The wet shaving thread

[spawnfreak]

anybody tried the Gillette Fusion Power? It has a motorized vibrator which generate micropulses that enhance the blades power.

I use it as an upgrade from Mach3 Turbo and is really much much better from Mach3 Turbo

 

[Roxtin]

^ looking for one was not available in Pune, will check Noida market on Sunday.

 

[FaH33m]

Not much of shaving tension for me . All that grows is a semi Goatee which needs shaving only once every fortnight

 

[corelement]

Not much of shaving tension for me . All that grows is a semi Goatee which needs shaving only once every fortnight

noooooblet

 

[viralbug]

Not much of shaving tension for me . All that grows is a semi Goatee which needs shaving only once every fortnight

And still you manage to cut yourself. That too on cheek bone.

 

[blr_p]

10k, 1k per month for 10 months and reducing thick facial hair to thin/fine/non existant hair is far far cheaper than a lifetime of misery shaving.
Notice, the hair isnt GONE, ive just had high energy done under my jawline so I never have to shave under again, but used medium on face so the
"thickness" and "roughness" , the kind that bruises your skin if you rub against your chin..thats gone.. the hairs much softer and easier to shave.

I also dont understand guys who buy 3-5k worth electric razor and thousands worth shaving equipment to shave thick facial hair everyday or 2 days when in a country like india it takes only 5-7k just to reduce facal hair density by 70% by laser permanently if they know they dont look good in a beard and never keep one thats impossible to grow in such thickness to start with. Why is it such a "drastic step" you dont become less aesthetic, it's more efficient and cheaper in the long run. Theres no ego and question of maturity involved.

OK, i've read around a little bit about lasers, never knew such a thing even existed until you mentioned it.

The thing here is I or anyone else for that matter has no way to understand what you must have gone through. You say you had a really tough beard to shave that hurt your hands if you rested on it. My dad had an incredibly tough beard, i always joked that he could prolly light a non-safety match on it if he went ATG. It gets a lot tougher with age but he was a one pass guy and was satisfied with the result.

I feel in your case its less the money spent over a liftetime than the actual having to endure the shave that was the bigger problem that had to be solved. There's many ways to shave a tough beard, would they have worked if you tried. I don't know because only you know what your tolerance limit is.

Why i said drastic is because once its removed its gone, forever. After having been so used to hair growing back it would feel odd not to have it grow back again, ever. Now if it was painful in anyway prior to the laser then this would very well be a welcome change. Otherwise there's this missing 'phantom limb' thing. I read that laser is classified as semi-permanent in the sense hair has grown back for some ppl that underwent it, tho i'm told this is more in the case of ppl that have lighter hair than not.

Secondly, laser is a new treatment in comparison to say electrolysis which has been studied for a much longer time. Is there a chance of future complications later on in life as a result of laser ? No one knows. Nothing nasty has turned up so far.

Thirdly, is there any chance of being permanently disfigured as a result of this treatment.

Fourthly, i'm not sure i never want to grow a beard in the future, its unlikely tho i'd like to keep the option open.

Fifthly, what kind of a shadow will you have if you do not shave for several days.

Lastly, the degree of laser being sought. Now in your case you mention thinning but you also said upto 70% was going to be removed. The thinning part i can understand but going full out would be odd, because then your face would resemble a pre-pubescent boy. I can get it very smooth after a few passes but the hair roots and darker tone are still visibly present, it just can't be felt coming from different directions. Now unless you happen to be like that naturally it would be hard to keep a secret and ppl would kinda want to know what happened and learn you actually paid to get this done. Is this such a thing you could live with.

Understand that i'm not knocking your choice here as its a personal one.

What would Bond do

 

[corelement]

Why i said drastic is because once its removed its gone, forever. After having been so used to hair growing back it would feel odd not to have it grow back again, ever. Now if it was painful in anyway prior to the laser then this would very well be a welcome change. Otherwise there's this missing 'phantom limb' thing. I read that laser is classified as semi-permanent in the sense hair has grown back for some ppl that underwent it, tho i'm told this is more in the case of ppl that have lighter hair than not.

Secondly, laser is a new treatment in comparison to say electrolysis which has been studied for a much longer time. Is there a chance of future complications later on in life as a result of laser ? No one knows. Nothing nasty has turned up so far.

