So whose Bombay is it anyway?

not that a name matters, but when a group makes it a matter of prestige/pride, it's a clear indication of the parochial outlook of the group...

Given a choice between spending the money spent on the (IMHO farcical) exercise of officially renaming the city to Mumbai on improving the citys' infrastructure, what would you have chosen?
 
superczar said:
not that a name matters, but when a group makes it a matter of prestige/pride, it's a clear indication of the parochial outlook of the group...

Given a choice between spending the money spent on the (IMHO farcical) exercise of officially renaming the city to Mumbai on improving the citys' infrastructure, what would you have chosen?
Click to expand...

You are talking as if renaming the city and improving the infrastructure is same things and as easy. Renaming does not call for billions of rupees. Improving infrastructure of Mumbai does. And where is the money? Its spent on running and improving economy of entire nation.

So dont blame lack of infrastructure on these things. Its money business, money that this city generates, and money which is needed for our entire country and not only for the city.
 
Wraith said:
Would you change your name just cause someone couldnt say it right?
Click to expand...

Defnitely, i have a friend called Anil..

..but the 'merikuns pronounce it as Anal.

He goes by his middle name now

:rofl:
 
yogi7272 said:
dude .. what mns got to do with that .. :rofl: i said it ..not every marathi is a supportor of mns / shiv sena .. :hap5: central government has to co-ordinate with state agency for such things given they have real political will for it ;)

sidenote: many people are already shifting to navi mumbai ..airport or no airport ..far better place to live than mumbai .. but now ..even its on the same path to congestion as mumbai ..
Click to expand...

Yes I know not all maharastrians are supporters of the MNS. (Does the MNS even have real support is what is left to be seen in the coming days.)
I'm just stating the issues a person needs to be concerned with if he/she drawn in by the sena's ideology or the ideology of any breakaway faction.

In fact, I'm surprised you ask me this. I don't know why people are so complacent on things that will actually benefit them. When I compare Bombay with Bangalore, I see that we are having a metro installed here(although it's routing seems like a joke but still, it's some progress.) though we probably don't need it for now.

I think the recent posts on the subject are an indication of how easy it is to distract one from the real issues. People are worried about name and language and pushing their own agenda forward. Nobody concentrates on asking the right questions or about personal freedom. I think we deserve what we get.

OT: Wasn't Ramesh Kini a maharastrian?...no really...I don't remember. Someone care to enlighten me? Wasn't it the sena/BJP who got rid of him?
 
ummmm with the risk of being too factual............

I hope you are aware that railways come under central govt railway budget and not local governance :p

About the replay to your earlier post.

Learning to speak tamil may not come in handy in professional life of your kid, but it will improve social life of your kid many folds........
 
Funky said:
What does MNS have to do with these issues. That party if to be honest nobody at this moment. You talk about these issues and at the same time forget that central government refused to give the required amount needed for fast forward movement of the Metro project. The national highway work is still crawling because of lack of funds.
Click to expand...

This lack of funds that you talk about, the reason why it happens is because of people in charge of sanctioning projects for eg: PWD(public works dept) are in connivance with contractors doing the job. The problem is most visible in Bombay where corruption is rampant and upto 50% of govt money goes in kickbacks.

Funky said:
You are talking as if renaming the city and improving the infrastructure is same things and as easy. Renaming does not call for billions of rupees. Improving infrastructure of Mumbai does. And where is the money? Its spent on running and improving economy of entire nation.
So dont blame lack of infrastructure on these things. Its money business, money that this city generates, and money which is needed for our entire country and not only for the city.
Click to expand...

To be honest, believing that lack of funds is the sole reason for the pathetic infrastructure of Bombay is a bit naive. A lot has to do with politicians shirking their responsibility and not holding to account those responsible for the implementation of such projects. Why they do that is because they are part of the same system of kickbacks.
 
ummmm with the risk of being too factual............

I hope you are aware that railways come under central govt railway budget and not local governance
Click to expand...

hehe, it was the general idea...

Learning to speak tamil may not come in handy in professional life of your kid, but it will improve social life of your kid many folds........
Click to expand...

thats debatable..i have my doubts..not knowing tamil has made absolutely zero difference to my social life in Chennai except for the occasional issue with bargaining with autowallahs (which anyway isn't really an impact to my social life)

yeenuff ranting....I am out of here now :p
 
Funky said:
Who is complaining. I am asking why should anyone now have a problem when city is named Mumbai. Its done, live with it. I am glad it happened.

