MH-BJP Govt dictate : Marathi movies on prime time :P

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Must say south Indian, North-east peoples are the most cooperative i had came across in my life ,they do come with big heart B-)

Also, try once to move across MH in your personal car, seeing out state registration you will be stopped every 30km by some Traffic cop in search of bribe :p (now got a solution to bypass them :p)
 
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Much say south Indian, North-east peoples are the most cooperative i had came across in my life ,they do come with big heart B-)
Also, try once to move across MH in your personal car, seeing out state registration you will be stopped every 30km by some Traffic cop in search of bribe :p (now got a solution to bypass them :p)
Like wise everywhere.... MH parents dont send boys leave aside girls to work in NCR / WB / Bihar at all. They will let them sit at home rather then sending them north. Ask the same parents about B'lore / Gujarat even Chennai they will be ready to send their kids here.
Only reason is that not every one has an experience to stay everywhere. We go by what is shown in news/media.
Try going to HP / Srinagar with your own car ....
Same between AP and TN and Karnataka.
But these are occasional events not a regular thing. Be it any state. And if you are getting stopped at any state post then you are doing something really dumb.
Ask any south indian guy about North Indians and you will hear the same rhetoric. That they are drunkards/ rouges / miscreants blah blah.... Where do you think that label came from?
And talking of cars yes MH did have a toll plaza havoc in last 10 years due to the corrupt congress but that is getting changes. Just yday this same BJP govt that you all are bad mouthing has shut 12 toll plazas and made other 53 tolls free to private cars and state transport buses. Only commercial and goods vehicles have to pay toll now.
And likely in next few months they are planning to shut down more tolls after arriving to some solution with the current companies which own the tolls.

Like they say the grass is greener on the other side... like wise... to each his own home state (no matter which or how it is) is always a known territory and of comfort zone.

So use your brains and debate on topic rather than demeaning and belittling each others states. Coz anyone with little common sense would know that all five fingers are not same and any classification does not apply to an entire state.
 
Must say south Indian, North-east peoples are the most cooperative i had came across in my life ,they do come with big heart B-)

Also, try once to move across MH in your personal car, seeing out state registration you will be stopped every 30km by some Traffic cop in search of bribe :p (now got a solution to bypass them :p)

hence the reason people come in mumbai from all other states by the truckloads to do manual labour jobs, live in slums because they like to pay bribe everywhere in maharshtra? and get abused around in the state.

Dat Logic.
 
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hence the reason people come in mumbai from the northern (most cooperative states) by the truckloads to do manual labour jobs, live in slums because they like to pay bribe everywhere in maharshtra?
Oh Man, you just proved my fears right

What I find really scary though is this :
Regional jingoism was earlier limited to the less educated/blue collar sections of the populace- Many of us hoped that with improving standards of education/access to the wider world of information, the situation would improve
However, it appears that the situation has actually taken a turn for the worse- Well educated students/white collar workers often have no qualms about making blanket statements about the need for intra nation immigration control or a sweeping mandate about outsiders (whatever that means) to learn the local language .. ah, the list goes on
 
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that was to prove your logic right.
if maharashtra was the most disrespectful state, filled with hatred all around, why would people come here ?
No one said anything about MH being the most disrespectful state
I have in fact lived in Pune for close to 5 years now and find it a beautiful place to live in

It instead is a concern around MH becoming a nanny state that is taking regional/linguistic jingoism and the son-of-soil argument too far

I would want my adopted state to be a cosmopolitan place which attracts talent from all over the country and even the world, not a xenophobic and sectarian place with a closed mindset
 
Sorry Missed your Post .. Tapatalk issues.
Also, replying back late. Had read you post: but was tied up...!

it is the perception of the native people in respective Metros, the local language not being given the due importance.
How is this perception actually being generated. Are there some campaigns around this..? Is cinema the only vector to assess the importance of a local language.? Do not the sign boards, governmental forms, transport vehicles have local signage on them..? Have the locals stopped conversing in local languages..? I doubt that is happening. I have been to Madras, and I saw people using their own language, and would talk to me in a different language. Hindi or English. It was cool. In Bombay it is similar. Ya, people ask: where are you from, since Northern India's Hindi is quite different and laced with Urdu. But so what....! No where, are these languages even near the "e" of extinction. I fail to understand, why shared/popular culture has to be guided (or nudged) by an external force. If it is not let to grow and prosper and develop on societal paradigms, it will cease to be natural and become fabricated and artificial.