Laser isnt permanent hair 'removal', its permanent hair 'reduction'. Theres literally 0 chance if any complication unless the doc and the patient are both idiots. If you did some research on the matter, every frequency and strength of a laser has some form of reaction on the body, in this case the hair laser targets the absorbtion frequency of the pigment in the hair to burn it and cease the stem cells from proliferating along with the sebacious glands which produce acne and ingrown hair. It's used for everything from circumcision to brain surgery, hell dude, people who lose their penile skin from degloving and get split skin thickness grafts have to get laser done once the graft has taken root, do you think docs would do that if it isnt safe? If you did some more research on it, take fraxel for example to treat collagen repair by non invasive techniques, or say lasers for treatment of varicose veins youd realise these have been done for decades now. The age of electrolysis and laser are the same, laser was far more expensive to fabricate until the late 90's.

The difference is electrolsysis is FAR FAR MORE painful than laser and its permanent, theres FAR more risk in electrolysis than laser will ever have.

Thirdly, is there any chance of being permanently disfigured as a result of this treatment.

Fourthly, i'm not sure i never want to grow a beard in the future, its unlikely tho i'd like to keep the option open.

Fifthly, what kind of a shadow will you have if you do not shave for several days.

- Like I said, theres no chance unless both you and your doc are both morons. I specified my settings, depth, energy per sq i. If youre a moron who leaves it to the doc like he's god obviously he's gonna screw you up.

- Like I said, its not removal, it's reduction...

- Shadow? what? I'm presently LOVING not having to shave everyday. It's such an amazing sense of freedom. No blister, no rashes, no cuts, no foam, no blades , ahhh. I was actually waiting for this day till the point the hair became thick and hard because the thicker and harder they are, the more effective the laser is at lower settings.

Lastly, the degree of laser being sought. Now in your case you mention thinning but you also said upto 70% was going to be removed. The thinning part i can understand but going full out would be odd, because then your face would resemble a pre-pubescent boy. I can get it very smooth after a few passes but the hair roots and darker tone are still visibly present, it just can't be felt coming from different directions. Now unless you happen to be like that naturally it would be hard to keep a secret and ppl would kinda want to know what happened and learn you actually paid to get this done. Is this such a thing you could live with.

Understand that i'm not knocking your choice here as its a personal one.

I think there's some confusion, lemme explain it a little better.

What is the principle behind a hair laser, its basically "hair reduction"

What is reduction? How does reduction happen?

- Damaging hair root stem cells : since obviously we're talking stem cells here, you cannot damage all of them because to do that youd have to damage the surrounding dermis. No only a certain % of it gets damaged from the laser depending on the setting. This determines the future of that hair strand. If the laser was set to high, more stem cells were damaged, if the laser was set to say 5, then 50% of the stem cells were damaged, making thick hair, 50% less thick.

- Reduced hair growth cycle ( aka increasing the time between shaves because say if the laser was set to 5, 50% of the stem cells for that hair root have been damaged and reabsorbed back into the skin by catabolization thus that hair strand takes 50% more time to grow in and its much softer once it does and not razor sharp.

Also, whats the deal with keeping it a secret? We're not living in the dark ages anymore, get with the times. I told all my friends and colleagues at work way before, they all thought the result was awesome. The girls are always touching my face

 

[blr_p]

It's used for everything from circumcision to brain surgery, hell dude, people who lose their penile skin from degloving and get split skin thickness grafts have to get laser done once the graft has taken root, do you think docs would do that if it isnt safe?

The difference is in your example laser is being used as a more precise knife with a cauterising action. But when used to modify hair growth that too on so many hair roots, what would the long term effects be ? We don't know, thats not to say it will necessarily be bad, its just that enough time has not passed yet. What's the skin cancer potential here of damaging hair root stem cells ? Can't say.

If you did some more research on it, take fraxel for example to treat collagen repair by non invasive techniques, or say lasers for treatment of varicose veins youd realise these have been done for decades now.

What is the laser doing in these two instances ? only cutting or modfying cell behaviour ?

The age of electrolysis and laser are the same, laser was far more expensive to fabricate until the late 90's.

Electrolysis is over a hundred years old, thats what i meant by age and its effects being well understood. Whereas laser is what, 20 years at most and half of that time it was used as a better knife.

I agree, electrolysis is more painful, slower and with inexperienced hands, more dangerous. Ideally its used only in less dense areas as it would not be feasible over a larger area like the face.

