Audio Very early impressions of my newest IEM

anubhav2345 said:
Santosh , always gets the best of the top tier IEMS !!

Achal .... me left farrr behind in IEM race :(
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It is no race,ljokerl`s ratings may not apply to you.I myself prefer IE7 over both SM3 and IE8.Both of them are definitely a tier above IE7, but I just like it`s signature and that is what matters.
 
anubhav2345 said:
Santosh , always gets the best of the top tier IEMS !!

Achal .... me left farrr behind in IEM race :(
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Since I have many different top-tiers, you'll find it within the top 3 of many reputed reviewer's rankings. It's just the strength in numbers ;).

My own ranking will not coincide with dfkt or clieOS. It may match joker's to a large extent because of similar preferences, but even there in some cases I'll differ. Neither of these three should be your reference unless your preferences closely matches theirs.

As a listener, our job is not to rank IEMs based on technical factors, minute differences etc., So, use these as a guide to know about IEMs' signatures and see if they'll match your tastes. But don't take them too far to your head.

Edit: Do read a few opinions that are against SM3 getting 10/10 too. It's not for everybody :)
 
Just like the RE262 and Re1.

I stopped listening to the Re1s for some time now after getting the RE262s but on a whim I tried them today just to see if I started to hate the sound or not and what do you know I started smiling as soon I as heard them.

For once I could make out that they just dont have the detailing or transparency of the RE262 and even their mid range glosses over a lot of detail but what the heck I still love them ! :p
 
Whats the problem then DBA 2 ?!! it truly deserves the TOP-tier status !! its worthy of being someones favorite :)

why DO you rate SM3 above :mad: when you like DBA 2 more, i thought its all about preference !! :mad:

RE1 is also great, but am not sure , after the 262 they deserve being favorites or not :p
 
Because of the 'new toy' syndrome ;).

Actually, there are aspects of SM3 which make it edge a bit over DBA-02 at this stage. While it's no headphone to wrap around your head, it has a sound stage that is like a band around your head, while DBA-02's is smaller in comparison. The bass while lacking the low bass rumble and the impact (that TF10 and FX700 do very well) is more bodied than DBA-02 (which rolls off a tad prior to SM3). The forward mids give it a small edge in certain tracks. While I'll say DBA-02's cymbals as very lean, they acquire some body with SM3. Besides all that, it has better positioning and separation. DBA-02 tends to get too busy sometimes, not SM3. It's not a HUGE difference - more like 10.0 for SM3 and 9.85 for DBA-02 (ok! I suck at giving scores for SQ, which is why I never attempt :p).

When I go from SM3 to DBA-02, I like it for being lean, fast, clear and more engaging. I actually need more time with all my top-ranked IEMs - SM3, DBA-02, FX700, e-Q5 and TF10 to place them in my own ranking list. If over a 2-3 week period, I seem to prefer DBA-02 more times than SM3, then DBA-02 would be back to numero uno position. After all, I don't have the pressure of ljokerl to prove anything. It's a list only I care about, so if my ears tell me so, the positions will be reversed in no time and updated in my head-fi profile :)
 
you seem to have 2 syndromes , " new toy " and "new Buy " ;)

still great if you are loving it all ! :)

Hmm, SM3's soundstage is what pull me towards it!!

and DBA's signature is what i want to try ! , i want to try the CK10 more though.

hay!! did you order CK10 already, tell me via a pm i wont tell anyone :p ( you like shocking us all with purchases)

But at the end of the day i thing i am really happy with the Signature i get with FX700, so i am waiting for the miracles now!!
 
I think you're better off trying both and concluding for yourself. Frankly, I expected SM3 to blow me off with it's "massive" sound stage initially. But, it does not have a massive sound stage like the width of RE1, depth of TF10 combined. What it does is filling up the space better, giving you the illusion of the massive space it has got to position things. Let's say the total stage is like 8 rows. Because SM3 has a thicker sound, the vocalist is almost occupying the first two rows, then it positions a guitarist in 3rd row. Due to the thick notes, each note is like a fat man occupying two seats together. It then places a cymbal strike in #6 and #7, a fading effect in row #7-8. Now, many seats are filled within your imaginary head-itorium. With DBA-02, a lean sounding IEM, the vocalist is in row #2, guitarist is in #5, cymbals sound unattached at row #8. Since it's thin, it does not have the fat man, each sound occupies only one seat in each row. It would look vacant compared to SM3 for sure.

I just did a short A-B between SM3 and DBA-02. Played Opeth's "Dirge for November" (Blackwater Park) in SM3 first, DBA-02 next. This is what I felt on going to DBA-02 : Mids and Vocals sound thin & recessed, but it's fast, drums sound natural.

Then, after a short break, I played A Perfect Circle's "Brena" (Mer De Noms) in DBA-02, then SM3. When I played it in the DBA-02, the cymbals sounded fast, forward and had a great impact. It's positioning from left to right and front to back was indeed very good. When I switched to SM3, I found treble to be very recessed, the cymbals no longer having the impact as they are positioned far off me, no match to DBA-02. But, mids sound rich, bass has more body and impact. The "fat man" is at work here, giving you a very nice stage filled with all the items, but without poaching on each other's space.