Talent never is the decisive factor in this country, we have reservations & quotas . Govt has to support.
That is literally saying: Quotas for cinema. Ok.

No it is just properly enforcing the rule which was there long before, nailing the cheat carried out by multiplexes of showing Marathi movies only for namesake. Similar to Corporate Hospitals showing 25% Free beds for the poor for namesake & getting tax rebates.
I think it is a different set-up now. IE: rule.

if everyone is as liberal it is a great thing & a great new direction to go. Practically it is never so.
Okay, so we should continue to live in our hived culture. And the government can propagate it..??

which is the first thing to be objected , How can Central Govt support one regional language over other ??
And same with a State Government..? But yea, the Hindi forced influx is incorrect. But using cinema halls as a combatant tool, is incorrect.

No it is tapatalk & Swiftkey auto corrections, Not intentional, Too busy to sit in front of a PC. Not busy enough NOT to learn the local language
Nice.
 
hence the reason people come in mumbai from all other states by the truckloads to do manual labour jobs, live in slums because they like to pay bribe everywhere in maharshtra? and get abused around in the state.

Dat Logic.

IF you had used your little bit of your 666666'th sense, you might know, from whom (which class people) the money is extorted (bribe), moreover migration is due effect of more industrilization in mumbai-pune :p
 
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IF you had used your little bit of your 666666'th sense, you might know, from whom the money is extorted (bribe), moreover migration is due effect of more industrilization in mumbai-pune :p

so from your logic
extortion (bribe)= more industrialization
Big heart = migration.

BTW nice diversion from the thread topic.
 
hence the reason people come in mumbai from all other states by the truckloads to do manual labour jobs, live in slums because they like to pay bribe everywhere in maharshtra? and get abused around in the state.
Really feel pity of how people are generalised
What would you call those people who migrate to more greener pastures like the US, Middle east, Australlia, Canada, etc.
Only satirical difference I find in the two is;the truckloads are less educated and more hunger stricken and migrate out of necessity
slum.JPG

For a better definition of slums, google images for labour camps in dubai or talk to people pursuing MS in the US staying 5-10 in a room.
All can be generalised as slums.
The problem here is perception, not definition.
A perception made by the so called chauvinists that all immigrants (Not only North Indians,but any non-marathi)are a pest to the state.
A perception that started with the "Bajao pungi, bhagao lungi" movement in the end of 1960's
Tiger’s roar: How Thackeray’s ‘politics’ filled a systemic vacuum - Firstpost
This(Bal Thackeray) is the man who built on his father KS Thackeray’s leadership of the Samyukta Maharashtra Movement (SMM), which in the 1950s harnessed the desire for articulating a Marathi identity by campaigning for the creation of the State of Maharashtra. But what started as a legitimate manifestation of Marathi pride gave way soon enough to linguistic chauvinism that targeted south Indians (in particular) and even Gujaratis in Mumbai as “outsiders” who were feeding off Marathas.
An perception or rather a delusion,which is deep embedded into the less-intellect sect of the society who fail to realise that there is major chunk of population that contributed to what the state is today
 
Really feel pity of how people are generalised
What would you call those people who migrate to more greener pastures like the US, Middle east, Australlia, Canada, etc.
Only satirical difference I find in the two is;the truckloads are less educated and more hunger stricken and migrate out of necessity
that reply was to the below quoted post.
of course you can always quote irrevelant posts and make up a story.
Must say south Indian, North-east peoples are the most cooperative i had came across in my life ,they do come with big heart B-)

Also, try once to move across MH in your personal car, seeing out state registration you will be stopped every 30km by some Traffic cop in search of bribe :p (now got a solution to bypass them :p)
 
of course you can always quote irrevelant posts and make up a story.
Cooking up stories??