Shadow? what? I'm presently LOVING not having to shave everyday.

This is the bit i did not get,
- By how much will it be reduced after you have all the ten sessions ? 50%, 70%, more.
- Where will this reduction be, only on the face, neck or both.

Put another way, will it look like any hair is growing there at all ? I know you said there would still be a stubble, its just visualising how it will look in the end.

You've only had four sessions out of ten so there is a way to go still. So when i asked about shadow i meant how does it look (so far) if you do not shave for several days, just less growth than previously.

Also, whats the deal with keeping it a secret? We're not living in the dark ages anymore, get with the times.

Just a general aversion to any kind of plastic surgery and it being unnatural. Thing is you're not doing it to look better are you, its to get around the pain as i understand it.

 

[corelement]

The difference is in your example laser is being used as a more precise knife with a cauterising action. But when used to modify hair growth that too on so many hair roots, what would the long term effects be ? We don't know, thats not to say it will necessarily be bad, its just that enough time has not passed yet. What's the skin cancer potential here of damaging hair root stem cells ? Can't say.

Skin cancer from thermal damage??? lol.........

What is the laser doing in these two instances ? only cutting or modfying cell behaviour ?

No, they're varopizing microscopic dots on the skin for stem cells to react and generate new collagen and/or damage vein walls to have them collapse and get reabsorbed by chemicals and tissues in the body.

This is the bit i did not get,

- By how much will it be reduced after you have all the ten sessions ? 50%, 70%, more.

- Where will this reduction be, only on the face, neck or both.

Hair removal lasers work on the princpal of heating up the pigment in hair. They have a particular absorbtion frequency. The reduction factor is directly proportional to what energy setting is used and the persons skin thickness and skin type and nature. The question of safety is eliminated by doing patch tests a month beforehand.

Put another way, will it look like any hair is growing there at all ? I know you said there would still be a stubble, its just visualising how it will look in the end.

You've only had four sessions out of ten so there is a way to go still. So when i asked about shadow i meant how does it look (so far) if you do not shave for several days, just less growth than previously.

Visually I still have facial hair but physically its much softer and thinner. Presently it looks awesome, circulation in the area has dramatically increased, the skin looks much better than before and dosnt catch dust particles. my shaving days have gone from 1-2 days to 10 days.

Just a general aversion to any kind of plastic surgery and it being unnatural. Thing is you're not doing it to look better are you, its to get around the pain as i understand it.

For me yes I had a condition called pseudofollicitis. Where my skin has an immune system reaction from the sharp edges of hair grazing against the skin ad getting inflammed and rashed. Basically, my beard was too thick for my skin. But to be honest, im glad.... I seriously reccomend it to everyone whos sick of extremely thick and dense facial hair thats like a sandpaper to shave.

 

[ragzdiablo]

Im still in trimming phase :ashamed:

 

[blr_p]

Hair removal lasers work on the princpal of heating up the pigment in hair. They have a particular absorbtion frequency. The reduction factor is directly proportional to what energy setting is used and the persons skin thickness and skin type and nature.

Are you saying the laser just thins the hair follicle, rather than zapping the hair root entirely ?

Meaning the hair is always there, grows as normal, its just thinner (in diameter) than before and continues to grow like that in the future.

Visually I still have facial hair but physically its much softer and thinner.

Is the density of hair growth still the same but with thinner follicles ?

No, they're varopizing microscopic dots on the skin for stem cells to react and generate new collagen and/or damage vein walls to have them collapse and get reabsorbed by chemicals and tissues in the body.

Right, so its getting rid of stuff that will not be used anymore. Whereas here the hair cells will still be present after the treatment its just that they won't be growing as thick hair as they did to in the past. They have somehow been re-programmed.

Do you see what i mean, you still need those hair cells, you're not doing away with them entirely. So the question remains whether imparing their function will or won't have any long term effects.

For me yes I had a condition called pseudofollicitis. Where my skin has an immune system reaction from the sharp edges of hair grazing against the skin ad getting inflammed and rashed. Basically, my beard was too thick for my skin.

Right, so you did have some condition before to go ahead with this.

 

[corelement]

Are you saying the laser just thins the hair follicle, rather than zapping the hair root entirely ?

Meaning the hair is always there, grows as normal, its just thinner (in diameter) than before and continues to grow like that in the future.

Yes, that is correct, however this also depends entirely on what "setting" the laser was at when you had a session and what kind of skin/hair you have.

