failed on COVID-19

The International Panel for Pandemic Preparedness and Response issued its report on Wednesday into the global handling of the COVID-19 pandemic, calling for a new transparent global system to be set up for investigating disease outbreaks.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com

Regarding Oxford vaccine, it was on Bill Gates's vested interests, not about WHO.

Was saying many in the top acted irresponsibly with selfish interests. Same with Indians.
 
netant said:
A doctors' story from Bangalore ( copy paste from reddit)

damn... isn't doctors are suppose to be vaccinated before everyone else ? BC kya nanga nach chal raha hai.
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This is one of the side effects of allowing hundreds of private medical colleges every year.
Doctors are vaccinated mostly from January to March. As I'm in India now, I can guarantee that at least 80 percent of doctors including interns from proper medical colleges were vaccinated by March- April.
Things are completely different in private colleges. Government allow them to operate, but most of them don't have anything ( including teachers!! and often patients!!!!) and graduates from these colleges are not considered as doctors ( State Government won't take them, central government won't take them, corporate hospitals will employ them with 40-50K INR/ month salary, or force them to work with hourly payment and zero benefits)
These unfortunate people will literally pay crores for a useless MBBS certificate ( as they learn nothing in medical schools, they can't even practice properly..and will never have a patient base)
No wonder these people won't be given vaccines and forced to work in covid hospitals as they can't do anything.
Any intern from a normal medical school in this situation will go to medical council and hundreds of his peers and seniors will support him/ her.
But someone from a private school will never get a single supporter ( as his peers and seniors are also in the same situation or simply too scared to protest as they may loose their low paying jobs)
The entire medical education system is being destroyed by allowing private medical colleges. They only added completely "useless" doctors in the society.
Marcus Fenix said:
@red dragon are you guys at WHO validating the COVAXIN data for admitting in into WHO EUL ?
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I'm not totally sure of what's going on. A microbiologist sent me a mail with some useless documents.
From his email it seemed GOI needs WHO's recommendation for Covaxin.
EU/ US don't consider Covaxin recipients as vaccinated and when travel resumes, possibly won't allow them to enter.
Prole73 said:
WHO's top leader was dilly dallying with their advises, allegations about his and entire org's connections with China, etc. WHO's utter lack of leadership and timely guidance actually caused this pandemic to spread far worse.
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Mate, it's true Tedros ****ed up earlier. It's true China funds WHO.
But WHO is not a leader of anything. It's a bunch of professional beggars, it will stop functioning the moment donations die.
WHO can't enforce anything on any country. It doesn't work like FDA/ CDC/ICMR.
All WHO guidelines are suggestive, not enforcing.
It's an organisation for beggars ( who can't afford doctor/ medicine) by beggars.
 
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The reason why they gets well deservedly called out is that being such a humongous organizations, they utterly failed in their duty.

The reality is that people in responsible positions, common man like those from India, and many from other poor countries kept WHO at high respect and were used to that mindset considering it is a world body which deserved grand standing, with diverse and highly proficient Drs. and scientists. Unfortunately, they came out as extremely weak are involved in lot of useless nefarious stuff. Their initial eff up is the whole reason why the world ended in way during pandemic.

People consider such an international body to be far reputable than local systems, especially in countries like India. If you say they are like beggars, at least some of good people within them should have shouted truths loudly, even beggars do that.

> From his email it seemed GOI needs WHO's recommendation for Covaxin.
> EU/ US don't consider Covaxin recipients as vaccinated and when travel resumes, possibly won't allow them to enter.

Hope WHO will be able to do some due diligence and call out issues with Indian vaccine, if any.
 
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raksrules said:
Need a way to download this video so can bombard on whatsapp to trigger bhakts.
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For Android there is an app called "Tweet2gif" by "Naevtamarkus." I've been using it for a long time now. It's really good. The developer is also quick to patch up bugs.
But I think you use an iPhone so I don't know if there's one for iOS.
Screenshot_20210523-121919~2.png
 
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xkcd0137 said:
o_O WHAT?!

I told my Sis to get Covaxin after I read in Hindu that Fauci voched for Covaxin that its okay for the 617 (Indian) variant. Can't we rely on such reliable sources now? Kindly confirm.
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Fauci is the one who signed off on the gain of function research. He lied to the public at the beginning of the pandemic.
Learnt the hard way that when dealing with people more powerful than me what they do is often a better indicator of truth than what they say.
 
Prole73 said:
The reason why they gets well deservedly called out is that being such a humongous organizations, they utterly failed in their duty.

The reality is that people in responsible positions, common man like those from India, and many from other poor countries kept WHO at high respect and were used to that mindset considering it is a world body which deserved grand standing, with diverse and highly proficient Drs. and scientists. Unfortunately, they came out as extremely weak are involved in lot of useless nefarious stuff. Their initial eff up is the whole reason why the world ended in way during pandemic.