I was just emphasizing on the way people are generalised or the stooped level of discrimination people make when they meet a North Indian
KRK/deshdrohi fan spotted.
FYI, I find the OP and KRK both annoying and am nowehere related to both, neither am I a North Indian
But can't stop pointing out people who get carried away by politic gimmicks.

Just compare the sheer mass of movies released in Hindi and Marathi of any month

List of Bollywood films of 2015 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
V/s
List of Marathi films of 2015 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Its always thrice the number of Marathi movies released in any week and people expect so much from the Multiplex owners to gamble with show timings.

Really appreciate that you admit your posts are irrelevant
 
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Just compare the sheer mass of movies released in Hindi and Marathi of any month

List of Bollywood films of 2015 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
V/s
List of Marathi films of 2015 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Its always thrice the number of Marathi movies released in any week and people expect so much from the Multiplex owners to gamble with show timings.

Really appreciate that you admit your posts are irrelevant
that is what i was trying to say anyways. their volumes are low to start with , so its never is going to be a case of hindi movies not getting a screen because a marathi movie is being "forced" on the multiplex.

so the outrage for marathi movie, whatever that was, which translated further to people feeling north indians being discriminated was over exaggerated.
 
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How is this perception actually being generated. Are there some campaigns around this..? Is cinema the only vector to assess the importance of a local language.? Do not the sign boards, governmental forms, transport vehicles have local signage on them..? Have the locals stopped conversing in local languages..? I doubt that is happening. I have been to Madras, and I saw people using their own language, and would talk to me in a different language. Hindi or English. It was cool. In Bombay it is similar. Ya, people ask: where are you from, since Northern India's Hindi is quite different and laced with Urdu. But so what....! No where, are these languages even near the "e" of extinction. I fail to understand, why shared/popular culture has to be guided (or nudged) by an external force. If it is not let to grow and prosper and develop on societal paradigms, it will cease to be natural and become fabricated and artificial.

Will any Language die a sudden death ? it is slow death always. So such incidents as lack of support to local cinema etc , along with influx of outsiders , opposing the language oriented laws of the state create such a perception. People anyway try to find fault in others, even for their own misery. First the linguistic creativity dies, then as the new adopters of the language reduce as necessity for learning the language reduces ( especially if the locals are liberal enough to talk in English and Hindi, instead of forcing local language for communication to outsiders), and alternatives emerge . So a perception ensues which gets profound with mass hysteria. The "We should do something about it " usually leads to some unforeseen complications.
Movies have replaced Literature as far as the torch bearers of linguistic creativity is concerned, especially for the common man. The majority of Local Mass hardly read any Novels or Literature instead prefer to watch movies based on them. in this regard , I don't see anything wrong with government supporting its own movie industry. Govt is also selected by the same people, how it becomes a external force ? they're doing it because the majority of their voters will support their action, & Majority is not an external force either.

Chennai wasn't that friendlier to Hindi speakers earlier, it has changed a lot now; as the competition demands. Also your expectation differs when you enter Chennai, about communicating in Hindi when you compare to Mumbai. For example do you remember any opposition for changing Madras to Chennai ? you had lot of debates for Banglore to Bengaluru.


That is literally saying: Quotas for cinema. Ok.

No it is not like quotas , it is more of affirmative action; they're not forcing you to watch Marathi movies, neither are they asking you to watch minimum of 1 marathi movie to watch 5 other language movies etc. Quota system exists everywhere , there's a limited quota of only 10% seats to Asian origin Americans in US ! to save the rest of the seats to their natives.
It is almost like Govt supporting any dying local art form, how can it be wrong ??

Okay, so we should continue to live in our hived culture. And the government can propagate it..??