This is measurable by the pain factor. When the laser is given, moderate to light rubber band effect is enough to give the results that you mentioned and the kind I got. This was a setting of 5 and 7, but when I started off, the doc used a setting of 9 where the hair was thickest and caused the most problem. The other areas that got 5 and 7 have recurring growth, the area which got "9" it was like a bigass rubber band hitting you like people did in school, but that spot of 9, theres no regrowth. This was controlled.

Is the density of hair growth still the same but with thinner follicles ?

The density of the hair spread is still the same, the density of each strand/follicle is about 50% thinner.

Right, so its getting rid of stuff that will not be used anymore. Whereas here the hair cells will still be present after the treatment its just that they won't be growing as thick hair as they did to in the past. They have somehow been re-programmed.

Do you see what i mean, you still need those hair cells, you're not doing away with them entirely. So the question remains whether imparing their function will or won't have any long term effects.

[/QUOTE]

I dont get what you mean by "hair cell" theres no such thing as a "hair cell" tho. Hair is nothing but keratin. The same thing your nails are made of. Body and facial hair has no purpose, contrary to say what americans think how useless a foreskin is but a foreskin is neural tissue yet all americans males are circumcised, this is a failure of medical understanding and public intelligence on their part, the concept is not the same for hair. facial hair and body hair has no purpose. Hair is a product of androgen male hormones. It's no gland or organ. Infact, majority of hair laser results have been beneficial to skin circulation and sweat control unless the doc and patient as I said were both morons and didnt know how to use the laser.

 

[dipen01]

Ok I could use some suggestions.

My beard growth is very fast and even though I shave only once a week, Ideally I should shave twice a week. I have been shaving at saloon since 3-4 yrs (not to mention that its way too costly - 30-35bucks / shave ) and before that I used Sensor Excel (may be for few months). Now I need to start shaving on my own.

According to barber, I have a thick beard (not the density of the beard but in a sense that shaving is difficult). I don't wanna roughen up my skin even further, so I avoid frequent shaves. As mentioned, last time I shaved it was 3-4yrs back and I think I have lost the hang of it.

So considering everything, which razor do i buy ? (Also what should be preferred - Gel/Foam/Cream)..

Regards,

 

[blr_p]

I dont get what you mean by "hair cell" theres no such thing as a "hair cell" tho. Hair is nothing but keratin. The same thing your nails are made of.

I was referring to the hair stem cells you mentioned earlier. The cells responsible for growing hair. If i understood you correctly then the laser is thinning the hair right down to the cortex, the initial part of the hair under the skin. The bit I don't get is how just shining a laser makes the hair forever grow thinner in the future. Is it that simple to trick the cells into not growing hair as thick as before ?

According to barber, I have a thick beard (not the density of the beard but in a sense that shaving is difficult). I don't wanna roughen up my skin even further, so I avoid frequent shaves.

There are a few things here to keep in mind
- rough hair can be made soft if you prep it correctly. You can have a hot shower before you shave, or additionally you can hold a hot towel to your face for a cpl of minutes with the shaving cream under and having massaged it prior. If you do this i highly recommend Godrej's Menthol mist, awesome tingling sensation. What you don't want to do is use cold water as the two elements important here are heat & hydration to weaken the hair.
- Irritating the skin is a function of two things, getting the blade angle right and using a light touch so your shaving the hair instead of the skin and using a moisturiser after so the skin recovers faster from any damage.
- Shaving more often means the hair does not have enough time to grow too long so strange as this may sound, shaving everyday will actually mean an easier shave than doing it once a week or cpl of times a week. Most i can manage is every other day, if i went once a week it would be tough to shave as well.
- You need to know when a blade gets dull, because then you start to apply more pressure and your chances of getting nicks or razor burn increase. If its tugging instead of cutting then its time to replace it. Your barber always used a fresh blade every time you went there but you want to get a few more shaves with just one blade. That figure depends on how often you shave, how well you prep and ultimately how sharp and tough your beard is.
- you need to know your grain ie which direction the hair grows. If its fairly uniform then a simple up-down will work however if it grows in different directions then you have to figure out yourself how the grain lies. Get a credit card or similar plastic and start rubbing it in different directions, the direction that makes the least noise is the grain, so you want to shave in that direction for least irritation.

So considering everything, which razor do i buy ? (Also what should be preferred - Gel/Foam/Cream)..