And when its official you are legally required to use this name in every official work thats it. Call it bombay or mumbai in your mind, noone cares.

But dont be irked when someone tell you its called Mumbai and not Bombay because thats its official, legal and actual name unlike before when Bombay was official English language name.
Click to expand...

Well, when Mumbai was officially known as Bombay, if someone told you tht you shud call it as Bombay and not mumbai, wudnt u be irked ?? ;) Why cant one have the same freedom now in the opposite sense? If this is not double standards, then what is? :p

Seriously when the city cud have 2 names then, either of which cud be used officially, why cant it have 2 names now?? MAybe the priority has changed, and Mumbai has become the first name of the city, but why cant we use Bombay as an alternative like we cud use Mumbai in the past?? :S
 
sydras said:
This lack of funds that you talk about, the reason why it happens is because of people in charge of sanctioning projects for eg: PWD(public works dept) are in connivance with contractors doing the job. The problem is most visible in Bombay where corruption is rampant and upto 50% of govt money goes in kickbacks.

To be honest, believing that lack of funds is the sole reason for the pathetic infrastructure of Bombay is a bit naive. A lot has to do with politicians shirking their responsibility and not holding to account those responsible for the implementation of such projects. Why they do that is because they are part of the same system of kickbacks.
Click to expand...

Are you assuming corruption in Mumbai is worse than anywhere in India? If yes, how did you reach to this conclusion.

Take an example of the recent metro project. Central govt outright refused the 650cr siting the legality issue of bidding taking place without approval of Centre’s Private-Public Action Committee which was non existent when bidding took place.

Then refusing to grant the money for mithi project siting a technicality that mithi is river and not a drainage system :S

All these are just plain BS reasons.

These are not small amount.

Metro will cost 20,000 cr rupees. State and Mumbai alone cant build that much money even through private sector investment.

BMC has annual budget of 7000Cr.

Even if you consider every last penny out of this is utilized properly without corruption its simply not possible for state or city alone to finance this project. As estimated expense on the city by independent analysts is around 10000cr.

Calculate yourself. ( SOrry, I have nasty habit of remembering numbers :p )
 
And now its NOT CORRECT to call the city Bombay.
Click to expand...

lol why r u so highlighting it.....BOMBAY BOMBAY BOMBAY :p

Show me the rule where it says I cant say it as BOMBAY.....I still say MADRAS sometimes....in fact some flights have their route shown as Bangalore to MAS

(MAS for MADRAS) Go Sue them...sorry for the caps....but couldn't help it. 2 hrs & the fanaticism still doesn't stops. Hats off to u all.....my last post here ...THANKS
 
Funky said:
Metro will cost 20,000 cr rupees. State and Mumbai alone cant build that much money even through private sector investment.
Click to expand...

And neither did Delhi or Bangalore manage it by themselves. Figures i read were something to the tune of close to 50% financed by the Japs.

..the've been in a rather generous mood recently, given the Chinese are coming up.

Hasn't anyone spoken to them yet ?
 
blr_p said:
And neither did Delhi or Bangalore manage it by themselves. Figures i read were something to the tune of close to 50% financed by the Japs.

..the've been in a rather generous mood recently, given the Chinese are coming up.

Hasn't anyone spoken to them yet ?
Click to expand...

these figures are nowhere close to what delhi metro cost. Due to Geographical location and due to whats under the soil here in Mumbai, this project is costing 2.5 times as much as Delhi metro.
And also keep in mind that Delhi metro got the backing of central govt easily.
Mumbai is unplanned city made up of reclaimed land. To build a metro in such location increases the cost.
Even with reliance participation out of those 20,000cr Mumbai metro needed just 650cr from Central govt and that too was rejected.
 