Govt is just ensuring the availability of Marathi Movies at all show hours, if the majority voters won't support Govt on this issue, they will have to stop. but the majority feel that Marathi Movie Industry is dying & Govt should " do something about it". Nobody can force a culture on you, it is impossible, Neither this govt is forcing you to watch Marathi Movies !! It is just ensuring the availability of Marathi Movies at all show hours, for a person who wants to watch them. Even if it inflects a small financial burden on already Cash Rich Multiplexes, who claim Tax rebates on the basis of it.

And same with a State Government..? But yea, the Hindi forced influx is incorrect. But using cinema halls as a combatant tool, is incorrect.

Movie as a Combat tool ; I think I have answered this in first paragraph.
Forced Hindi Influx; Who started it ? even before this enormous proportion of inter state migrations occurred, North Indians felt it is tough to learn South Indian Languages, instead they adopted a shortcut of Teaching Hindi to South Indians, Central Govt Supported it ! Tamilians cleverly opposed it as they saw what was coming , though Hindi could never become the National Language; the efforts to Popularize Hindi in Non Hindi Speaking areas still continues, at the expense of exchequer. Even that fuels the perception of local language getting a raw deal in Locals.

It was one of the many blunders of Nehruvian Ideology , Linguistic Basis for division of states, one more tool to divide a nation which is already divided ! But that is different discussion altogether.

Few of My salient observations here , after reading fellow member comments:

If a Marathi Movie industry or Marathi Art and Culture is Dying , it is part of our diverse linguistic and cultural heritage is dying, as Indian (though I don't speak Marathi) it is part of my nation which is dying. I would probably watch a Marathi movie next time when I visit to Pune, just to support their movie industry ! If I'm an outsider settled in Maharashtra, I should support do that ! This city has embraced me and I should do everything to save it's culture and language. I don't see that coming from any outsider in Mumbai and Pune . Isn't it Regionalism to shut my eyes when part of my citys' linguistic art form is dying (only because I don't speak that language)? I will be an outsider and deserve to be treated as an outsider as long as I don't support such causes which local people are concerned about !
I don't see that coming from a Non Marathi settled in Mumbai, Pune . A great opportunity to bridge the gaps was wasted !
It is for Marathi today, tomorrow it may be some other language and perhaps one day my native language too, it is collective responsibility of the people residing in that city not only the Marathi Speaking population !
I personally believe it is a great opportunity to learn a new language when you are residing in that state, some local feel of the city can be understood only in local language, else it is like browsing through the streets in Google Earth !

Someone commented that we were small provinces fighting each other before British invaded us, and never united. What are we doing now ? continuing the same mistake ?
If you are Blaming and painting Maha Govt for Supporting Marathi Movie Industry as Regionalism , then closing your eyes and not supporting Marathi language and culture though residing in Maharashtra for many years (Just because your mother tongue is not Marathi) is Worst kind of regionalism !

I would have loved see all Mahrashtrians (Marathi or Non Marathi) coming in support of Marathi Movie industry.
BTW the Marathi Theatre industry is fairly standard and well organized, Many of the Marathi movies , though lacked in production values (because of budget constraints ) were far superior in terms of content and creativity. The commercial failure of such movies is universal across India , but intellectual potential is worth saving the industry.


My Point is Simple; if Marathi or any other Indian language art form is dying it is part of my heritage is dying (even though I don't speak that language) ; it is my duty to preserve it to the future generations. I will be an outsider and deserve to be treated as an outsider as long as I don't support such causes which affect the local language and culture I choose to reside in.
 