Gilette presto to start with & keep it easy or any other double-bladed razor. Any cream you want. You will get a decent shave with it. Just do one pass north-south and shave everyday. Try not to go over an area without lather, if its required, relather.

Gel is more for 3+blade razors, its function is just to help the blade(s) glide (better) over your skin and keep irritation down. The gel does nothing to mositurise the skin at all. Going with cream means you have to make it but then you have lots of variety, with cans its just one or two. A little bit of practice and you get a very good lather for cheaper than a can.

Fewer blades ie passes means less irritation and taking it to the logical conclusion implies a single blade would be the best but given you have not used one in a long time it would be harder to learn a DE than say a presto on your own, unless you were very motivated. Once you get the hang of that and want a better shave then its time to go to a DE. But its better to take things very slowly intially.

 

[corelement]

I was referring to the hair stem cells you mentioned earlier. The cells responsible for growing hair. If i understood you correctly then the laser is thinning the hair right down to the cortex, the initial part of the hair under the skin. The bit I don't get is how just shining a laser makes the hair forever grow thinner in the future. Is it that simple to trick the cells into not growing hair as thick as before ?

Every persons ratio of stem cells for something is drastically different, people have the genes for hair in x place of y thickness and z type of hair. All a laser does is target the "pigment" within the hair. The heat travels to the roots and vaporizes some of the stem cells, namely the ones responsible for making hair so thick and hard. With lesser stem cells forcing growth of the hair, skin retains nutrients better and circulation automatically increases. There is a marked improvement in the dermis quality after the hair is gone. There is no harm or cancer crap in this. Cancer happens when your own cells are at fault. Here hair stem cells are being "vaporized". Hair has no purpose, if it did then if you removed a split thickness skin graft from done area and had to put it in another area, the doner area would have dramatic setbacks.

 

[dipen01]

Gilette presto to start with & keep it easy or any other double-bladed razor. Any cream you want. You will get a decent shave with it. Just do one pass north-south and shave everyday. Try not to go over an area without lather, if its required, relather.

Fewer blades ie passes means less irritation and taking it to the logical conclusion implies a single blade would be the best but given you have not used one in a long time it would be harder to learn a DE than say a presto on your own, unless you were very motivated. Once you get the hang of that and want a better shave then its time to go to a DE. But its better to take things very slowly intially.

Thanks for the tips.. I guess I will buy another one of Gillette Sensor Excel.. Any specific creams that you might suggest ?

 

[SidhuScorpion]

I use Mach 3, I have sensitive skin and dense/thick beard, have to shave everyday, Mach 3 gives me a closer and comfortable shave, impossible to cut. But I am unable to make the difference in genuine and duplicate blades. Sometimes I end up feeling like I want to scratch my skin off. Got these from city's most reputed departmental store. Now switching back to cheapo double-edge razor, chances of counterfeit razor blades will be less.

 

[blr_p]

I use Mach 3, I have sensitive skin and dense/thick beard, have to shave everyday, Mach 3 gives me a closer and comfortable shave, impossible to cut. But I am unable to make the difference in genuine and duplicate blades. Got these from city's most reputed departmental store.

Have ppl here seen fake M3 blades ? -- thought they would be difficult to copy.

Sometimes I end up feeling like I want to scratch my skin off.

Sounds like dry skin. I use a moisturizer just after a shave.

Now switching back to cheapo double-edge razor, chances of counterfeit razor blades will be less.

Less chances but technique is quite different and will take time to adapt to. No bending wrists for example and more attention to blade angle. One thing you will appreciate is less gumming up that happens with multi- blade, no need for running water with a DE.

 

[SidhuScorpion]

Dude read my post again, not dry skin case. I am familiar with Mach 3 shave, will feel the difference immediately, missing smooth, close, effortless shave. I am almost certain that they are fake or rejected blades. I use Nivea without alcohal and Betnovate-N occassionally after shave.

I use Mach 3, I have sensitive skin and dense/thick beard, have to shave everyday, Mach 3 gives me a closer and comfortable shave, impossible to cut. But I am unable to make the difference in genuine and duplicate blades. Sometimes I end up feeling like I want to scratch my skin off. Got these from city's most reputed departmental store. Now switching back to cheapo double-edge razor, chances of counterfeit razor blades will be less.

 

[corelement]

Have fun with chronic dermal atrophy from betnovate-n