People consider such an international body to be far reputable than local systems, especially in countries like India. If you say they are like beggars, at least some of good people within them should have shouted truths loudly, even beggars do that.

> From his email it seemed GOI needs WHO's recommendation for Covaxin.
> EU/ US don't consider Covaxin recipients as vaccinated and when travel resumes, possibly won't allow them to enter.

Hope WHO will be able to do some due diligence and call out issues with Indian vaccine, if any.
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How is WHO responsible for what's happening in India now?
Do you know what do we really do at WHO?
How many doctors from anywhere in the world went to Africa during Ebola pandemics? Do you have any idea how many friends I lost in just 7-8 years of real work for WHO?
What respect are you talking about? We don't really work to earn respect. We don't care about anything but human life.
Can you name any doctors working for WHO at present except our former DGs ( Tedros is not a real doctor)?
We don't work for fame brother. All of us working here could earn a lot more, some of us have left big clinical practice/ huge pharmaceutical companies.
What has India done for WHO? It didn't even donate a single penny, when we were finding residual polio cases is Bihar and Western UP and vaccinating the most difficult to access areas.
Yes, Trump can criticize us...we survived on US donations for years. But India!! Brother, you would still have poliomyelitis if WHO didn't send help.
There's nothing to call out...we are not the authority to test vaccines. If Bharat Biotech's data makes sense, it will be approved, otherwise it won't be listed as recommended vaccine. That's what WHO can do. Nothing less, nothing more. We don't have the resources / intention to have an anti- Covaxin campaign even if Bharat Biotech continues to send rubbish. It's the duty of a nation to determine what they plan to inject it's citizens with. ICMR has more manpower than us. Let them do at least something..
I still can't find any videos about Fauci talking about Covaxin.
 
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As mentioned already, people have deep respect for Drs. and staff who selflessly work saving lives.
World naturally see WHO in that light and expect to behave in transparent and honest manner.
They don't differentiate between Drs. on the ground and executives sitting in posh positions.
Unfortunately for everyone, the pandemic exposed the realities.

India's share of contribution is more than double the China's at 0.48 per cent and much closer to France's (0.5 per cent). Interestingly, even Pakistan contributes (0.36 per cent) to the WHO more than China.

www.indiatoday.in

Who funds WHO?

Donald Trump accused the WHO of being too China-centric and stopped the US's contribution to the health agency. The US contributes about 15 per cent of total WHO funding while China's share is half of India's and even less than Pakistan's.
www.indiatoday.in www.indiatoday.in

According to senior officials in the National Centre for Disease Control, in January when cases were piling up in China, there was a meeting in Delhi in which WHO officials brushed aside government concerns saying “there is no human to human transmission”. “When cases kept going up and moved out of Wuhan, we asked what’s happening? Either there are more sources than just one wet market in one province or there is clearly human to human transmission happening,” said a source.

indianexpress.com

The WHO balance sheet: How it is funded, where it spends

Coronavirus (COVID-19): President Donald Trump has declared he will halt US funding to WHO. How much does WHO get from the US and other member states, including India? Where does it spend? What is its role in India’s COVID-19 battle?
indianexpress.com indianexpress.com

Once things were totally out of hand, they were constantly fear mongering, to this date.
This is not be isolated with India, the antics they did with Taiwan was globally infamous.

Indian pharma business have done a lot to the world providing cheap medicines. We should not forget that, whatever eff up our political leaders do.

Sorry if these comments come out harsh, are not meant to make it difficult for such honest people like you, feels I should not waste your time on these discussions. Anyways, was just mentioning how people think about this and their view points.
 
JMP said:
We have had front row seats to this experiment run across the US. Friends, families and workplaces torn apart over political affiliations and Trump. Instead, Reason with people, reach out, if it fails try again and again till it works. Ridicule and derision will only make things worse.