Guess that sums up my quick A-B.
 
hmm , you sure made things clear, Nothing is perfect !! thats the same way i feel when i A-B my pairs ! ..but i want it ALLL, thats why i ordered miracle :p ( call me childish , i am though ! )

If the trebles is anything near to the re262's i think they wont replace my FX700. i will try if i get a chance though ! :)

Great A-Bing BTW. clean and clear. :D
 
That's the strangest thing about it, strategy!

Once I stop A-B-ing and go back to listening to SM3 alone, I don't find anything lacking at all. It has the sparkle when you need it, it has the details and once you are past the first 20-30 mins, you don't even find it recessed. I always come out of a 1-hr+ session with SM3 thinking that these are the perfect IEMs and "what more can I ask for?". With many others, what I usually do is find something lacking and start to notice it everywhere. May be they voodoo me or something, I don't know :). They are sure not the most perfect IEMs ever made. They do have faults, yet they somehow seem to mask it once you get used to their signature. That's why I need 2-3 weeks of much more intense listening and lot more proper A-B-ing to put them in their place.
 
yeah FX700 are not perfect either, one thing i want with the FX700 is a tad more speed.

yeah in all listening sessions i do find RE262's treble ok , but still when ever i play a song whose Highs i remember ...it starts off as dull. thats why i sometimes switch.

WHile this is with Metal and rock. I do find they perfet for indian music with great vocals ( and i doo find them natural and transparent )
 
esanthosh said:
Then, after a short break, I played A Perfect Circle's "Brena" (Mer De Noms) in DBA-02, then SM3. When I played it in the DBA-02, the cymbals sounded fast, forward and had a great impact. It's positioning from left to right and front to back was indeed very good.
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omg... I'll eventually end up getting them if I keep reading your descriptions. Thankfully they are out of stock everywhere :D
 
It's interesting how many are up in arms (without crossing the flaming line) against ljokerl's 10/10 rating for SM3. I thought it was hard to dislike SM3 once you get used to their presentation. Guess I was wrong. But then, I think many who are complaining had issues getting used to the presentation. May be I should qualify each of my statements with "IF you get used to the way of presentation...." like I do with DDM :)
 
its not that he gave the 10/10 ratting ...the main issue here is that he gave them 10/10 while he lowered the earlier 10/10s that is what is generating such atm!!

No doubt they are good ..10/10 is fine by me , but he lowered the others says that they are better than all !! YOU SEE, BETTER THAN ALL!!
 
But, CK100 / CK10 / DBA-02 were not perfect in every way either. I didn't see too many complaints back then.

I have done the same thing - putting SM3 ahead of DBA-02 despite it's flaws because it's that good. So, I understand it better. I cannot speak for ljokerl, but what I'd say is that SM3 is NOT the benchmark IEM that I'd evaluate every IEM against. That is not why I consider it a little ahead of DBA-02 at this stage. But it's because I cannot rank it lower or equal to DBA-02. It's not in a whole different league as I'd say for say, M6 vs DBA-02.Does it mean it's better than all? In a way, yes! But does that mean, it is THE best? Not at all. Am I making things clear or am I confusing more? :ashamed:

If we have 4/5 people who try out both SM3 and DBA-02 / CK10, may be I could get an idea of why SM3 evokes so much of polarization.
 
Im not saying that the earlier IEMs were perfect ...but they were perfect for his requirement !

the fact that SM3 are not as per his requirements and still replaced the earlier ones ( his favorites ) has caused the stir IMO

also , yeah SM3 are not probably Perfect ..but the closest one, to perfection among the lot, sonically.

10/10 means the best in all the IEMs he has tried ...and 125 IS a LOT !!

I think CK10/CK100's brilliance is easy to recognize that's why no one objects when they get 10/10.

while SM3 are great because of their detail and enveloping (and evolving ) soundstage.
 
That's the thing. It's not an easy IEM to get your head around. Unlike CK10/DBA-02 which are still within the traditional means of presentation, DDM / SM3 do it their way. If you get used to their ways, over a period of time, it's hard to dislike them. Imagine a live stage with vocalist at center, guitarist to the left, drummer to the right. That's how most IEMs will present the stage. With SM3, the vocalist will be up front, (Edited after actual listening) and the things are much more spread out. Most IEMs would present the real stage within the confines of your head, but SM3 takes a few things 'out of the ear', 'behind your head'. If someone is very particular about the feeling of "being there", SM3 is not for them. It has it's own distorted vision of the stage.

Like appreciating some weirdo award winning movies, it takes some adjusting. If you read dfkt's review, it's a perfect example of how things go with SM3 - dismissal, denial, trial, acceptance, appreciation. Luckily for me, I am already a weirdo looking for a "different" ways to see things - be it movies or IEMs, so I took very less time adjusting. If you do fall in line, 10/10 looks absolutely correct. If not even 8/10 would look charitable.

This is how it approximately feels: .

This is the actual setup : http://www.flickr.com/photos/hsqsoft/4741690579/

The rectangle is Kurt Cobain. The one on SM3 to the left is where the initial guitar begins. But, it's pretty close or even confined within the rectangle itself in HDSS. The left edge is cymbals, the right edge is guitar. The two lines on the back of HDSS are how I felt the crowd clapping at the end of the song, where as in SM3, they are behind my head on left and right edges. Also, in HDSS, most of the cymbal strikes are closer to the drummer at the center with a few at the edges. In SM3, I felt more at the edges than closer to the drummer.
 
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