Good post Drkrack, some really nice points in there ..
My only counter to that is languages and cultures (regional or national) are living, evolving entities and the path they tend to follow emulates a free market economy

Sanskrit died a slow death over the millennia because it became too rarified and controlled as Hindi and other derivatives of Sanskrit (Including Marathi which has far more in common with Sanskrit than Hindi which has a strong Persian influence) became more commonly spoken

Hindi too currently is on a steep path of decline - There is hardly any recent worthwhile literature , Hindi movies aren't really Hindi anymore, Hindi newspapers tend to stick to cliches and sentence structures that probably have been the same over the last 40 years
The language has simply stopped evolving and will devolve into something entirely different over the next century or so

Now how do I solve for that? Do I issue a diktat to publishing houses to print at least 20% of their output in chaste Hindi? Do I instruct production houses to create at least 15% of their content in real Hindi ? Do I force engineering colleges to instruct at least 1 subject every semester i pure Hindi?

Or should I instead of getting sentimental about the imminent death of Hindi take a pragmatic course
And Should I just let the free market forces take their own course and let the free citizens of this great nation make their own choices?
 
^^ +1
And why only Marathi? The MH govt. should also support anything and everything that is declining including sick industries. Oh wait, that won't bring votes by nudging Marathi sentiments!
 
Good post Drkrack, some really nice points in there ..
My only counter to that is languages and cultures (regional or national) are living, evolving entities and the path they tend to follow emulates a free market economy

Sanskrit died a slow death over the millennia because it became too rarified and controlled as Hindi and other derivatives of Sanskrit (Including Marathi which has far more in common with Sanskrit than Hindi which has a strong Persian influence) became more commonly spoken

Hindi too currently is on a steep path of decline - There is hardly any recent worthwhile literature , Hindi movies aren't really Hindi anymore, Hindi newspapers tend to stick to cliches and sentence structures that probably have been the same over the last 40 years
The language has simply stopped evolving and will devolve into something entirely different over the next century or so

Now how do I solve for that? Do I issue a diktat to publishing houses to print at least 20% of their output in chaste Hindi? Do I instruct production houses to create at least 15% of their content in real Hindi ? Do I force engineering colleges to instruct at least 1 subject every semester i pure Hindi?

Or should I instead of getting sentimental about the imminent death of Hindi take a pragmatic course
And Should I just let the free market forces take their own course and let the free citizens of this great nation make their own choices?

Perfect, I expected this question coming, Here is My take.

Sanskrit (I have studied for 5yrs) wasn't ever a popular spoken Language in India, I guess it was solely a language of scholars and survived in ancient seats of learning. It has reached a situation where it cannot die further. It is survived by the extensive religious texts and preaching (a form of literature) and a minuscule of population in South Karnataka who still converse in Sanskrit on daily Basis (Maddur , Shimoga District). So when a language dies a natural death it is the literature written in that language keeps it alive or at least for the record. Literature was the only form of linguistic creativity those days, no movies etc, so this language is survived by its literature even in difficult times like this for any Indian language.

Yes , Hindi too is facing this problem so are many other regional languages. Hindi due to a shear mass of population speaking it , makes it less vulnerable. I agree that god knows what Hindi Movies are representing, Neither here nor there. Other than innovative marketing strategies I hardly see anything new in terms of content and story telling in newer Hindi Movies. Actually newer experiments are much easily seen in regional movies, so the question of perceived standard of bollywood cinema doesn't hold any water. especially when majority of blockbusters are shameless rip offs.


Now how would I go about saving a language ? Govt is Partly right, and partly wrong in this affirmative action.

First , is it right to leave commercial viability and free economy to dictate what we chose to save ?
If you leave it for commercial forces then, more than half of the remaining Forests will be destroyed in no time and Tigers will become an endangered species. Maintaining Forests and saving tigers for the future generations is our priority though the money is being spent from the exchequer , though it is commercially a loss making venture. Will you just stop spending on parents medical bills just because it is commercially illogical and investing it somewhere else yields you better results ? So we should come out of the superiority of commercial viability to dictate terms - it is again unduly emphasized criterion ( probably from Management Gurus) for matters like art and literature. Reading a literature for a professional is never going to be logically justified, & we are the victims of too much objectivity & "what I will get from all this " attitude popularized by western niche marketing principles.