@red dragon Maybe he is referring to -
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He is simply quoting what Bharat Biotech claimed. What else can Fauci say? If he says the truth ( Bharat Biotech's papers don't make any sense) it will lead to even bigger issues.
I have seen this epidemic in 5 countries by now.
Unfortunately India is the only country which is fighting against so many things
1. A completely insensitive PM and a government where nothing works/ moves forward
2. Unsympathetic doctors ( I've nothing against the young ones, they are brave, sympathetic, hardworking, mostly honest...it's the cancerous "senior doctors"- the most ignorant, arrogant, lazy and corrupt group of people)
3. Broken economy: Only possible to understand when you're in India and speaking to real people. This amount of insecurity and uncertainty about life in general and "what will happen if I die" is pretty unique to India.
4. Non existent health infrastructure: It is not bad, it does not exist.
I am coming from a relatively poor European country and familiar with not so good, but acceptable and universally accessible healthcare system ( better than NHS, far worse than German/ Dutch)
Blaming population for everything isn't acceptable, if India had half population, then also the infrastructure would have been non existent.
As the "mad statistician" of Geneva HQ, I can show you guys, Indian infrastructure can't support 10 million population ( this paper will be published in July/ August in NJEM, and I'm pretty sure 56 incher will arrest me, if I remain in India at that time, and will never allow me again in India in future if they can't catch me in Europe...of course they can't)
Regarding WHO's funding...mate I really don't know what to say...if China stops investing, we will go hungry, no matter what media claims.
I will be completely honest and transparent here about how much money we make.
We, the consultants and who hold permanent positions ( not as consultants) make aound 18-20L INR/ month for routine activities. It doesn't depend on the position ( as the operational hierarchy is very different) As chief of substance abuse and mental health division I earn no more than the instructors or any other permanent position which can be held by medical doctors only. This income is partially taxable depending on the location (in Geneva completely tax free...the main motivation of staying near HQ)
Now once sent elsewhere ( like my last posting was in Spain, Africa was cancelled) we are paid consultation fees...a substantial amount of money which is tax free..mind you, these are not easy postings, we literally sign a paper saying our family can't sue if we die in line of duty..and I've lost some friends in war torn countries.
Theoretically our DG holds an administrative post which is equal to a consultant. But he gets some other allowances as he has to travel continuously.
I don't know exactly how much Tedros makes, but can easily find out. Trust me on this, he's neither very rich or powerful. Thousands of doctors in India earns a lot more than him. He can't even travel business class now ( except inter continental travel)
Just look at his suits man!!
Yes, sure he made some mistakes, but please don't blame him for what's happening now. I don't know about the truth behind Trump's comments, but Tedros is certainly not a very rich man (or he hides it really well)
WHO actually went through a big reform in March- April and the HR department is completely gone. IT has been outsourced completely.
Except 5/6 people in accounts and 4 administrative posts all are medical doctors.
Unlike most corporate, WHO is fairly transparent.
Please understand it's not a very rich organization. Many of us could make a lot more in clinical medicine.
Public health is mostly for the poor, by the poor. We don't even have a single hospital or laboratory. All the labs are microbiologists work are actually rented/ donated.
If I get sick tomorrow, I can't go to a WHO hospital, as it doesn't exist. I will be admitted in some private hospital and my colleagues will be writing letters to the hospital authority requesting free treatment. If Tedros gets sick, the same thing will happen.
If you or anyone ever go to Switzerland and visit Geneva, if possible visit our HQ once. There's a board to the right of the main entrance, it has names of all the people who lost their lives on line of duty, the list grew so big, that we have now reduced it to last 5 years and does not include "members"
Right now, a team of 7 people are in Gaza strip. If they are paid good money, is it unfair? Even if all come back safely, they will definitely suffer from PTSD. A surgeon had to amputate both lower limbs above knee in a 6 year old yesterday. He also has a kid of similar age. The man has not spoken a single word since the surgery. There are many better skilled surgeons, but how many can take so much mental trauma?
I am in India, don't know how will I return by 12th as my wife is pregnant.
Our lives do get really difficult at times mate.
 
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> If he says the truth ( Bharat Biotech's papers don't make any sense) it will lead to even bigger issues.

Don't think sitting in USA's top post and considered as world's top lead, he will have to face bigger issues. Even then, if there is some truth, he should say that in open considering the stature they assigned to him.

> Blaming population for everything isn't acceptable, if India had half population, then also the infrastructure would have been non existent.

Fully agree with this.

Population can be considered as an asset too, when managed by wise leaders in a resourceful country as India. Unfortunately, everybody here blames population from morning to evening.

Right now if you listen to mainstream media in India, they are hideously pitching to open up businesses as Covid19 cases are 'reducing' and is in 'control'. Our country's leaders are hell bent on writing off the entire country to businessmen those are chronically selfish, majority of them from a certain region. They want to push a glossy narrative too.

India's tax system put everything into shame, with most meager returns to citizens.
 
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Population in India is THE PROBLEM. We don't have enough landmass to fit these 139 crores. Just look at the population density for heaven's sake. This is not something worth even arguing.
 
Population in India is a problem when political leaders of the country is busy scavenging corruption monies.

India have enough water and natural resources compared to many other countries. If population is considered as a asset, properly managed and concentrated around well planned cities with proper infra, it will be less resource hogging on nature and cleaner.

India's population growth is decelerating, in some rare communities less than replacement levels. Already recognized as a problem for future generations.

But political leaders only have time to write off country to pvt. entities and eat from taxes without doing anything other than hate politics.
 
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