Might be a bit irrelevant, but I think some of the political activities can be reduced by shifting state capitals from major cities. The combination of business centers and political centers at same place dont go well.
 
superczar said:
so it was alright when your family migrated..but it somehow becomes wrong when others do? :rofl:
Click to expand...

rofl back!!! dad had to learn marathi when he came here-first in colaba where city book shop is and then in linking road as it was necessary. In the old days ordering books was done only in marathi and calculated with word of a mouth (talking about the 50's and 60s time). If a person migrates and establishes himself permanently, then he can follow his own religion and what not, but at the same time learn the language and everything comes with it at the same time. It doesnt make sense now-a-days if your born here and dont know marathi-if you are born in France wouldnt it be silly if you dont know french??? I know France is a country with a different language, but in India almost all state have their own language and traditions. Same applies for other states as well.
 
My 2 cents

About the language thing - Its quite simple, you will become fluent in the language of your peers. I was appaling at hindi and marathi up until my FE, but in college, my peer group changed from primarily english speakers to marathi + hindi speakers and now , 7 years later, i am fluent in both(in a relative sense ofcourse).

As far as languages in schools is concerned, I believe that Hindi should be constant in all schools (hey, its our national language) and tested , the local language should be taught but with the aim of enriching the student about the local area he lives in and not as an exam that needs to be passed. That solves 2 problems in 1 go, you preserve the local language, and you don't screw transfer students in the exams.

Now back to the actual topic of the thread, I dont believe anyone is condoning the actions of Raj or the MSN in this case. The question is of immigrants.

Immigrants are very important for a city's growth. The problem is not so much if "skilled" immigrants come into a city, then the city grows and everyone is happy. The issues begin to crop up when all and sundry come into the city full of hopes and suddenly 100 new slums pop-up.

There are 2 ways of tackling this problem

1. Instiute a State-Level Visa system.. but then that defeats the purpose that we fought till 1947 for.

2. Develop the states that the immigrants come from, develop the villages in the country so that there is a opportunity for everyone, regardless of their location, to live a life of dignity. That would reduce the influx into the big cities.

But the 2nd one does not have a political hook, it will not rile the masses into action and get votes. So it will probably never be done.
 
Heh another 10 page thread...

BTW Mumbai is not so bad, infact its an accepted name, even Bruce (Maiden lead singer) in the end did say Mumbai....

And all those arguments about Marathi lang being forced is baseless, you have an option of an ICSE or CBSE schools. The locals here are getting frustrated, and you cannot blame them, however liberal you are. Maharshtrians wont even make up 40% of the Mumbai's population right now, they have a problem because their daily life is degrading. Travel in a local train and you will know..

There is a certain geographical culture or a norm, and its being eroded and replaced by a pathetic one (all you ultra liberal folks please take a visit to a place called Premnagar at Goregaon west opp Inorbit mall) The fact is go to any slums where majority of the ppl are non north indians, and goto a slum where majority of them are north Indians. Huge freaking diff there itself, I am fairly liberal myself so are most of my colleagues but inadvertently we curse aloud everytime we pass Premnagar. Go figure....
 
Aces170 said:
Heh another 10 page thread...
And all those arguments about Marathi lang being forced is baseless, you have an option of an ICSE or CBSE schools. The locals here are getting frustrated, and you cannot blame them, however liberal you are. Maharshtrians wont even make up 40% of the Mumbai's population right now, they have a problem because their daily life is degrading. Travel in a local train and you will know..
Click to expand...
So forcing others to learn marathi will solve their problems? This is the whole point of the language discussion. This forcing of marathi thing..it just distracts the poor maharastrians from their plight. It gives them a false sense of security. And politicians have been exploiting this for a long time.
Don't you see, even if outsiders learn marathi, they will not give up their culture nor will they magically become maharastrian.
Aces170 said:
There is a certain geographical culture or a norm, and its being eroded and replaced by a pathetic one (all you ultra liberal folks please take a visit to a place called Premnagar at Goregaon west opp Inorbit mall) The fact is go to any slums where majority of the ppl are non north indians, and goto a slum where majority of them are north Indians. Huge freaking diff there itself, I am fairly liberal myself so are most of my colleagues but inadvertently we curse aloud everytime we pass Premnagar. Go figure....
Click to expand...
I didn't quite get the example. But, just as you have a right to preserve your culture, I have a right to protect my personal freedom.
 
soggy316 said:
1. Instiute a State-Level Visa system.. but then that defeats the purpose that we fought till 1947 for.
Click to expand...
Something like the double citizenship requirement that the US has can be implemented. However, if you ask me, it will be another bureaucratic nightmare to go through and riddled with corruption just like any other govt organization.
 
Back
Top