Second, The language should reinvent themselves,
should come up with newer innovations, that makes adoption easier. Some amount of affirmative action is needed from the people and government in this regard. You should make it easier to type in Qwerty keyboards, include popular words, though foreign to the native vocabulary so that daily conversation shouldn't be exhaustive. Why English is excelling because, yearly thousands of new words are added its dictionary. Adoption , Updating and user friendliness are a key issue here.

Third, We should be proud of our language and cultural heritage,
if there are Black spots in our history, let me assure you nobody has a clean history ! We should insist on representing in our local language at international forums without feeling bad about not knowing English. Is Italian or a French feel inferior for not knowing English ? why should Indians be ? Come out of this Colonial Mentality, we are no more a British Colony ! Then only the Companies will be forced to make Next Mac OS version with option of Marathi, If Pizza Hut Can be forced to make Tandoori Pizzas and Serve Biryani it is not impossible to achieve. Stop giving undue importance to English. There are convent primary schools in Bangalore who will fine the kids speaking in Kannada inside the premises , even during lunch break ! Such moves should be opposed by all , Kannadigas & Non Kannadigas alike.

Fourth , Linguistic division of states,
Whether it was right or wrong ; we will have to live with it, The local language should be given utmost importance and it is a duty of every resident of the Local area to preserve its linguistic heritage, irrespective of the Fact that language is your mother tongue or not . Let us be united about it.
1. So Please Dear Marathi Manoos, open your arms and show a gesture of outsider friendliness to those truckloads (I don't mean only people from Bihar & UP outsiders in general ) who have come here to earn their livelihood, at the end , it is the Maharashtrian culture which is getting rich by imbibing better customs and traditions in others into your own culture. It is English which is getting richer and stronger day by day with influx of foreign words in its vocabulary. Embracing outsiders whole heartedly will not only enriches your culture but financial gains too.

2. Now truckload of Bhayyajis (I don't mean only people from Bihar & UP outsiders in general ); it is your turn to revert it back ! Had your native states been good enough for you, you wouldn't have migrated in the first place, there is something better here. These local people have welcomed you and allowed you to piece fully earn your daily bread (without forcing you to learn the local language), in spite of knowing that it will dilute their majority on local language and culture. As the next generation Maharashtrians it is your duty to save the local language and culture as much as the duty of Maharashtrians, you cannot have only the comforts without responsibilities. If you have that much respect for a culture and a language because its a birthplace for you or your fathers (native state I mean) , Have some respect and responsibility towards a culture and language which is going to be the birth place for your kid. If you are unable to adopt in spite of max efforts, show the right direction to your future generations. If you genuinely respect your mother tongue, you will respect others mother tongue too, especially if you are residing in that region. For Ex Shettys and Kamath, Pie s etc, they are as Maharashtrian as anybody else though their native language is Tulu or Konkani Respectively.

Had a non Marathi speaking Population came in support of Marathi movies , a small procession holding placards to save Marathi cinema, a token or a gesture of "Marathi Talkies Bharo" , We could have wiped the careers of hate monger politicians , presstitutes and pseudo intellectual writers alike. A clear example could have been set, for rest of India to follow. A clear opportunity missed.

I have numbered them arbitrarily as one and two ; somebody shouldn't conclude that Marathis should open their arms first and outsiders will respond equally later etc.

First understand, it is lack of our unity to speak and practice certain language and culture in designated region , leads to superiority of English language or western culture. If we are united in giving utmost importance the local language and culture, without any force , Nobody can force their language or culture on us. English becomes a common medium because we lack unity. Dear History Pundits, don't make the same mistakes , learn and don't repeat history.

Fifth, In spite of all above measures if a language dies a natural death , let it RIP.
At least we tried our best. Probably we might evolve into some other technology in future where everyone can converse in his own native language still everybody listens and understands in his own language. Who knows what future holds ; probably we may not need a language as a medium of communication itself, probably universal gestures and smileys may take over !


Sorry if it seems long & boring or preaching like, but I couldn't justify not expressing. Especially after those silly verbal fights between my fellow Indians !
 
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